My crazy aunt

[Independent Gal]

I mentioned once before, I think, about my crazy aunt F and how one of my biggest wedding fears was her going off the deep end. I know pratically everyone has a crazy relative that they worry about! But just to give you an idea of what I''m dealing with here...

I just went to breakfast with her and my grammy. Near the end of the meal, I mentioned that I hadn''t finalized the guestlist yet, and so it might be prudent not to talk to anyone in the family about my wedding plans before the invitations go out. I brought this up in a casual non-confrontational way, and the reason is that when my dad got married last fall, she took it upon herself to invite a tonne of people (like 15!) and help them make travel arrangements and things... people my dad had no intention of inviting. It became a huge issue. She was also, by the way, calling my dad''s venue and giving them instructions, and changing my step-mom''s instructions and stuff! Can you imagine!

Well, I can''t afford an extra 15 people, and it would mean there would be no room for a dancefloor at my venue, so I thought I''d just slip that in.

Now, how does Aunt F respond? She stands up, in the middle of the restaurant, and starts YELLING at me. Mind you, when she yells at me (which happens about once a year or so) it''s almost always about my father, as though I were responsible for anything he does. So she just stood there shrieking (and I mean SHRIEKING!) in the middle of the restaurant about how dare my father this and what makes me think that that. And why do I think I''m so special and my father once did XYZ and blah blah blah.

ARGH! So embarassing! And angry making! Everybody was staring. I just have this sinking feeling that she''ll do something horrible to ruin my wedding.

I have to prepare myself to try to ignore her. But imagine if she starts yelling at me at the wedding?!?! I seriously wouldn''t put it past her.

I''m also going to tell the event coordinator at my venue to ignore anything she says, except say ''Can you direct me to the ladies room'' and check with me before changing ANYTHING.

I''m rather upset now. Partly because it really upsets my grammy when she does stuff like that. How did she end up so, well, INAPPROPRIATE?

 

[tiffanytwisted]

How awful!
My first thought was maybe you should not invite HER. Although that''s probably not an option.
I do think you should notify all of your vendors about her. It sounds like she can be pretty conniving, so notifying them in advance to only discuss changes with you is probably a good idea. Most vendors already have that policy, but if she''s convincing enough there''s no telling.

 

[princesss]

Oh, Indy, I''m so sorry!

I''d say tiffanytwisted''s suggestion of making sure your vendors don''t talk to her is a good one. Beyond that...maybe hope she''s sick on your wedding day? That''s mean, I know, but dang I wouldn''t want to put up with that on such a special day.

I''ve got my fingers crossed for you.

 

[Independent Gal]

She is definitely conniving, but in this really weird way. After being her niece for 30ish years, I still can't figure her intentions out. She always SEEMS to be trying to help, she's rarely actively mean, but everything she does is just so INAPPROPRIATE or completely subverts things or is just plain embarassing.

Like once when I was about 16 yrs old and had a bout of typical teenager family tensions, she went in to the store where I worked part-time, and asked to see the manager, and told him I was having 'emotional problems' (WTF?!?!) and that she was 'grateful' that he was being so kind and supportive when she knew I was 'difficult'.

W?T?F?!?

It's just so embarassing.

Or she'll throw a tantrum if you don't let her buy you something you don't want / need. And I mean a TANTRUM. and ALWAYS in public. But if you DO let her get it for you, it becomes a HUGE production that sucks up two weeks of your life. E.g., she'll insist you talk to the salesperson on the phone and tell him exactly what you want and then tell him how excited you are, even when you didn't want it. WAH! so awkward. Then often she'll just change her mind and not get it. But come up with some kind of weird implausible excuse. I mean, isn't that the weirdest thing you ever heard? It's like, what planet is she from?

Or, helping people find accomodation for my dad's wedding (helping! helping!) when they're not actually invited, and telling them that my dad just 'screwed up' the wedding which is why they didn't know they were invited.

Or sometimes she calls my dad's assistant and shares private details about my dad with her, then gives her 'instructions' about him.

And the lies OH THE LIES!!!!! And the posturing. She pretends she is best friends with people she barely knows, and she twists stories around until they are so implausible as to be hilarious, seemingly to aggrandize herself. I just don't get it.

It's like she lacks some sort of filter for what is OK behaviour and what isn't. So then she gets so upset if you get upset or tell her to quit it, because she just doesn't seem to get why what she's doing is just plain wrong and why people get annoyed with her.

The only thing I'm pretty sure about in terms of understanding her is that she HATES my father.

Like, HATES him.

OK, thanks for letting me vent.

 

[Ellen]

Seriously? I would sit her down (in private) and tell her that episode was totally uncalled for. And I would point blank ask her if she enjoys embarrassing you.

Then, I would tell her in no uncertain terms, that if you even get an inkling of an idea that she''s going to pull something at your wedding, she will be escorted out. Period.
''

And I wouldn''t care one iota if this upsets her.

I feel for ya.

 

[Independent Gal]

Ellen, that''s exactly what I''m going to do. And then I''ll cross my fingers because in the past when presented with a clear ''Do NOT pass go, DO NO collect $200'' she has reacted 1 of 2 ways: either she settles down. Or, she goes into vengeance mode and throws the game and all the pieces on the floor. Those are the only times I''ve seen her be truly, actively mean.

The thing is, because she seemingly doesn''t perceive her behaviour to be bad, she really doesn''t ''understand'' why people get so mad at her. Y''know? she sees it as us persecuting her if we try to stop her, and not appreciating all her ''help''. I think that''s why she likes those public outbursts. She gets to tell EVERYONE how HORRIBLE we are.

Still, I AM going to put my foot down and I WILL have her escorted out if necessary.

I think there might actually be something ''wrong'' with her (my grammy is convinced it''s that she didn''t get enough air when she was first born) but I have no idea what it is.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/12/2007 1:07:42 PM
Author: Independent Gal
Ellen, that''s exactly what I''m going to do. And then I''ll cross my fingers because in the past when presented with a clear ''Do NOT pass go, DO NO collect $200'' she has reacted 1 of 2 ways: either she settles down. Or, she goes into vengeance mode and throws the game and all the pieces on the floor. Those are the only times I''ve seen her be truly, actively mean.

The thing is, because she seemingly doesn''t perceive her behaviour to be bad, she really doesn''t ''understand'' why people get so mad at her. Y''know? she sees it as us persecuting her if we try to stop her, and not appreciating all her ''help''. I think that''s why she likes those public outbursts. She gets to tell EVERYONE how HORRIBLE we are.

Still, I AM going to put my foot down and I WILL have her escorted out if necessary.

I think there might actually be something ''wrong'' with her (my grammy is convinced it''s that she didn''t get enough air when she was first born) but I have no idea what it is.

Then I would add to your instructions to her, "if you are not sure what is and isn''t acceptable, REFRAIN".

I know how frustrating it can be. I have a sister who I KNOW has something wrong with her, but the whole family tip toes around it, and it has not helped. So when I finally had enough a few years ago, I kindly tried to tell her she needed help, only to receive a scathing response. It was ME who had the problem. It''s always everyone else, not her.

This is the same girl who didn''t come to her own fathers funeral, offering up a variety of weak excuses. I say weak because unless you are in prison or the hospital deathly ill, you go. And she couldn''t understand why I was upset with her.

 

[Independent Gal]

Fathers'' funerals are not ''optional''. If you can physically get there, you go.

When you say you know she has something wrong with her, is there some kind of diagnosis you know about? Something that might help me (and my family) understand why she''s so freaking hard to cope with?

I think it will be easier when my Grammy passes away, though heaven willing, that won''t be for years to come. My grammy is 87 (almost) and one thing crazy aunt F is good at is keeping grammy''s social calendar full and her life interesting when we are all out of town... they go on cruises and out for meals and stuff and my grammy really enjoys it, and has largely made her peace wtih F''s weird behaviour. So if there''s ever a conflict between F and another family member, it REALLY upsets my grammy. I love her so much that it kills me when she''s upset, which is partly why I maintain any contact with F at all. But it also means F knows juuuust how to get to me if she''s in ''vengeance mode''. Once she told me to ''drop dead'' because I asked her not to do something that would have been very embarassign, then called my grammy and said I was being horrible and told her all kinds of COMPLETELY fabricated terrible lies about me. I''m not even sure how she came up with some of the things she said. But I then got a very sad, upset, scared phone call from Grammy worried about what F had told her and whehter any of it was true. Isn''t that psychotic?

It was truly awful. Except for my mom''s wisecrack that since F had called her ''mommy'' to cry and get me into trouble, she as my ''mommy'' would be happy to call F and scold her too. At the time i thought that was hilarious.

But I was really shaken up about it. Took me a few days to get over it.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/12/2007 1:41:13 PM
Author: Independent Gal

When you say you know she has something wrong with her, is there some kind of diagnosis you know about? Something that might help me (and my family) understand why she''s so freaking hard to cope with?

No, there''s not been a diagnosis, because remember, there''s nothing wrong with her. (according to her, so she would never go try to get help) But from things she had said and done (some were just plain nuts and I can''t believe my family let them go, like the funeral) I knew something was up and did some research on mental illness. The problem is, her "symptoms" overlap certain categories, so I really have no idea, just suspicians. Manic/Depressive is a real possiblity among other things.

I wish I could tell you something that would help, but you''re in kind of the same boat I am. THEY don''t think it''s them, it''s everybody else. (btw, this is a classic symptom of mental illness) So, what do you do? If they won''t accept help, there''s not much you can, unless someone gets to the point where they are a danger to themselves or others, then you have them committed.
You just have to deal with it as best you can, not fun.

I am lucky in that my sister is thousands of miles away from me, and has been for years. So I only have to deal with her sporadically...

 

[Jas12]

wow! I thought my nutty great aunt was a handful...but she has nothing on yours

When you talk to her about the ourburst I would calmly and simply hammer her with logic, If she disputes I would point-blank ask her questions like " do you feel it is helpful to yell and make a scene in a public area, when we were moments before just enjoying lunch converstation"?

I am curious--is she able to have a meaningful conversation with you or is there no discussion going on ?

Sounds like she certainly has a problem--like my great aunt--there are a few ''screws loose'' as my dad would say. It may not be something clearly labeled but there nonetheless. I would continue to make arrangements like you are planning for your wedding day to ensure she doesn''t end up as the main attraction!

 

[Independent Gal]

Jas, it depends what you mean by 'meaningful'. We can make small talk about silly things... clothes, jewelry, her job, etc. I try to let her do all teh talking because if you give her juuuust a little bit of room, she starts meddling. E.g., it is CRITICAL that she not know where guests will be staying, which vendors I've booked, etc. She's always trying to get that kidn of info and you never know if it's because she's just interested, or whether she's up to something. I won't even tell her my fiance's last name until I have to, because I wouldn't put it past her to look him up and start calling him. Or his parents across the ocean. Or whatever.

But if I say something serious like 'it hurts my feelings when you do x' or 'could I ask you not to do y', a typical response would be 'I don't know why YOUR FATHER thinks that you can XYZ! I am just TIRED of your constant ABC. DON'T you understand how much I DO for your grandmother. You people don't appreciate ANYTHING. I'm not PUTTING UP WITH THIS. And why does your FATHER think he can get away with blah blah blah. I've had ENOUGH. You're such a little QRS! Drop dead you!' etc. Logic is consistently met with dissipate rage that seems to stem from the fact that my father was ever born. Sorry! I wasn't there! Nothing to do with me. Not really his fault either!

I have yet to figure out if there's any way of having her actually HEAR me. So mostly I just stop talking.

But I WILL put my foor SEIROUSLY down when it comes to the wedding, whether or not it upsets my grammy. Grammy's a big girl too. She will understand and she will cope.

ETA: Oh, and just to be clear, my father does PLENTY for my grammy too, as do we grandkids. He calls her every single day. He visits her or takes her out two or three times a week when he isn't traveling for work. He helps her with her groceries.... and we kids call her at least once a week, write her letters, and visit her practically every day when we're in town.

 

[laine]

Hey IG--Sorry you're dealing with this, it doesn't sound like fun. I imagine logical arguments don't help much, because she is so completely illogical and irrational. Not to diagnose a complete stranger or anything, but it sounds a bit like histrionic personality disorder. Take a look at the info on it--it may give you an idea on how to approach her. Good luck!

 

[Harleigh]

Oh, Indy, you poor thing!

I am so sorry that you are having to deal with this. I completely agree a warning to ALL of your vendors is necessary, along with "Wanted" posters of dear ol'' Aunt F so they ALL know who to look for on your wedding day! Hee hee! Sorry...I know I''m not being very helpful here, I was just picturing all of your vendors looking at your aunt funny and for once making HER wonder what''s wrong with her!

It definitely sounds like she is a bit unbalanced...we have one of those on my dad''s side of the family, I guess she''s my half-aunt, and luckily she lives in Wisconsin. She has alienated everyone in the family so that no one, not even her grown children, will have anything to do with her. It''s sad, but that''s what her actions have resulted in after years of torment and anguish for everyone else.

Best of luck, hon...we''re all here for you!

 

[diamondfan]

I am sorry for your troubles with this, Indy/

From my completely armchair view, she has some mental instability and I do not think talking to her will really matter. She is not going to process what you say, so you must contain her as best as you can (but I cannot see how, aside from chaining her to her bed the day of your wedding). Sorry to sound harsh, but it seems like a bit more than a lack of a filter...it sounds more problematic than that...though I cannot really assess what and to what degree...

 

[monarch64]

Damn, IG, can you slip her a mickey on your wedding day? Just kidding, of course...unless that were actually a possibility?

Sorry you''re having to deal with this behavior from her, I hope she settles down about things and handles herself appropriately. Crossing my fingers for ya.

I have a semi-crazy auntie...she''s my mom''s youngest sister and she has no filter either. She will say the most inappropriate things at the worst possible times and then think it''s the funniest thing in the world much to the dismay of everyone else around her. My mom actually had a "chat" with her before my bridal shower and wedding, and lo and behold she was on her best behavior. Not one bit of crazy emerged, amazingly!

 

[firebirdgold]

Is it too late to Elope?

My sister and I use to joke about getting some valium and slipping it into our mother''s drink for thanksgiving and other events. Sounds to me like you might want to seriously consider it.

Sorry, not much advice on how to deal with her. She''s clearly nuts ( and not bi-polar thank you very much). So all I can do is send a *hug* your way!

 

[Ellen]

Date: 8/13/2007 11:59:51 AM
Author: IndieJones
Is it too late to Elope?

My sister and I use to joke about getting some valium and slipping it into our mother''s drink for thanksgiving and other events. Sounds to me like you might want to seriously consider it.

Sorry, not much advice on how to deal with her. She''s clearly nuts ( and not bi-polar thank you very much). So all I can do is send a *hug* your way!

Who said she was? If you''re referring to my post, I was talking about a possible illness of my sister, not her aunt.