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How do you value jewelry at the time of purchase?

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LooseOnTheLead

Rough_Rock
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Aug 22, 2007
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I guess this is more of a rant than anything else. :-) I'm new at the whole jewelry thing, and I'm frustrated by my inability to know what a given piece is worth.

For example...my fiancée and I attended InterGem last weekend, and, lo and behold, she found a necklace she liked. To put this in perspective, it was the only piece of fine jewelry in the entire show that she really wanted. Naturally, my inclination was to try to get it for her. But...hey, it would be expensive for me, especially since I'd just bought her engagement ring less than two months ago. The "retail" (yeah, whatever) price on the necklace was $6200, and the wholesale (or whatever they called it) price--i.e., the price the exhibitors were quoting as the selling price--was $3100.

Now, please forgive me if my description of the piece is terrible. Again, I'm new at this.

The necklace was in white gold (not sure if 14K or 18K, but that's not important here). The pendant had a 6.5-carat moonstone surrounded by pavé. On the chain were several melee diamonds. According to my fiancée, who had her loupe with her, the diamonds appeared colorless and loupe-clean. (Keep in mind, though, that she's an amateur. She admitted that she probably couldn't tell the difference between a D and an I in a diamond of that size. Or maybe she was being modest. I don't know.) Total carat weight of diamonds was about 1.2. The moonstone was easily the nicest one we saw at the show, although there weren't that many of gem quality. It was fairly transparent, showed nice adularescence, and had a pale blue schiller, with perhaps a bit of yellow.

My fiancée loved the design, which spoke to her in a way that nothing else at the show (or anywhere else so far, for that matter) did. We got the price down to $2700, including tax. Okay...so now what? How the heck do I know if I should be paying that, or half that? Even if I could value the materials accurately, what price do I put on design and workmanship? It's easy to say, well, she likes it, so it's worth the money, but obviously that isn't true at some point--e.g., I would not have considered the piece for $50K. On the down side, there were two things I knew for sure: (1) The exhibitors are capitalists who want to make money. (Nothing wrong with that, of course.) (2) I'm not a good negotiator. So what do I do? Assume that (1) and (2) virtually guarantee that any price I end up with will be overpaying, and therefore I just shouldn't buy the jewelry? Or should I chalk the assumed excess expense up to the cost of a relationship and wedding, and move on?

We didn't buy the necklace on the first day of the show, but we bought it early the next morning on the grounds that she needed something that would go with her wedding dress at the very least, and this necklace was something that would go with almost anything dressy she'd ever wear. Okay, fine...but...I'm still troubled by my vulnerability. Yes, if I'm concerned about what I paid, I could take the thing to get it appraised, but it now that we've bought it together, it has sentimental value that wouldn't show up in any professional appraisal. What I'd like to be able to what to pay for something AT THE TIME OF PURCHASE. Unfortunately, I suspect I will never be able to do that very well with jewelry.

Yep, that was mainly a rant. But if you have any suggestions, I'd like to read them.
 
My first guess is that you walk around with an appraiser or maybe invest in courses at GIA then intern as an appraiser?

I hate to be such a naysayer, but you cna''t walk around looking for deals everytime you buy jewelry. They are not always commodities. There is the price you pay because you like it, or the price you pay when you are a wholesaler. You are not a wholesaler and won''t be reselling it, so your cost is basically what you would LIKE to own it for. The only way to learn pricing in your case is over time and LOTS of price comparison shopping. That could take years. Even being a trained gemologist you don''t learn pricing. That''s always the hardest thing to learn, and appraisers take many years to get close, which is why certifications can take a minimum of 2 years with a trained appraiser overseeing your work.

Also the karat of gold you were looking at IS important. That adds value to it, even if the necklace were scrapped the price of purer (18K) gold to less pure (14K) can make it up to $50-$500+ more. If it was Platinum, you are looking at a whole lot more. Then you have quality of the make and if it''s signed by a brand or famous maker (which in your case I think doesn''t apply, am I correct?)

The process of valuation would include these steps however:

Valuating the main piece of gemstone or diamond. If it''s more than one major part, then valuating them all.

Opals do not value very high, unless they are a rare or particularly good specimen. A good moonstone will have an even irridescence with a bluish hue and usualy a clear or white milky body color) the weight of the stone and it''s overall condition is also important, but with no references to remember and compare, you won''t know how to value it. it must be attractive to the eye in your case.

Then you would have to determine the general quality and weighs for the diamonds. Knowing if they are colorless and average clarities can help you determine at their size range the scrapable value of these stones (but again this is something you learn with expereince in the trade and time, as well as mostly for people within the wholesale arena to resell) For you, check to see the stones are not too colored or inclusions can not be obvious with a loupe (because of size of the melee you will need to see even SI stones)

Then the karat of gold or platinum will give the item more cost, can''t say by how much, I don''t deal with raw gold and it''s pricing

And of course the whole factor of quality and how well the piece is finished. Smooth and polished edges and prongs, versus cast prongs and course edges. Hnadmade and hand modeled is always more expensive due to quality and labor...

Good luck, but remember if you like it, bargain it down to what you would pay and enjoy your new wearable art...
 
Thank you, Nicrez...but I may have overstated my desire. I'm not looking for "deals", necessarily, although they'd be great. My concern is about whether I'm paying anything resembling a fair price, even for a retail customer. I have no hope of making a truly accurate appraisal, but it would be nice to know that--using the example from the original post--I didn't pay $2700 for something I should have gotten for $1700. And when I talk about the price I "should have gotten", I mean from the perspective of a retail customer, which is what I am. Even when I buy from a supposed wholesaler, I am essentially a retail customer, so there's only so much I can hope for as far as getting a deal goes.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I want to know that a price is in the right ballpark and that I'm not being fleeced. Incidentally, this is why I said the karats of the gold aren't that important. It's so hard to even roughly pin down what a piece of jewelry is worth that worrying about whether the exhibitor is slightly overpricing the gold seems like a waste of mental energy. Maybe I'm wrong there, though. (?)

The necklace is an Andrew Sarosi. It's unique, but I don't know that he qualifies as a "famous maker". I know he's made some kind of gem donation to the Smithsonian, and I know he's provided a gem or two for GIA to photograph, but that doesn't necessarily tell me much about his reputation as a designer.

By the way, just in case, I don't mean to imply that the exhibitors seemed untrustworthy. They were quite helpful and friendly, and they spent a lot of time with us.

Let me try something here. My rant was intended to be general, but allow me to attempt an appraisal of the material components of the necklace. It will be fun for me, and perhaps it will give you a better idea of what I'm saying.

Kyrie and I are hardly moonstone experts, but we looked at all the moonstones at the show, and this one was clearly the nicest. Assuming that "information" is remotely accurate, would $50 a carat be too optimistic? If not, that would put the moonstone at $325.

I don't know how much gold is in the necklace, but $200 worth seems conservative. There is at least as much metal there as in Kyrie's Tiffany-style engagement ring, and probably more. Maybe much more. It's hard to compare the volume of a piece of solid material to that of much thinner material with spaces.

The diamonds in the necklace have a tcw of 1.22, but let's say half of that is melee and half is pavé. That's probably conservative. If I value the pavé diamonds at zero and the melee diamonds at, oh, $1000 a carat, that gets me to about $600 for the diamonds.

So that's $1125 for materials, plus or minus. The question then becomes, are the design and craftsmanship worth the additional $1500 or so? There's certainly nothing unusual about designer jewelry for what I paid, but beyond that, I have no opinion. Pavé looks like incredibly painstaking work to me, but I'm not a jeweler, so I don't know.

In any case, I appreciate the opportunity to vent. Thanks for reading and being patient.
 
I dunno. You''ve been given excellent advise above. I think the key phrases for this purchase were that it was "it was the only piece of fine jewelry in the entire show that she really wanted" and "she needed something that would go with her wedding dress at the very least". So in this case, this particular piece is going to play a big part in your wedding history, in the photos, etc. Looking at it from that perspective, you paid what you had to pay.
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It doesn''t sound like an unreasonable amount to me, but I''d love to see a pic of the piece.

I used to regularly attend certain antique shows. Eventually, the vendors would recognize me, and I''d get the standard discount of 20%. That was because I knew what general values on pieces should be, and they knew they''d be seeing me often and might unload more product on me. Another useful trait is being able to walk away, which you did the first day. They came up with a better offer the next day. Or you might have left a card for them to call if they didn''t sell the piece--maybe you could have got a little more off the price, but as I said, this piece was too important to your fiancee to take a chance on losing it. In other circumstances though, those are things to try. And no, you don''t always get a discount, or much of a discount. Depends on the circumstances and vendors.
 
Please post a pic, so we can see this piece. Based upon viewing some of his other work, it looks as if you got it for a fair price. I, however, am not an expert [/disclaimer]
 
Thank you all for your comments, and I think that everything you''ve written has been correct. The main problem here is that, again, I''m new at this. Probably every other purchase I''ve made in the last several years has been of an item that was available from multiple vendors. To use Nicrez''s word, those purchases were of commodities, so it was easy to price-shop and get a good idea of what the items were worth. Then I shopped for the engagement ring, and that was relatively easy to get a handle on, too. (I now believe I could have done a bit better, but I guess that''ll be in my next life. ;-)) Each diamond is unique, but still...given the specs and expected performance, diamonds are sort of commodities themselves--perhaps not compared with vacuum cleaners or toothpaste, but compared with colored stones. And it doesn''t help that I''m so analytical by nature. I don''t need everything to be numerical, but this almost-purely qualitative stuff is hard for me. I''m enjoying it, but it''s hard.

Please don''t misunderstand me. I''m not REALLY complaining, in the sense that I''m unhappy. Frankly, I''m having a blast with this stuff. Anything challenging is going to cause some healthy frustration at times, though, and I''m just expressing that.

I will try to post a photo or two when I can.

I still don''t think I''ve made my main issue clear. I''ll try again. I bought the necklace because it was within my budget and because Kyrie liked it. You all are telling me that''s fine, but I think there should be other considerations. Let''s go back to when I wanted to buy an engagement ring. For the sake of argument, assume my budget was $5K. Further, let''s say that Kyrie wanted a one-carat diamond, and she preferred yellow (i.e., industrial grade) diamonds with modest clarity and cut quality. Make the setting something simple in 14K gold. Now, I could say that (a) I needed to buy an engagement ring, (b) I should give Kyrie what she wanted, and (c) my budget was $5K. If that were all the reasoning I needed, I''d pay $5K for an industrial-grade diamond in a simple ring setting. Do you see what I''m saying? Yes, I could do that, but I also could accomplish the same goal for much less money. Maybe with the money that was left over, I could have bought a necklace, earrings, and whatever else. Just thinking about my budget and what my true love wants is not all there is to it.

So regarding the necklace, yes, it was within my budget, and yes, she liked it a lot, but there''s still this sense that I''m missing a piece of the puzzle. Maybe that piece is simply not much of an issue in the case of jewelry with colored stones like it is with diamond rings, but I doubt it. If my budget at the show had been, say, $50K, I would not have paid $50K for the necklace just because Kyrie loved it. Or maybe I ignorantly would have, but it would have been wasting money...I think. There has to be some sense of market value, and I don''t have that at this point. I will probably never have it to the extent that Nicrez or some others have it, and there''s only so much I''m willing to do about the deficiency, but...I want to be better than I am now.

Anyway, again, I''ll try to post a couple of photos.
 
Okay, here are some photos. The lighting is incandescent apartment light, so it''s not optimal, but I hope you''ll get the idea.

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Photo #2.

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Photo #3.

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Oh. I LOVE that. So lovely. Not commenting on the rest... .but I love the halo around that beautiful moonstone. Such a halo.
 
It is beautiful and will look perfect with her wedding dress. I have no idea what it is worth but you could always get it appraised (which you might want to dod for insurance anyways) since you seem curious.
 
Date: 8/30/2007 1:10:06 AM
Author: Tacori E-ring
It is beautiful and will look perfect with her wedding dress. I have no idea what it is worth but you could always get it appraised (which you might want to dod for insurance anyways) since you seem curious.
Yeah, I''ve considered going for an independent appraisal, but I''m not sure it''s worth the time and money at this point, given that (a) my fiancée is attached to the necklace, so we''re not returning it under almost any circumstances, and (b) the jeweler is mailing us an appraisal for insurance purposes. I''m still thinking about it, though. Put it this way: If not for all the other wedding-related expenses I''m incurring at the moment, I probably wouldn''t hesitate. Also...I suppose that if I already knew and trusted a reasonably priced appraiser in the area (D.C.), I might be more inclined to go ahead and do it.
 
Your insurance co might require an independent one anyways since jeweler''s tend to inflate their apprasials.

Regardless you make her happy and a happy wife = a happy life.
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