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I feel so lost now that I started this journey...

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jamhenkim

Rough_Rock
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Apr 18, 2014
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First, I want to say hello and thanks to everyone in this community for posting such great information that allowed me to become a semi-amateur diamontologist(prob. not even close). I've been in search of the "perfect" diamond for a good two months now and it's getting pretty difficult to find what I want. When I first started researching, i thought I had a good idea of what i wanted... But the more I learned, the more uncertain I got. It's more than just the 4C's for me now. I've looked at probably about thirty different stones since I started and I can't seem to find the stone I'm looking for; at the cheapest price.

For example, there are so many talks about "table and depth" and "hearts and arrows.” Bluenile states table: 55-57% and depth: 60.1-61.9% being the best to achieve "hearts and arrows," while Brian Gavin has diamonds out of those ranges that have "hearts and arrows." To me, I've found myself to liking how the diamonds shine when they have a good H&A pattern. When diamonds don't have H&A, the diamonds shine seem to be kind of "splashy" whereas, diamonds with H&A seem to shoot "beams." Over time, I fell in love with how diamonds with H&A shines. That was when it got so hard for me...

There's a lot of talk about how I should find a person who I can trust to find a good valued diamond. However, most of us do not have that kind of luxury so I end up looking at sites like Bluenile and filtering out to signature ideal, and even Brian Gavin with very few selections. I'm reading mixed reviews and it's confusing me even more.

All I wanted to do at the beginning of my journey was to find the perfect stone for this girl I love so much. It’s really consuming too much time and effort for me now. I just want to find a person I can trust on this site so I can move on and focus on something that matters more. Is there anyone I can trust to help me find my perfect diamond?




Some examples of my search:

http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-diamond-ring?elem=sub2&forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP&track=rotator1#diamonds_forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP|builder=BYOR|pid=LD04145685

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.891-f-si1-round-diamond-ags-104069795040

http://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-diamond-ring?elem=sub2&forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP&track=rotator1#diamonds_forceStep=DIAMONDS_STEP|builder=BYOR|pid=LD02539834

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.810-f-vs1-round-diamond-ags-104063219022


4C'S:

Ct: 0.80-1.00
Color: F-D
Cut: Ex/Ideal
Clarity: VS2(Eye clean SI1)-VVS1
Fluor: Faint-None
Polish: VG-EX
Symm: EX
Price: $3,000-8,000
Depth: 60.1-61.9% (???)
Table: 55-57% (???)
 
That .891 F SI1 looks fantastic! Do you not want to go over 1 ct? With 8000 and going down to G or H you can get some very nice larger superideal H&A stones.

Here's some other options (I'll assume the budget is for the stone):

.86 D SI1 (ask Jon if eyeclean)
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11444/

.94 G VS2
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11574/

.944 E SI1, verified eye clean
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3019441.htm

If you're willing to compromise on color (for a round going down to H is still being conservative, G if you're REALLY safe), here's some larger size options, which she might appreciate:

1.121 H SI1, verified eye clean (this would be my pick)
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3060882.htm
 
Jamhenkim,

You are not alone! There are thousands upon thousands of people who start their journey looking for the perfect diamond with one idea of what they want, then learn all there is to see here on PS and find themselves overwhelmed with information. Tables, Pavilions, Angles, Depth, Clouds, Needles, etc. etc. where does it end?

If I may propose a few parameters that should help you immensely:

Color and clarity happen in incremental steps. Most people can select from a range. Meanwhile, man has a bit to do with selecting possible Carat weight of the stone, but EVERYTHING to do with the cut of the stone (and the resulting H&A images).

Here is the process I would recommend:

Find diamonds with ASET images (Idealscope is OK for rounds) and look for the best possible light performance - 1st and foremost.

In your posted parameters you listed D-F color. We call those “collection colors” and they are indeed the highest value. If you’re not ‘married’ to the collection category you may be able to relax on that standard, however. Diamonds in the near-colorless range can have a very white appearance, especially with top cut, and you then have more flex in other Cs.

Contact the seller of any stone which is in the SI1 range or lower and ask if the diamond is 'eye-clean' [You have this already listed] be sure you and the seller have the same definition of ‘eye-clean.’

If you get ASET images and lab reports and post them here for opinions you will find a supportive and knowledgeable group (both in and out of the diamond trade) to help steer you in the right direction.

This should be an EXCITING and hopeful time far more than stressful!

Best wishes – and hopes that you find your dream diamond!
 
Thanks guys,

Roqsteady.
I really liked that G VS stone and the 1ct option is not a bad idea. However, I found myself to be a little color sensitive and didn't like even the G so much compared to the colorless range. I like the Ice cold look but I'll give it another thought since you won't be able to notice the difference when its mounted and by itself.


Diamond Hawk,
Thanks for the support.
I'll def post those up when I get them.
 
Take heart!
It took me 4 months to find the perfect diamond and it was a little intense.
Came out the other side with something I love absolutely.
Know you will too.
Hang in there :lol:
 
RockyRacoon|1397843555|3655579 said:
If you're looking for something larger, with a higher color, but still in your price range, check out this option:

.921ct, E, SI1
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.921-e-si1-round-diamond-ags-104068964004

However, I think I would go with the .891ct from BGD. That one looks great and will be a solid value for your money!


Yes, I think so too but that's on reserve.
Also, I like your suggestion too. I just need to verify that it's eye clean.
 
jamhenkim|1397850948|3655641 said:
RockyRacoon|1397843555|3655579 said:
If you're looking for something larger, with a higher color, but still in your price range, check out this option:

.921ct, E, SI1
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.921-e-si1-round-diamond-ags-104068964004

However, I think I would go with the .891ct from BGD. That one looks great and will be a solid value for your money!


Yes, I think so too but that's on reserve.
Also, I like your suggestion too. I just need to verify that it's eye clean.


Ahhh... I thought you were the one who reserved it! Either way, you can reach out to BGD to find out how much longer that one is Reserved.

The .921ct claims 'This diamond is eye clean,' but I would confirm with BGD before moving forward.

Either one of those is a major winner.

Best of luck!
 
Actually, the WhiteFlash and Good Old Gold stones seem to be a better value in terms of price. I would choose from these:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3019441.htm ($6565 with ps/wire discount)

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2962074.htm ($6502 " , good choice if you want VS2)

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11444/ (looks like a very nice stone and a good price)

I am sorry you found your search hard. But it is actually quite easy if you focus on the vendors who specialize in hearts and arrows stones!
 
I also like the .89 BG its a great stone but I was also wondering why you don't go to G and go over a carat
 
heididdl|1397869275|3655788 said:
I also like the .89 BG its a great stone but I was also wondering why you don't go to G and go over a carat

I'm not sure if 1ct is that much different from a .9ct (price to size perspective).
I rather have a more perfect stone than a little bigger stone with more money.
Also, to my research, a stone does not jump too much in size for one grade in color...
What do you think?
 
jamhenkim, coming from a different culture, where the diamonds are mostly "tiny but perfect" rather than "as large as you can get" I congratulate you for your healthy attitude towards maximizing the quality aspects over size.

Having said that, I do understand that to some the difference between a 0.9ct and a ONE CARAT is tremendous psychologically (nothing wrong with that) and I think that is what others were going after.

I guess what you want to consider, is whether it makes you and the gf feel more special/proud to think that the stone is as high in color as possible within the budget or as high in ct size as possible. And both are equally good choices!

I have to admit that though I am from the "Tinydiamondland" I too got a bit hung up on the mental carats in the end and went from looking for 0.3ct center stone only accepting stones over half carat and not a 0.01ct less. Totally irrational. I blame Pricescope. :nono:
 
I have a couple more in the same price range. I guess i decided to push for the 1ct.
I feel like socal is a bad place to be with a small stone... haha

Was wondering the pros and cons between the three diamonds:

This one i posted just previously:
1.) 1.016 G VS2 (MB) - WP: $8,245
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.016-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104067973020#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/3/

2.) 1.01 ct G VS2 - WP: $8,354
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3063732.htm?source=pricescope

3.) 1.011 ct G VS2 - WP: $8,164
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3045735.htm

OR:
Save a little money and go a tiny bit smaller?

4.) 0.94ct G VS2 - WP: $6,575
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11574/
 
Good choices!

I'd go with option 1) Alot of people here love the effect of blue fluorescence, and in normal lighting you'll see no negative effects at all. It faces up the largest of the 3, AND you can actually get it even cheaper if you ask for the Pricescope discount (it should come out to 8075 if you're paying with wire transfer). So that makes it a pretty easy win for me :)
 
Hi jamhenkim :)

Roqsteady posted *this* stone to this thread:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3060882.htm

I think this is a stunning stone. Having seen a bunch of them, I would prefer to go with a WF ACA, a BGD signature cut, or a GOG superior - as opposed to a BGD Expert Selection or a GOG premium cut. For my money, I could actually see the difference.

I think the larger size would be very nice, the cut is second to none, and my own e-ring is an H SI1, and if you look at my avatar, you'll see that it's very white - and has no tint from any angle. I own a BUNCH of SI 1 stones, and they're all eye clean, so I'd be checking with WF to see if this one was also. If they say 'yes', that addresses the clarity issue.

The stone is within your stated budget (so there's that point checked off your list), and the size is generous, so no problems there.

If you decide an H is acceptable to you, I'd make a move on this stone if it's still available. I own a lot of F and E colored stones - and even a D or two - and, even though I love them, I find them to be somewhat hard and cold looking compared to my H. My H is very white, but softer; not 'warmer' - just softer.

I am very color sensitive and dislike warm stones in solitaires (sorry everyone!!), but I have NO issues with my H.

Call them and ask their opinion - they'll be straight with you.
 
And I don't mean to be a debbie-downer, but there was a gentleman on here last week whose fiancee absolutely freaked (and not in a good way) when he told her he was considering a stone with fluorescence. I have to say, I'm not a fan either, though I can live with it. But some women, sometimes unexpectedly, have very strong views on fluorescence, either for or against.
 
mrs-blop|1398122979|3657419 said:
Hi jamhenkim :)

Roqsteady posted *this* stone to this thread:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3060882.htm

I think this is a stunning stone. Having seen a bunch of them, I would prefer to go with a WF ACA, a BGD signature cut, or a GOG superior - as opposed to a BGD Expert Selection or a GOG premium cut. For my money, I could actually see the difference.

I think the larger size would be very nice, the cut is second to none, and my own e-ring is an H SI1, and if you look at my avatar, you'll see that it's very white - and has no tint from any angle. I own a BUNCH of SI 1 stones, and they're all eye clean, so I'd be checking with WF to see if this one was also. If they say 'yes', that addresses the clarity issue.

The stone is within your stated budget (so there's that point checked off your list), and the size is generous, so no problems there.

If you decide an H is acceptable to you, I'd make a move on this stone if it's still available. I own a lot of F and E colored stones - and even a D or two - and, even though I love them, I find them to be somewhat hard and cold looking compared to my H. My H is very white, but softer; not 'warmer' - just softer.

I am very color sensitive and dislike warm stones in solitaires (sorry everyone!!), but I have NO issues with my H.

Call them and ask their opinion - they'll be straight with you.



Thank you for your in-depth suggestion mrs-blop. I almost considered going with that stone.. haha
However, size isn't the biggest factor for me because I'm already pushing it at 1ct.

I know in the US 1ct is the norm but 1ct in Korea is super dooper huge; most people settle at .03 to .04 avg.
In addition, she's very young so it would look a little snobby to go even bigger than that within our culture.
(She's 23 and I'm 27, and the average age of first marriage is 31.6 for men and 28.7 for women in Korea)
So, at 1 ct point I rather buy color and clairty because I don't need to go more than that.

I don't know if it's just me but I actually see color difference between an E and a G, easily.
I had to actually bite my tongue to even go down to a G. hahaha :sick:

Also, your ring looks really awesome and I would definitely consider going lower on the color scale if I were to set it in yellow gold like yours; it would be probably better to go lower in that aspect. However, maybe it's because I'm a guy, but I kind of like the icy look on a diamond set on platinum/14k white.

Regarding fluorescence, I'll definitely check that with her somehow if she cares for it. (of course, in secret somehow haha)

Thanks again!

Please PS people, help me make a decision or suggest anything that's better than my choices. (Don't want to go lower than a G and VS2)
I need to make a decision by next month. ^.^
 
jamhenkim|1398121280|3657403 said:
I have a couple more in the same price range. I guess i decided to push for the 1ct.
I feel like socal is a bad place to be with a small stone... haha

Was wondering the pros and cons between the three diamonds:

This one i posted just previously:
1.) 1.016 G VS2 (MB) - WP: $8,245
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.016-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-bl-104067973020#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/3/

2.) 1.01 ct G VS2 - WP: $8,354
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3063732.htm?source=pricescope

3.) 1.011 ct G VS2 - WP: $8,164
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3045735.htm

OR:
Save a little money and go a tiny bit smaller?

4.) 0.94ct G VS2 - WP: $6,575
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11574/


Hi, guys again.
I was just wondering if there was another expert on here that can give their opinion on these diamonds.
I would really really appreciate it.
Thank you.
 
I'd personally go for either the BGD stone or the GOG. The GOG is really nice and it faces up at 6.3mm. Which is great. And I genuinely don't think I would pay an additional 2k for .15 of size as the BGD stone is 6.45 right now with diamond prices being so high.

So unless hitting the one carat mark is really important to your lady (and it really is for some, and that's fine, I'll be honest and say that it was important for me when I got engaged), I would recommend the GOG stone.
 
the GOG looks awesome and it's on reserve now so I hope that's you! It's backed by the Lifetime guarantee so upgrading in the future for a special anniversary or baby, it's all possible. Congrats!!
 
jamhenkim said:
I rather have a more perfect stone than a little bigger stone with more money.
I agree 100%. That's the same decision I made.

That 1.016 BGD Blue has some strange asymmetry in the center - don't know how those missing blue areas will affect contrast.

Take a look at this very clean stone: http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-infinity-new&id=937

I just bought a G VS1 from them and it is SUPER white. I can tell you that you could not possibly be pickier than me. And I have compared it to Es and Fs, and mine looks whiter and brighter, presumably due to the precision of the cut.

But I feel your pain. I also did not enjoy the hunting for the stone and the mass absorption of data. It was nerve-wracking all the way to the moment my fiancé opened the box. :love:
 
SandyinAnaheim|1398201356|3658049 said:
jamhenkim said:
I rather have a more perfect stone than a little bigger stone with more money.
I agree 100%. That's the same decision I made.

That 1.016 BGD Blue has some strange asymmetry in the center - don't know how those missing blue areas will affect contrast.

Take a look at this very clean stone: http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-infinity-new&id=937

I just bought a G VS1 from them and it is SUPER white. I can tell you that you could not possibly be pickier than me. And I have compared it to Es and Fs, and mine looks whiter and brighter, presumably due to the precision of the cut.

But I feel your pain. I also did not enjoy the hunting for the stone and the mass absorption of data. It was nerve-wracking all the way to the moment my fiancé opened the box. :love:

Thanks for your input SandyinAnaheim.
I think I'm going to follow your decision and pick the GOG diamond.
I called Jonathan over at GOG and he told me that the diamond is a superior cut in every aspect, that I would not be disappointed.
He said the only thing that knocked it off from being superior is that one of the heart is a little smaller than the others.
I think this is the one, save some money and we'll go to a better honeymoon.
Thank you people.

I hope my girl loves it!

Also,
I see that you live in Anaheim; I live in Fullerton (OC, Calif.).
May I ask where you went to have your diamond appraised?
And how are you going to upkeep your diamond ring(etc. cleaning, insurance, etc etc)?

Thanks thanks
 
jamhenkim said:
I see that you live in Anaheim; I live in Fullerton (OC, Calif.).
May I ask where you went to have your diamond appraised?
And how are you going to upkeep your diamond ring(etc. cleaning, insurance, etc etc)?

Before you buy, maybe you should read up on Hearts and Arrows. Here's a couple of articles for you:
http://niceice.com/hearts-and-arrows-diamonds/
http://www.prosumerdiamonds.com/hearts-and-arrows/
https://www.pricescope.com/journal/hearts_and_arrows_diamonds_and_basics_diamond_cutting

My custom rings came with an appraisal. But I've had other jewelry and my and my fiancé's watch appraised at Ben Bridge Jewelers at South Coast Plaza. They give a discount on multiple pieces. Incidentally, this is also the place I compared my G stone to their Es and Fs and was floored that mine was whiter and brighter. :twisted:

I was originally intending to get insurance on my rings, but they are SO well crafted, that I know that none of those stones are coming out unless I do some horrifically brutal thing to those rings. So I'm going to save my $525/yr and not insure.

For cleaning I bought a new old stock Jewel Jet on eBay as recommended here and polish the platinum myself. But when it's time to get the prongs checked, I'll take them to Ben Bridge Jewelers where I can watch my precious while they inspect.

I'm curious though - what are you doing for a setting?
 
SandyinAnaheim|1398218908|3658266 said:
jamhenkim said:
I see that you live in Anaheim; I live in Fullerton (OC, Calif.).
May I ask where you went to have your diamond appraised?
And how are you going to upkeep your diamond ring(etc. cleaning, insurance, etc etc)?

Before you buy, maybe you should read up on Hearts and Arrows. Here's a couple of articles for you:
http://niceice.com/hearts-and-arrows-diamonds/
http://www.prosumerdiamonds.com/hearts-and-arrows/
https://www.pricescope.com/journal/hearts_and_arrows_diamonds_and_basics_diamond_cutting

My custom rings came with an appraisal. But I've had other jewelry and my and my fiancé's watch appraised at Ben Bridge Jewelers at South Coast Plaza. They give a discount on multiple pieces. Incidentally, this is also the place I compared my G stone to their Es and Fs and was floored that mine was whiter and brighter. :twisted:

I was originally intending to get insurance on my rings, but they are SO well crafted, that I know that none of those stones are coming out unless I do some horrifically brutal thing to those rings. So I'm going to save my $525/yr and not insure.

For cleaning I bought a new old stock Jewel Jet on eBay as recommended here and polish the platinum myself. But when it's time to get the prongs checked, I'll take them to Ben Bridge Jewelers where I can watch my precious while they inspect.

I'm curious though - what are you doing for a setting?

According to those articles, the stone I reserved at GOG doesn't seem to be 100% heart and arrows... :(
I guess the arrows look more dead on, but isn't that what matters more?
Does it make that much of a difference?

You seem like a knowledgeable person. What can you tell me about the GOG stone?
I'm kind of second guessing myself now...


I'm planning to do a 6 prong tiffany in platinum/14k white. I'm not sure which metal to go with.
They both have their pros and cons... and you?
 
I had a whole explanation all typed out last night and somehow lost it when I hit submit. :angryfire:

The reality is hearts are visible only through the pavilion and not really visible anymore once the diamond is set. Since neither you nor I are cutters nor advanced mathematicians, we cannot measure the precision of a diamond's cut. However, H&A are the product of very precise mathematical proportions in relation to each other. All the facets on a diamond with the exception of the culet should be aligned exactly 180 degrees opposite of each other. When they are not, you start to see anomalies in the hearts and or the stars. The hearts could be cleft, different sizes, shapes, disproportionate, different distances from the V below it, etc. The stars are the visual representation of the facet cutting on the crown and are evaluated for symmetry in much the same way as the hearts, except that they will always be visible.

Bear in mind that the hearts effect is a way to evaluate optical symmetry, which is not the same as the symmetry measured by AGS or GIA. That symmetry refers to the organization of the facet intersections along with their placement. Optical symmetry is a result the size, shape and relation of the facets to each other and how they reflect light internally. An ideally cut stone may not always have H&A, and a stone exhibiting H&A may not be ideally cut. Many vendors will claim their stones are H&A when the criteria for a true H&A has not been met, but currently there is no grading standard for H&A or optical symmetry.

There are stones that don't have H&A that have excellent optical performance, much like there are stones that exhibit H&A and have diminished light performance due to their cut. There simply is no substitute for a precisely cut diamond. You will see things in it that you won't see in other stones. I didn't believe it until I saw it myself.

As for the settings, I had both of my rings custom made at the same time so they would be a perfect match to each other. I chose platinum for its weight, color, strength and durability. My camera had battery leakage so I haven't been able to take good pictures of my rings, but here's an image sent by Wink before he shipped the rings.

_17223.jpg
 
SandyinAnaheim|1398264883|3658537 said:
I had a whole explanation all typed out last night and somehow lost it when I hit submit. :angryfire:

The reality is hearts are visible only through the pavilion and not really visible anymore once the diamond is set. Since neither you nor I are cutters nor advanced mathematicians, we cannot measure the precision of a diamond's cut. However, H&A are the product of very precise mathematical proportions in relation to each other. All the facets on a diamond with the exception of the culet should be aligned exactly 180 degrees opposite of each other. When they are not, you start to see anomalies in the hearts and or the stars. The hearts could be cleft, different sizes, shapes, disproportionate, different distances from the V below it, etc. The stars are the visual representation of the facet cutting on the crown and are evaluated for symmetry in much the same way as the hearts, except that they will always be visible.

Bear in mind that the hearts effect is a way to evaluate optical symmetry, which is not the same as the symmetry measured by AGS or GIA. That symmetry refers to the organization of the facet intersections along with their placement. Optical symmetry is a result the size, shape and relation of the facets to each other and how they reflect light internally. An ideally cut stone may not always have H&A, and a stone exhibiting H&A may not be ideally cut. Many vendors will claim their stones are H&A when the criteria for a true H&A has not been met, but currently there is no grading standard for H&A or optical symmetry.

There are stones that don't have H&A that have excellent optical performance, much like there are stones that exhibit H&A and have diminished light performance due to their cut. There simply is no substitute for a precisely cut diamond. You will see things in it that you won't see in other stones. I didn't believe it until I saw it myself.

As for the settings, I had both of my rings custom made at the same time so they would be a perfect match to each other. I chose platinum for its weight, color, strength and durability. My camera had battery leakage so I haven't been able to take good pictures of my rings, but here's an image sent by Wink before he shipped the rings.

Thanks for your time and effort.
From what I hear about Jonathan at GOG from this community is that you could trust him.
He told me that this is a brilliant diamond, especially at the price.
It's probably not as great as your stone but it's also not as expensive.
I hope mine shines just as bright!
Thanks thanks again I learned a lot from you and your ring looks AMAZING! Congrats!

Anyone else care to share their expert analysis regarding my future purchase?
I'd really really appreciate it.
Thanks thanks.

0.94ct G VS2 Premium Round Ideal Cut Diamond - WP: $6,575
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/11574/
 
I assure you that Jon has seen the best of the best stones, both his own and other vendors so if he tells you it's a beautiful stone, you can trust him. At this point, you've found a beautiful diamond that gives you the best bang for your buck - awesome color, clarity, and carat combination - my advice is to purchase and be done with it at this point. Usually once you see it for yourself, you'll feel alot better because you can confirm the beauty with your eyes.
 
jamhenkim said:
From what I hear about Jonathan at GOG from this community is that you could trust him.
He told me that this is a brilliant diamond, especially at the price.
That's exactly what I've heard as well. I'm glad you're feeling less "lost" now and you've learned a lot! :cheeky:
 
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