Is there such thing as a good "fixer-upper" diamond?

[Swirl68]

Several years ago my original wedding ring broke and part of it was lost. I had a limited budget for a new ring and limited selection in the area I live. Thanks to Pricescope, I was able to get wonderful new diamond rings at prices I still can't believe. I've been thinking about another diamond purchase and have started watching the forums again. And that got me thinking...

You know those home repair shows where people can't afford "turn key" homes and instead buy homes with issues and fix them up? Do you think that can be done with diamonds? I was surprised to find that recuts are not all that expensive, like around $300 a carat, is that correct?

There's a thread going on right now- "The challenge is on. Will you join me?" and some of those diamonds suggested there just might be awesome diamonds if the cut was better.

Do people buy ever buy a diamond with the specific intent to "fix-it-up" with a recut and come out better cost-wise? Or does the reduction in carat weight not make this cost-effective?

Obviously, it would be a risk and a gamble and many people would just prefer to pay the premium and go with a popular trusted vendor. But do you think that risk could be reduced to an acceptable level with the help of Pricescope posters who like to help others on a budget and know their stuff when it comes to evaluating certificates, images, and videos?

 

[OoohShiny]

I think the only way to do such a thing without spending as much as buying 'right' in the first place would be buying secondhand, and I'm not sure that they would generally come with grading reports, images and videos.

 

[KristinTech]

I definitely think experienced PSers could play that game if they wanted—and come out ahead! But I think for anyone playing with “scared money,” the risk would be too great.

 

[Wewechew]

I actually did this with an OEC I bought (https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/oec-recut.240785/).

As others have mentioned, the only way it makes sense is to purchase a preloved stone at a discount. But you also have to take into consideration that not all stones can be cut- inclusions may make a recut very risky. The only reason I purchased the above diamond is because 1) it was a steal, and 2) if the stone was ineligible for a recut, it was still a beautiful stone and I would have been fine sticking it in the pendent with the small chip.

 

[whitewave]

I think when you get into SI and I clarities, the risk becomes greater than at higher clarities. It also depends on if you are close to a benchmark weight, like 2 carats and the recut will have you fall below.. etc.

I do think some members here could win at this game, but you should be gambling with funds you don’t mind losing IMO...

 

[Swirl68]

Yeah, probably not a good idea.

Here was my (probably ill-conceived) plan:

A diamond for a pendant, (originally wanted pear shape, but would probably have to go with RB for this recut plan) as big as I can afford with the strongest fluorescence as I can get. (But not cloudy or oily of course.) I want it to glow blue with the slightest hint of the sun. I'm not too picky about clarity. Relatively eye clean is good. I'd definitely take a good I1. Not too picky on color either, as long as it looks decent in white gold. I would, however, like it to be cut really well and be very sparkly. I probably wouldn't even get it recertified. I also thought the search might be really fun, combing through listings and such and getting the diamond I really want by doing it myself and at a significant discount.

I don't think I have enough knowledge to do this though. I'd be comfortable gambling some money on this project, but at a certain point, I'd probably start to get scared and then it wouldn't be fun for me anymore.

I'm just going to table this whole idea for now. Thanks for the advice!

 

[whitewave]

Yeah, probably not a good idea.

Here was my (probably ill-conceived) plan:

A diamond for a pendant, (originally wanted pear shape, but would probably have to go with RB for this recut plan) as big as I can afford with the strongest fluorescence as I can get. (But not cloudy or oily of course.) I want it to glow blue with the slightest hint of the sun. I'm not too picky about clarity. Relatively eye clean is good. I'd definitely take a good I1. Not too picky on color either, as long as it looks decent in white gold. I would, however, like it to be cut really well and be very sparkly. I probably wouldn't even get it recertified. I also thought the search might be really fun, combing through listings and such and getting the diamond I really want by doing it myself and at a significant discount.

I don't think I have enough knowledge to do this though. I'd be comfortable gambling some money on this project, but at a certain point, I'd probably start to get scared and then it wouldn't be fun for me anymore.

I'm just going to table this whole idea for now. Thanks for the advice!

I think it is an interesting idea. @Wink has discussed with us recutting before. I believe he said that the benchmark weight is worth more than the cut category? Wink, is that correct?

(For that one particular potential issue)

 

[whitewave]

@ILikeShiny you went through this process. Thoughts?

 

[Wewechew]

I think it is an interesting idea. @Wink has discussed with us recutting before. I believe he said that the benchmark weight is worth more than the cut category? Wink, is that correct?

(For that one particular potential issue)

When I was looking to recut my diamond earrings, this was a toss up. They are currently just over 1.5tcw and a recut would, obviously, knock them under .75ct each. I was told the value of the stones going from very good to ideal cuts was zeroed out with the loss of carat weight. So basically I wasn’t losing value, but I wasn’t gaining any either. At least that’s how I was advised in this one case.

 

[Bron357]

While it sounds like a fabulous idea I don’t think any of us “mortals” would be able to accurately assess a “damaged” diamond and calculate the carat weight loss to improve it and if the smaller result would be worth more money.
I mean, it you came across a I colour S1 2.10 carat OMC with a tiny chip, would it be worth more as an ideal round cut of just over 1 carat if the cut doesn’t improve clarity? I doubt it, sure trim the chip but don’t touch the cut.
I think with recuts you need to stay in desired “carat weight segments”. The diamond of 1.95 carats is considerably less than a 2.02 carat and all things being equal, you wouldn’t be able to detect the size difference.
To me the best value is in pre loved jewellery. Anyone who has bought a “standard” diamond (I mean not like D IF) and had a glamorous setting made to suit, the resale value is always less than outlay. Always.
I bought the attached pre loved setting for $695. It has over a carat of diamonds and it is a hefty 7 grams of 14kt gold. I could not have a ring like this “made for me” for less than $2,000. Those baguettes have to be cut and matched. Someone, not me, paid a considerable sum to have that setting made.

 

[BlingDreams]

@whitewave - thanks for the tag.

OP, this is an interesting question because I was just thinking about this myself the other day. Why not get a 3ct G/VS diamond with a poorer cut, pay for the recut, and reap the benefits of a more beautiful stone and POSSIBLY increased value? I haven’t researched it; just a thought I had.

In theory though, I think it’s a promising idea as long as 1) your insurance will cover your stone if it’s damaged during the process of recurring (or you can afford to suck it up if it breaks), 2) you stick with VS or above, and no inclusions that are near/break the surface (as those pose the biggest risk of damaging the stone or making it ineligible for a recut), and 3) you go with the best recutters. I’d also suggest not starting with a stone very close to a benchmark weight as you don’t want to drop below those with the cutting.

 

[Wewechew]

In theory though, I think it’s a promising idea as long as 1) your insurance will cover your stone if it’s damaged during the process of recurring (or you can afford to suck it up if it breaks), 2) you stick with VS or above, and no inclusions that are near/break the surface (as those pose the biggest risk of damaging the stone or making it ineligible for a recut), and 3) you go with the best recutters. I’d also suggest not starting with a stone very close to a benchmark weight as you don’t want to drop below those with the cutting.

The best bet would be to find one just under a benchmark weight to start with.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Yes to what Wewechew said, because getting a 3 ct recut means the stone will finish in the 2 ct range and it's unlikely to come out well financially that way. You'd have to buy a 3.5 ct stone that was pretty well cut at the outset, probably with VS clarity, and recut hoping to stay above 3 cts.

I actually bought a stone that was recut. It was an OEC that was recut into an AVR. Started around 2.4 cts and ended up 2.1. This turned out extremely well. The stone was VVS clarity so it was a good recut candidate. I really wouldn't buy a round brilliant with the purpose of recutting, though. It's a lot of risk and if it's not already fairly well cut, you're going to lose some weight. You'll likely save some money just buying one with strong fluorescence.

 

[ChristineRose]

I'm going to say no, unless for some extraordinary reason you can get a stone very cheap.
Here's my reasoning: It's often said on PS that most diamonds are cut for weight, not performance. This is incorrect. All diamonds are cut to maximize profit.
Was it cut to fit a magic number? That's because a better cut would have brought it down below target, and made it worth less. You're better off buying the superideal which started with optimal proportions rather than paying the inflated magic number price.
Is it poorly cut because it's older? There's very few supply chains for diamonds, and once an old stone re-enters it will be cut to skim the edge of GIA XXX, like most diamonds cut today, unless the weight loss is large enough to bring it to XXX. In which case you can assume that this diamond would need more weight loss to bring it to PS standards because it required a lot of weight loss just to bring it to a XXX.
Does it have unattractive inclusions? Then removing the inclusions is risky, or the grade bump and weight loss would have reduced the price of the diamond.

In each case you're paying extra for something besides cut and you are going to lose that when the stone is recut to a less valuable (in $$) diamond. It has to be less valuable because if it weren't it would already be better cut. Therefore you always can get what you really want (and nothing else) for a lesser price.

There are exceptions of course: Craigslist, e-bay, pawn shops. But keep in mind that there are professionals out there playing the same game you are. They have better access to and knowledge of cutters, they have higher tolerance to risk if all goes wrong, and they have Rap reports and they know how to use them.