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Help with Princess Cut Diamond!

serc

serc

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Messages
41
Could you pricescope experts tell me which of the following stones are worth further looking at? My budget for the engagement ring is 10K +/- 1K. I am looking for a diamond with following specifications:

Carat: 1.2-1.4
Color: F-H
Clarity: VVS1-VS2
Cut: As good as my budget allows

Here are the stones I've found so far.
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2735798.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2696762.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2690310.htm
http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=381023&ref=pricescope
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-2297658-1.40-carat-Princess-diamond-H-color-VVS2-Clarity.aspx?sku=2297658&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-2509935-1.33-carat-Princess-diamond-G-color-VVS2-Clarity.aspx?sku=2509935&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-1909865-1.30-carat-Princess-diamond-H-color-VVS2-Clarity.aspx?sku=1909865&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com

Some of them have AGS certification so they come with light performance pictures. Can I ask the vendor to provide me with Ideal Scope and ASET images for the stones that are GIA certified with no light performance pictures? Is this reasonable?

Thanks for your help in advance. If you have any stones that you'd like to suggest, please feel free to do so.

Regards
 
Some vendors will provide ASET, some won't. WF will, I don't know about b2c & ED.

The WF ES and PS both look fine - there are differences in the photos but I suspect both are very pretty in-person, your best bet is to call and ask which they would recommend and why. The other WF is a virtual stone - meaning they don't own it, and don't have it in-house on-hand for inspection. They'll have to find out if it's available, have it called in, you'll have to wait for it to be shipped in for inspection, and you may be responsible for all or part of the shipping (definitely call and ask each vendor how this works first).

You have a great budget for what you're looking for - tons of options! Here are a few more I found in a quick search -

1.21 G VS1 from GOG 6.6k http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8926/

1.23 H VS1 Solasfera from GOG $8.4k http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8960/

1.23 G VS1 Solasfera from GOG $10.3k http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8958/

(request professional review and ASET if interested)
1.2 G VVS2 from JA $6.7k http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-VVS2-Good-Cut-Princess-Diamond-858965.asp
1.54 G VS1 from JA $10.7k http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-VS1-Premium-Cut-Princess-Diamond-1325157.asp
 
Hi Yssie,

I really appreciate that you took your time to give me your opinion on these stones. I think I will ask James Allen for ASET images of three stones, then post the pictures and would love to hear your review on these diamonds if you do not mind. Thanks again taking the time to look at these.

Regards,
 
No problem, happy to help! When you get photos start a new thread with "princess ASET" in the title and you'll get more tailored responses.

In this case - given that you do have a very healthy budget for what you're looking for and therefore plenty of in-house options - I would not recommend trying to dig through the virtual listing, it's time consuming and can get surprisingly expensive if you wind up shipping several stones before finding the right one. In-house stones often come with more generous policies as well, though again you'll want to ask each vendor what each specific stone comes with (WF's ES line has the lifetime upgrade/buyback but PS stones are case by case, I think JA will honour a spend-double upgrade policy on any stone they sell)

I just took a closer look at the stones I suggested yesterday - you'll want to ask GOG about the vthn girdle on the first one. The first JA has an exthn girdle - the faceting is lovely, but the durability risk would be too much for me to recommend taking the chance - the GOG is a better buy all round IMO (same price, better policies, safer girdle, no practical difference btwn VS1 and VVS2 so you aren't sacrificing anything).

Another couple that may be of interest -
1.72 H VS2 $10.9k http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-VS2-Premium-Cut-Princess-Diamond-1376205.asp (request review and ASET)
1.51 F VS2 $9.9k http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-VS2-Good-Cut-Princess-Diamond-1342270.asp (pic is tilted, would ask for a new head-on pic and ASET)
1.52 E VS2 $9.3k http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/E-VS2-Good-Cut-Princess-Diamond-1376691.asp (review + ASET)
 
Yssie,

Thanks again. I will start a separate thread once I get ASET images from JA. I already asked them for ASET images for three diamonds. Also, when you say "review", what does that mean? Can you clarify as I am a newbie :).

As a separate note, I think I mislead you when I said my budget was 10K+/-1K for the ring, because that unfortunately includes setting as well, and the setting I like costs 2.5K in white gold, therefore I want to be within 8.5K for the loose diamond which brings total cost to 11K and that is my max :(. I will post the ASET images for the diamonds from JA. Thanks for the suggestions. I really appreciate it. Talk to you soon.

Serc
 
Ah, got it!
Okay - we can tell you more when you have photos. By "review" I just mean what your rep thinks about the stones you've requested ASETs for - you can ask them if there's one they recommend, and why.
 
Okay Thanks!!! :mrgreen:
 
You have some nice choices there. I would never buy a princess without an ASET image. Always go for the aset.

My favorite is the Solasfera 1.23 from GOG, I think it has beautiful symmetry.
 
Hi Chel,

Which Solasfera 1.23 from GOG do you refer to? G color or H Color? Thanks,
 
GOG #8960 the H 1.23ct. I like the symmetry and the smaller table. Also the location of the tiny inclusion will be completely hidden in the facet pattern. That would be my pick of the bunch with ASETs.

I would not pay a 2k premium for 1x color class upgrade.

Also you have some really great options that I suggest you narrow down your options a bit so you are really only considering... say 3....I'd forget about all the stones above 10k as I don't think any of them warrant to price increase. And anything you can't see an ASET image for- never buy a princess without an asset.
 
Okay Thank you Chel! I will narrow down my choices and start a new thread to see what everyone suggests. Have a good day!

Serc
 
If you're still reading this, I think the Solasfera is by far the best choice!

I saw your initial post where you outlined a number of criteria for your diamond. Of them all, cut was the one that was left flexible, but with a budget like yours, cut would be the first most noticeable thing. You can still manage most of the other criteria you set out to fulfill to boot.

With a solasfera you have an excellent cut to begin with, and from all the images/vids I've seen on them, if you like the way that the gem performs, you'll have a gorgeous stone! Definitely the H from a cost standpoint, you can push the savings into a more beautiful setting.

2K goes a long way on a good bench!
 
I agree with TristanC, the solafera is a beautiful cut.

Providing you go above H and are eye clean, go for the best cut you can afford, then the biggest. Size and sparkle will make the most impact. Noone but the most avid PSer would see the difference between a E and a H or a VVS1 and a VS2.

The GOG H 1.23 is the winner- and imho well priced so you can spend more on a super setting. I would get it on hold now!
 
I would choose the first GOG - http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8926/ over both Solasferas. The Solasfera looks beautiful, but so does this one, and the Solasfera carries a heavy premium that I just don't think is worth it in this case, given that you have a fantastic unbranded alternative..

My recommendation: call GOG and see what they think :sun:
 
Thank you Tristan, Chel and Yssie! Of course I am reading this. I think that GOG solasfera one (H color) will be in my list. Again, I think I misworded my priorities in my original post. I absolutely agree that the cut is the most important. I am very flexible in color and clarity as long as it is eye clean and not yellowish. I also like this one from WF and I talked to Liza from WF and she was very helpful with this specific stone. When you look at ASET images of Solasfera one and this WF one, do you see any significant difference? WF one is bigger in size and 1K cheaper.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2690310.htm

The only thing that worries me is the fact that I watched some videos produced by GOG where Jonathan compares Solesfera vs "Ideal Cut" princess stone and there is a tone of difference under different light conditions. Since this WF stone has AGS0 grade, should I worry less? I am not sure if I will be able to see my top choices in person so what is the best way to handle this except for ASET images?

As I mentioned earlier, I requested ASET images for three diamonds from James Allen, as well and will post all my top choices in one thread so I can make my final decision with your help! Thanks for your time in advance. I really appreciate all of this.

Serc
 
Ok so here is my mini crib sheet for reading the assessment images:

Idealscope image: Red = good, white = bad. The more red the more light returned, the more white the more light that has leaked out. . But you want some dark patterns to add contrast but not too much.

Aset image: In order of preference... Red = great with most light return, Green = good as this is reflected light from windows, Blue = ok as blue give contract and this is good *in moderation*, white = bad as this is light lost due to leakage.

This is my personal opinion on the three, so far top choices, based solely on the images and photos: (Are you near to either GOG or WF as you could go in and compare in person? then you could just pick the one that appeals most)

1= GOG Solasfera 1.23 H VS1, Pros: I think it has beautiful symmetry and has a very high level of red in both images so will return most light. Cons: there is some light leakage and green area in the corners. I personally prefer light leakage in the corners compared to the centre.

2= WF 1.29 H VS2, Pros: Very red so good light return, better performance in the corners and edges than the others as it has a high level of green there. Cons: I don't like the white circle in the centre as this is a deadzone with no light returns here.

3= GOG 1.21 G VS1 Pros: Good light return (but lots of intermingled blue so high level of contrast) Cons: Less symmetry than both the others, more leakage in the corners and edges than other two.

You have now identified some great stones, I think you are now sweating the small stuff a bit. Whilst the GOG solasfera is my favorite the others are lovely too. And the different in size between the three stones is fractions of a mm so it won't have any noticeable or visual size difference.
 
Thank you Chel. I think you are right that I am sweating the little stuff a bit as I will do this only one (hopefully :) ). Thanks for your detailed comments. GOG Solasfera and WF stones are contenders. I will wait to see what James Allen has to offer and then make a decision to go with a specific vendor. I understand that everyone speaks highly of GOG and WF but that is whole another discussion I guess. Thanks again.

Serc
 
Yssie|1325084294|3089974 said:
I would choose the first GOG - http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8926/ over both Solasferas. The Solasfera looks beautiful, but so does this one, and the Solasfera carries a heavy premium that I just don't think is worth it in this case, given that you have a fantastic unbranded alternative..

My recommendation: call GOG and see what they think :sun:
Click to expand...

This is a gorgeous stone; however, notice that the dimensions aren't much larger than 1ct and really aren't what I would expect for a 1.2ct princess. Note that the depth is 79.5%. It's up to you to decide whether that's too much. My absolute cutoff for rejecting a stone is 80%, and that's pushing it. Jon would have to confirm with you, but I believe that's why the price is substantially lower than some of the others. So despite seeing that it's a gorgeous ASET and a really nice looking facet pattern, I would personally say no to this one.

Solasferas are beautiful and cut to very tight standards (they're pretty much all the same and all good), but I agree that they come with a price premium. The WF one vs. the Solasferas...tough choice. They're all excellent and just about the same in dimensions. I think it comes down to personal preference in faceting patterns. Study the faceting carefully and notice that the WF one has a larger square table whereas the Solasferas have smaller rounder ones. The central pattern seems to be more like pretty flower petals in the WF one and more of an X-shape with really nice contrast around it in the Solasferas. The WF one has 4 chevrons, creating a busier look than the 3-chevron Solasferas. Taking all of these subtle differences together, I'd choose the Solasferas because of my own personal preferences on these issues.

GOG's video was not referring to AGS ideal cuts like WF's, but rather vendors who label stones as ideal based solely on table/depth, polish/symmetry, and other proportions (in other words, not actual measurement of light performance). You have nothing to worry about when the stone has an AGS0 grade to back it up...it's just personal preference and nitpicking from here on out. Not that nitpicking is bad or anything...I'm a classic nitpicker... 8)
 
May I add another one to the mix? This is one from WF that is cut much more similarly to the Solasferas:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2696804.htm

Dimensions look good for the carat weight too. Don't discount it solely based on the I color. My princess is an I, and while I can see the color when I hold it up next to a D, I can't tell the difference when I hold it next to an F or G (haven't seen it next to an H, but I would extrapolate and say I wouldn't see the difference there either). Also, it has medium blue fluorescence, which is known to help I-J and lower colors appear whiter in sunlight. I suspect that the only reason this diamond didn't get WF's ACA rating was the fluorescence (for some reason any more than negligible/faint disqualifies it from being an ACA).

Considering that one vs. the Solasferas, the cutting is much more similar, and it comes down to price vs. color.
 
Hi Jstarfireb!

Thanks for the magnificient review! I will keep that I color stone in mind. I really really do not want the center stone to look yellowish so I am really hesitant about I color diamonds.

Also, I talked to Liza from WF and asked about the white area in the center of the H color stone (the link below)

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut-loose-diamond-2690310.htm

and here is her view on the issue:

11:31:51 AM [serc] well what do you think about that white area in the middle of the H stone IS image?

11:32:12 AM [serc] does that tell you anything or it is just an expected image?

11:32:31 AM [Liza] That's no problem, and is not visible to the eye. Many (if not most) princess cut diamonds will have that to some degree. The G VS2 has it as well, just a little smaller.

11:32:42 AM [serc] Okay

11:33:10 AM [Liza] All that is is light behaving a little "strangely" at the culet. It's not visible in real life, because the light return from the rest of the pavilion (the lower portion of the diamond) is being reflected to your eye. So it's not something you can actually see.

Do you guys agree with her assesment? Do not get me wrong, she was super helpful, I am just trying to see what everyone's opinion is.

Serc
 
Yssie,

Thanks. So basically it is common among princess cuts and nothing to sweat about. Thanks,
 
Okay everyone, I received asset images from James Allen and they recommend only one stone out of three I had selected earlier. I will start a new thread and ask everyone's opinion on my final four (I do not think James Allen one is a contender but will post it for you to judge). Thanks,

Serc
 
Thanks for the kind words, guys! I'm glad my opinion was helpful.
 
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