Is this too deep? was this a bad choice?

[MelanieC]

Hi there,

I am new to this forum. I am purchasing a new diamond wedding ring for my 17th anniversary present. My husband took me to the mall originally without doing any research and we bought a ring. I was certain the girl told me the diamond was G(H) with an SI1. We didn''t know what we were looking at and she didn''t show me other rings (I later found out because they didn''t have much better)and I was rushed due to having to get back home to meet my daughters friend at our house. When I did research at home, I thought OK....a G with an SI1 is not a bad ring. I know I the diamond seemed cloudy but I didn''t know if they were supposed to be that way. All other diamonds of that quality were alot more expensive online. I went to pick up the Cert and found out it was an I1 with G(H) color. I started looking at other stores and doing more research. The ring was to be ready this past Friday so I went in with an open mind to look at it. It was horrible. It was definately cloudy and inclusions were visible to the eye. It also had a IGI cert that didn''t list table or depth or anything. I got my money back and started over.

Out of all the places I have looked at, the one I went to yesterday spent over 3 hours looking at diamonds with me. She spent time looking at each diamond and marking on the paper where the inclusions were at and then I looked at them. She was wonderful and we matched colors, inclusions etc. I really liked her and I liked how she was showing me the diamonds. I found an H VS2 that I liked, but then when we looked at the GIA cert it had a table of 55 and a depth of 67.something. There was also an H SI1 with not to bad inclusions that I could not see with the eye, only the loupe. It had a table of 55 and a depth of 64.4 or 64.5. We took them outside to see which one had more sparkle, we compared them. The one that had the smaller depth was definately a little larger.

Now I came home and found this site and I am not sure
Here is what I remember about the diamond

Size 1.01 carat
depth 64.4 or 64.5
table 55
symmetry very good
Polish Excellent
culet- none
flourecence - none
I believe it was thin - to something??

I would be able to get a copy of the Cert on Tuesday. Why I didn''t ask for a copy I have no idea.

I did pay for this ring, but after researching once I got home I am not sure if this ring is too deep. They seemed to think it was a very nice diamond. I payed $4638 for it, and I had given them a budget of $5500 for the diamond. I think I want to buy from them. She really spent time and having a local jeweler to go back to can be good. I also can take it back and upgrade to a better diamond at any time and I don''t have to spend a specific amount.

The diamond is much nicer than the original one. My husband is getting tired of me being picky. I just want the best diamond I can get for my money. Should I insist she start looking for a better diamond, or do I get my money back and buy from Mondera or Blue nile.

If I bought from Mondera or Blue nile I would have to take it to a Jeweler to get the setting I want.

Any help is appreciated. I am so exhausted from all this worry, running around to different stores and research. I want to find my diamond. Get my setting and be happy!!

 

[WinkHPD]

It sounds deep to me, but without knowing the pavilion and crown angles it is not possible to say that it will not be an attractive stone.

For sure there are better looking diamonds out there that will be closer to the 60-62% depth with appropriate pavilion and crown angles that will result in a much brighter stone for your money.

I applaud you wanting to work with your local retailer, there you can see and compare many stones, even if you pay a few more dollars. It sounds as if this lady has been working hard for you too. Ask her to bring in an ideal cut or a Hearts and Arrows quality ideal cut for you to look at. Then you will see what you have been missing!

Wink

 

[Richard Sherwood]

Hi Melanie. The best way (in my opinion) to handle a purchase like this is to make the sale contingent upon the diamond appraising out to your satisfaction by an independent or objective appraiser, with a right-of-return (for any reason) period.

That takes all the anxiety out of it. You have the services of a professional to tell you all the pros and cons of the diamond.

With deeper stones, the light return performance is determined more by the crown-pavilion angle relationship than the depth. Most deeper stones are so because of the thickness of the girdle. A thicker girdle usually has little effect on the brilliance of the diamond if the cutter has compensated with a good crown-pavilion angle relationship.

I've seen plenty of 63-64% depth diamonds which sat up and blazed away. The negatives are that the diamond usually has a thicker girdle and smaller diameter. This puts the diamond in a lower cut class category (usually class 3A-3B, commercial make), which sells for a deeper discount than a fine make (class 2 or better) diamond. This is appropriate (even if the diamond is gorgeous) because of the smaller appearance of the diamond. You shouldn't have to pay extra for carat weight which you can't see with the eye.

The price you paid appears (at first glance) to be a fair bricks & mortar jewelry store price. You could buy it for less over the internet, but you seem to enjoy the relationship you have with your jeweler, and there are many perks which come from an established jeweler/client relationship.

You'll know better once you talk to an appraiser. If he says "Excuse me for a moment", turns around and vomits, then you know you might have a problem. If he gazes at it for a while and says "Oh, what a pretty stone", then you'll start to relax.

 

[Mara]

I'll chime in with a consumer's perspective. I would never put my money down on a round brilliant stone with a depth of 64 or 65. That is WAY too out of the range for ideal. There's a reason why there is a range...stick within it or close to it if you want the diamond to look the best it possibly can.




Use this jeweler if you really want to. But go back in armed with some numbers that will help you find a stone that should outshine all the others you have seen. The highest that I would go on depth would be 62% but some find that stones with depth of maybe up to 63% can still be extremely beautiful IF the other parameters and specs on the stones are inline.




The parameters that I would take back into this jeweler are along the lines of the following...




Depth: 60-62.5%


Table: 55-57%




Also you need to get crown and pavilion angles from the company, and this can only be done by a Sarin report. Tell them you require a Sarin with this further information in order to finalize a sale. The crown angle and pavilion angle will tell you more about the cut of the stone.




Stick with a crown angle around 34-35 and a pavilion angle of 40.5-40.9. The pavilion angle is more strict than the crown angle in terms of flexibility.




In terms of the other items on the GIA/AGS cert, try to get Very Good in polish and symmetry and EX EX or ID ID if you can. Fluorescence does not really matter unless it's strong blue, but SB with something like a G or H color should be fine. Girdle should be something like thin-medium or thin-slightly thick...stay away from 'very thick' or 'thick' or 'extermely thin'.




Color and clarity, I think you are in a sweet spot with G or H and SI1 as long as it's eye clean and you can't see anything with your eye. Some SI2's are very clean as well but it really depends on the diamond. SI2 represents a huge savings over SI1 so if you can find one that is eye-clean, it will allow a larger diamond or a better cut or similar with that extra $$.




Anyway, my two cents. I bought one diamond that was not well-cut and ended up selling it later and getting an ideal cut stone. My ideal cut stone is AMAZING and hands-down the difference is hugely visible. Even people who don't know anything have said my stone looks 'different' in a good way of course. So the CUT does make a difference. I'm a firm believer of having it all...you still have some room in your budget...just let this jewelry store know your parameters and have them work with you. DON'T settle for a stone that is mediocre when there are tons out there that are going to be what you desire. And now that you are learning more..keep educating yourself. As you can see..there's alot more than diamonds than just picking one out sight unseen with no specs or numbers as your first experience was!

Good luck!

 

[Mara]

Here is a screenshot of what is available through some of the Pricescope vendors...use it as a comparison for your offline shopping. See the tables, depths, crown and pav angles? The prices? These are all 1.01-1.08c stones that are G/H SI.




These are stones you would like to mimic for your stone in terms of numbers, and these should all be top performers. One thing to note is that the right stone will have great numbers AND a great look to your eye. But if it doesn't tickle you in terms of visual, the numbers don't mean as much..keep looking til you find something that has good numbers and sparkles like mad!

 

[bling]

mara gives great advice..and some nice options to choose from. Like others have said, its an important decision..and although your husband is getting anstsy..tell him you want to make the right decision now..so there wont be a next time!

hehehe...
its fine if you want to go through your local jewelry store, and if they are able to call in stones, be sure to give them your specs (like the ones mara gave to you). If they cannot, then you might want to think about getting your stone online, and then maybe having your local jeweler design your setting..the best of both worlds! good luck!