Dancing Fire|1457241053|4000421 said:Must stop having babies born out of wedlock.katharath|1457234058|4000393 said:kenny|1457229951|4000381 said:packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
Someone from a group that is statistically more likely to be disenfranchised finally getting a decent job with benefits IS making it better 'in the beginning' ... AKA their kids.
That's no band aide.
We can't exactly take a way their kids and give them to be raised in 'nice' families on the right side of the tracks, with hope, the right values, language clothing & mannerisms of the more successful classes, high expectations, middle+ income and career connections.
A parent getting a decent job is just one step in the right direction out of the never-ending cycle of hopelessness, but a big one.
This. That is how you break a cycle and move forward.
kenny|1457226242|4000352 said:msop04|1457225347|4000350 said:kenny said:msop04|1457224074|4000346 said:kenny said:msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
That's the short view.
The long view is equality.
If a white male is more qualified for something, but it's given to a Hispanic female (who does not have the same qualifications), that does not in any way ensure future equality. It means minorities have no incentive to try as hard as their majority counterparts. No one wants to work hard, only to be told they can't have something bc of their race/sex.
It seems to me that it's not true equality that some are seeking... it's special treatment.
Groups with, overall, lower economic status getting better jobs helps their kids do better.
Kids may get better nutrition, health care, education and grow up with something whites have long take for granted, hope and high expectations for themselves.
Over time inequality will be reduced and affirmative action can end.
In theory, that sounds great… Reality is that you have to want to do better to really do better. From what I have seen and witnessed, very few want to do better when all they have to do is exist to reap the benefits for which others work hard. When there is no incentive, everyone will eventually stop trying. That's just common sense.
You try being raised in a culture/family/home/community where the only hope is a lucky lottery ticket.
lulu|1457281099|4000560 said:I'll vote for Hillary. She's a very energetic liar but Trump is unthinkable.
Niel|1457281848|4000566 said:Dancing Fire|1457241053|4000421 said:Must stop having babies born out of wedlock.katharath|1457234058|4000393 said:kenny|1457229951|4000381 said:packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
Someone from a group that is statistically more likely to be disenfranchised finally getting a decent job with benefits IS making it better 'in the beginning' ... AKA their kids.
That's no band aide.
We can't exactly take a way their kids and give them to be raised in 'nice' families on the right side of the tracks, with hope, the right values, language clothing & mannerisms of the more successful classes, high expectations, middle+ income and career connections.
A parent getting a decent job is just one step in the right direction out of the never-ending cycle of hopelessness, but a big one.
This. That is how you break a cycle and move forward.
Oh, df, I assumed you where pro life.
Are you one of those conservatives that support birth control education in our public school systems?
AGBF|1457301260|4000693 said:House Cat, I love what you wrote. And ksinger, I love the letter you posted. I know these worlds, not because I grew up in them, but because I knew children (and adults) from them due to my work. Your descriptions, House Cat, and those of the teacher who wrote the letter you posted, K, are such a good reminder. I did not remember what it was like for children to have to go home from school into abusive situations. Maybe that is a perspective to which I needed more exposure. I tend to remember my last job (in 1992) in which I worked with poor adults-although I was supposed to be doing psychotherapy in a mental health clinic!-because I happened to be working in such an impoverished city. I couldn't just sit there and look at psychodynamics while a poor woman was feeling unwanted as she moved from the couch of one relative to the couch of another, essentially homeless, trying to find housing! And struggled to get medical help for her diabetes! I was told to treat her depression. Well guess what. Her her depression was not simply chemical; it was also reactive!
AGBF
Exactly!... agree with you 101%!...smitcompton|1457286069|4000586 said:Hi,
After reading Housecats last post, I wish to celebrate those that are able to lift themselves up: Our immigrants. Imagine, people with no money, unable to speak the language, working in factories, raising children who have ambition and desire to get ahead. Generations of every kind of people come here and make it. Asians are the top middle class earners now.(CNBC)
How long do you keep affirmative action? Isn't 50 yrs enough? Black American have had middeclass success, as shown in Atlanta Georgia. Sure racism exists, as has prejudice against most all immigrant groups when they arrive. They all move ahead. And usually within a generation. Immigrants know the fields to go into to get ahead. Amazing!
Parents teach their children to be independent. When you keep giving your children an excuse for behavior that will not be conducive to that end, You hurt them. We hurt those persons that we expect nothing from. We also expect too much from our schools, who are over burdened with caring for children who are not being cared for at home.
My view of life is more optimistic. Responsibility begins at home with parents.
Annette
PS. I have changed my view. I will vote for Clinton.
PS. I have changed my view. I will vote for Clinton.
Gypsy|1457339285|4000902 said:You know what bothers me most, regarding the Democrats? The inevitability of Hillary because NO ONE ELSE IS RUNNING. There are SEVERAL great Democrats that would have been great nominees for the left. BETTER than Hillary, IMO. But they were browbeaten or scared off from running. And that LACK OF CHOICE bugs the crap out of me. We should have had more than Bernie and Hillary to chose from.
missy|1457354953|4000943 said:... I don't vote a party (I really don't Kenny) ...
Dancing Fire|1457314666|4000784 said:[quote="House Cat|
ETA: Hiring people from these areas should be considered as a way to help lift them and their children out of this kind of survival living I have described. It is a first step in providing those basic needs that I am referring to. If you lift the family up, the children have a fighting chance. If the children are elevated, their children will do better. This becomes a positive, snowball effect for this family. Hiring someone of "ethnicity" is so much more than giving away a job.
vtigger86 said:[quote="House Cat
__________________
Well, it's kind of like that for the very poor. The middle class status is for everyone else, not them. Nice cars, good food, safety, a nice marriage, that is all for other people or fairytales on TV, but it isn't even an option for them. They wouldn't even know HOW to go about changing their lives in order to reach a different financial status.
msop04|1457397101|4001268 said:vtigger86 said:[quote="House Cat
__________________
Well, it's kind of like that for the very poor. The middle class status is for everyone else, not them. Nice cars, good food, safety, a nice marriage, that is all for other people or fairytales on TV, but it isn't even an option for them. They wouldn't even know HOW to go about changing their lives in order to reach a different financial status.
Why not??.. You should stop making excuses for them, if poor Chinese immigrants can get themselves off the ground so can American born citizens.
Wish I was smart enough to be a pharmacist... [/quote]vtigger86 said:msop04|1457397101|4001268 said:vtigger86 said:[quote="House Cat
__________________
Well, it's kind of like that for the very poor. The middle class status is for everyone else, not them. Nice cars, good food, safety, a nice marriage, that is all for other people or fairytales on TV, but it isn't even an option for them. They wouldn't even know HOW to go about changing their lives in order to reach a different financial status.
Why not??.. You should stop making excuses for them, if poor Chinese immigrants can get themselves off the ground so can American born citizens.
[emoji1303]
Dancing Fire|1457396757|4001266 said:[quote="House Cat
__________________
Well, it's kind of like that for the very poor. The middle class status is for everyone else, not them. Nice cars, good food, safety, a nice marriage, that is all for other people or fairytales on TV, but it isn't even an option for them. They wouldn't even know HOW to go about changing their lives in order to reach a different financial status.