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How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want cert?

dtz22

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 29, 2016
Messages
1
Hi all. New here. Shopping for an engagement ring online and in brick and mortar stores.

Something I noticed from some salespeople is that when I ask to see certification on a diamond ring I like, some say "all that matters is that you like it." Like, why see certification if I like the ring? Not sure how to respond to that.

One person told me that they don't show certification until after you buy the ring, claiming that they don't have the certification paperwork to whip out for each ring as I see them. That seemed very odd.

Not sure what to make of this. It all seems shady since I can go on Blue Nile or James Allen and look at certifications to my heart's content.
 

PintoBean

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 27, 2011
Messages
6,383
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

How about, I am very analytical by nature, and besides a diamond being eye clean and beautiful, I also need it to be mind clean, so could you please give me the AGS or GIA report number?
 

gr8leo87

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
381
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

They should readily make the certificate available unless they have something to hide.
 

marcy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Messages
23,779
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

Usually the case or packet has the certificate number in it. I just use my cell phone and look it up online.
 

flyingpig

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Nov 7, 2015
Messages
2,177
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

don't even respond. just walk away. it is a waste of time to deal with such vendor. Most likely, they don't have ideal cut diamonds.
 

Wink

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
May 3, 2001
Messages
7,475
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

dtz22|1456781765|3997505 said:
Hi all. New here. Shopping for an engagement ring online and in brick and mortar stores.

Something I noticed from some salespeople is that when I ask to see certification on a diamond ring I like, some say "all that matters is that you like it." Like, why see certification if I like the ring? Not sure how to respond to that.

One person told me that they don't show certification until after you buy the ring, claiming that they don't have the certification paperwork to whip out for each ring as I see them. That seemed very odd.

Not sure what to make of this. It all seems shady since I can go on Blue Nile or James Allen and look at certifications to my heart's content.
I will resist the urge to say, "RUN FOREST RUN!" as that might be rude.

I will say however that every bricks and mortar store that I worked in, including mine, had certificates available for any and all that asked. Not all stones were papered though, and for those I had a deal. I will send it in to be papered by GIA. If it comes in at or higher than what I grade it, you pay for the report. If it comes in below what I grade it, I will lower the price, pay for the paper and also refund your money if that is what you prefer. Only two people ever took me up on it and both got better grades on the reports than what I promised them.

When I closed my retail location and went Internet only I probably threw away three or four dozen reports that were never requested when the diamonds sold. Back then most in house buyers were there because of my reputation, not my reports. Of course on the Internet, the reports give us a way to assure you that we are not making this all up. I believe I sold one or two unpapered diamonds on the net after one of my Antwerp trips fifteen or twenty years ago, and I would have gladly gotten a report, but the buyers said they would rather have the price of the report taken off the price of the diamond, which I did since I had not yet sent the diamonds in.

Both were from a parcel of H-I-J bluff diamonds in the 1.25 ct range that were advertised as I1's although a couple might have gotten low SI2 grades. (In the parcel, not the diamonds sold.)

I sold all of them in a couple of weeks after I advertised them in a newsletter, and never did send any of them in to be papered. They were big and cheap, $1,900 per carat and I had purchased more than ten carats (I think it might have been 14 carats, but it is so long ago that I do not really remember) with a check that I had four weeks to make good. I had told my supplier that I had already spent my available money, mostly with him, before he showed me the parcel. He made me such a good deal that when he did he laughed and said if I did not buy at this price I was not really in the business and should go get a job. I actually would have paid about $1,950 per carat for those diamonds at wholesale in the States and I wanted to sell them so quickly that I advertised them at just under that.

Sigh, once again I digress. If there are reports available on the diamonds you are looking at and they will not show them to you until after you have bought, then you probably should be looking elsewhere. Seriously! That is just plain bad service. It is true, both with and without paper, that what really matters is whether or not YOUR eyes like what they are seeing, but if your mind is in turmoil, it will not matter either way, as you will always be wondering what is wrong.

Just my thoughts.

Wink
 

ringo865

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Feb 14, 2014
Messages
2,369
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

Many B&M stores (the ones near me) do not carry certed stones (mom & pop), or they are EGL or IGI certed (maul & chain stores). There is one AGS store that has certed stones.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,633
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

I'd say start over. How about posting a thread here of what you are looking for and a budget, and people will help you find some great stones?

But for future reference in local stores, this is what I would recommend.

Go in and ask, do you have GIA graded Excellent cut diamonds? If they say yes, say, I would like to see all your diamonds in the 1 ct range (or whatever size you are looking at) and I would like to see the grading reports as well as the stones. (I wish you luck on that because I rarely found that where I live and that is why I bought online!) Leave if they do not cooperate!

On a notecard, write these numbers out and have in your pocket:

These are measurements to help you stay in ideal cut territory with a GIA excellent cut stone.

table: 54-58

depth: 60-62.3

crown angle: 34-35.0

pavilion angle: 40.6-40.9

Check the stones and then look at the reports. First see if the report says GIA and Excellent cut. Then look at the numbers for table, depth, crown angle, and pavilion angle and see if they fall in the range above. If so, write down the information and their price for the stone. Then come back here and tell us the numbers, and we can look up similar stones and do price comps for you to be sure you are paying a fair price. Never commit when you look for the first time. They want the sale before you leave, so they may try to say the stone may be gone, etc. Don't worry, there are plenty of diamonds out there! You want to get a great stone for a fair price!
 

Rockdiamond

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
8,188
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

a lot of good advice given so far- one caveat-
In many cases, if the diamond is sent out from the cutter/dealer for approval, the original GIA document is not shipped with the stone. But often times a photocopy might be sent- and even if that's not present, you can look up any GIA report number on their site and see a copy of the report ( unless it's pretty old)
If a seller is claiming to have GIA graded diamonds, and not providing at least report numbers, it's a very bad sign.
But if they provide the GIA info and claim they will have the original after the purchase is finalized, it's not necessarily a problem.
If that's the case, I would advise a consumer to get it in writing.
 

MissGotRocks

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
Messages
12,220
Re: How to respond to salesperon at B&M store when I want ce

If they had it, they would be happy to share it with you. When they don't, they come up with clever lines to cover the fact.

Walk out, plain and simple. There are too many great stones with certs to be found online. Don't listen to that kind of double talk - just see it for what it is. I have found that there are many more stores with uncerted or meaningless certed stones than there are with well cut GIA or AGS stones. Through the years and the economic downturn, I found that stores that used to have such a thing are now primarily limited to EGL certs. GIA and AGS certed stones were more expensive and not readily sold so they quit stocking them. Folks here on PS are educated about the cut of diamonds; the public at large not so much.
 
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