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Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - thoughts?

niina

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 23, 2016
Messages
16
As I am no expert in diamonds I would appreciate all comments about this GIA #1239742482 -diamond?
No picture :(sad

http://www.gia.edu/report-check?reportno=1239742482



GIA Report Number ........................................ 1239742482
Shape and Cutting Style ............................ Round Brilliant
Measurements ................................ 7.35 - 7.40 x 4.53 mm

Carat Weight ......................................................... 1.51 carat
Color Grade .......................................................................... H
Clarity Grade .......................................................................SI1
Cut Grade ............................................................... Excellent

Polish ...................................................................... Excellent
Symmetry .............................................................. Excellent
Fluorescence .................................................. Medium Blue
Inscription(s): GIA 1239742482, H&A
Comments: Clouds, pinpoints and surface graining are
not shown.

Depth 61.5 %
Table 56 %
Crown Angle 32.5°
Crown Height 14.0%
Pavilion Angle 41.0°
Pavilion Depth 43.5%
Star Length 45%
Lower Half 75%
Girdle Medium to Slightly Thick, Faceted, 4.0%
Culet None

Maybe I am a bit worried about fluorescence in SI1, should I ?
I am looking for one with diameter above 7.1mm (so that it would fit beautifully with the old ones)...
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Hi Niina,

medium fluor and SI1 is usually fine. Transparency and haziness is more of an issue in very strong fluor (very occasionally at that) and even rarer in strong fluor.

The diamond has a shallow crown, and they can be more predisposed to chipping. The angles are complementary but the diamond will favour bright white return rather than a firey diamond with lots of scintillation.

Is there any reason why you are buying an SI1 diamond without a picture with these proportions? I'm also weary that on the inscription there is H&A. These are usually not true H&A and someone has chosen to inscribe it into the diamond. This does NOT mean GIA think it's H&A. GIA will inscribe into the diamond anything they are told to, so people may falsely (purposely or not) label stones as H&A.

If you tell us your budget and requirements we can help find you find that is more ideally cut within budget with photographic evidence!
 

niina

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 23, 2016
Messages
16
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Thanks a lot for the reply :)

I have been looking the diamond in EU and my budget would be around 10k€.
This means around 8-8.5k$ if considering ones outside EU (because of taxes).

My wish is to find one shiny brilliant with diameter above 7.1mm.
I have seen once 1ct H/SI1 and it looked beautiful. That was the reason I was looking SI1 diamonds, no other reason :)
I have tried couple of different sizes and found out the the best would be around 7.1mm or a bit more (for example the 1ct was a bit too small compared to my other two channel set princess cut diamond rings).
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

I'm not at all negating SI1, in fact personally I think theres not much point buying much cleaner if you look hard enough as eye clean SI1's are not that rare. But they are often not eye clean so I wouldn't buy an SI1 without a video ideally or an image and gemologist assurance that it is eyeclean.

Will try look for you later. If you drop to an I colour you can probably get a well cut diamond possibly around 7.3/7.4mm spread. Would this be OK?
 

niina

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 23, 2016
Messages
16
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

If there is a possibility that I-colour seems a bit yellow, then I rather take smaller size with brighter colour.
But as I said I am no expert in these. I just have been told that H-colour seems white and one can not tell the difference between H to D colours (if not seen many many diamonds).
 

Diamond_Hawk

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Apr 8, 2014
Messages
1,221
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Maybe I am a bit worried about fluorescence in SI1, should I ?

As I'm in the trade, I cannot comment on specific diamonds but I can tell you that fluorescence affects every diamond differently. The best thing to do with diamonds with fluorescence is to look at the actual diamond or work with a company that will have a gemologist inspect it and tell you if there is a noticeable effect.
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,183
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

gm89uk|1479911781|4101847 said:
Hi Niina,

medium fluor and SI1 is usually fine. Transparency and haziness is more of an issue in very strong fluor (very occasionally at that) and even rarer in strong fluor.

The diamond has a shallow crown, and they can be more predisposed to chipping. The angles are complementary but the diamond will favour bright white return rather than a firey diamond with lots of scintillation.

Is there any reason why you are buying an SI1 diamond without a picture with these proportions? I'm also weary that on the inscription there is H&A. These are usually not true H&A and someone has chosen to inscribe it into the diamond. This does NOT mean GIA think it's H&A. GIA will inscribe into the diamond anything they are told to, so people may falsely (purposely or not) label stones as H&A.

If you tell us your budget and requirements we can help find you find that is more ideally cut within budget with photographic evidence!
HI gm89uk!
I have not had this experience........are there stats or other factors that you know of that would back the statement that shallower crowns are more likely to chip?
I'm only asking because it does seem that sometimes aspects that are highly unlikely to occur get factored in.....
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Rockdiamond|1480102711|4102578 said:
HI gm89uk!
I have not had this experience........are there stats or other factors that you know of that would back the statement that shallower crowns are more likely to chip?
I'm only asking because it does seem that sometimes aspects that are highly unlikely to occur get factored in.....
Hello Rockdiamond, it honestly seems like something that is just regurgitated around here but I have never seen any proof of it. Since posting that I've been following the other thread with the point Pyramid made which was refreshing to read :clap:

Nina, I advise that you go into a local store and look at GIA / AGS graded stones, and view some H and I stones in various lightning conditions and see if the I appears yellow. Well cut stones are like mirrors that will face up very white, so may only notice a slit tint from the side if at all, in an I. A cut above are beautiful stones that will face up especially white, because they are so well cut.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3227665.htm
This lets you hit the 7.1mm mark but is an SI2 and it states to enquire about eyecleaniness. I would necessarily post it from any other site, but they have branded it with their ACA brand so it might be worth chatting to them about it

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3690183.htm This looks beautiful, not sure why it didn't make the ACA grade, best to ask them. I'm sure it'll be very pretty

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3690183.htm This has an inclusion under the table but has been labelled eyeclean.
 

Wink

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 3, 2001
Messages
7,473
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

niina|1480059162|4102442 said:
If there is a possibility that I-colour seems a bit yellow, then I rather take smaller size with brighter colour.
But as I said I am no expert in these. I just have been told that H-colour seems white and one can not tell the difference between H to D colours (if not seen many many diamonds).
I personally love a well cut G-H-I colored diamond and find them to be very whitish looking. However, I do not like that you have been told you will not see a difference between H to D colors. The face up color may be very nearly the same, depending on how well the diamond is cut, the better the cutting, the better the face up appearance. With great cutting, even a J-K colored diamond will appear very whitish face up.

However, looking from the side, it will be easy to clearly see the difference from a D and an H, even if both are not present at the same time. The other fact being dismissed out of hand by what you have been told is that some people are very color sensitive and others are not. None of us here can answer the question as to which you are. Only you can do that, and to do that you will need to see the diamond involved.

Like Rockdiamond, I cannot comment on this specific diamond, but I think you need to visit some local jewelers and see some diamonds to learn what your eyes like. I suggest finding at least one who deals in true Hearts and Arrows quality cutting to determine what YOUR eyes like in the way of cutting as well.

Wink
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,183
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

gm89uk|1480104861|4102587 said:
Rockdiamond|1480102711|4102578 said:
HI gm89uk!
I have not had this experience........are there stats or other factors that you know of that would back the statement that shallower crowns are more likely to chip?
I'm only asking because it does seem that sometimes aspects that are highly unlikely to occur get factored in.....
Hello Rockdiamond, it honestly seems like something that is just regurgitated around here but I have never seen any proof of it. Since posting that I've been following the other thread with the point Pyramid made which was refreshing to read :clap:

Nina, I advise that you go into a local store and look at GIA / AGS graded stones, and view some H and I stones in various lightning conditions and see if the I appears yellow. Well cut stones are like mirrors that will face up very white, so may only notice a slit tint from the side if at all, in an I. A cut above are beautiful stones that will face up especially white, because they are so well cut.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3227665.htm
This lets you hit the 7.1mm mark but is an SI2 and it states to enquire about eyecleaniness. I would necessarily post it from any other site, but they have branded it with their ACA brand so it might be worth chatting to them about it

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3690183.htm This looks beautiful, not sure why it didn't make the ACA grade, best to ask them. I'm sure it'll be very pretty

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3690183.htm This has an inclusion under the table but has been labelled eyeclean.

Got it! I think it's valuable to find the oft repeated, yet inaccurate things here on PS and point them out. IMO, this is in that category.
There may ( or may not) be reasons to bu this diamond- but risk of chipping is not among them.

Carry on y'all!
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Rockdiamond|1480106127|4102592 said:
Got it! I think it's valuable to find the oft repeated, yet inaccurate things here on PS and point them out. IMO, this is in that category.
There may ( or may not) be reasons to bu this diamond- but risk of chipping is not among them.

Carry on y'all!
Yes I think it's good to tidy up old recycled misnomers that get passed around as facts every now and again!
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,183
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

gm89uk|1480114660|4102619 said:
Rockdiamond|1480106127|4102592 said:
Got it! I think it's valuable to find the oft repeated, yet inaccurate things here on PS and point them out. IMO, this is in that category.
There may ( or may not) be reasons to bu this diamond- but risk of chipping is not among them.

Carry on y'all!
Yes I think it's good to tidy up old recycled misnomers that get passed around as facts every now and again!
:angel:
 

carbonquest

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 4, 2016
Messages
26
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

I can see some people have already posted some Whiteflash options:

But here is one for $8000 (and would equate to under 10k once you do UK tax): http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3738898.htm

Or you can compare these 3 diamonds:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3718109,3738898,3706895


Lovely diamonds and much better than that original shallow crown angle you posted. not to mention, as its an ACA, it is cut to one of the highest levels in the World - far better than anything you'll find in the UK
 

gm89uk

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
May 26, 2015
Messages
1,449
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Rockdiamond|1480117346|4102631 said:
gm89uk|1480114660|4102619 said:
Rockdiamond|1480106127|4102592 said:
Got it! I think it's valuable to find the oft repeated, yet inaccurate things here on PS and point them out. IMO, this is in that category.
There may ( or may not) be reasons to bu this diamond- but risk of chipping is not among them.

Carry on y'all!
Yes I think it's good to tidy up old recycled misnomers that get passed around as facts every now and again!
:angel:
Somewhat more accurate explanation regarding shallow crown and chipping

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/shallow-crown-and-chipping-risks.172159/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/shallow-crown-and-chipping-risks.172159/[/URL]
 

niina

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 23, 2016
Messages
16
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

Thank you all for the replys :)

If I undestood right Whiteflash ACA certified diamonds would be a safe to buy.
Please comment on these two:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3260767.htm

This one is H/SI1 (same as I have already seen) but there are quite much twinning wisps, crystals and clouds in the certificate.
Is that not a problem?

And this one, also H/SI1:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3698987.htm

Looks so very beautiful too and is more "clean" to my eye, but the price is ofcourse more than I have planned..


(It might be hard to find good selection of different diamonds in my nearest city as it is so so small :) but I definitely should try and ask.)
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,183
Re: Medium blue fluorescence in SI1 clarity diamond - though

gm89uk|1480171203|4102730 said:
Rockdiamond|1480117346|4102631 said:
gm89uk|1480114660|4102619 said:
Rockdiamond|1480106127|4102592 said:
Got it! I think it's valuable to find the oft repeated, yet inaccurate things here on PS and point them out. IMO, this is in that category.
There may ( or may not) be reasons to bu this diamond- but risk of chipping is not among them.

Carry on y'all!
Yes I think it's good to tidy up old recycled misnomers that get passed around as facts every now and again!
:angel:
Somewhat more accurate explanation regarding shallow crown and chipping

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/shallow-crown-and-chipping-risks.172159/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/shallow-crown-and-chipping-risks.172159/[/URL]
So people don;t need to click around, here's David Atlas' explanation of why he feels a shallow crown can lead to greater possibility of chipping:
Oldminer|1329948102|3131910 said:
A diamond with a shallow crown angle, less than 30 degrees, with a thicker girdle is likely to get little nicks and tiny chips over time which are no big deal. Combine a shallow crown angle with a very thin or extremely thin girdle and you vastly increase the chance for a far more damaging chip, larger nick, cleavage or a facture which can compromise the whole stone on occasion. Usually, the damage a person gets in normal wear is not a complete loss of the diamond, but it can be a major problem requiring substantial weight loss and a major cutting cost.

Diamonds are vrey durable, but brittle and you can chip and cleave them, especially if they have a weak zone. We don't see lots of damaged diamonds, but when it happens, you can certainly undrestand the sentimental attachment issues that can't ever be fixed.
From a mechanical standpoint, what David is saying makes sense- BUT- we'd need to really exaggerate the issues for the differences to be meaningful.
For example- a very thin girdle combined with a very shallow crown. I mean really shallow- maybe below 30 degrees. There's no possibility of both of those aspects existing on a GIA VG or EX cut graded round diamond.
 
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