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Hypothetical senario about getting a nice diamond for less. Need your inputs!

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d_vader

Rough_Rock
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Nov 4, 2005
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I want to preface my statement by saying that I am a novice about the whole diamond business so please be patient if my question sounds naive.

I was reading about the whole business of 8*, H&A, etc.

I'm convinced that these cuts are superior to many other diamonds since I believe that cut is the most important quality in a diamond.

However, because of the "special-ness" of these diamonds, naturally we will be asked to pay a premium on them. A 1.0 carat with one of these types of cuts can be easily over 5 figures.

I could spend half of that to get a larger diamond with similar quality at the mall.

Couldn't I potentially purchase a lower-priced diamond with good quality at the mall and have it re-cut. Of course, I would pay the extra $300-$1000 for the recutting, but it would be cheaper than buying one already made?

So to sum up, here is a hypothetical senario.

I want to propose to my gf. I am shopping for a ring, and my budget it $9000.

I am at a jewerly store at the mall. They are having a sale on diamonds. I find a 1.5ct, VS1, E color, round diamond for $5000. (Even though that last sentence is an assumption, I was trying to be as accurate as possible, so please commennt if you think that that kind of diamond with price is impossible to find. I wrote it because I think I might have actually seen it before).

I like it except that it doesn't have the best light return. It isn't horrible, but not like the H&A, 8*, or other types of cut.

Despite that, I purchase the diamond anyway because I know that I can go ahead and get it recut by 8*, H&A, etc. I pay $1000 for the recutting. It reduces to a 1.3 but now it has great light return with no leakage.

In total I spend $6000, well within my budget for a large, well-cut diamond.

If I went straight to H&A, 8*, etc. to get that same diamond (1.3, VS1, E color) wouldn't I have spent over 5-figures?

So why doesn't everyone do this??? Please comment on where I might have gone wrong with my senario.
 
I highly doubt you are going to find a 1.5 E VS1 stone anywhere for $5000.
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And if you do, I bet it isn't certified by GIA, AGS, or even EGL-USA. And in that case, I would highly doubt it is in fact an E VS1 stone at all.

Also with recutting, you take the risk that the diamond doesn't just shatter into a million pieces.
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Woah!

I didn''t think diamonds would shatter...I thought they were the hardest substances on earth!

And if it did happen wouldn''t the diamond cutter be liable?

Also, sure maybe I won''t find a 1.5, VS1, E for $5000, but even if I found one for $9000 (that''s possible right?), then after recutting, wouldn''t it still be cheaper than getting straight from the H&A or an 8* dealer who would charge me $15,000 for the same diamond in their store?

In this case, I went over my $9000 budget, but that isn''t important as trying to understand the process.

Also, please note, I''m not here to find out the secret of getting cheap, quality diamonds. I had this thought, and I was very curious.

Basically, I''m wondering why other people aren''t doing this! What can go wrong?
 
I think it sounds like a fabulous idea...

Try it and let us know how it turns out!!
 
or you could save your trip to the mall and the effort spent trying to find someone to recut your crapper and just buy this one.
 
If you want a well cut diamond, you'll be hard pressed to find one in the mall, that's for sure. You're better off doing some research and buying online.
 
Just for reference, you''d probably be pretty hard pressed to find a 1.5 E VS1 anywhere that''s decently cut for less than $13-14,000.
 
For reference I checked the Zales website and a 1.5 ct J SI2 IGI graded (coughworthless) was 13k. I think you need a plan B, cos recutting a mall stone wont be a bargain
 
My opinion: Let the experts on rounds here on PS (defiantely not me
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) help you find a diamond that you can afford and will love. Looks like Belle is already lookin around for you!
 
Date: 11/4/2005 12:47:50 PM
Author: belle
or you could save your trip to the mall and the effort spent trying to find someone to recut your crapper and just buy this one.


LMAO .. ROTF!!!! Your "crapper"! *snort* *gurgle*
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Seriously though, Belle is on the money! People don''t do that because it is a crazy idea. Average folks in the world do not have access to fine diamond cutters and no legitimate/not to mention "A-List" or "branded" (i.e. 8*) cutter is going to assume the risks associated with cutting/perhaps breaking your "crapper" to make a measly 1K.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 1:35:50 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 11/4/2005 12:47:50 PM
Author: belle
or you could save your trip to the mall and the effort spent trying to find someone to recut your crapper and just buy this one.
LMAO .. ROTF!!!! Your ''crapper''! *snort* *gurgle*
36.gif



Seriously though, Belle is on the money! People don''t do that because it is a crazy idea. Average folks in the world do not have access to fine diamond cutters and no legitimate/not to mention ''A-List'' or ''branded'' (i.e. 8*) cutter is going to assume the risks associated with cutting/perhaps breaking your ''crapper'' to make a measly 1K.

WAIT!! Hold on a minute! Is ''your crapper'' somehow less ''offensive'' than ''random stone''...
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tee hee!!

(mara...feeling punchy today!!
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)
 
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Too funny Mara. Anyway belle is right, take a look at the stone she found.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 1:35:50 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 11/4/2005 12:47:50 PM
Author: belle
or you could save your trip to the mall and the effort spent trying to find someone to recut your crapper and just buy this one.


LMAO .. ROTF!!!! Your ''crapper''! *snort* *gurgle*
36.gif



Seriously though, Belle is on the money! People don''t do that because it is a crazy idea. Average folks in the world do not have access to fine diamond cutters and no legitimate/not to mention ''A-List'' or ''branded'' (i.e. 8*) cutter is going to assume the risks associated with cutting/perhaps breaking your ''crapper'' to make a measly 1K.
What are the risks of recutting a diamond? Will it actually have the potential to get shattered? If it did, aren''t they responsible?
 
There are always risks when getting a diamond re cut. It all depends on the diamond the nature of the inclusions etc... Some will take the liabilty for it some won''t.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 1:41:30 PM
Author: Mara
WAIT!! Hold on a minute! Is ''your crapper'' somehow less ''offensive'' than ''random stone''...
11.gif
tee hee!!

(mara...feeling punchy today!!
31.gif
)

Oooooof. Ya caught me! Touche, Mara, touche!
9.gif
 
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..
 
Date: 11/4/2005 2:34:04 PM
Author: mrssalvo
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..
Yeah, but it won''t be a H&A or an 8*.
 
d_vader


you better come up with plan B b/c it ain''t gonna work.
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the link belle gave you was for a H & A stone...it can be done...belle gave you a 1.5 ct stone. drop down a touch in size and you've got quite a few to chose from..
 
Date: 11/4/2005 2:47:59 PM
Author: d_vader

Date: 11/4/2005 2:34:04 PM
Author: mrssalvo
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..
Yeah, but it won''t be a H&A or an 8*.
There are lots of H&As available. No, you will get an 8* but you also will not pay the large 8* premium.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 2:47:59 PM
Author: d_vader
Date: 11/4/2005 2:34:04 PM
Author: mrssalvo
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..

Yeah, but it won't be a H&A or an 8*.


Have you contacted the 8* people to see if they are even WILLING to do such a thing? I'll bet they are not. And I'd be wary of anyone else who claims that they can cut a mall stone into an 8*.

9K is a VERY, very nice budget. You can get something ANY gal would love, love, love. Not sure why you're trying to make it so hard for yourself!

You asked for opinions - we're telling you: it's not a good idea. It won't work. No one has encouraged this plan (well, un-ironically at least). If you want our help finding a NEW PLAN, we're "on it". If you don't - que sera sera! And good luck to ya.
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Date: 11/4/2005 2:55:09 PM
Author: Patty

Date: 11/4/2005 2:47:59 PM
Author: d_vader


Date: 11/4/2005 2:34:04 PM
Author: mrssalvo
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..
Yeah, but it won''t be a H&A or an 8*.
There are lots of H&As available. No, you will get an 8* but you also will not pay the large 8* premium.
First, I want to thanks everyone who replied with all the helpful comments. It means a lot.

I''m gonna look into these options.

Again, thanks for all your comments!
 
Date: 11/4/2005 3:05:12 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 11/4/2005 2:47:59 PM
Author: d_vader

Date: 11/4/2005 2:34:04 PM
Author: mrssalvo
if you have a budget of 9K you can get a very nice stone without the headache or risk of having it recut..

Yeah, but it won''t be a H&A or an 8*.


Have you contacted the 8* people to see if they are even WILLING to do such a thing? I''ll bet they are not. And I''d be wary of anyone else who claims that they can cut a mall stone into an 8*.

9K is a VERY, very nice budget. You can get something ANY gal would love, love, love. Not sure why you''re trying to make it so hard for yourself!

You asked for opinions - we''re telling you: it''s not a good idea. It won''t work. No one has encouraged this plan (well, un-ironically at least). If you want our help finding a NEW PLAN, we''re ''on it''. If you don''t - que sera sera! And good luck to ya.
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Who says that I am making things hard for myself. I don''t consider finding a ring that my future wife would appreciate a burden at all.

Yes, I did ask for opinions, and I know that you are telling them. I read them and am considering my options.

Please don''t make the mistake of implying that I don''t value anyone''s opinions or that I will reject them just because I am asking about the H&A and 8* cut.

I''m trying to make the most informed decision possible, and I need to ask questions to get there.

Good luck to you too!
 
1. recutting especially by 8* is going to cost far more than you think by a factor of 2-3.
2. no one will accept liability of a stone shattering during a recut if it shatters its your problem.
3. you can buy a h&a diamond online for not much more than a lot of crapper diamonds in a b&m.

Super-ideal recut by infinity is $800 per ct + recert fee + 2 way overseas shipping and insurance.
So for a 1.5ct your looking at $1600 or so.
for 8* last i heard double those prices.
 
just for the record..i was calling d_vaders HYPOTHETICAL stone a crapper. the hypothetical one that is knows is not good and wants recut.
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just for the record.
 
There was someone a time ago who got a diamond recut to an 8* through Wink who is an 8* dealer. He posts on this board sometimes. I would ask him about it if I was you. I don''t know if a mall grade diamond would work and if the diamond shatters on the wheel it would be your loss of $ I believe.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 4:45:07 PM
Author: Pyramid
There was someone a time ago who got a diamond recut to an 8* through Wink who is an 8* dealer. He posts on this board sometimes. I would ask him about it if I was you. I don''t know if a mall grade diamond would work and if the diamond shatters on the wheel it would be your loss of $ I believe.
Thanks, but mall grade or not, isn''t a 1.5 VS1 E color bought at the mall the same as if it was bought online or at tiffany''s?
 
Date: 11/4/2005 4:49:33 PM
Author: d_vader

Date: 11/4/2005 4:45:07 PM
Author: Pyramid
There was someone a time ago who got a diamond recut to an 8* through Wink who is an 8* dealer. He posts on this board sometimes. I would ask him about it if I was you. I don''t know if a mall grade diamond would work and if the diamond shatters on the wheel it would be your loss of $ I believe.
Thanks, but mall grade or not, isn''t a 1.5 VS1 E color bought at the mall the same as if it was bought online or at tiffany''s?
If the stone has a GIA or AGS certificate, then yes. If it has and IGI certificate or no certificate, then maybe, maybe not.

And of course even if it''s a 1.5c E, VS1, it may be a great cut or it may be a poor cut...you don''t know that information unless you have an AGS cert or a Sarin report.
 
Date: 11/4/2005 4:49:33 PM
Author: d_vader

Date: 11/4/2005 4:45:07 PM
Author: Pyramid
There was someone a time ago who got a diamond recut to an 8* through Wink who is an 8* dealer. He posts on this board sometimes. I would ask him about it if I was you. I don''t know if a mall grade diamond would work and if the diamond shatters on the wheel it would be your loss of $ I believe.
Thanks, but mall grade or not, isn''t a 1.5 VS1 E color bought at the mall the same as if it was bought online or at tiffany''s?
It depends on who is grading it and whether it is actually accurate. I would trust GIA and AGS and maybe even EGL USA with an independent appraisal. I certainly wouldn''t just be taking the mall store''s word nor the word on an IGI report.
 
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