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I''m LOST:(! I1/SI3 - what to do...

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Chelle0511

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Feb 19, 2009
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Hello All!

I''m a little upset - I sure wish this diamond buying experience had been more of a pleasure for us! We chose to purchase my diamond and setting from a local jewelry store instead of the internet...thinking it would be quicker, more personal/exciting, and we trusted the local family owned store.

Now I''m SOOOO confused, have lost sleep and have had a constant bellyache for 3 days!

Found the setting - love it! Custom ordered it in my size and it should be here next week.

The diamond - OH MY!

I was set on nothing lower than a G/SI1, and wanted something in the .9ct range, since a full carat was beyond our budget (5K total - setting is $1400)

Jeweler calls me Monday and has a diamond she thinks I''ll be pleased with.

.92/G/I1/Excellent Cut/GIA Cert - $3475.00 I went in there thinking negative - an I1 - NO WAY! She said there was only 1 visible inclusion and my prong will 100% cover it. I searched - and never did see it!

I checked it out - loved it! Searched for the inclusion - couldn''t find it ... decided on it and left.

I kept thinking for two days - an I1 for my engagement ring - how sad.

Went back today, looked again, still liked it.

HOWEVER - her "diamond guy" was there and he had another I may be interested in.

.90/G/SI3/Ideal Cut - $4995.00

$1500 more to bump up to an SI3? She said she would knock off $600, but would you do it?

I have to admit the .90 looked larger than the .92, and had a bit more sparkle...but they both looked nice to me. I even looked under the microscope and still didn''t see much - what looked like small scratches maybe. No feathers, etc.

WHAT DO I DO? HELP...

Also, what is the average price per carat on a G SI3 vs. a G I1?

Thanks everyone - I look forward to your responses!
 

neatfreak

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Messages
14,167
GIA doesn''t have SI3...so it must have been EGL? And an EGL SI3 is likely to be a GIA I1...
 

Ellen

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 13, 2006
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24,427
Date: 3/19/2009 5:22:39 PM
Author: neatfreak
GIA doesn''t have SI3...so it must have been EGL? And an EGL SI3 is likely to be a GIA I1...
Ditto.
 

Upgradable

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
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5,537
Your eye is what will tell you!! Don''t compromise on what YOU FIND BEAUTIFUL!! We can tell you this and that, but it has to work for you!!!!
 

Chelle0511

Rough_Rock
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78
The SI3 was a bit sparklier and a hair larger, only bc I saw them side-by-side, otherwise I would have never been able to tell the two apart.

However, the I1 was a GIA Excellent - is that okay?
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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42,064
Date: 3/19/2009 5:33:32 PM
Author: Chelle0511
The SI3 was a bit sparklier and a hair larger, only bc I saw them side-by-side, otherwise I would have never been able to tell the two apart.

However, the I1 was a GIA Excellent - is that okay?
In order to know for sure, we need all the proportions, depth, table, angles and so on. Yes and that is the case that SI3 is an EGL created and used grade only, GIA do not use such a term and their clarity grades go from SI2 to I1 so it is pretty much assumed that EGL SI3 would be GIA I1 if GIA were to grade the diamond.
 

Upgradable

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Messages
5,537
Definitely look at the stones in all different kind of lighting environments. Jewelry spotlights are designed to make diamonds sparkle. See if you can look at them outside, in regular office light, indirect lighting, etc. This baby is going to have to perform in all environments.
 

Chelle0511

Rough_Rock
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Feb 19, 2009
Messages
78
I did take the 2 of them outside, side-by-side - I couldn''t see much difference. They both had amazing SPARKLE:)!
 

2Artists

Brilliant_Rock
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Oct 13, 2007
Messages
622
You did the right thing coming here. If you listen to the experts here you will be able to get a fabulous ring that you love. You deserve to have a ring you love and a ring buying experience that does not make you lose sleep and does not give you "constant bellyache for 3 days".

I just wanted to say you are in good hands here at PS and the experts here can help you sort this out. Best luck.



Mrs.2Artists
 

Ellen

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 13, 2006
Messages
24,427
It basically comes down to this.

You have a certed GIA G I1 that looks great. Then you have a ?, that is most likely an I1 (or lower), H (or lower), that is a hair bigger, for 900.00 more.


I know which one I would pick, but it''s up to you.
 

neatfreak

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Feb 17, 2007
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14,167
Date: 3/19/2009 6:01:11 PM
Author: Ellen
It basically comes down to this.


You have a certed GIA G I1 that looks great. Then you have a ?, that is most likely an I1 (or lower), H (or lower), that is a hair bigger, for 900.00 more.



I know which one I would pick, but it''s up to you.
Well said.
 

Lorelei

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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42,064
Date: 3/19/2009 6:07:32 PM
Author: neatfreak

Date: 3/19/2009 6:01:11 PM
Author: Ellen
It basically comes down to this.


You have a certed GIA G I1 that looks great. Then you have a ?, that is most likely an I1 (or lower), H (or lower), that is a hair bigger, for 900.00 more.



I know which one I would pick, but it''s up to you.
Well said.
Ditto.
 

2Artists

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Oct 13, 2007
Messages
622
Do you have to get the stone from this store or are any online vendors a possibility?

Mrs.2Artists
 

phoenixgirl

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 20, 2003
Messages
3,369
The I1 doesn''t bother me; they can be a great way to save money is the inclusion isn''t noticeable. What bothers me is that you think the other stone sparkles more and looks bigger even though it''s a smaller size . . . sounds like the I1 may be deep cut, or at least not the greatest GIA excellent specimen. Their excellent grades can occasionally miss the mark.

What bothers me even more is the price. Type in G I1 0.92 carats into the search engine here. 5 GIA certed stones with those exact specifications come up, price range $1781 to $2428. With $3500 to spend you can get a beautifully cut diamond with higher clarity and a cut we know is superb.

For comparison:

1.00 G I1 GIA excellent with nice pic for under 3k
 

purrfectpear

Ideal_Rock
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Mar 31, 2008
Messages
4,079
.90 to .92, G, I1 vary from a low of $1500 to a high of $2428 in GIA diamonds.

G, SI3 vary from $1400 to $2800 in EGL diamonds (as far as I know, GIA doesn''t use SI3 as a grade).

No idea how eyeclean any of them are, you''d have to have them called in to a trusted Pricescope dealer and have them tell you.
 

canuk-gal

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Chelle0511

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
78
The setting I selected she is selling to me at $1300 (a little under retail). I called today before closing and she told me that she would come down on the diamond (on day one of shopping in there, I was with a mutual friend of both of ours and she told me she would sell it under retail) and I could get the setting and diamond for $4100 - $4200 out the door (I''m assuming this includes tax). In estimating, that makes the diamond around $2600.

She also told me, she would choose the I3, because of the certification, price, etc. It must be better, because she will make less money off the sale of this diamond.

I''ll call tomorrow and get the GIA cert number, that way I can get the additional proportions off of GIA''s website, correct?

Thanks again to everyone - you are all truly wonderful!
 

canuk-gal

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Date: 3/19/2009 10:21:38 PM
Author: Chelle0511
The setting I selected she is selling to me at $1300 (a little under retail). I called today before closing and she told me that she would come down on the diamond (on day one of shopping in there, I was with a mutual friend of both of ours and she told me she would sell it under retail) and I could get the setting and diamond for $4100 - $4200 out the door (I'm assuming this includes tax). In estimating, that makes the diamond around $2600.

She also told me, she would choose the I3, because of the certification, price, etc. It must be better, because she will make less money off the sale of this diamond.

I'll call tomorrow and get the GIA cert number, that way I can get the additional proportions off of GIA's website, correct?

Thanks again to everyone - you are all truly wonderful!
HI:

Yes. In addition, the EGL stone will have some proportion info, get that as well so YOU can make an informed decision. BTW, EGL is know to have softer grading than GIA or AGS so the stone as an S13 and H color, would be lower by comparison. Hence you are not comparing apples to apples with these two stones. I would choose the one I want!

cheers--Sharon
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,438
SI3 is a marketing ploy to grade some I1 diamonds with a nicer terminology. It does nothing to the actual quality of the diamond. Dealers often claim SI3's are the very finest of I1 and the lowest end of SI2, but I can't find one dealer who would allow his SI2 to be graded SI3 by any lab without a battle over incorrect grading. The argment about some SI3's being SI2's is pretty much as incredible as a thinking person will realize it truly is. Diamond dealers are a smart bunch when it comes to their one product, DIAMONDS. SI3 is a great game, but it is only a game and the way it is being used has no benefit for consumers.

Many years ago I wrote an article about altering clarity grading to more absolute standards and allowing that maybe there was a place for SI3 so long as several other grading changes could be agreed upon. No surprise, no one agrees on solidifying grading of clarity. The trade prefers a nice amount of subjectivity and consumers must remain skeptical and cautious. With SI3 you are never looking at a GIA or AGS report.

I think you would find very few of the appraisers listed in Pricescope offering SI3 grading unless specifically called upon to work it into a report for some special reason. We know what it is supposed to mean. We know what it is used for. We know what is going on. Now those who read this thread know, too.

One should avoid lumping all EGL labs around the world into one category. They are run differently from one another. The USA lab is light years ahead of some overseas EGL offerings and is on the right track.
 

phoenixgirl

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 20, 2003
Messages
3,369
Date: 3/19/2009 8:47:22 PM
Author: purrfectpear
.90 to .92, G, I1 vary from a low of $1500 to a high of $2428 in GIA diamonds.


G, SI3 vary from $1400 to $2800 in EGL diamonds (as far as I know, GIA doesn't use SI3 as a grade).


No idea how eyeclean any of them are, you'd have to have them called in to a trusted Pricescope dealer and have them tell you.

I checked .90 G SI3 EGL too, and on the PS search engine all stones were $1644 to $1961 *except* one stone which was listed for $2894. I thought maybe the first number should have been a "1," so I clicked on the link (Abazias), and it is listed on their website for $2109. I assume that they meant to write "$1894" as their PS sale price.

So this tells you that EGL SI3s are actually valued less than GIA I1s with the same color.


You already have the setting you want and are obviously going to buy from this jeweler . . . I just think you can do better. I would not settle for a stone that didn't sparkle as much or look as big as a smaller stone.

Can you write down all the specs from the GIA certificate and post them? That will give us a little more insight.
 
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