HPHT diamond vendors

[pregcurious]

Can someone recommend reputable vendors for HPHT diamonds? I am curious about prices for fancy light yellow diamonds in ~6.5 mm in diameter.

 

[PinkyPie]

http://www.suncrestdiamonds.com/

I have spoken with them in the past, and they do sell direct to consumer (super duper nice too).

 

[pregcurious]

Wow, thank you pinkypie! I saw their reds, and the first thing I thought was, I am going to ditch looking for natural colored gems! I had no idea!

 

[VapidLapid]

OP, please use the report concern button and ask the moderators to move this thread to the appropriate forum.

 

[Rosebloom]

Please excuse my ignorance, VL, but why does this need to be moved? Aren't HPHT are earth mined diamonds that are treated, not man made diamonds?

 

[Lady_Disdain]

I am confused as well. HPHT diamonds are treated diamonds, which are forum legal. Some people may dislike them, just like some people shun BE treated sapphire or even just heated stones, oiled emeralds, etc. Each of us has a different tolerance for treatment (I think I broke a gem dealer's head when I said I didn't like irradiated stones). Coloured diamonds have also been discussed here as well, with no problem.

By the way, HPHT diamonds seem to be trending right now. Several great designers have pieces with them, both as melee and as center stones.

 

[pregcurious]

I'm also confused. I am discussing mined diamonds that have been heat and pressure treated. They are colored stones, and therefore I don't think they belong in RT, as the colored diamond experts are in CS. I know there are multiple CS users who own irradiated diamonds, which are similar to me in terms of threshold of treatment to HPHT, and I am assuming they would know something about HPHT diamonds.

HPHT diamonds are not synthetic, so they do not belong in the lab grown diamond forum.

Could you explain more VL?

 

[Rosebloom]

Curiosity coincided with a rare quiet moment so I called Suncrest to inquire about prices. A one carat red VS is around $10k. Obviously there is a good deal of range based on exact color, clarity, etc. a one carat pink is more expensive than the reds because it is a more rare outcome of the treatment. A one carat VS intense yellow is around $6k.

I wouldn't consider a HPHT yellow because the price is way too high compared to untreated. But if I was in the market for a red diamond I'd probably learn more as they are obviously at a more obtainable price point.

 

[pregcurious]

Thanks, Rosebloom. I hadn't contacted them yet. I am really amazed by the color of the reds they have online. I'm used to untreated red diamonds having a burgundy hue that I dislike.

The yellows they have are very highly saturated, probably more so than I would want. It's interesting.

 

[Lady_Disdain]

Thanks, Rosebloom. I hadn't contacted them yet. I am really amazed by the color of the reds they have online. I'm used to untreated red diamonds having a burgundy hue that I dislike.

The yellows they have are very highly saturated, probably more so than I would want. It's interesting.

The reds are beautiful but they look too good for me. I know it sounds odd but they seem almost artificial. But I think I might change my mind if I had one on my finger on a sunny day.

 

[pregcurious]

Lady_Disdain, I know what you mean. I was joking about leaving behind natural colored stones. I like my red spinel, and recognize they are different creatures. Plus, top red spinels will have red fluor.

The thing that struck me the most about seeing the Hope diamond was that despite all the grey tone and a darker hue, it sparkled like a white diamond and did not have areas of extinction. It looked nothing like a sapphire or spinel. Diamonds are different creatures, and they're fascinating when colored.

 

[VapidLapid]

Sorry, I thought HPHT was synthetic; high pressure high temperature growth technique like it says here in wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_diamond
I had no idea there was a hpht treatment only.

 

[Lady_Disdain]

No problem!

Here you go: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_enhancement#High-pressure_high-temperature_treatment (hey, you started with wikipedia!). Or, if you prefer: http://www.gem-a.com/media/74500/jog%202010%20part%206%20schmetzer%20web.pdf

 

[kenny]

Wow, how tacky.
Nowhere on this page did they bother mentioning those multi-million dollar FCDs are natural in material and color origin, and their product is not.

It's as if they are saying you get all the imagined glamor and prestige of fully natural colored diamonds, but for less.

There's nothing wrong with man-made material, or mined material with color altered by humans, but they are not fully natural.
The market has determined that fully natural is more valuable than lab-grown diamonds or mined ones with treated color.

It's not the same thing, only cheaper ... otherwise there would be no price difference.
And yes, I clearly have a dog in this race.

I paid $36K for a 0.10 ct Fancy Red diamond, knowing full well I could have gotten a 1 ct red that's not fully natural for a fraction of the price.
I could have gotten a Swarovsky crystal even cheaper and glass even cheaper and plastic even cheaper.
I didn't want those.
I wanted a diamond that came out of the earth Red.
For that, I had to pay the price.

I don't think Jennifer Lopex is wearing anything less than the real deal so IMHO they should delete that page from their website.
(I'm also under no illuions that she'd be caught dead wearing a 0.10 ct diamond. )

Ya get what ya pay for.

 

[ChristineRose]

The best friend of the guy who gave her that diamond convinced him to dump her. I have no idea who wears it now. Also, she wore a dress that needed to be glued on. Glue literally is tacky.

 

[pregcurious]

Anyone know of other vendors besides Suncrest? I read some articles and it seems that they are very visible, but there must be other companies.

 

[pinkjewel]

You could try Africagems.com. They sell HPHT melee-so I would think they'd have access to larger diamonds,too.

 

[pregcurious]

Thanks pinkjewel!

 

[ChristineRose]

There's these guys:

http://www.lucentdiamonds.com/

but I am unsure who actually sells their stones or even if they are still active. The site has not updated in a long time and everything I can find about them is old.

 

[LD]

Wow, how tacky.
Nowhere on this page did they bother mentioning those multi-million dollar FCDs are natural in material and color origin, and their product is not.

It's as if they are saying you get all the imagined glamor and prestige of fully natural colored diamonds, but for less.

There's nothing wrong with man-made material, or mined material with color altered by humans, but they are not fully natural.
The market has determined that fully natural is more valuable than lab-grown diamonds or mined ones with treated color.

It's not the same thing, only cheaper ... otherwise there would be no price difference.
And yes, I clearly have a dog in this race.

I paid $36K for a 0.10 ct Fancy Red diamond, knowing full well I could have gotten a 1 ct red that's not fully natural for a fraction of the price.
I could have gotten a Swarovsky crystal even cheaper and glass even cheaper and plastic even cheaper.
I didn't want those.
I wanted a diamond that came out of the earth Red.
For that, I had to pay the price.

I don't think Jennifer Lopex is wearing anything less than the real deal so IMHO they should delete that page from their website.
(I'm also under no illuions that she'd be caught dead wearing a 0.10 ct diamond. )

Ya get what ya pay for.

Kenny you have to look at both sides of the coin here and not everybody wants the same thing as you. I would hazard a guess that most people want a diamond that they can wear in a piece of jewellery and that isn't so small that the setting dominates. That means that most natural coloured diamonds (except yellows and some pinks) become unaffordable.

If you want a red or blue or green, then HPHT in half carat, one carat etc., means you can enjoy a coloured diamond at a price that isn't beyond mere mortals. Oh and the greens get their colour in exactly the same way as the earth makes them naturally.

I have many natural and treated coloured diamonds but my red HPHT is the best I own because (a) I love it, (b) it's a wearable size and (c) the natural equivalent is well out of my price range - and most of us!

 

[pregcurious]

Anyone know of any places that carry more affordable yellow HPHT stones? I may go for a yellow garnet if I can't find something more affordable. I find it very difficult to find yellow garnets that don't have brown or green (same w/sapphires), so I thought HPHT would be a good road, but apparently it's still a pricey road.

The back story is that I want to put a stone in a YG setting that I have. The setting has sentimental meaning to me, but I really dislike YG unless it has a red or yellow stone. (Just a weird preference.) Not only is red expensive, but I already have my ideal red. While I'm all about color and no treatment when I'm collecting stones, this ring is not going to be about the stone at all. I prefer diamond (over garnet) because it's durable and sparkly, and I want to wear this without worrying the stone is going to chip.

 

[kenny]

Wow, how tacky.
Nowhere on this page did they bother mentioning those multi-million dollar FCDs are natural in material and color origin, and their product is not.

It's as if they are saying you get all the imagined glamor and prestige of fully natural colored diamonds, but for less.

There's nothing wrong with man-made material, or mined material with color altered by humans, but they are not fully natural.
The market has determined that fully natural is more valuable than lab-grown diamonds or mined ones with treated color.

It's not the same thing, only cheaper ... otherwise there would be no price difference.
And yes, I clearly have a dog in this race.

I paid $36K for a 0.10 ct Fancy Red diamond, knowing full well I could have gotten a 1 ct red that's not fully natural for a fraction of the price.
I could have gotten a Swarovsky crystal even cheaper and glass even cheaper and plastic even cheaper.
I didn't want those.
I wanted a diamond that came out of the earth Red.
For that, I had to pay the price.

I don't think Jennifer Lopex is wearing anything less than the real deal so IMHO they should delete that page from their website.
(I'm also under no illuions that she'd be caught dead wearing a 0.10 ct diamond. )

Ya get what ya pay for.

Kenny you have to look at both sides of the coin here and not everybody wants the same thing as you. I would hazard a guess that most people want a diamond that they can wear in a piece of jewellery and that isn't so small that the setting dominates. That means that most natural coloured diamonds (except yellows and some pinks) become unaffordable.

If you want a red or blue or green, then HPHT in half carat, one carat etc., means you can enjoy a coloured diamond at a price that isn't beyond mere mortals. Oh and the greens get their colour in exactly the same way as the earth makes them naturally.

I have many natural and treated coloured diamonds but my red HPHT is the best I own because (a) I love it, (b) it's a wearable size and (c) the natural equivalent is well out of my price range - and most of us!

You are misreading me.
I completely respect that people vary on this.
I never said everyone should do what I do, or that non-naturals should be taken off the market.

My criticism is limited to this seller's marketing, using X to sell Y, and worse, implying X and Y are the same thing.
It would be like Honda using glamorous pics of Bugattis, Lamborghinis and Maseratis driven by celebrities to market Honda Civics.
"Look, Brad Pitt drives a Ferrari, so buy a Honda."
Nothing wrong with Honda; I'm a loyal Honda guy.

All greens getting their color from radiation (whether in the earth or in a lab) has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.
Again, fully natural greens would cost the same as treated ones if they were "the same".
If a person wants a treated green and enjoys it fully and even thinks of it as the same as natural that's fine, but they'll get a wake up call if they try to sell it.

Fully natural means something, and these companies make more money when they work hard to blur the line in buyer's minds.
Imagine a bride finding out she was proposed to with a lab-created diamond, rather than one that was mined.
Many brides would be pissed.
Natural means quite a lot to many people, and is reflected in the pricing.
(Yes if he and she both agree they prefer a lab-created stone so they can save for a house or whatever that's fine. Nothing wrong with lab-created. But blurring the line is wrong.)

If people prefer to wear plastic or even sandstone beads then they are the best ... to them.

I'm also well aware many people will look down on me for posting this.
In their minds I come across as a snob and braggart.
Oh well.
The message is more important than the messenger.

 

[LD]

Kenny I'm not looking down on you or saying you're anything. You have your preferences and that's fine.

I understand what you're saying that they're using photos of coloured diamonds (presumably natural although in some cases we can't be sure ) and they're selling treated diamonds. However, they have full disclosure on their products so it's not like anything is hidden. If they didn't disclose - well that would be another case altogether. The heading of the page clearly says "famous" diamonds. Strangely I don't think this is misleading and normally I am highly critical of this.

Like I said, I have a foot in both camps here.

 

[kenny]

No problem LD.
You are very fair and level headed.

I was not referring to any individual, just the collective.

BTW, sorry for the threadjack.
I just thought it was a legit observation and point to make.

 

[ChristineRose]

The HPHT diamonds are not to natural diamonds as a Honda is to a Ferrari. The treated diamonds look and function exactly like their natural counterparts. A better comparison would be a signed first edition to an otherwise identical later printing It isn't a question of quality, but of rarity. I certainly understand a preference for the rarer stuff, but it is not fair to imply that the treated are inferior. In price at least, they are vastly superior.

 

[pinkjewel]

The HPHT diamonds are not to natural diamonds as a Honda is to a Ferrari. The treated diamonds look and function exactly like their natural counterparts. A better comparison would be a signed first edition to an otherwise identical later printing It isn't a question of quality, but of rarity. I certainly understand a preference for the rarer stuff, but it is not fair to imply that the treated are inferior. In price at least, they are vastly superior.

I disagree- HPHT diamonds RARELY look like natural color diamonds. The heat treatment does not mimic the color of naturally mined diamonds.

 

[kenny]

Even if the colors matched exactly, if GIA determines the color and/or the material is not natural in origin then ... it's not natural in origin and will be priced and positioned in the market accordingly.

It's not about what's superior or inferior; those terms are not gemological grades they are value judgements.
I've already stated if you love sandstone then that's perfect, for you.
The market has determined that sandstone is less expensive than diamonds.
If one person feels sandstone is superior to diamond, so be it.

Once again I'm only commenting on a vendor implying one product is the same as another MUCH more expensive one, blurring the line, making them seem the same when they are not.
One is natural, the other is not.

Natural matters to enough people that it is reflected by a HUGE price difference.
In D-Z white diamonds, some may prefer an L to a D.
Lucky for them because the market has established L is less expensive.
That does not make D superior, or L inferior.
Superior and inferior, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

Even the person who honestly prefers the L color, and not because it lets them get a larger diamond, can not argue that the market prices/values the D higher than the L.
That's just economics/market forces.
It is not surprising that some, likely the majority, will take that to mean D is superior to L ... especially people who paid for a D.
Buyers of Ls may not agree that D is superior, and may focus on their L being superior, value-wise.
Human nature/cognitive dissonance, you know.

Also the most superior thing, pricewise, is owning nothing ... that's free!

 

[pregcurious]

HPHT-treated diamonds discussed on this post are natural diamonds that have been treated with the aim to improve color. They are not rare or as expensive as completely natural colored diamonds. Those are facts. I am looking into them because I cannot afford natural colored diamonds. I've never known people to receive such criticism when asking for other heated stones (sapphire, tanzanite, etc.)

Please move the discussion about the pros and cons of HPHT-treated diamonds to another thread. Kenny, if you want to criticize people's choice in stones, and then say you aren't pointing anyone specifically, you shouldn't do it in someone's thread.

Thanks to those who tried to help me out.

 

[kenny]

I'm not criticizing. Sheesh.
Read what I wrote, all of it, in context.

The worst I've done here is a slight/perhaps threadjack, for which I apologized.
My posts after that were only to defend myself from inaccurate comments.

 

[periwinklegirl]

Hi Pregcurious,
I've bought from Africa Gems and been very happy with them. Pinks and greens though, not yellow, and nothing big. Marc is very easy to deal with. And they have a good return policy (like all trusted PS dealers). And I've returned something no problem.

Good luck finding your yellow sparkly!