Infinity''s Princess Cut B Scope Report

[RockDoc]

Please do not download - copy or distribute this image.

(c) 2005 Gemex and Accurate Appraisal - All Rights Reserved... for educational and information only

I can't animate this but I will ask Gemex, if they will add it to the live report segment of their site.

One of the more unusual images is Image Six which is the diamond viewed in diffused light to show the symmetry of the stone. This diamond has been cut to exceptionally fine symmetry, and this well a symmetry image is very uncommon in Princess B Scope Reports.

Unfortunately, the images shown are static, and only represent the five photo positions of fire.

There is also white light - color light - and Symmetry that can only be viewed either by an authorized Gemprint center or on the LIVE REPORT segment of Gemex's site, however this diamond isn't on their yet.

Those interested in seeing the animations, can go to Gemex and see the samples there.

Rockdoc

 

[Spear]

Wow, thats what I call light return!!

 

[RockDoc]

Kudos to Paul Slegars (Infinity Diamond) and Gary Dutton ( Diamond Expert)

This is one of Paul's PET ROCKS... so he "gave birth" to this New Baby Pet Rock !!!

Note the: White Light return and Color Light Return. The blue "rating bars" are partially off the chart. This may be a new record for these and Gemex will in the consumer's best interest aimed the grading scale, and for future ones that may grade potentially better.

Still trying to upload the photos.

Rockdoc

 

[DiamondExpert]

Bill, thanks for sharing your/GemEx''s info with us.

 

[belle]

w

w!! thanks for sharing rockdoc!!

 

[Kaleigh]

Awesome, cool pics. Thanks Rockdoc!!!

 

[noobie]

Oh no, another one to add to the "buy" list!

 

[moremoremore]

Am I crazy? I''m not sure I like that. How will this stone look in person with that contrast? Just a big ol cross?

 

[Dancing Fire]

RockDoc
is this an AGS 0 cut?

 

[DiamondExpert]

Yep, AGS Ideal for proportion, light performance and finish (polish and symmetry).

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 5/20/2005 11:35:51 PM
Author: moremoremore
Am I crazy? I''m not sure I like that. How will this stone look in person with that contrast? Just a big ol cross?

Only one way to know for sure, bring one in to look at. These are the most fantastic Princess cuts I have ever seen! Paul has been working on these for over a year in the planning stage and once AGS gave him the parameters he was one of, if not the first, to submit stones for AGS grading under those parameters.

Wink

 

[laughinggravy]

Hey More, how are you?

If you check out my thread, an afternoon at Infinity you''ll see that I was really gob-smacked (UK-speak for ''stunned'') by their Princesses. They really are different beast altogether. I''ve never been interested in the cut before but these were like (of course describing a stone is the toughest thing) little, square globules of light. They are so full of light that they almost don''t look solid. It is imposs to describe but they are very, very lovely and I''m a step cut gal through and through so not an easy client to persuade.

Check one out, if you can. I''m sure Paul''s US vendors would be delighted to help you get access to see one. The scope report is the first example of an image that comes close to showing what these are all about.

I''ll post shots as soon as we buy, but it''s not going to be until later in the year and I''m no great shakes at taking photos. (And I shan''t be allowed to get my hands on it until my 40th in Nov!!!!)
Abi

 

[researcher]

This stone really is an entirely different beast! I just compared this BScope with my own triple VH, and it''s COMPLETELY different! One thing I found interesting is my stone scored "higher" on scintillation (off the charts) and "lower" on white light (mine wasn''t off the charts). Also, in image six my stone shows 4 "V''s" that are more centered on each side instead of 4 "arrow shapes" that point more from the corners to the center. Wow. I sound really stupid right now--sorry for my lack of proper terminology! My point is it doesn''t even look like my princess stone! Is there an ideal scope image of this stone? How has the cut changed?

 

[viscera912]

good morning everyone

great bscope rockdoc!

this is a fascinating analysis of the princess diamond. i haven''t bought my engagement ring for my gf because i have been waiting for these AGS 0''s to come out. im curious though how many are actually coming out? there couldn''t possibly be a LOT coming out, or maybe im wrong? does anyone have any info on this? also, with this unreal light return are the prices of these beauties going to be pretty expensive? ya know im working on that med school tuitiion

anyway, hope you all have a splendid weekend!

jason

 

[viscera912]

sorry i just noticed i hit the century mark for postings! only 900 more for my next target

 

[Rhino]

It''s nice to see that B''scope results do indeed correllate with AGS data. I kinda figured this would be the case but this confirms. Now PAUL ... GET THOSE STONES OVER HERE.

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Date: 5/20/2005 11:35:51 PM
Author: moremoremore
Am I crazy? I''m not sure I like that. How will this stone look in person with that contrast? Just a big ol cross?

I tried to get a Buddha-image in there, but I failed. The cross will have to do.

Just joking. The pictures here are static, and straight on. When you start rocking the stone, it is an overflow of scintillation.

Live long,

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Date: 5/20/2005 9:17:35 PM
Author: RockDoc
Kudos to Paul Slegars (Infinity Diamond) and Gary Dutton ( Diamond Expert)

This is one of Paul''s PET ROCKS... so he ''gave birth'' to this New Baby Pet Rock !!!

Note the: White Light return and Color Light Return. The blue ''rating bars'' are partially off the chart. This may be a new record for these and Gemex will in the consumer''s best interest aimed the grading scale, and for future ones that may grade potentially better.

Still trying to upload the photos.

Rockdoc

Hi Bill,

Thank you for the kudos, but this is not a one-man-job. This one also goes to our team, who have all done their utmost, while they were in unknown territory. I am very fortunate to work with people, who are willing to follow an untested and unproven idea, just because they trust the person coming up with the idea.

Because of this, I think that we should also send kudos to AGS, because they took us outside of the traditional princess-box. If not for them, we would not have gone into these combination of proportions.

Live long,

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 5/21/2005 3:26:01 PM
Author: Paul-Antwerp

Because of this, I think that we should also send kudos to AGS, because they took us outside of the traditional princess-box. If not for them, we would not have gone into these combination of proportions.

Live long,

I second that Paul. they used an almost identical process (but with more available tools) to the way I developed HCA, but they had 2 extra variables to add into the equation (for rounds only mainly use T,C and P - they had T, 2xC and 2xP).

There is still many harder cuts for them to do however. Any stone with a LxW function is unbelievably more difficult.

And the other issue is that their current charts for both round and princess are extremely difficult to program into a rough scanner for auto planning.

 

[moremoremore]

Let''s see em! I''d love to see a picture of one of these hot mamas!
So does this mean that you can''t say that the jubilee or sq cushion gives the best light return in a square anymore?

This really is fantastic. I do love the shape of the princess and it''s great this shape is getting some attention!

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Date: 5/21/2005 11:49:17 AM
Author: viscera912

im curious though how many are actually coming out? there couldn''t possibly be a LOT coming out, or maybe im wrong? does anyone have any info on this? also, with this unreal light return are the prices of these beauties going to be pretty expensive? ya know im working on that med school tuitiion

anyway, hope you all have a splendid weekend!

jason

As far as we are concerned, we are cutting about 5 to 10 of them every week. As you can see, that is not a lot.

However, we seem to have the production system under control now, and if demand increases, we can easily obtain more rough in order to increase production.

As for pricing, please check with our dealers. You should be aware of this though. From the rough stone, that we use, and which is best suited for princess-cuts, one can produce two stones of 1 Ct, if cut according to traditional princess-cuts. In our case, going for AGS-0, we can obtain only one stone of 1 Ct, and another one of around 0.40 Ct. That is an enormous difference in weight retention, and you can imagine that this is reflected in the pricing.

Live long,

 

[viscera912]

hi paul,

paul happens to be my middle name! thanks for the reply to my post, i was afraid of the price difference. i knew these were going to be some serious diamonds, thus the price would have to be as serious as the beauty. im allready on a tight budget so i''ll just have to see about grabbin one of these ags 0''s. if all goes as planned i will start "shopping" this summer around july-august so hopefully by that time the price will have simmered a little bit.

if i can''t afford it then could still get a beautiful aga 1 or 1b, which hopefully will decline in price. actually that is a good question, when the ags 0''s come out will the price of the aga 1''s and 1b''s go down? perhaps i didn''t word that sentence properly. due to the new change in grading, the diamonds that would have been at the top of the list, the most "ideal" cuts if you will, would it be safe to say that there could be a price drop in those diamonds since they are being replaced by the ags 0''s? thanks for the response

jason

 

[moremoremore]

GARY.....PAUL!!!!! I AM AT A LOSS!!!! Thank you for e-mailing me a picture Gary (at my request).
All I can say is...IT IS STUNNING!!!!!!!! I'm going to ask Leonid if I can post it b/c I just think this stone needs to be seen. I mean, really. I'm speachless.

 

[researcher]

MMM~
You HAVE to post the pic (or send it to me at least!)--PLEASE, PLEASE, PRETTY PLEASE!!! I can''t wait to see what this stone looks like!!!

 

[researcher]

Date: 5/23/2005 12:04:01 PM
Author: viscera912


hi paul,


paul happens to be my middle name! thanks for the reply to my post, i was afraid of the price difference. i knew these were going to be some serious diamonds, thus the price would have to be as serious as the beauty. im allready on a tight budget so i''ll just have to see about grabbin one of these ags 0''s. if all goes as planned i will start ''shopping'' this summer around july-august so hopefully by that time the price will have simmered a little bit.


if i can''t afford it then could still get a beautiful aga 1 or 1b, which hopefully will decline in price. actually that is a good question, when the ags 0''s come out will the price of the aga 1''s and 1b''s go down? perhaps i didn''t word that sentence properly. due to the new change in grading, the diamonds that would have been at the top of the list, the most ''ideal'' cuts if you will, would it be safe to say that there could be a price drop in those diamonds since they are being replaced by the ags 0''s? thanks for the response


jason

What an interesting question! My guess is some of the top cuts will, in fact, meet the standards for AGS 0 in cut (I''m hoping my stone will be one of them, especially considering my BScope results). So, it may just be that, as is the case with EGL and GIA where you can find an EGL graded stone that is graded with the same strictness as GIA at a cheaper price, you will now be able to get a GIA graded stone that is equal in cut to the AGS 0 graded stones at a cheaper price. However, I most definitely could be wrong.

Hopefully one of the experts will answer your question!

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Date: 5/23/2005 3:22:08 PM
Author: researcher

Date: 5/23/2005 12:04:01 PM
Author: viscera912

if i can''t afford it then could still get a beautiful aga 1 or 1b, which hopefully will decline in price. actually that is a good question, when the ags 0''s come out will the price of the aga 1''s and 1b''s go down? perhaps i didn''t word that sentence properly. due to the new change in grading, the diamonds that would have been at the top of the list, the most ''ideal'' cuts if you will, would it be safe to say that there could be a price drop in those diamonds since they are being replaced by the ags 0''s? thanks for the response


jason

What an interesting question! My guess is some of the top cuts will, in fact, meet the standards for AGS 0 in cut (I''m hoping my stone will be one of them, especially considering my BScope results). So, it may just be that, as is the case with EGL and GIA where you can find an EGL graded stone that is graded with the same strictness as GIA at a cheaper price, you will now be able to get a GIA graded stone that is equal in cut to the AGS 0 graded stones at a cheaper price. However, I most definitely could be wrong.

Hopefully one of the experts will answer your question!

Once again, I think that there is no parallel between the situation of rounds and that of princess-cuts.

In a round, one basically has two main angles and a table as the foundation of the stone. With so few basic parameters, and with the average cut-quality of rounds being rather high, and with the tools to cut rounds being much more advanced and reliable, a cutter of rounds can indeed unwillingly produce a great stone, then send it to a lab that does not maximize the value of that stone, and in this way, it is possible to find a great stone with an unexpected cert.

In a princess-cut, the situation is quite different. To start, the average cut-quality of msot princess-cuts would be graded AGS5 or lower, where most round brilliants would be graded AGS2 or 3. Then, a princess-cut is much more complicated with two main pavilion angles and two main crown angles. Finally, AGS has literally taken us outside of the box, and these AGS-0''s have proportions that absolutely untraditional in the princess-cut as it used to be. Because of this, it is highly unlikely for a cutter accidentally cutting an AGS-0. And the cutters who cut the AGS-0 on purpose will definitely send their stone to AGS for a grading report. Sending such a stone to another lab would be foolish.

Live long,

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

What Pauls says could be defined in odds of 1 in 50 or 1 in 100 - and even knowing the table and depth % is nt a huge help.

if a stone has a great ideal-scope image it has a 1:2 cnace of being AGS0 for llight performance, but still not very good odds of being AGS 0 for many other factors.

You can get an idea by reading the new tutorial for round stones - the basic rules are the same.
http://diamonds.pricescope.com/agsideal.asp

Leonid is in the process of a complete upgrade of the tutorial.

Any comments and suggestions welcomed

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

About an hour ago, I received an e-mail from a colleague, who was laughing with my sudden embrace of the Brilliancescope, while I am known as being quite critical about the validity of this machine''s measurements. He was specifically refering to this thread.

I was surprised, since I do not recall having changed my position about the Brilliancescope.

Anyway, to make things clear, I am still very critical about the validity of the measurements of the Brilliancescope. My criticism has always been about the bar-graph, where, according to me, an incorrect definition is used for especially scintillation and colored light return. As such, I still feel that one should not emphasize the importance of the bar-graph-scores.

On the other hand, I understand Rhino''s point of view, in which he stresses that the 6 pictures of the Brilliancescope contain a lot of valuable information for him. I have not worked enough with the machine and its results to disagree with this.

Incidentally, Elmyr (the services-company, who take our pictures and Sarin-measurements) is in the process of installing a Brilliancescope. Knowing that our stones perform well on this tool, this measurement will probably soon be included in the information we give about our stones. However, I wish to stress that this does not mean that I fully endorse the machine and its measurements.

Even with amazing scores like the one above, I still think that what the machine calls scintillation and colored light return is actually something else.

I hope that this clarifies my position.

Live long,