Living together before marriage

[kcoursolle]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:07:39 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i would disagree that the divorce rate has remained stagnant since the mid-80s. the last stat i heard was the high 50s and growing!

This is partially false. Despite the media''s continued attention at exaggerating divorce trends...evidence from journals says that the chance of a first marriage ending in divorce peaked in the 1980''s and then levelled out. However, unfortunately due to data constraints, we have no idea what is currently going on in divroce trends from about 1995 onward...

 

[musey]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:16:21 PM
Author: poptart
Ha ha Musey, you can tell you did this for you class! You sound like me when I have written a 15 page paper and I'm just giving information left and right about everything I have written. Gotta love school!

HA!! I know, isn't it ridiculous? I'm in complete "library" mode doin my academic journals, etc. etc.

10 sources minimum! 7 must be academic journals, 2 from approved textbooks, and one of your choice that must be approved by the professor and BOTH Ta's!

hahaha, I feel like a total nerd

ETA: now off for RING SHOPPING with the BF! so no more cohabitation stats for me for at least.... 3 hours....

 

[galeteia]

Date: 12/10/2006 9:25:02 AM
Author: ladykemma
...runs and gets popcorn.....

*offers to swap some twizzlers for a handful of LK''s popcorn*

 

[indecisive]

Date: 12/10/2006 6:18:23 PM
Author: musey

P.S. If you want the sources for those stats, they''re all from the following academic journals/books that I used to write a term paper on this a couple of weeks ago. Do not trust the internet for statistics, anyone can write ANYTHING and publish it online as ''fact.''

Journal of Marriage and the Family
American Sociological Review vol. 53(1)
Demography vol. 42
Population: An English Selection vol. 9
Law & Social Inquiry vol. 23(1)
The Future of Children vol. 15(2)
Continuity and Change in the American Family by Lynne Casper (my professor)

Thank you! It gets me so irritated when people will quote anonymous sources from the internet and think it is fact... or anecdotal evidence. I was a science major so it is all peer reviewed academic journals for me!

 

[poptart]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:22:32 PM
Author: musey

Date: 12/10/2006 7:16:21 PM
Author: poptart
Ha ha Musey, you can tell you did this for you class! You sound like me when I have written a 15 page paper and I''m just giving information left and right about everything I have written. Gotta love school!

HA!! I know, isn''t it ridiculous? I''m in complete ''library'' mode doin my academic journals, etc. etc.

10 sources minimum! 7 must be academic journals, 2 from approved textbooks, and one of your choice that must be approved by the professor and BOTH Ta''s!

hahaha, I feel like a total nerd

ETA: now off for RING SHOPPING with the BF! so no more cohabitation stats for me for at least.... 3 hours....

Oh, no more paper talk, I beg of you! I can''t take anymore papers and am SO ready for this break!

*M*

 

[kcoursolle]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:37:30 PM
Author: indecisive

Date: 12/10/2006 6:18:23 PM
Author: musey

P.S. If you want the sources for those stats, they''re all from the following academic journals/books that I used to write a term paper on this a couple of weeks ago. Do not trust the internet for statistics, anyone can write ANYTHING and publish it online as ''fact.''

Journal of Marriage and the Family
American Sociological Review vol. 53(1)
Demography vol. 42
Population: An English Selection vol. 9
Law & Social Inquiry vol. 23(1)
The Future of Children vol. 15(2)
Continuity and Change in the American Family by Lynne Casper (my professor)

Thank you! It gets me so irritated when people will quote anonymous sources from the internet and think it is fact... or anecdotal evidence. I was a science major so it is all peer reviewed academic journals for me!

I probably should have cited as well. I don''t have time to look up all of the cohabitation literature, but here are a couple to get people started if they are actually into this stuff:

This article talks about racial differences in the relationship betwee cohabitation and divorce
Phillips, Julie A. and Megan M. Sweeney. 2005. "Premarital Cohabitation and the Risk of Marital Disruption among White, Black, and Mexican American Women." Journal of Marriage and Family 67:296-314.

Although this article focuses on racial differences in divorce, the beginning gives a pretty clear review of recent overall trends in divorce over time (i.e. whether divorce has levelled out in recent periods):
Sweeney, Megan M. and Julie A. Phillips. 2004. "Understanding Racial Differences in Marital Disruption: Recent Trends and Explanations." Journal of Marriage and Family 66:239-250.

 

[RoseAngel04]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:06:43 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 12/10/2006 6:57:37 PM
Author: musey

Date: 12/10/2006 6:41:19 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
you marry for love, not for dusting or dirty laundry or clutter. besides, you (plural) learn about habits even without living with a person. to me, because i feel strongly against living together before marriage, because its pretty shallow and insecure if dirty laundry or clutter or ocd cleaning determines compatability or whether or not you will love a person.

I hesitate to speak for anyone else, but I do think that we are not talking about habits of cleanliness as what we'd want to learn about pre-knot. There are much bigger issues (spending habits/financial priorities being only one). I appreciate the sentiment of 'marrying for love,' but for a large portion of the population, marriage is not as simple as 'love is all you need.'

Case in point: my lovely cousin got engaged about this time three years ago, after dating her boyfriend for four. They chose to have a short engagement; they were in love, the parents approved, everyone in her family LOVED this guy. They moved in together for a 'trial marriage,' and they both agreed that they would act 100% as though they were married. Not two weeks in, my cousin made an Emergency Room visit: she wanted to go out with her girlfriends, he said she 'belonged' to him now as they were 'married,' and long story short she ended up with a broken arm and twin shiners on her face

Had they not 'trial marriage-d' before their wedding day, she would have discovered this after it was too late to simply walk away.

THIS is an extreme case, but after witnessing all this I can't really see the argument for **unconditional** love.


ETA: TravellingGal--same thought at almost the same moment! Romantic love is nearly impossible to make unconditional, as much as we may want it to be.

Yup, I agree. Unconditional love is something they preach at you at church so you don't go running out and getting divorce. Yet almost every church group I've ever been to would be understanding if someone divorced a wife beater. While it doesn't say it in the bible that you can divorce such low lifes (at least I don't think so), it certainly does say that husbands are supposed to love their wives as Christ loved the church, so that seems like an out to me.

I grew up in church and still retain my faith, as it is important to me. But I just think that unconditional love thing is too unrealistic. Even between a parent and child, love sometimes goes awry.

Some people are just less capable of loving others more than themselves.

Love within a marriage should be unconditional, unconditional love for an imperfect person. Just as you mentioned that husbands are instructed to love their wife as Christ loves the church, Christs love IS UNCONDITIONAL. Therefore that is what we should strive for. I'm talking to Christians, so if you're a non-believer then you most likely don't take interest in what the Bible says about marriage. We as humans are in no way perfect creatures, therefore unconditional love at times in some marriages doesn't work. So, within my own marriage I will strive to unconditionally love my husband the way Christ loves the church. The church as times (and the church is the ppl not the structure) disobeys God and his word, but he still loves us. This is my belief of what marriage was intended to be. Will my future husband make mistakes, most definitley, as will I. But I will still love him inspite of his flaws. Breaking one's vows and cheating etc is observable by God as grounds for divorce. Yes, God does look down at divorce for it isn't part of his plan.

I'm sorry it looks like I've rambled on longer than I hoped for. I believe this is what bibliobaggins meant of unconditional love?!? ETA: But maybe not.

As for the living together before marriage (what this thread is suppose to be about), FI and I with our religious beliefs will not be doing until we take our vows. Not judging anyone at all, just as I would hope noone judge us that we aren't living with one another before marriage.

 

[biblobaggins23]

even with major life changes and personalities changing, that still goes for couples who have lived together prior marriage.

i think some people who co-habitat prior marriage may be pluralistically ignorant of the studies and stats and are following trends even with research that shows its not a good idea based on the studies i have found.....

"Several studies have shown that a couple who live together before marriage are more likely to split up (or to go on to divorce), after marriage. There have been British and Scandinavian social studies which have linked the rise in divorce with the rise in cohabitation. And now comes an American study which has produced the same results. David Popenoe of Rutgers University and Alan Booth of Pennsylvania State University have conducted the study which shows that couples who live together before marrage are 48 percent more likely to get divorced than those who do not.

Moreover, living together doubles the risk of wife-battering and child abuse. Cohabiting couples also register lower "happiness levels" than those who have married. Living together, David Popenoe concludes, "is not a good way to prepare for marriage or to avoid divorce." Alan Booth says of the profile of permanent cohabitees: "They show a lot of symptoms of depression. Their relationships are not stable, especially if there are children."

from http://www.ad2000.com.au/articles/1999/apr1999p12_366.html


Marriage Myth 5: Couples who live together before marriage, and are thus able to test how well suited they are for each other, have more satisfying and longer-lasting marriages than couples who do not.

Fact: Many studies have found that those who live together before marriage have less satisfying marriages and a considerably higher chance of eventually breaking up. One reason is that people who cohabit may be more skittish of commitment and more likely to call it quits when problems arise. But in addition, the very act of living together may lead to attitudes that make happy marriages more difficult. The findings of one recent study, for example, suggest "there may be less motivation for cohabiting partners to develop their conflict resolution and support skills." (One important exception: Cohabiting couples who are already planning to marry each other in the near future have just as good a chance at staying together as couples who don't live together before marriage).

Marriage Myth 9: Cohabitation is just like marriage, but without "the piece of paper."

Fact: Cohabitation typically does not bring the benefits — in physical health, wealth and emotional wellbeing — that marriage does. In terms of these benefits, cohabitants in the United States more closely resemble singles than married couples. This is due, in part, to the fact that cohabitants tend not to be as committed as married couples, and they are more oriented toward their own personal autonomy and less to the well-being of their partner.

Copyright 2002 by David Popenoe, the National Marriage Project at Rutgers University, New Brunswick, N.J.

from http://health.discovery.com/centers/loverelationships/articles/marriage_myths.html

report by david popenoe, a major researcher in this area.
http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publications/SWLT2%20TEXT.htm

Nevertheless, the research is now clear. Cohabitation prior to marriage serves to undermine, rather than to strengthen the marital bond. Here's how Wartik summarizes the research: "Couples who move in together before marriage have up to two times the odds of divorce, as compared with couples who marry before living together. Moreover, married couples who have lived together before exchanging vows tend to have poorer-quality marriages than couples who moved in after the wedding. Those who cohabited first report less satisfaction, more arguing, poorer communication and lower levels of commitment." -- The Cohabitation Trap: When 'Just Living Together' Sabotages Love," by Nancy Wartik, in Pyschology Today http://www.albertmohler.com/commentary_read.php?cdate=2005-08-16

http://www.emediawire.com/releases/2006/5/emw382860.htm

" 'Claire M. Kamp Dush, doctoral candidate in human development and family studies, is first author of the study. She says, "It had been consistently shown in the past that, contrary to the popular belief that living together will improve a person's ability to choose a marriage partner and stay married, the opposite is actually the case." " Dush's findings were printed in the article: 'The Relationship Between Cohabitation and Marital Quality and Stability: Change Across Cohorts?," was published this month in the Journal of Marriage and the Family. Dush is at Penn State University. Dush's co-authors are Dr. Catherine Cohan, research scientist, and Dr. Paul Amato, professor of sociology and demography.

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/07/24/cdc.marriagereport/index.html a study by the CDC also finds that living together before marriage increases divorce

http://www.stcdio.org/omf/marriage-ministry/7ReasonWhy.htm and lists tons of scholarly articles to back it up in the bibliography

"Living Together Pre-Marriage May Lead to Divorce " http://alpha.montclair.edu/~DavidsonM/Living_Together_Divorce.html


"Living Together: What Aren't They Telling You?" http://www.gnmagazine.org/issues/gn41/livingtogether.htm

Does Cohabitation Protect Against Divorce? http://www.citizenlink.org/fosi/marriage/A000000882.cfm

Cohabitation: The marriage enemy http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/columnists/lovemarriage/love4.htm

"Live-In And Learn" http://health.yahoo.com/topic/relationships/other/article/pt/Psychology_Today_articles_pto-20001101-000012

http://marriage.about.com/od/cohabitation/qt/cohabfacts.htm lists other studies which show its not a good idea.

 

[poptart]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:36:02 PM
Author: Galateia

Date: 12/10/2006 9:25:02 AM
Author: ladykemma
...runs and gets popcorn.....

*offers to swap some twizzlers for a handful of LK''s popcorn*

.... decides the discussion is on the verge of becoming volatile... sits quietly on the couch next to LK and Galateia. Chocolate pudding, anyone?....

*M*

 

[TravelingGal]

lol, I think your source is a bit biased...

David Popenoe is professor of sociology at Rutgers University, where he is also co-director of the National Marriage Project and former social and behavioral sciences dean. He specializes in the study of family and community life in modern societies and is the author or editor of nine books. His most recent books are Life Without Father: Compelling New Evidence That Fatherhood and Marriage Are Indispensable for the Good of Children and Society and Promises to Keep: Decline and Renewal of Marriage in America.


You''re entitled to your opinion. I''d be more interested in hearing about your own life experience with this issue (oh wait...that''s right, you aren''t married yet) than reading about all these random studies that proclaim things as "fact."

 

[biblobaggins23]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:17:41 PM
Author: kcoursolle

Date: 12/10/2006 7:07:39 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i would disagree that the divorce rate has remained stagnant since the mid-80s. the last stat i heard was the high 50s and growing!

This is partially false. Despite the media''s continued attention at exaggerating divorce trends...evidence from journals says that the chance of a first marriage ending in divorce peaked in the 1980''s and then levelled out. However, unfortunately due to data constraints, we have no idea what is currently going on in divroce trends from about 1995 onward...

yeah, you are right. according to the census bureau it was 50 percent, then they lowered it, then raised it now, its in the high 40s, which is what i think i meant to say.


however, regardless of the divorce rate, countless studies show, living together before marriage is not good for a married couple''s relationship.

okay, thats all i have to say, and i think i proved my point and why i am so adamant about my opinion.

i don''t judge or condemn any of y''all who do choose to live together before marriage, but be careful and good luck!!!

 

[RoseAngel04]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:52:22 PM
Author: poptart

Date: 12/10/2006 7:36:02 PM
Author: Galateia

Date: 12/10/2006 9:25:02 AM
Author: ladykemma
...runs and gets popcorn.....

*offers to swap some twizzlers for a handful of LK''s popcorn*

.... decides the discussion is on the verge of becoming volatile... sits quietly on the couch next to LK and Galateia. Chocolate pudding, anyone?....

*M*

Lol...I agree with ya''ll it''s being taken a bit too far.

 

[poptart]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:53:27 PM
Author: TravelingGal
lol, I think your source is a bit biased...

David Popenoe is professor of sociology at Rutgers University, where he is also co-director of the National Marriage Project and former social and behavioral sciences dean. He specializes in the study of family and community life in modern societies and is the author or editor of nine books. His most recent books are Life Without Father: Compelling New Evidence That Fatherhood and Marriage Are Indispensable for the Good of Children and Society and Promises to Keep: Decline and Renewal of Marriage in America.


You''re entitled to your opinion. I''d be more interested in hearing about your own life experience with this issue (oh wait...that''s right, you aren''t married yet) than reading about all these random studies that proclaim things as ''fact.''

I''m sorry, I had to speak... My mom''s a single mother and she adopted me so we have been getting this speech since the day I was born. Surprisingly, I am not, nor have I ever been, pregnant, addicted to drugs, a junvenile delinquent, academically challenged, or a plague upon society. And yet, certain "statistics" would have, and tried to, categorize me as this when I was younger. Ok, I''m done. I just get so mad when I read things like that.

*M*

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:45:35 PM
Author: RoseAngel04


Love within a marriage should be unconditional, unconditional love for an imperfect person. Just as you mentioned that husbands are instructed to love their wife as Christ loves the church, Christs love IS UNCONDITIONAL. Therefore that is what we should strive for. I''m talking to Christians, so if you''re a non-believer then you most likely don''t take interest in what the Bible says about marriage. We as humans are in no way perfect creatures, therefore unconditional love at times in some marriages doesn''t work. So, within my own marriage I will strive to unconditionally love my husband the way Christ loves the church. The church as times (and the church is the ppl not the structure) disobeys God and his word, but he still loves us. This is my belief of what marriage was intended to be. Will my future husband make mistakes, most definitley, as will I. But I will still love him inspite of his flaws. Breaking one''s vows and cheating etc is observable by God as grounds for divorce. Yes, God does look down at divorce for it isn''t part of his plan.

I''m sorry it looks like I''ve rambled on longer than I hoped for. I believe this is what bibliobaggins meant of unconditional love?!? ETA: But maybe not.

As for the living together before marriage (what this thread is suppose to be about), FI and I with our religious beliefs will not be doing until we take our vows. Not judging anyone at all, just as I would hope noone judge us that we aren''t living with one another before marriage.

RoseAngel, I fully agree that we should STRIVE for unconditional love. I''m just saying that even for christians, there are exceptions to that rule (cheating, verbal abuse, whatever.) I''m just probably arguing semantics here...as I know what you mean. I think that love IS conditional.

 

[biblobaggins23]

well, its not just david popene. its countless other researchers as well who have found the same thing in their reserarch studies as he has!!! like the center for disease control. as long as anyone does the scientific research to back up their studies and have been randomized and blind studies they are considered valid.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:58:28 PM
Author: biblobaggins23

Date: 12/10/2006 7:17:41 PM
Author: kcoursolle

Date: 12/10/2006 7:07:39 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i would disagree that the divorce rate has remained stagnant since the mid-80s. the last stat i heard was the high 50s and growing!

This is partially false. Despite the media''s continued attention at exaggerating divorce trends...evidence from journals says that the chance of a first marriage ending in divorce peaked in the 1980''s and then levelled out. However, unfortunately due to data constraints, we have no idea what is currently going on in divroce trends from about 1995 onward...

yeah, you are right. according to the census bureau it was 50 percent, then they lowered it, then raised it now, its in the high 40s, which is what i think i meant to say.


however, regardless of the divorce rate, countless studies show, living together before marriage is not good for a married couple''s relationship.

okay, thats all i have to say, and i think i proved my point and why i am so adamant about my opinion.

i don''t judge or condemn any of y''all who do choose to live together before marriage, but be careful and good luck!!!

Yes, and there are "countless" other studies that say the opposite. People will quote what the want to believe.

You are fine to have your opinion, but I don''t think you proved anything.

 

[biblobaggins23]

haha, i respect you for your opinion, but i don't think others who think its a good idea have proved anything either. i don't think that its a good idea and the research studies ranging from the CDC to David Popene to Pyschology Today to Penn State that i have found is very convincing has furthered my opinion that its a bad idea. and i would hardly consider those range of sources and others claiming it to be a bad idea biased. thanks though travelin gal.

 

[San Diego Bride]

Date: 12/10/2006 6:41:19 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
yeah, but thats what marriage is all about. its about working issues out and accepting someone as they are regardless into your life and adapting to their way of living and working out problems and still maintaining love and respect for each other that you (plural) vowed under god. to me, personally, in my opinion, i think that living together before marriage is cheating in certain aspects because you shouldn't have to live with a person to find out by living together whether or not you should marry them. you marry for love, not for dusting or dirty laundry or clutter. besides, you (plural) learn about habits even without living with a person. to me, because i feel strongly against living together before marriage, because its pretty shallow and insecure if dirty laundry or clutter or ocd cleaning determines compatability or whether or not you will love a person. i have much more respect for couples who start out fresh and continually work together despite differences. and i'll say again, in my opinion, you (plural_ are starting your marriage off with so much stress if you carry over pet peeves you knew about before you got married. everyone has their faults, and no one is ever going to be the perfect human being and no one is going to live exactly the way you live. no one is ever going to live up to your expectations, and you (plural) can't expect a person, even if you live together, to meet that ideal. if you live that way, no one will ever be the love of your life cause they won't be perfect enough. why let the love of your life go if he can't make the bed every morning?


wow. i find this very interesting. i don't understand why people feel the need to judge others.

i lived with my husband before we were married and know it was absolutely the right decision for us. we were 1000% committed to each other the day we moved in together and remained just as committed once we exchanged vows. it was not a "trial marriage". it was simply the first step in our becoming a family. living together was not a difficult adjustment for us, nor would it have been difficult if we had waited.

we made and will always make the best decisions for us as a couple. i don't know whether to find it comical or offensive that someone else would look at our lives and have "less respect" for us. luckily for us, we don't live our lives to please others. we respect ourselves and each other.

live together, don't live together. to each her own. if you don't feel it's right, then please don't do it. but it would be preferable if you didn't pass judgment either.

ETA: sorry, i obviously don't know how to quote a post correctly.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:14:01 PM
Author: novia

Date: 12/10/2006 6:41:19 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
yeah, but thats what marriage is all about. its about working issues out and accepting someone as they are regardless into your life and adapting to their way of living and working out problems and still maintaining love and respect for each other that you (plural) vowed under god. to me, personally, in my opinion, i think that living together before marriage is cheating in certain aspects because you shouldn''t have to live with a person to find out by living together whether or not you should marry them. you marry for love, not for dusting or dirty laundry or clutter. besides, you (plural) learn about habits even without living with a person. to me, because i feel strongly against living together before marriage, because its pretty shallow and insecure if dirty laundry or clutter or ocd cleaning determines compatability or whether or not you will love a person. i have much more respect for couples who start out fresh and continually work together despite differences. and i''ll say again, in my opinion, you (plural_ are starting your marriage off with so much stress if you carry over pet peeves you knew about before you got married. everyone has their faults, and no one is ever going to be the perfect human being and no one is going to live exactly the way you live. no one is ever going to live up to your expectations, and you (plural) can''t expect a person, even if you live together, to meet that ideal. if you live that way, no one will ever be the love of your life cause they won''t be perfect enough. why let the love of your life go if he can''t make the bed every morning?


wow. i find this very interesting. i don''t understand why people feel the need to judge others.

i lived with my husband before we were married and know it was absolutely the right decision for us. we were 1000% committed to each other the day we moved in together and remained just as committed once we exchanged vows. it was not a ''trial marriage''. it was simply the first step in our becoming a family. living together was not a difficult adjustment for us, nor would it have been difficult if we had waited.

we made and will always make the best decisions for us as a couple. i don''t know whether to find it comical or offensive that someone else would look at our lives and have ''less respect'' for us. luckily for us, we don''t live our lives to please others. we respect ourselves and each other.

live together, don''t live together. to each her own. if you don''t feel it''s right, then please don''t do it. but it would be preferable if you didn''t pass judgment either.

ETA: sorry, i obviously don''t know how to quote a post correctly.

No kidding novia. I have respect for ANYONE who continually and diligently works on their relationship, and not just those who start out "fresh."

 

[Kit]

Date: 12/10/2006 7:01:28 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
but why would you have to live with a person to find those things out? if you have good communication and spend time with each other and truly love a person for who they are regardless of their faults, you won''t have to live together prior to marriage because you will know about the person in all aspects of their life and know he is right for you.


for me, and my partner, we strive to love each other unconditionally and we know our faults and differences without living with each other. i know our marriage is strong and we both love god and give our marriage to god for strength. no one in either side of our family has gotten a divorce as of yet. as long as god is on our side, we have good communication, and strong marriages around us or for anyone else, in my opinion, there is no reason to live together before marriage.


to me, trial marriage is the kiss of death for a marriage.



sorry i was giving cleaning/messiness as an example....

Perhaps because you haven''t considered that many people don''t want god as a third party in their relationship, this is why you are unclear on how two people who thought they were in love realize maybe they aren''t after they married!!

I find it personally offensive that you are
a) spreading propaganda on this forum regarding co-habitation before marriage, all of which is completely unscientific and made up to scare vulnerable individuals like yourself; and
b) wishing me "luck" and telling me to be careful because I am living in "sin" (as you probably think).

Marriage is about a lot more than god and luck. It''s about hard work, shared goals, and dedication. And love certainly helps. Well anyways, I really don''t need your good luck wishes.

Oh, and one more thing I am not sure folks have yet mentioned on this thread as far as compatibility goes between two people getting married...sex! I am definitely glad I know that FI and I are 100% sexually compatible before I bind my life and future to his...would NOT want to be unpleasantly surprised in that department as a newlywed. No, you don''t have to live together to figure this one out, but it''s still an important part of marriage.

 

[biblobaggins23]

i''ve said before, i''m not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i''ll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:52 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i''ve said before, i''m not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i''ll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

Well, I''m probably more conservative than people here would think, but I believe live and let live.

You may want to reread your posts before you submit, because you definitely come across as judging.

 

[RoseAngel04]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:29:23 PM
Author: TravelingGal
Well, I''m probably more conservative than people here would think, but I believe live and let live.

You may want to reread your posts before you submit, because you definitely come across as judging.

I agree TG.

 

[Kit]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:52 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i''ve said before, i''m not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i''ll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

...beating dead horse...

I think that you have to accept that marriages in which the individuals didn''t cohabitate have ended in divorce...cohabitation is simply not what you think it is--some kind of kiss of death. Other factors contribute to divorce.

Honestly, you are really being offensive. Perhaps I am taking it too personally, but seriously you are basically saying that all of us who are cohabitating before marriage are going to get divorced! Now, I''m sure we all know this is plainly untrue, I know I do. But still, it is offensive to hear someone actually say it. I am here to tell you, your opinion on this matter is offensive so just be careful where/when you let it loose.

 

[poptart]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:37:24 PM
Author: Kit

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:52 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i''ve said before, i''m not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i''ll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

...beating dead horse...

I think that you have to accept that marriages in which the individuals didn''t cohabitate have ended in divorce...cohabitation is simply not what you think it is--some kind of kiss of death. Other factors contribute to divorce.

Honestly, you are really being offensive. Perhaps I am taking it too personally, but seriously you are basically saying that all of us who are cohabitating before marriage are going to get divorced! Now, I''m sure we all know this is plainly untrue, I know I do. But still, it is offensive to hear someone actually say it. I am here to tell you, your opinion on this matter is offensive so just be careful where/when you let it loose.

I don''t think you are taking it too personally. It certainly strikes a strong note with me as well. I''ve just learned that you can''t live to please others or prove yourself to them. It''s pointless to try, especially when there are better things that a person could be doing... like eating chocolate pudding! (can you tell I REALLLY want some??)

*M*

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:45:56 PM
Author: poptart

Date: 12/10/2006 8:37:24 PM
Author: Kit

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:52 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i've said before, i'm not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i'll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

...beating dead horse...

I think that you have to accept that marriages in which the individuals didn't cohabitate have ended in divorce...cohabitation is simply not what you think it is--some kind of kiss of death. Other factors contribute to divorce.

Honestly, you are really being offensive. Perhaps I am taking it too personally, but seriously you are basically saying that all of us who are cohabitating before marriage are going to get divorced! Now, I'm sure we all know this is plainly untrue, I know I do. But still, it is offensive to hear someone actually say it. I am here to tell you, your opinion on this matter is offensive so just be careful where/when you let it loose.

I don't think you are taking it too personally. It certainly strikes a strong note with me as well. I've just learned that you can't live to please others or prove yourself to them. It's pointless to try, especially when there are better things that a person could be doing... like eating chocolate pudding! (can you tell I REALLLY want some??)

*M*

Oh c'mon poptart...don't you know the dessert of choice on this forum is lemon pie?

 

[Kit]

Mmmmm.....pie.

 

[biblobaggins23]

yeah i understand that divorce happens to non co-habitating couples as well. i wasn't saying all co-habitating couples will get divorced nor would i intentionally imply that...i am saying the likelihood is higher based on the research i have read. you may be misconstruing what i said, my opinion was, why increase the chances? i don't think its right and i don't believe in it. i am sorry if my opinion seems offensive, but i strongly believe its wrong, however i don't judge anyone. i'm done.
apple pie please.

 

[poptart]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:48:54 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 12/10/2006 8:45:56 PM
Author: poptart

Date: 12/10/2006 8:37:24 PM
Author: Kit

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:52 PM
Author: biblobaggins23
i''ve said before, i''m not judging anyone to each his own. but from a christian standpoint and from a research standpoint as the result of studies from psych journals and the cdc, i have my own opinion and i''ll stand by it. i want all marriages to be successful.

...beating dead horse...

I think that you have to accept that marriages in which the individuals didn''t cohabitate have ended in divorce...cohabitation is simply not what you think it is--some kind of kiss of death. Other factors contribute to divorce.

Honestly, you are really being offensive. Perhaps I am taking it too personally, but seriously you are basically saying that all of us who are cohabitating before marriage are going to get divorced! Now, I''m sure we all know this is plainly untrue, I know I do. But still, it is offensive to hear someone actually say it. I am here to tell you, your opinion on this matter is offensive so just be careful where/when you let it loose.

I don''t think you are taking it too personally. It certainly strikes a strong note with me as well. I''ve just learned that you can''t live to please others or prove yourself to them. It''s pointless to try, especially when there are better things that a person could be doing... like eating chocolate pudding! (can you tell I REALLLY want some??)

*M*

Oh c''mon poptart...don''t you know the dessert of choice on this forum is lemon pie?

Oh don''t tempt me!! I have some lemon cookies in the kitchen that taste just like lemon pie!! Look what you''ve done TG... I''m off to cookie land!

*M*

 

[San Diego Bride]

Date: 12/10/2006 8:22:00 PM
Author: Kit
Oh, and one more thing I am not sure folks have yet mentioned on this thread as far as compatibility goes between two people getting married...sex! I am definitely glad I know that FI and I are 100% sexually compatible before I bind my life and future to his...would NOT want to be unpleasantly surprised in that department as a newlywed. No, you don't have to live together to figure this one out, but it's still an important part of marriage.

i respect everyone's own opinions but as far as sex is concerned this was not a shoe i was willing to buy without trying it on first!


ETA: since people are obviously a little sensitive i feel the need to preemptively defend myself and say that, no, this was not meant to belittle sex or its importance/value.