Is this ASET overly backlit and tilted...

[Kaycee2018]

Or showing some leakage? Thoughts and opinions welcome. Thanks!

 

[Karl_K]

Its over backlite but could also show excessive leakage.
what are thw numbers and do you have any other images?

 

[Kaycee2018]

Its over backlite but could also show excessive leakage.
what are thw numbers and do you have any other images?

Thanks, @Karl_K . It’s a tricky 35/40.8 combo.

TABLE. 57%
DEPTH. 61.8%
CROWN ANGLE 35.0°
CROWN HEIGHT 15.0%
PAVILION ANGLE 40.8°

Waiting for more images.

 

[Karl_K]

inconclusive so far

 

[Kaycee2018]

 

[sledge]

To me, it appears actual leakage from 11-1 o'clock position. Although I believe the severity of the leakage is over exaggerated because of the strong backlighting.

The remaining areas appear to be bright backlighting.

Also it appears there is some minor digging of the crown going on, as evidenced by those green splotches on the outside edges of the ASET.

Visible Effects of Painting & Digging on Superideal Diamonds

With grateful acknowledgment to John Pollard, Sergey Sivovolenko, AGSL and GIA Laboratories for valuable resources and input. Graphics produced with DiamCalc software by OctoNus. Note: This article pertains only to […]

www.pricescope.com

 

[AV_]

IMHO the ASET is overly back lit and tilted toward 9 o'clock possibly no more than a couple of degrees [if even]. The picture is also tilted, even more slightly, downward. The H&A shots look well aligned, the hearts perfect, the arrows view asks me to think about the contrast between crown facets - a detail that the tool is not meant to show but does; I have not paid as much attention to such possible nuances as others have & could tell this tale.

 

[Kaycee2018]

the arrows view has very strong contrast - that can be again lighting or some subtle detail of the diamond,

Thank you @AV_ . Regarding your comment above, what potential concerns are there with very strong contrast in the arrows view?

 

[sledge]

What % are the star facets and LGF's?

There are slight scallops in the perimeter of the arrows image.

Did you notice that too @Karl_K?

 

[Kaycee2018]

What % are the star facets and LGF's?

There are slight scallops in the perimeter of the arrows image.

Did you notice that too @Karl_K?

Star Facets are 50%
LGF's are 75%
Girdle is 3.5%
Crown Height is 15%
Pavilion Depth is 43%

 

[AV_]

@Kaycee2018 I'd still be concerned about photography, not the stone.

 

[AV_]

ctd

What I am seeing in the H&A face up/arrows view are relatively intense red kite facets - this does not appear in the ASET such as it is, or in the picture, and it is not an expected effect of painting/digging either, so I remain with the photographic setup to explain this faint something or other.

I wish it were possible to pick nuances of H&A, but nothing of the way they are sold online allows this sort of thing - they are meant to be as alike as possible, for good reason. I am not sure it makes much sense to still want to choose, but then, these things are not about reasonable,they are beautiful. H&A belong at a farmacy [very standard stuff there; mostly white too]

2c

 

[Karl_K]

What % are the star facets and LGF's?

There are slight scallops in the perimeter of the arrows image.

Did you notice that too @Karl_K?

Yea I am more concerned about the stronger leakage beside the 12 oclock arrow in the ASET.
In the arrow photo you can also see it the 2 areas beside the 6 oclock arrow are darker where the dark background bleed through.
The heart image is pretty good however, to good for there to be major twist.
So it is likely just some a bit steep lowers around steep mains.
Honestly absent a better taken ASET I consider it still inconclusive.

 

[Kaycee2018]

Thanks for everyone's input. Seems like more and more retailers are offering advanced imaging, but the images are taken so poorly they are of little to no use. Frustrating.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Same company as Sledges "catch". The backlight is way too strong. Have told them several times. Dumb and dumber.
Even told them it is the system I helped design!

 

[Kaycee2018]

B

Same company as Sledges "catch". The backlight is way too strong. Have told them several times. Dumb and dumber.
Even told them it is the system I helped design!

Thank you @Garry H (Cut Nut) . I assumed at a minimum the lighting was too strong just based on comments related to other images here. I’m going to roll the dice on this one and see how it looks IRL. Thanks to a generous return policy, I’ve got nothing to lose. Fingers crossed

 

[daisygrl]

Thanks, @Karl_K . It’s a tricky 35/40.8 combo.

TABLE. 57%
DEPTH. 61.8%
CROWN ANGLE 35.0°
CROWN HEIGHT 15.0%
PAVILION ANGLE 40.8°

Waiting for more images.

I have a ring with the exact same measurements as you... and just like you, I thought the 35/40.8 is a tricky combo and was hesitant to get it much less keep it... The diamond turned out to be beyond stunning. I have just posted some pics in my original thread of how it shines (my profile pic is one of them.) Take the risk and see for yourself.

After I got this one and while it was still within a return period, I had a chance to get the same size (different vendor) 34.5/40.8 and declined it because this one sparkled like no tomorrow. Plus, I saw some not so great 34.5/40.8 (either they manipulated angles somehow or something else went wrong but it was not the greatest ring as one might expect)

 

[Kaycee2018]

Thank you @daisygrl . I read your posts and your pics look fantastic! So happy your 35/40.8 worked out. I’m going to give this one a chance, but the post below does give me pause. Wish me luck!

Why Advanced Images Matter...A Bad 34.5/40.8...

Granted the following graphic is from 2016 and for pear shapes, but it illustrates a point. Looking at the charts we can see: 0.90-0.99ct, I, SI1 = approx $3,900 per carat 1.00-1.49ct, I, SI1 = approx $4,500 per carat So roughly $600 makes the difference of shutting the doors or staying open...

www.pricescope.com

 

[Kaycee2018]

Video of the diamond in question...

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www.yadavjewelry.com

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

B


Thank you @Garry H (Cut Nut) . I assumed at a minimum the lighting was too strong just based on comments related to other images here. I’m going to roll the dice on this one and see how it looks IRL. Thanks to a generous return policy, I’ve got nothing to lose. Fingers crossed

We would love to see an ASET or Ideal-scope photo when it comes - can you arrange that KC?

 

[daisygrl]

Thank you @daisygrl . I read your posts and your pics look fantastic! So happy your 35/40.8 worked out. I’m going to give this one a chance, but the post below does give me pause. Wish me luck!

Why Advanced Images Matter...A Bad 34.5/40.8...

Granted the following graphic is from 2016 and for pear shapes, but it illustrates a point. Looking at the charts we can see: 0.90-0.99ct, I, SI1 = approx $3,900 per carat 1.00-1.49ct, I, SI1 = approx $4,500 per carat So roughly $600 makes the difference of shutting the doors or staying open...

www.pricescope.com

Of course! Keep us updated. Btw, the post you referred to was about 34.5/40.8 and not 35/40.8. I guess, they all go case-by-case. Good luck!

 

[Kaycee2018]

We would love to see an ASET or Ideal-scope photo when it comes - can you arrange that KC?

i don’t own any scopes, but I‘ll try using a DIY scope. I am terrible at taking diamond photos though and my attempts at taking photos while using a DIY scope in the past have not been great. There is definitely a level of talent and/or experience involved that I don’t have LOL

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Plenty of good advice here. It is frustrating when internet companies do not insist on quality images. It is a constant battle!

If the company from which you are buying has in-house QC, ask them to examine the diamond and send you a set of images taken by THEM in their US offices prior to shipping to you. If they don’t do that, please do try to get a set of images after you receive the diamond.

 

[Kaycee2018]

Plenty of good advice here. It is frustrating when internet companies do not insist on quality images. It is a constant battle!

If the company from which you are buying has in-house QC, ask them to examine the diamond and send you a set of images taken by THEM in their US offices prior to shipping to you. If they don’t do that, please do try to get a set of images after you receive the diamond.

Will definitely do that! Thanks. I’m told they should have it by early next week.

 

[sledge]

Thanks for everyone's input. Seems like more and more retailers are offering advanced imaging, but the images are taken so poorly they are of little to no use. Frustrating.

I agree. It's great to see more images being offered, but it's extremely frustrating to see them overly bright, tilted, etc so it makes deciphering them difficult.

That said it gives me a little hope the industry is changing. Maybe a forest first then details like trees approach. The fact they exist is good. But maybe as they themselves understand the impacts better and customers start better understanding and demanding better quality it will improve.

I have a ring with the exact same measurements as you... and just like you, I thought the 35/40.8 is a tricky combo and was hesitant to get it much less keep it... The diamond turned out to be beyond stunning. I have just posted some pics in my original thread of how it shines (my profile pic is one of them.) Take the risk and see for yourself.

After I got this one and while it was still within a return period, I had a chance to get the same size (different vendor) 34.5/40.8 and declined it because this one sparkled like no tomorrow. Plus, I saw some not so great 34.5/40.8 (either they manipulated angles somehow or something else went wrong but it was not the greatest ring as one might expect)

The 35/40.8 is tricky because it's not as complimentary as a 34.5/40.8 or even 34/40.8 combo.

I believe @Garry H (Cut Nut) uses a 5:1 ratio to express the importance of an inverse relationship between the crown and pavilion angles. So essentially steep crown/shallow pavilion or vice versa.

When you start going steep/steep then you introduce more potential risk for something to go wrong. Faceting has to be more precise, etc.

Another important factor is the CA and PA values reported on the GIA report is comprised of 8 actual values of each that is then rounded and averaged. So yes, it gives us an approximation of what to expect but it doesn't pinpoint potential outliers.

The images are useful because it will hopefully detect the outliers that may be problematic.

Thank you @daisygrl . I read your posts and your pics look fantastic! So happy your 35/40.8 worked out. I’m going to give this one a chance, but the post below does give me pause. Wish me luck!

Why Advanced Images Matter...A Bad 34.5/40.8...

Granted the following graphic is from 2016 and for pear shapes, but it illustrates a point. Looking at the charts we can see: 0.90-0.99ct, I, SI1 = approx $3,900 per carat 1.00-1.49ct, I, SI1 = approx $4,500 per carat So roughly $600 makes the difference of shutting the doors or staying open...

www.pricescope.com

That was my thread and I'm sorry it caused you concern. That was not the intent.

My point was that many consider a 34.5/40.8 to be the dream proportion and in that case it had all the right other proportions but the images showed us what I was talking about earlier that they get us close but don't tell us the whole story.

Unfortunately those images also had backlighting and tilt issues.

Looking at the a plain picture of the diamond you could see some asymmetry but many buyers may not have caught onto that or dismissed as the other data looked so promising.

As online diamond purchasing continues to grow I think and hope sellers will provide good advanced images to help customers make better informed decisions upon.

Of course! Keep us updated. Btw, the post you referred to was about 34.5/40.8 and not 35/40.8. I guess, they all go case-by-case. Good luck!

Indeed they are case by case. I've mentioned this in the two responses above. Simply stated, proportions alone don't tell us the whole story.

Will definitely do that! Thanks. I’m told they should have it by early next week.

Based on the video link, I would anticipate you are purchasing through Yadav?

I'm not sure they offer full images like some of the other retailers such as B2C or IDJ.

If the trigger isn't pulled, you may reach out to one or both of those vendors with the GIA report number and see if they can also source the diamond. Usually Yadav deals in virtual inventory readily accessible by other vendors.

They may even be able to match or beat the price. But the real win would be getting a full array of images and possibly a detailed SARIN report that shows all the actual values.

If you've already bought, then you can pick up an ASET scope for $50. Maybe it would be easier to use than the DIY version?

 

[Kaycee2018]

Back with another option. Understanding the issue with the lighting and possible tilt of the ASET for diamond above diamond, what are your thoughts on this one in comparison? Does it look more promising? Thanks!

HCA .6

Light Return:	Excellent
Fire:	Excellent
Scintillation:	Excellent
Spread:	Very Good
HCA Score :	0.6 - Excellent - within TIC range

TABLE. 56%
DEPTH. 60.8%
CROWN ANGLE 34.5°
CROWN HEIGHT 15.0%
PAVILION ANGLE 40.6°
PAVILION DEPTH 43%
STAR FACETS 50%
LGF's 80%
GIRDLE 3%

 

[Karl_K]

That one looks great, the longer lgf% compliments the angle combination.

 

[Karl_K]

My point was that many consider a 34.5/40.8 to be the dream proportion

That does not make it correct, there is nothing magical or special about that specific set of numbers. It just happens to be close to the modern equivalent of the numbers tolk came up with for a different design and different lighting.
That said in a reasonably well cut stone it is a good combo when combined with complimentary other facets and table size.
To say that 34.5/40.8 is the best is illogical as saying 60/60 is the best.

 

[Karl_K]

Another important factor is the CA and PA values reported on the GIA report is comprised of 8 actual values of each that is then rounded and averaged. So yes, it gives us an approximation of what to expect but it doesn't pinpoint potential outliers.

The biggest issue with gia numbers is the gross rounding applied after the are rounded then averaged then rounded then grossly rounded. Say that 3 times fast lol.

 

[Karl_K]

I believe @Garry H (Cut Nut) uses a 5:1 ratio to express the importance of an inverse relationship between the crown and pavilion angles. So essentially steep crown/shallow pavilion or vice versa.

While that works within a very narrow range, you hit obstruction and color retention issues quickly as you move the pavilion, and it varies with table size and lgf%, but most importanly it does not find all of the potentul good combinations.