he''s always freakin BROKE ..

[nkarma]

Mismanagement of money is a HUGE dealbreaker to me. It isn't to some. You are going to have to accept how he is and will not change and then work from there. He will always be like this so if you want to do things like save for a house, your kids college fund, a vacation, you are going to have to do those all yourself. You choose to marry him knowing all you know and you should never nag him to change. He won't anyway and you knew how he was from the start. The only person that will be financially responsible in your relationship will be you. If that is something you can deal with and makes all the other stuff worth it, then stay with him, but like I said you better be really truthful to yourself first.

 

[RaiKai]

I do think you both need to have a HONEST conversation about finances if you are planning to get married. That means looking at your incomes, expenses, budgets, spending and saving habits, financial goals, and so on.

I am concerned that you have no idea how much is going to his mom, for example. Is this going to continue after marriage? Is this permanent? What if you have children and need the money for yourselves?

And, it may be true that you DO have different approaches to finances. Either you are both able to work with that and compliment one another, or not and then you are going to have to evaluate the situation. But, the differing approaches or "financial IQ" or so forth probably won''t change at this point in your lives.

 

[Amber St. Clare]

I''ve been married for 26 years {I know, what am I doing in LIW thread!

}. I think the two of you REALLY need to sit down and have a no hold barred talk about finances--you both have dependant children AND he is helping his mom {a situation about which you were in the dark}. Finances are a HUGE part of marriage, even when both parties are on the same page. YMMV

 

[GliderPoss]

Date: 5/19/2010 5:26:59 PM
Author: Amber St. Clare
I''ve been married for 26 years {I know, what am I doing in LIW thread!

}. I think the two of you REALLY need to sit down and have a no hold barred talk about finances--you both have dependant children AND he is helping his mom {a situation about which you were in the dark}. Finances are a HUGE part of marriage, even when both parties are on the same page. YMMV

Couldn''t agree more! BIGGEST challenge of our marraige has always been finances - wish had "that talk" before we married then I would have taken an entirely different approach to it. ended up in deep strife due to mismanagement and I was oblivious to it all! Thankfully we are back on track and I manage our finances now. Don''t put it off - find out now....

 

[kagordo4]

Date: 5/16/2010 1:22:15 PM
Author: monarch64
Ditch him. Seriously. I can''t believe you even took the time and consideration to begin a thread about this. Someone who is 15, let alone 35 doesn''t have $13 for a haircut and has horrible money management skills is not marriage material. You will NOT be able to change this about him. Trust me. Make your break now before you get further involved with this guy.

That really was unnecessary. My boyfriend is honestly stupid sometimes when it comes to money. From the time we started dating he was always overdrafting, missing bill payments, etc. I assure you that changed very quickly. I hate micromanaging but I did it. Now his bills are paid early, he puts $500 each paycheck into a savings account, drastically improved his credit score.

A good and solid relationship is where BOTH people can bring something to the table. We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. My example, I get grumpy and stress out way too often. I freak out about physics and organic chemistry, and applying to medschool, etc etc. He is super chill and helps me stay calm.

He made his mistakes and then fixed them, with my help. I feel like your comment to the OP was harsh and callous and I was personally offended, even if she was not.

 

[monarch64]

Date: 6/9/2010 10:31:58 PM
Author: kagordo4

Date: 5/16/2010 1:22:15 PM

Author: monarch64

Ditch him. Seriously. I can''t believe you even took the time and consideration to begin a thread about this. Someone who is 15, let alone 35 doesn''t have $13 for a haircut and has horrible money management skills is not marriage material. You will NOT be able to change this about him. Trust me. Make your break now before you get further involved with this guy.

That really was unnecessary. My boyfriend is honestly stupid sometimes when it comes to money. From the time we started dating he was always overdrafting, missing bill payments, etc. I assure you that changed very quickly. I hate micromanaging but I did it. Now his bills are paid early, he puts $500 each paycheck into a savings account, drastically improved his credit score.


A good and solid relationship is where BOTH people can bring something to the table. We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. My example, I get grumpy and stress out way too often. I freak out about physics and organic chemistry, and applying to medschool, etc etc. He is super chill and helps me stay calm.


He made his mistakes and then fixed them, with my help. I feel like your comment to the OP was harsh and callous and I was personally offended, even if she was not.

Gee K, sorry you were personally offended. My comment certainly wasn''t directed towards you. It, like most of my thousands of comments made on PS over the past 5 years, came from a good place that was meant as a wee bit of anonymous tough love towards the OP, not to mention that I posted said comment almost a MONTH ago and much has transpired on this thread since then.

If you''re taking it upon yourself to be personally offended by something I posted which was directed to someone else then that is your problem.

Further, I speak from experience myself, as most of us do when we post with our OPINIONS. Have a lovely evening!

 

[merbear1215]

I think, the thing about finances is it is COMPLETELY learned. Luckily, my family was good with finances, and my dad talked to us often about finances (not how much the family had, but things like "make sure to pay off your credit card each month in full so you don''t pay interest"). In addition, he opened credit cards in my name when I was like 15. I hardly used them, he paid all the bills, and as a result, I established (or he established for me) really great credit and bought a home at 22.

My fiance had NONE of that. A few years ago, he says how he pays the minimum each month on his cc. I asked "why" and he said why pay more when you don''t have to. He had no clue interest existed. Crazy, I know. But he just was never taught. And, there are other examples like that.

Since we have been together, I have taught him what I know, and his credit and money has improved vastly improved.

So, I guess what I am saying is there is a big difference between being fiscally irresponsible or simply not knowing about finances and how to make them work.

 

[TooPatient]

You both need to sit down and talk about finances together. You should both write out how much you make each month, what goes to taxes, mortgage, utilities, tuition, child support, etc.

It sounds like he has a lot going on right now and you need to find out what it is, how long it is expected to last, what happens after, etc.


FI and I have times when our budget is super tight too. Things happen and sometimes it just works out that way. Mortgage, car, tuitions, and other bills get paid. Whatever is left has to cover groceries, pet supplies, and other necessities.


Hopefully his mom gets a job soon and you can see how he does when he isn''t supporting himself, a child, and his mom.

Even if his financial skills are awful, that doesn''t have to be a deal breaker. He could be aware that his skills are lacking in this area and be glad for your assistance in setting up a livable budget. (Just as I''m sure you will be glad for his assistance in whatever area he is good at)

 

[lilyfoot]

Date: 6/10/2010 11:46:05 AM
Author: merbear1215
So, I guess what I am saying is there is a big difference between being fiscally irresponsible or simply not knowing about finances and how to make them work.

I completely agree with this statement.

However, (and I am not saying this is the case is the OP''s situation), some people just don''t care to be financially responsible, and "money" is often quoted to be the number one reason why people get divorced.

I guess what I''m trying to say is that there are financially irresponsible people who are ignorant to the hurt their habits are doing; and there are financially irresponsible people who know they are being irresponsible. I think it''s up to the OP to figure out which set of people her BF fits into, and how she feels about that.

 

[kagordo4]

Date: 6/9/2010 11:43:06 PM
Author: monarch64

Date: 6/9/2010 10:31:58 PM
Author: kagordo4

Date: 5/16/2010 1:22:15 PM

Author: monarch64

Ditch him. Seriously. I can''t believe you even took the time and consideration to begin a thread about this. Someone who is 15, let alone 35 doesn''t have $13 for a haircut and has horrible money management skills is not marriage material. You will NOT be able to change this about him. Trust me. Make your break now before you get further involved with this guy.

That really was unnecessary. My boyfriend is honestly stupid sometimes when it comes to money. From the time we started dating he was always overdrafting, missing bill payments, etc. I assure you that changed very quickly. I hate micromanaging but I did it. Now his bills are paid early, he puts $500 each paycheck into a savings account, drastically improved his credit score.


A good and solid relationship is where BOTH people can bring something to the table. We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. My example, I get grumpy and stress out way too often. I freak out about physics and organic chemistry, and applying to medschool, etc etc. He is super chill and helps me stay calm.


He made his mistakes and then fixed them, with my help. I feel like your comment to the OP was harsh and callous and I was personally offended, even if she was not.

Gee K, sorry you were personally offended. My comment certainly wasn''t directed towards you. It, like most of my thousands of comments made on PS over the past 5 years, came from a good place that was meant as a wee bit of anonymous tough love towards the OP, not to mention that I posted said comment almost a MONTH ago and much has transpired on this thread since then.

If you''re taking it upon yourself to be personally offended by something I posted which was directed to someone else then that is your problem.

Further, I speak from experience myself, as most of us do when we post with our OPINIONS. Have a lovely evening!

Time is irrelevant in this discussion, your comments were not based specificallly one month ago, otherwise your past experiences would not be relevant either. We cannot base an opinion on the past and then have the opinion become irrelevant one month later (as a function of time, of course), it makes no sense and invalidates all argument, just like in sciences.

I apologize as clearly my rebuttal came out arrogant or perhaps rude as was not the intention.

I also apologize that clearly you have experienced something in your life to cause you to have a strong distrust or distaste for men who have monetary problems. Alas, I must still disagree; not all men who lack the proper monetary skills should be marked at invalides and thrown to the side. I once again stress that a good relationship consists of both partners bringing something to the table.

And finally, my offense was based on the men I have encounter that do in fact suck at money, and simply need a woman (or man depending on their preferences) to help reel them in and ground them.

I do hope this clears up the obvious misunderstanding.

 

[RaiKai]

Date: 6/10/2010 1:17:13 PM
Author: lilyfoot

Date: 6/10/2010 11:46:05 AM

Author: merbear1215

So, I guess what I am saying is there is a big difference between being fiscally irresponsible or simply not knowing about finances and how to make them work.

I completely agree with this statement.


However, (and I am not saying this is the case is the OP''s situation), some people just don''t care to be financially responsible, and ''money'' is often quoted to be the number one reason why people get divorced.


I guess what I''m trying to say is that there are financially irresponsible people who are ignorant to the hurt their habits are doing; and there are financially irresponsible people who know they are being irresponsible. I think it''s up to the OP to figure out which set of people her BF fits into, and how she feels about that.

Agreed lily!

One of the shows I like to watch is ''Til Debt Do Us Part. Money (and how a couple manages it) is definitely a BIG factor in relationships and it can be very divisive. There are indeed people out there who know VERY well how to manage money and how finances work - they just would rather be irresponsible and not worry about it (and rather leave the other worrying about it). Or sometimes they are both that way and find themselves in serious trouble.

So, there are lots of variants on how someone values, approaches and manages finances. Two individuals in a relationship can even have different approaches, as long as they can work together, keep the communication open, and come to agreements on their financial affairs and so on to work as a team - it is about finding a balance.

 

[kagordo4]

Date: 6/10/2010 11:46:05 AM
Author: merbear1215
I think, the thing about finances is it is COMPLETELY learned. Luckily, my family was good with finances, and my dad talked to us often about finances (not how much the family had, but things like ''make sure to pay off your credit card each month in full so you don''t pay interest''). In addition, he opened credit cards in my name when I was like 15. I hardly used them, he paid all the bills, and as a result, I established (or he established for me) really great credit and bought a home at 22.

My fiance had NONE of that. A few years ago, he says how he pays the minimum each month on his cc. I asked ''why'' and he said why pay more when you don''t have to. He had no clue interest existed. Crazy, I know. But he just was never taught. And, there are other examples like that.

Since we have been together, I have taught him what I know, and his credit and money has improved vastly improved.

So, I guess what I am saying is there is a big difference between being fiscally irresponsible or simply not knowing about finances and how to make them work.

This is exactly what I was trying to say. My boyfriend was credit stupid. I have perfect credit. We worked together and fixed his problems and that seems exactly what you did as well.

This is what I meant by both partners bringing something to the table.

 

[monarch64]

Date: 6/10/2010 1:46:22 PM
Author: kagordo4

Date: 6/9/2010 11:43:06 PM
Author: monarch64

Date: 6/9/2010 10:31:58 PM
Author: kagordo4

Date: 5/16/2010 1:22:15 PM

Author: monarch64

Ditch him. Seriously. I can''t believe you even took the time and consideration to begin a thread about this. Someone who is 15, let alone 35 doesn''t have $13 for a haircut and has horrible money management skills is not marriage material. You will NOT be able to change this about him. Trust me. Make your break now before you get further involved with this guy.

That really was unnecessary. My boyfriend is honestly stupid sometimes when it comes to money. From the time we started dating he was always overdrafting, missing bill payments, etc. I assure you that changed very quickly. I hate micromanaging but I did it. Now his bills are paid early, he puts $500 each paycheck into a savings account, drastically improved his credit score.


A good and solid relationship is where BOTH people can bring something to the table. We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. My example, I get grumpy and stress out way too often. I freak out about physics and organic chemistry, and applying to medschool, etc etc. He is super chill and helps me stay calm.


He made his mistakes and then fixed them, with my help. I feel like your comment to the OP was harsh and callous and I was personally offended, even if she was not.

Gee K, sorry you were personally offended. My comment certainly wasn''t directed towards you. It, like most of my thousands of comments made on PS over the past 5 years, came from a good place that was meant as a wee bit of anonymous tough love towards the OP, not to mention that I posted said comment almost a MONTH ago and much has transpired on this thread since then.

If you''re taking it upon yourself to be personally offended by something I posted which was directed to someone else then that is your problem.

Further, I speak from experience myself, as most of us do when we post with our OPINIONS. Have a lovely evening!

Time is irrelevant in this discussion, your comments were not based specificallly one month ago, otherwise your past experiences would not be relevant either. We cannot base an opinion on the past and then have the opinion become irrelevant one month later (as a function of time, of course), it makes no sense and invalidates all argument, just like in sciences.

I apologize as clearly my rebuttal came out arrogant or perhaps rude as was not the intention.

I also apologize that clearly you have experienced something in your life to cause you to have a strong distrust or distaste for men who have monetary problems. Alas, I must still disagree; not all men who lack the proper monetary skills should be marked at invalides and thrown to the side. I once again stress that a good relationship consists of both partners bringing something to the table.

And finally, my offense was based on the men I have encounter that do in fact suck at money, and simply need a woman (or man depending on their preferences) to help reel them in and ground them.

I do hope this clears up the obvious misunderstanding.

Uh...with all due respect, you''re 21. HisspecialK and her SO are 35. I don''t know how old your boyfriend is but it sounds like you stepped in at a point in his life where he hasn''t completely ruined himself financially. That''s great.

I don''t discriminate in my distaste or my distrust of anyone according to gender, don''t worry. I know plenty of women who can''t balance a checkbook or handle credit cards and I feel the same way about them.

 

[RaiKai]

Date: 6/10/2010 2:02:35 PM
Author: monarch64

Date: 6/10/2010 1:46:22 PM

Author: kagordo4

Date: 6/9/2010 11:43:06 PM

Author: monarch64

Date: 6/9/2010 10:31:58 PM

Author: kagordo4

Date: 5/16/2010 1:22:15 PM


Author: monarch64


Ditch him. Seriously. I can't believe you even took the time and consideration to begin a thread about this. Someone who is 15, let alone 35 doesn't have $13 for a haircut and has horrible money management skills is not marriage material. You will NOT be able to change this about him. Trust me. Make your break now before you get further involved with this guy.

That really was unnecessary. My boyfriend is honestly stupid sometimes when it comes to money. From the time we started dating he was always overdrafting, missing bill payments, etc. I assure you that changed very quickly. I hate micromanaging but I did it. Now his bills are paid early, he puts $500 each paycheck into a savings account, drastically improved his credit score.



A good and solid relationship is where BOTH people can bring something to the table. We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. My example, I get grumpy and stress out way too often. I freak out about physics and organic chemistry, and applying to medschool, etc etc. He is super chill and helps me stay calm.



He made his mistakes and then fixed them, with my help. I feel like your comment to the OP was harsh and callous and I was personally offended, even if she was not.

Gee K, sorry you were personally offended. My comment certainly wasn't directed towards you. It, like most of my thousands of comments made on PS over the past 5 years, came from a good place that was meant as a wee bit of anonymous tough love towards the OP, not to mention that I posted said comment almost a MONTH ago and much has transpired on this thread since then.


If you're taking it upon yourself to be personally offended by something I posted which was directed to someone else then that is your problem.


Further, I speak from experience myself, as most of us do when we post with our OPINIONS. Have a lovely evening!

Time is irrelevant in this discussion, your comments were not based specificallly one month ago, otherwise your past experiences would not be relevant either. We cannot base an opinion on the past and then have the opinion become irrelevant one month later (as a function of time, of course), it makes no sense and invalidates all argument, just like in sciences.


I apologize as clearly my rebuttal came out arrogant or perhaps rude as was not the intention.


I also apologize that clearly you have experienced something in your life to cause you to have a strong distrust or distaste for men who have monetary problems. Alas, I must still disagree; not all men who lack the proper monetary skills should be marked at invalides and thrown to the side. I once again stress that a good relationship consists of both partners bringing something to the table.


And finally, my offense was based on the men I have encounter that do in fact suck at money, and simply need a woman (or man depending on their preferences) to help reel them in and ground them.


I do hope this clears up the obvious misunderstanding.

Uh...with all due respect, you're 21. HisspecialK and her SO are 35. I don't know how old your boyfriend is but it sounds like you stepped in at a point in his life where he hasn't completely ruined himself financially. That's great.


I don't discriminate in my distaste or my distrust of anyone according to gender, don't worry. I know plenty of women who can't balance a checkbook or handle credit cards and I feel the same way about them.

This. And for the record, people CAN change opinions as time passes and circumstances change. That is part of maturing and deepening your breadth of life experiences. Relationships are not "the sciences" and even the sciences change their theories or amend as new findings come along.

As you said yourself the men YOU encountered just sucked at money and needed some financial help and perhaps some responsibilities to understand finances better. That does not mean ALL men are like that or ALL men (or women) are in that situation. Nor does it mean that all women want to parent someone else into being an adult. Especially not when they are in their thirties.

I met my DH when he was 35, and sorry, but if he "sucked at finances" at that age and had put himself into a big black consumer debt hole, or was "mysterious" about his finances....he may have brought "other things to the table" but I personally see no reason to overlook such big red flags, and I would NOT have continued a relationship with him (nor he would have with me if I was the one with the incredibly poor money management). I do not have some huge distrust or disgust or anything of men who cannot manage their finances or are shady about them and so on (nor do I of women). I just would not choose to date them.

I actually am the primary breadwinner in my marriage, and for a period of time while DH went back to school, after taking an early retirement from the military, I was the only breadwinner. I don't have an issue with someone who makes less than me and so on. It has nothing to do with someone not having a whole lot. It does have to do with how the manage what they DO have. What I have an issue with is someone who is fiscally irresponsible once they are grown adults. His financial situation is MY financial situation and vice versa and to me it is important WE have a healthy financial situation and have similar views and financial goals without me having to "parent" him into it. That is not what *I* want in a relationship or a marriage. I look for a true partner in every sense of the word.

So yes, both people in a relationship bring things to the table, and have their own strengths and weaknesses, but we can also choose what strengths and weaknesses we want on our shared table.

Maybe you see this as me as having "thrown lots of men to the side" on the way, but, I don't care. I did not settle for less than was important to me (not just shared financial values and attitudes of course, but also emotional openness, wonderful communication skills, self-awareness, honesty, intelligence, tenderness, a brilliant sense of humour and all the other things that are important to me (it is a long list)) and I would not trade the man I am with for anything in the world.

 

[princesss]

Honestly, part of what I want my partner to bring to the table is fiscal responsibility. Crushing debt and poor money management skills are not attractive, and were I to start dating somebody new, I would not consider him as a serious partner without similar views on money. And that''s at 24 - if I were 35 and the guy still could not get his money habits under control, I''d be gone. It is not worth it to try to "train" him - he''s an adult and should be acting like one, and part of that is knowing how to take care of your money. I refuse to enter into a relationship with anybody but an equal partner, and if I have to mother and baby and teach somebody vital life skills, we are not equals.

 

[nkarma]

Date: 6/10/2010 4:05:23 PM
Author: princesss
Honestly, part of what I want my partner to bring to the table is fiscal responsibility. Crushing debt and poor money management skills are not attractive, and were I to start dating somebody new, I would not consider him as a serious partner without similar views on money. And that''s at 24 - if I were 35 and the guy still could not get his money habits under control, I''d be gone. It is not worth it to try to ''train'' him - he''s an adult and should be acting like one, and part of that is knowing how to take care of your money. I refuse to enter into a relationship with anybody but an equal partner, and if I have to mother and baby and teach somebody vital life skills, we are not equals.

Big Ditto. I think kagordo4 got all mad because she is youngish. If you meet someone at 35 who has lived for 17 years on his own and can''t afford a haircut, that is a MAJOR problem. I agree somewhat with what others said about learning from parents. I learned by doing the opposite of what my parents did, but at some point if you can''t take initiative to figure out how to handle your finances, how to build credit, etc...I think there is something wrong with you whether you were taught or not.

Like princess, financial irresponsibilty is a HUGE dealbreaker for me...no matter how great he is otherwise, he would be out of the picture until he acted like a self sufficient adult.

 

[Smurfysmiles]

Let me get this straight- you''ve been dating 2 years and haven''t had a money talk yet? I think that concerns me more than the fact that he might be struggling a bit financially (hey man he''s not the only one! I cut my OWN hair lol)

 

[hisspecialk]

wow. . . .i dont think i know where to start. . .

i guess with the ditch him comment .. lol the thought had occured to me. . BUT my deicison was going to be based on how he responded to us having the talk, whether he was willing to make full disclosure and how open he was willing to be to my ideas about fixing his credit and financial standing.

WE HAVE had several conversations that have been very successful and I feel comfortable that he is completely on board with letting me be the control freak that I am ----in regards to helping him fix and manage some things.

Helping his mother. . he was able to give me a figure of what he gives monthly. . but not able to tell me how long it would go on. .. i am still digesting that .. .as i would at least like to have a time frame that she is aware of in place. . . . .he is still mulling that over.. ..

thank to everyone for your advice, sharing your experience and just being open and brutally honest.
I appreciate you