Major Rant

[clearfading]

Sorry but I know this happens all too often to us PSers and is SO frustrating. I brought this lovely step cut I am inspecting to a local jeweler who is a "GIA graduate gemologist" and I hate that I had to pay him a cent. I knew more than him. How do these people graduate and not know this stuff? He said, "What was that, a radiant? I didn't get a good look at it" When he had it under 10x loupe and inspected it for minutes! Then he said diamonds are graded FACE up!! I told him that diamonds are graded face down. He said, "No they are cut to display light from the top so they are graded face up." It was just a waste of time and money.

 

[Arcadian]

I would have been rude and said "surely you didn't mean that". Now if he did, I would have then asked if he was high.

 

[cherij0411]

I was at a jewelry store the other day and the estate buyer was clueless as well

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I'd have asked for my money back if he called my step cut a radiant.

I take it y'all were talking about color grading since clarity is graded from top and sides/pavilion. Sometime you'll have to let me know which jewelry store never to go to.

 

[yssie]

One of my most vivid memories of high school is one particular day in physics class.

Our class was split into two halves - Newtonian and Transformative. The second half - optics and thermodynamics - I loved, but pulleys, levers, free body diagrams? Ugh.

One day we watched a video of some hobby group shooting homemade rockets. It was a very short video, poorly taken, mostly featuring a faceless child yapping about how he’d had to tweak this, that, the other to make sure it landed in the way he wanted this time because he’d lost the last one he’d made and his parents said materials were expensive...

It didn’t occur to me until after school that day that this boy wouldn’t have needed flashcards to learn those equations the way I did. He wouldn’t have my problem of being unable to remember them for more than a week at a time - they, and all their context and background and implications, would come as naturally to him as sleeping. He knew the material I struggled with so well that he could build on it without guidance.

Hobbyists are typically masters of their craft. It is, to me, entirely unsurprising that a hobbyist would be more knowledgeable about his field of interest than someone whose expertise is measured solely in certifications and schooling and for whom the topic is not of personal passion. You are on a forum of diamond hobbyists: selecting an appraiser who participates here, or who comes highly recommended by other enthusiasts, is one easy, surefire way to ensure your chosen professional has the expertise you’re looking for.

 

[Gussie]

When my son had leukemia his oncologist told me that the parents of children with leukemia know more about the disease and it's treatment than anyone else (including most doctors) besides the oncologists. So @yssie your point is so true that when there is a real interest in anything, be it a hobby or something else, people can and do learn the subject well.

 

[yssie]

Off topic - @ceg I’m sorry to hear that your son and your family went through that

 

[Arcadian]

I'd have asked for my money back if he called my step cut a radiant.

I take it y'all were talking about color grading since clarity is graded from top and sides/pavilion. Sometime you'll have to let me know which jewelry store never to go to.

For diamonds this is something thats a known thing if you've been here a while. Its also noted on gia.edu's own website by the orientation of the diamonds https://www.gia.edu/gia-about-4Cs-Color. Sure 'Id ask for clarification to make sure I knew what s/he was talking about; its the polite thing to do, but yeah I'd still ask if they were high or not. (hey I live in Florida, sometimes you just gotta know....lol)

 

[denverappraiser]

FWIW, clarity is graded face up. Color (except for fancy) is graded face down. Polish and symmetry are graded from all directions. That said, GIA has a lot of graduates. Some learned more than others. Some remember more than others. If you've got a college degree you surely understand what I mean. Just because they graduated doesn't mean they learned anything, nor does it mean they remember.

 

[WinkHPD]

It is legend in the trade that the most dangerous person to a jewelry store's financial health is a recently graduated gemologist from GIA. As someone coming from the Marine Corps to the jewelry business, I got my GG before my first job in the jewelry field. It took me many more years to learn the jewelry business.

In my opinion, a GG (graduate gemologist) degree is a great start to a career in jewelry, but from there you must learn ever so much more. Any recent graduate coming to Pricescope is going to discover that there is a whole world of technicalities about cutting that were not at all discussed in their undergraduate work. It will take many more hours of study to begin to understand what many here take for granted.

Those of you who have been here for more than ten to fifteen years will remember the great "Cut Wars" threads. Long and hotly contested threads about the intricacies of cut and what various things meant. The introduction of the Ideal-Scope and then eventually the ASET and the cut grade system brought forth by the AGSL when GIA steadfastly refused to do so for years. (Which then forced the GIA to introduce their own system, which most cut connoisseurs view as woefully lacking.)

These were wars between highly educated professionals for the most part, along with some intensely focused members of Pricescope who were not, at least then, members of the trade, but who had a deep interest in understanding cut. Those wars gave rise to the Prosumers here who are so helpful to new posters.

It is a fascinating place and I treasure the educational back and forth that takes place here. There is so much to learn from so many and even the most educated can not help but to learn something during their time here.

Wink

 

[clearfading]

FWIW Yes, I was referring to his color grading method FACE UP!! I asked him to turn stone over to color estimate it since they are graded bottom up. He never turned stone over and said his thing about they are graded face up, light reflected out top blah blah. I see the validity of the hobbyists point. I'd rather have been the one getting paid to more fairly estimate someone's stone than to be paying him to waste my time and money with a useless estimate.

 

[JDDN]

FWIW, clarity is graded face up. Color (except for fancy) is graded face down. Polish and symmetry are graded from all directions. That said, GIA has a lot of graduates. Some learned more than others. Some remember more than others. If you've got a college degree you surely understand what I mean. Just because they graduated doesn't mean they learned anything, nor does it mean they remember.

I totally hear what you're saying but I have to say that in getting any kind of degree, one hopes that the graduate has a minimum level of understanding and knowledge of at least the basics. Otherwise, the degree means nothing. Sure, some will have mastered the material more than others upon graduation and that holds true after some years in the profession when experience is factored in. But gosh, I hope that there's at least some amount of the professional knowledge that is circulating around their noggin! But maybe not in clearfading's experience!! It's not like the gemologist didn't know some rare obscure thing!

 

[Bonfire]

FWIW, clarity is graded face up. Color (except for fancy) is graded face down. Polish and symmetry are graded from all directions. That said, GIA has a lot of graduates. Some learned more than others. Some remember more than others. If you've got a college degree you surely understand what I mean. Just because they graduated doesn't mean they learned anything, nor does it mean they remember.

So true denverappraiser. That reminds me of the joke, “What do you call the person who graduated at the bottom of the class in Med. school? Doctor.”

 

[JoJa12345]

I once went to a jeweler that told me I had to trust him (after I questioned him on some things)~ he then told me several inaccurate facts about diamonds . It was when I first started learning about diamonds and a newbie on pricescope… I often think of my experience at that jewelry store and am SO relieved I never purchased anything from there. Scary that I knew more than he did even back then ~ even scarier....I don't make my living selling diamonds ~ he does!!
What makes me sad is that they get 5 star reviews and I’ve even had people refer them (they got their engagement rings from them). I feel like I’m in an awkward position because I can’t say anything bad about the place because I would basically be telling them their e-ring is bad.
I do wish more jewelers had the desire to learn more about the product they are selling, instead of just selling a product..

 

[flyingpig]

GIA G.G. means absolutely nothing to me. It is like WSET certificate in the wine industry.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

This is why I only buy diamonds and jewelry from jewelers I have found here.

I said something wrong above and wanted to correct it after reading Neil's post. Clarity is graded from the top, but inclusions are plotted on a top view and pavilion view diagram.