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Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope!

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Hello all,

I just bought an engagement ring!
I did some research online to figure out the 'C' that matters most to me and I have ordered them as such:
1. Cut
2. Carat
3. Clarity
4. Colour

Knowing the above... I bought the following diamond:

http://www.gia.edu/cs/Satellite?pagename=GST%2FDispatcher&childpagename=GIA%2FPage%2FReportCheck&c=Page&cid=1355954554547&reportno=6211520153

Measurements
6.73 - 6.77 x 4.18 mm
Carat Weight
1.16 carat
Color Grade
J
Clarity Grade
SI1
Cut Grade
Excellent
PROPORTIONS

Depth
61.9 %
Table
57 %
Crown Angle
35.5°
Crown Height
15.5%
Pavilion Angle
40.8°
Pavilion Depth
43.5%
Star Length
50%
Lower Half
75%
Girdle
Medium, Faceted, 3.0%
Culet
None



Pretty happy with it.... THEN I found pricescope and found all sorts of info iwth regards to the HCA tool... and lower halves... the effects of steep crown angles (which this current diamond has!!)...and so it gets penalized and gets a HCA of 2.6

So armed with this new knowledge... I found myself another diamond... this time from blue nile... that is almost exactly the same price, but with a HCA of 1.8:

http://www.bluenile.com/ca/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD06523123

Measurements
6.63 - 6.67 x 4.14 mm
Carat Weight
1.16 carat
Color Grade
J
Clarity Grade
SI1
Cut Grade
Excellent
PROPORTIONS

Depth
62.3 %
Table
56 %
Crown Angle
36°
Crown Height
16%
Pavilion Angle
40.6°
Pavilion Depth
42.5%
Star Length
55%
Lower Half
80%
Girdle
Medium, Faceted, 3.5%
Culet
None


Therein my dilemma.... prior to finding Pricescope.. I thought the diamond looked fine... I was happy that I got myself a 'triple excellent diamond'
But the more I read, the more I think...well maybe there are better diamonds out there... and there are 'sparkles' that I'm missing out on that I never knew existed...

I am a bit time constraint given the 30 day refund policy of the first diamond...

So now my question is... how many of you would go through the 'hurt' of returning the first diamond and trying this new 1.8 HCA one...

I can tell you right now, my girlfriend will not care. But for me, I would like to think that I did my homework on this and did it right.

Realistically, to a layman like myself and my girlfriend... how much better would the second diamond look compared to the first?
Note that they are exactly the same price.

Thanks all in advance... This community seems amazing.

Phil
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,631
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

I wouldn't trade it for that particular diamond. For one thing, you shouldn't buy an SI1 diamond without pictures to verify that it is eyeclean. Also, that 36 crown angle is a little high and I wouldn't buy a stone with those measurements without an idealscope or ASET image.

These are measurements to help you stay in ideal cut territory with a GIA excellent cut stone.

table: 54-58

depth: 60-62.3

crown angle: 34-35.0

pavilion angle: 40.6-40.9 (sometimes 41.0 if the crown angle is close to 34)

Always watch the diameter measurements. A stone that is on the deeper end may face up smaller in diameter than one that is not as deep.

Vendors with pictures: James Allen, Whiteflash, Good Old Old, High Performance Diamonds, Victor Canera, B2C Jewels (some), Enchanted Diamonds (click for stones with photos only in their search).
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Your stone is not necessarily bad. In fact, you did reasonably well when it comes to the proportions. It depends the actual numbers as GIA rounds alot. If the stone is more like 40.7/35.3, it may be just fine or even spectacular. Try HCA again with 40.7 and 35.3 instead of 40.8 and 35.5. Of course there is no way to verify what the actual proportions are.

So.. there is no guarantee that 40.6/36.0 is necessarily better than 40.8/35.5. Consider yourself lucky. You still have options. Whether you decide to keep or return and start fresh, either is a reasonable decision in my opinion.
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Thanks for the quick replies!
I guess my dilemma is exasperated by the fact that there's no way for me to know what a 'benchmark' 10/10 diamond looks like in real life...
I go to a jewelry store and I feel like all I see are blinding spotlights that reflects on anything...even my watch looks like it's made out of diamonds in there..
anyone else out there with more thoughts?

thanks again!

flyingpig|1459899019|4015902 said:
Your stone is not necessarily bad. In fact, you did reasonably well when it comes to the proportions. It depends the actual numbers as GIA rounds alot. If the stone is more like 40.7/35.3, it may be just fine or even spectacular. Try HCA again with 40.7 and 35.3 instead of 40.8 and 35.5. Of course there is no way to verify what the actual proportions are.

So.. there is no guarantee that 40.6/36.0 is necessarily better than 40.8/35.5. Consider yourself lucky. You still have options. Whether you decide to keep or return and start fresh, either is a reasonable decision in my opinion.
thanks for this flyingpig... that made me feel better.

I wonder what a HCA 1.8 actually looks like...compared to a 2.6...would us lay-people even tell the difference?
I mean, we're comparing 'triple excellent' to 'triple excellent' here..during my search through jewelry stores I saw dull diamonds...and their cuts are always 'very good' and not 'excellent'.
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

https://youtu.be/5kfwiy8v17Q

I carefully imagine your diamond is at least gold select level (normal gia x i assume), or most likely somewhere between gold select and platinum select(ideal), or potentially platinum select level.

There are alot of clips comparing normal gia xxx to ideal or super ideal diamonds. That should help you with decision making.

HCA has its limitation. Not all diamonds with HCA score of 2.0 of below are great diamonds. It is a screening tool.
 

AdaBeta27

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 7, 2004
Messages
906
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Are you in the USA? You could try to find a Hearts On Fire diamond dealer and look at their diamonds for comparison.
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

flyingpig|1459902501|4015939 said:
https://youtu.be/5kfwiy8v17Q

I carefully imagine your diamond is at least gold select level (normal gia x i assume), or most likely somewhere between gold select and platinum select(ideal), or potentially platinum select level.

There are alot of clips comparing normal gia xxx to ideal or super ideal diamonds. That should help you with decision making.

HCA has its limitation. Not all diamonds with HCA score of 2.0 of below are great diamonds. It is a screening tool.
THANK YOU!!!
Looking at this, my diamond behaves more like a cross between the middle one and the right one. I think my diamond isn't as uniform as the middle one in the way its arrows reflect light, but it isn't dark in the middle of the diamond like the one on the right.

AdaBeta27|1459904434|4015953 said:
Are you in the USA? You could try to find a Hearts On Fire diamond dealer and look at their diamonds for comparison.
Unfortunately I can't visit a store...I live in Canada.
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

With bluenile, you only pay for return shipping cost within Canada. With all other vendors, you pay full. So, you dont lose too much if you decide to return.

We can help you getting an ideal cut diamond if you choose this option, as long as you are not in a hurry
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

"Looking at this, my diamond behaves more like a cross between the middle one and the right one. I think my diamond isn't as uniform as the middle one in the way its arrows reflect light, but it isn't dark in the middle of the diamond like the one on the right."

Great assessment on your diamond :appl:
The darkness in the middle for the diamond on the right is due to large table. The inner circle does not light up when the arrows are lit. I also believe that your diamond performs more like the diamond in the middle with less uniformity, based on the 57/40.8/35.5 combo

I must note that this is not a good representation of how diamonds behave in real life. These light conditions in the clip are very specific.
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Both are potentially 40.8/35.5 if graded by GIA, depending on the actual measurements.
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3202009.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3253498.htm
Not the best, some leakages, not stones we recommend. Still decent and potentially pretty. far from ugly.

Here is 40.6/36.
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3571571.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3625406.htm
arguably better in general, but not always
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,175
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Greens represent "less bright" areas, which still produce light return.
White patches under the table in the IS image represents light leakage.

How these images translate into real-life viewing experience?
I never owned or seen a diamond with such ASET in person. But I have seen 40.8/35.5; it was beautiful.

Another stone with 40.8/35.5
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.03-carat-j-color-vs1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-936146
ASG Ideal with good looking computer generated ASET (which is a bit more lenient than actual ASET)

You mentioned less uniformity in how arrows light up, which is typical of 40.8/35.5. You identified your stone to resemble the platinum select than the gold select based on the table size and contrast pattern. According on your assessment, which I think is correct, no, it is not a super ideal H&A. Yes, there are stones with better sparkle, light return and well defined arrows. But I think it is still a decent GIA XXX and potential AGS0 with good light performance and contrast pattern.

You may have bought a good, or even great diamond. That's why nobody says "RETURN THE DIAMOND" so far; we are not afraid of saying this when we have to. You already had a great experience with BN. There is no guarantee that it will be the same. It is an interesting decision to make.

If you happened to return the ring, my recommendation is something like this
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.10-carat-j-color-vvs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-1021122
VVS is an overkill.. but it just happens to be VVS
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Thank you very much for your help flying pig.... i really appreciate it! You've been incredibly helpful. I will no doubt recommend pricescope to everyone I meet from now on who is looking at diamonds. I'm at an age where most my friends are now thinking about it.

I actually bought this diamond from Adiamor.com ... Simply because there's a setting there that is absolutely gorgeous! They looked at the diamond and said that it was a good looking diamond and eye clean...and given the triple excellent status I bought it.. I guess I got lucky!

I think I'll keep the diamond :) I think my girlfriend will like it.

Thank you again!

Phil

EDIT: I wonder if there was a 'comprehensive' blog post that I missed.
Maybe there should be a simple, one page, point form step by step guide or an app on how to choose a diamond. I realize it's a wealth of information but it was a LOT of work to even get to know how much I do know now.

Each 'C' has a tonne of often conflicting information and when I settled on 'triple excellent' on the 'Cut', it seems I still didn't know enough.

For example:

Colour - I knew I wanted something that faces up white and since I got a rose gold setting, a J is still appropriate for me. I knew about fluorescence and how because it is a J I should choose medium blue fluorescence...not 'strong' as that may make the diamond cloudy.
Clarity - I knew I didn't care for flawlessness, just something that was eye-clean. I knew I could limit my search to SI1 to VS1... as long as I could see a picture of the diamond, it is called 'eye-clean' and it wasn't cloudy.
Carat - I was looking at the diameter of the diamond (part of the reason why I chose my diamond - it's is 6.77mm wide..pretty big for its carat weight). I knew I wanted something that faces up close to a 1.2, but I didn't want to choose 1.2 exactly, as the price jump was more at rounded numbers.
Cut - I chose excellent, but further, I had to look to make sure polish and symmetry were excellent.....but STILL it turns out that wasn't enough.. I was just lucky.

That was a TONNE of research just to derive the above. There should be an app or something out there that decides all of that for a layman like me who isn't interested in becoming a diamond enthusiast but wants to get the absolute best diamond possible for his girlfriend, for the price.

I wonder if that exists. with the right marketing, and a low enough price point ($1-$3.99)...that would make a pretty good iPhone app I think...

Anyway I digress!
 

ringo865

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 14, 2014
Messages
2,369
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Phil, you did a great job!!! And now that you know about pricescope, after she says YES, have your gf (fiancée) post pics of her ring in the Show Me The Bling! thread.
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

ringo865|1459968957|4016258 said:
Phil, you did a great job!!! And now that you know about pricescope, after she says YES, have your gf (fiancée) post pics of her ring in the Show Me The Bling! thread.
Thank you!
I'm very excited now. I will definitely have her do that, using this username.
Will be in a few weeks or so ;-)

Thank you all - such a friendly forum.
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Just for those interested... here's the picture of the ring - as found on the online vendor's recently purchased page!!
r3010_68211.jpg
 

istase2000

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2012
Messages
328
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

Wow it looks beautiful! is that your actual ring? Love the arrows!
 

teknikal

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
12
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

the actual ring yup! a super close up image from the vendor just as they shipped it
18k rose gold with around 0.2 carat diamonds around it
 

Sagefemme

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Oct 8, 2015
Messages
291
Re: Just bought a diamond... then found out about Pricescope

That looks fantastic! Congratulations!
 
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