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FrogPrincess

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 16, 2006
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Hi everyone! I''m new here, but I''ve been reading the boards and everyone seems so knowledgeable about diamonds!

My boyfriend and I have started our search for my engagement ring. I am SO excited because this man is absolutely perfect for me, and I cannot wait to be married to him! I''ve never been a big jewelry girl, but he insists on getting me a beautiful ring, and I can''t turn that down, can I?

We live in NYC (Upper West Side) with our puppy, a cavalier king charles spaniel named Huxley. We found our ring designer - Ben Moses, on 47th Street - the sweetest older man who handmakes rings to fit specifications - I want a round-cut center stone @1.2-1.3 carats, with two small round saphires and one diamond on either side (forming a triangle). The ring will have art deco scrolling around the platinum band. I fell in love with a prototype he had at his shop, and he showed me how he can make it to fit all my personal wishes - including specific flower engravings and everything! I can''t wait to see it!

So, now the search for the perfect diamond: My bf has family in the diamond business (his grandfather was a diamond cutter from Antwerp who emigrated to NYC during the war). So, one of his uncles and some cousins are still in the business in Belgium, and they put us in touch with a diamond corporation (I think that''s what its called) here in NYC - Olympic Diamond - who will apparently give us a good deal.

Anyway - Bf and his father are going there today to see the stones... he wants to take me too, before he buys one, to make sure its the one I want (he''s so considerate!) I''ve been educating myself and him about the most important things to look for in a stone, and I think what I have in mind is:

1.2-1.3 carats (I don''t care about size for status - this looks good on my smallish hand and in the setting I love)
VS1-VS2 (or better, if possible!)
F-G color
Ideal cut (if possible - I don''t really understand the cut grading system, but I know its very important!)

Do you think its possible to get a diamond like this for @$8,000 - bf says he will spend as much $ as necessary to get me the ring I want but I can''t imagine asking him to spend more that $10,000 (he'' a lawyer and makes a lot of money but has loans and we want to buy an apartment...)

Any advice or help would be appreciated! I am so excited!!!!!
 
you can definitely get that size diamond for that price but it should come with a grading report from ags or gia. don''t pay that much for anything less than a well cut stone accompanied by one of those reports!

best of luck! and please post pics of your ring design!!
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Hi, and welcome! I wish you could go to Good Old Gold on Long Island before going to the other place. They will take a couple of hours educating you on diamonds and show you the finest cut diamonds. Then you''d have a reference point to know what to look for, plus a price comparison. There are many places in NY that are supposed to be wholesale, or whatever, but they are not! If you do go to GOG, be sure to make an appointment so they can plan to spend the time with you.

What you must insist on at the outset is diamonds that have been graded by AGS and GIA. You want AGS0 (ideal) or GIA Excellent. All GIA excellents are not equal to ideal, though, so you have to be careful. The best thing to do is to NOT buy today...just get a copy of the grading report on any diamonds you are interested in and then come back here and post the numbers. But just remember, other grading labs can be lax and you would not know what you''re getting. Also ask if this vendor has a lifetime upgrade policy in the even in later years you want to trade up to a larger stone.
 
Agree with Belle. If you actually narrow it to just AGS0, you can send your boyfriend on his way to go shopping.

From the point of what''s available for sharply discounted prices, which you can see on this board, $8 - $11 K does look about right (often "friends or relatives" are challenged to have prices these good). You can, for example, see this one locally to you, and its about the top of what you''ve mentioned in cost, but would do the job, nicely. Jonathan at GOG also can give your boyfriend a good presentation and education, regardless, so I''d recommend a trip...for one or both.
 
Thanks for all the advice... i''m not sure if we can get to GOG, but I will mention it to my bf. We will absolutely only get a diamond certified by GIA or ASG - I believe this place (www.olympicdiamond.com) only sells certified diamonds. I will tell him about the ASG0 grade too - what are the other grades that are "acceptable" below 0? (if any).
That diamond posted above is lovely, though - but more than I want to ask him to pay (the setting will be @$2,000) - I just can''t fathom spending so much money on a piece of jewelry since all I usually wear are diamond studs (8 point, VVS2, E, Very Good cut - a present from my grandmother)... but I know I will get used to wearing my beautiful ring!
 
Looking at their website, seems they only carry GIA.
 
Is that bad? I thought GIA was the most-widely used and trusted certification?
 
Date: 8/16/2006 12:15:14 PM
Author: Ellen
Looking at their website, seems they only carry GIA.
Click to expand...
ETA, although doing a search of inventory gives you a choice of certs...
 
Date: 8/16/2006 12:16:08 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Is that bad? I thought GIA was the most-widely used and trusted certification?
Click to expand...
No, it wouldn''t be "bad", just nice to have a choice. And AGS takes a bit of the guess work out of it.

I can''t copy or link the statement I''m referring to, guess the site won''t let me.
 
Date: 8/16/2006 12:16:08 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Is that bad? I thought GIA was the most-widely used and trusted certification?
Click to expand...
GIA is fine, but as I explained above, you want to see ONLY GIA Excellent cut stones, and even then you need to get a copy of the cert and post the numbers on here, because some are better than others.
 
Date: 8/16/2006 12:21:05 PM
Author: diamondseeker2006

Date: 8/16/2006 12:16:08 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Is that bad? I thought GIA was the most-widely used and trusted certification?
Click to expand...
GIA is fine, but as I explained above, you want to see ONLY GIA Excellent cut stones, and even then you need to get a copy of the cert and post the numbers on here, because some are better than others.
Click to expand...
this is part of the problem that i have with gia''s system (yes, just part of the problem!...tip of the iceberg part of the problem..
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)
besides the ''excellent'' category being very broad and allowing in unsightly steep/deeps
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a stone with great angles (that would have made ''ex'' or ags ideal) gets dinged if the girdle is too thin. by advising to get *only* gia ''ex'' you are not assured the best diamond and you could even be ruling out some great looking stones that got the ''very good'' grade. for the novice buyer that wants the top cut and a known performer, ags0 is the way to go.
 
Ok, I am getting more and more confused...
bf went to this diamond place today, and all of their diamonds are only certified GIA. He wants to get it from this place because they are offering him a good deal because he is "family," but they don''t use AGS... what should I do?

The stones he saw and liked today were rated either VG or G - is this really terrible?
 
Well... considering that for your budget you can get excellent cuts someplace else. Yes, that''s not good. Also you must understand that in diamond cutting ''good'' means acceptable (like a C in academic grades), very good means good (a B), and excellent means an A.... and even in GIA excellents there are A- ''s and A''s and A+ ''s.

So what your asking is... is it bad for your FI to spend the same $$ on a C or a B that he could spend on an A someplace else.

Well. Yes. It is. I wouldn''t do it. Family or not.
 
My opinion only, here...but strict reliance on numbers and charts, while useful for internet purchases, is less important when the customer has the opportunity to see prospecteve stones in person.

Since your BF is actually L@@KING at GIA graded stones I think he should let his eyes and heart be the final judge...

widget
 
Date: 8/16/2006 5:33:09 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Ok, I am getting more and more confused...
bf went to this diamond place today, and all of their diamonds are only certified GIA. He wants to get it from this place because they are offering him a good deal because he is 'family,' but they don't use AGS... what should I do?

The stones he saw and liked today were rated either VG or G - is this really terrible?
Click to expand...
It's not really very good. This is how people who often have "connections" don't often wind up on the winning side. There are some excellent VG, GIA graded diamonds, but you need to know what you're really looking for and it sounds like you haven't spent much time with the tutorials. If you're taking their advice, I'd recommend you back out gracefully and take some more time.

I wouldn't consider a GIA graded Good cut personally.

Now......what makes your bf believe they're offering such a good deal? i.e., what kind of pricing are they offering that is "such a deal?" Before he plunks down nearly 8 grand on a diamond (which should get a really well cut stone for that much), please ask these people for a Sarin and Ideal-Scope or BrillianceScope. If they balk, I'd walk.

Take your time here and don't be pressured to buy into the "family sponsored good deal, which may not be so good after all!"

Good Luck........
 
Date: 8/16/2006 5:50:55 PM
Author: Rod

Date: 8/16/2006 5:33:09 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Ok, I am getting more and more confused...
bf went to this diamond place today, and all of their diamonds are only certified GIA. He wants to get it from this place because they are offering him a good deal because he is ''family,'' but they don''t use AGS... what should I do?

The stones he saw and liked today were rated either VG or G - is this really terrible?
Click to expand...
It''s not really very good. This is how people who often have ''connections'' don''t often wind up on the winning side. There are some excellent VG, GIA graded diamonds, but you need to know what you''re really looking for and it sounds like you haven''t spent much time with the tutorials. If you''re taking their advice, I''d recommend you back out gracefully and take some more time.

I wouldn''t consider a GIA graded Good cut personally.

Now......what makes your bf believe they''re offering such a good deal? i.e., what kind of pricing are they offering that is ''such a deal?'' Before he plunks down nearly 8 grand on a diamond (which should get a really well cut stone for that much), please ask these people for a Sarin and Ideal-Scope or BrillianceScope. If they balk, I''d walk.

Take your time here and don''t be pressured to buy into the ''family sponsored good deal, which may not be so good after all!''

Good Luck........
Click to expand...
Ditto, on all of it.
 
I was thinking along the same lines as Rod. How does he know they are giving him a good deal? We see this from time to time on this forum..friends of the family offering a good deal, etc. And it almost always is NOT!!! Sometimes it''s a very bad deal.

You seriously don''t want a GIA good or very good. Picking a vg is technically possible as Belle has mentioned, but it would be like picking a needle out of a haystack for an inexperienced person. It''s still a little complicated to sort through the Excellents. You really, really need to make the trip over to Good Old Gold to see what excellent diamonds look like. And I am betting that you won''t find them priced a whole lot higher than these good and vg stones at Olympic. And Jonathan, the gemologist there, is very, very knowledgeable and very honest as well. I just hate to see you that close and not take advantage of at least the diamond education that they do there.
 
Date: 8/16/2006 5:33:09 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Ok, I am getting more and more confused...
bf went to this diamond place today, and all of their diamonds are only certified GIA. He wants to get it from this place because they are offering him a good deal because he is ''family,'' but they don''t use AGS... what should I do?

The stones he saw and liked today were rated either VG or G - is this really terrible?
Click to expand...
Everyone''s right.

Trust your boyfriend to get a beautiful diamond, and I''m sure he''ll be able to do it from this place.

Are you in a rush?

Encourage him to go to GOG....just for looking...seeing what many here think good is....and not to buy.

With perspective, he can go to his family place, and if he still likes what he sees, he will have compared. Or, he can ask them to bring in other pieces...since I''m sure they can.

Getting a diamond is supposed to be a positive process. Don''t let it become other than that.

Warm regards,
 
Bf discussed the diamonds he saw and prices with the jeweler who is making the setting - he and his son (a gemologist) said they thought 2 of the stones sounded really amazing and the price was almost wholesale that they are offering him. I think a lot of it has to do with how the stone looks. I am going to see them tomorrow, and will ask if they have Ideal Scopes and Sarin, and will see the GIA report too, of course.
Do you guys work for Good Old Gold or something? I''m not trying to be rude but I am sure that there are lots of other highly reputable diamond sellers, and not everyone in the world is trying to swindle customers.
I think that a family relationship that goes back more than 3 generations and is highly trusted by my bf''s family who are all in the industry is important. My future father-in-law has known these people his entire life... so why would they cheat him?
I have no desire to ever "trade-up" my engagement ring for a bigger one - the size bf is thinking is almost too big for me! - and I think we can get a beautiful stone from Olympic, but I am trying to do my homework first, of course!

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I WISH I worked for Good Old Gold! Mrs Darling Joy on here has already volunteered to be the greeter!
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No, seriously I came here in January to begin learning about diamonds and to look for a diamond for an anniversary ring my husband is buying for me. I looked at Good Old Gold, WhiteFlash, Winfield''s, James Allen, and Dimend Scaasi. I don''t live near any of them, so all my contact was by phone, email, and shipping of diamonds to see. Since GOG is in NY, it was just logical for us to recommend that you go there. We''re all envious and wish we could see their diamonds in person!

Just so you''re sure that I''m really a customer and have no connection to GOG other than that, here is a link to my very long thread deciding between two diamonds there! Just so you don''t have to read through to find out which one I chose, I chose the 1.63.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/two-beautiful-diamonds.47897/=
 
Date: 8/16/2006 5:49:04 PM
Author: widget
My opinion only, here...but strict reliance on numbers and charts, while useful for internet purchases, is less important when the customer has the opportunity to see prospecteve stones in person.

Since your BF is actually L@@KING at GIA graded stones I think he should let his eyes and heart be the final judge...

widget
Click to expand...
And I do agree with this, as long as there are GIA excellent and hearts and arrows stones in the mix to compare. It's sort of like choosing between McDonald's and Wendy's hamburgers (sure you might like one over the other, but...) without having the filet mignon in the line-up.

I really thought my old diamond was pretty until I saw ideal cut ones!
 
Date: 8/16/2006 7:58:24 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Bf discussed the diamonds he saw and prices with the jeweler who is making the setting - he and his son (a gemologist) said they thought 2 of the stones sounded really amazing and the price was almost wholesale that they are offering him. I think a lot of it has to do with how the stone looks. I am going to see them tomorrow, and will ask if they have Ideal Scopes and Sarin, and will see the GIA report too, of course.
Do you guys work for Good Old Gold or something? I''m not trying to be rude but I am sure that there are lots of other highly reputable diamond sellers, and not everyone in the world is trying to swindle customers.
I think that a family relationship that goes back more than 3 generations and is highly trusted by my bf''s family who are all in the industry is important. My future father-in-law has known these people his entire life... so why would they cheat him?
I have no desire to ever ''trade-up'' my engagement ring for a bigger one - the size bf is thinking is almost too big for me! - and I think we can get a beautiful stone from Olympic, but I am trying to do my homework first, of course!

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Click to expand...
1) Yes, for each sale Jonathan makes, I get half.

2) Only kidding, actually, why don''t you see this thread, and see if you think I only like everything he does? (The owner of Good Old Gold is Rhino).

3) Unllike Diamondseeker, I''ve been stuck here for 2 + years, after getting my wife''s replacement engagement ring, after she lost her diamond after some 16 years. Hopefully, in addition to learning some things, I''m hopefully helping others, too.

4) Good luck getting a sarin from your jewler friend. I live in Washington DC, a fairly major metropolitan area. They have no more than 4 sarin machines in my area. NYC is likely to have more than 4, but any random jewler will not have this $10K equipment.

5) Readers here have learned GOG has been successful, so we read where he has invested in equipment others have not, including Helium, more advanced than Sarin, and owned by maybe nobody but AGS in the US.

6) Forget, though, GOG. The point was only to get perspective. Go to any Nationally reputed vendor, like Tiffany''s, or a Hearts of Fire vendor, and see some diamonds that are really beautiful. (The advantage of GOG is that you could see well cut diamonds there, too, but not have to pay so much). Unfortunately, vendor lights frequently make not so beautiful diamonds look good anyway. You can get quality like the best stores show, without their prices. I think that''s what you want. That''s all.

7) Have a good time.
 
FrogPrincess, welcome to the forum.

Olympic Diamond is one of the largest wholesalers and some other online vendors might even list their stones on the web.

They''re not selling retail but perhaps a family member can get a stone from them. Run a price comparison from the front page for the stone(s) you''ll select, compare apples to apples. Also look at the tutorial.

Good luck and have fun.
 
How does this sound:

Round brilliant
1.41 carat
H
VS2
Dimensions: 7.10 x 7.14 x 4.47
Depth: 62.8
Table: 58
Girdle: Medium-Slightly Thick
Culet: None
Polish: VG
Sym: VG
Cut: VG
Flr: None

There are no inclusions on the table or top facets - it is very eyeclean and brilliant. GIA certified (these are their specs)

Thanks!
 
Your Highness, we need crown and pavilion angles to give an opinon. If you have the GIA number, you can look it up at www.gia.edu/reportcheck Did it tell you to take it home? (Cheesy personification)
 
Date: 8/17/2006 1:56:40 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
How does this sound:

Round brilliant
1.41 carat
H
VS2
Dimensions: 7.10 x 7.14 x 4.47
Depth: 62.8
Table: 58
Girdle: Medium-Slightly Thick
Culet: None
Polish: VG
Sym: VG
Cut: VG
Flr: None

There are no inclusions on the table or top facets - it is very eyeclean and brilliant. GIA certified (these are their specs)

Thanks!
Click to expand...
It could be a lovely stone. Have they provided any scope images? Did you get a sarin? And the big question, of course is: What kind of "DEAL" are they offering on this puppy? i.e., $$$$$

For what it''s worth, I like larger tabled diamonds. Mine is one.
 
Angles:
Crown: 35
Pavillion: 41.2
 
Bf won''t tell me the price exactly, but I think it is @$8,000 - which is what we want...
It is a gorgeous stone and is calling to me...
 
Date: 8/17/2006 2:08:32 PM
Author: FrogPrincess
Bf won''t tell me the price exactly, but I think it is @$8,000 - which is what we want...
It is a gorgeous stone and is calling to me...
Click to expand...
Please don''t take this the wrong way. If you have seen this stone and it speaks to you, that''s fantastic and you should buy it. But, since you have come online to ask our opinions, this stone is not a great deal. It''s priced right at the high end of a stone with its'' proportions. It''s not necessarily a bad deal, but you could get a better cut stone with this much money.

Still it''s not a dog and it''s a stone that could look beautiful and if it makes you happy, I hope it brings much pleasure to you for many many years (of course until Shrinkage sets in and you find yourself coveting a larger higher quality stone)

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