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Help with picking an Asscher Diamond

Which 1 or 2 is your favorite?

  • 1) 1.91 ct, F, VVS1

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 2) 1.64 ct, F, VVS2

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 3) 1.90 ct, G, VVS2

    Votes: 2 28.6%

  • 4) 1.72 ct, G, VVS1

    Votes: 2 28.6%

  • 5) 1.51 ct, G, VVS1

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 6) 1.60 ct, G, VVS1

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 7) 2.01 ct, G, VVS2

    Votes: 5 71.4%
  • Total voters
    7
S

shinee77

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 2, 2018
Messages
12
Hi all! I’m new to this forum and to the diamond hunt, but have been spending a lot of time recently narrowing down to the right Asscher stone for an engagement ring. While I think I’ve kinda figured out the “quantitative” part of the process (as much as I could from a few couple days of research), I could definitely use help narrowing down Asscher diamonds based on other aspects (windmills, hall of mirror effect, slow flashing vs fast flashing, extinction, etc). I’ve only been shopping online so far.

Here’s what I’m working with:
Asscher
Budget - $16000 USD
Carats - As big as I can get within budget and other parameters; looks to be about 1.3 to 2ct ish
Color - F or better, maybe G
Clarity - VVS2 or better
Cut - Looks like this is more subjective for Asscher, so based off below
Depth - 61-68%
Table - 61-68%
Polish/Symmetry - Excellent, maybe Very Good
Girdle - Very Thin, Thin, Medium, Slightly Thick, maybe Thick
Culet - None, Very Small, Small
Fluorescence - None, maybe Faint

I’ve used the above parameters and searched James Allen and Blue Nile. Here’s what I’ve found so far.

Top few options:
1) 1.91 ct, F, VVS1 - https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD06161923
2) 1.64 ct, F, VVS2 - https://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD10145079
3) 1.90 ct, G, VVS2 - https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.90-carat-g-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-5361623
(It may just be the photography/video, but the james allen one just looked great vs all the others)

Other contenders:
4) 1.72 ct, G, VVS1 - https://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD01854882
5) 1.51 ct, G, VVS1 - https://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD10770596
6) 1.60 ct, G, VVS1 - https://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD03069754
7) 2.01 ct, G, VVS2 - https://www.bluenile.com/build-your-own-ring/diamond-details/LD10819961

Any thoughts, preferences, or help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
 
I think I like the 1.72 Blue Nile one the best.

When I bought my 1.52 G vs1 from blue Nile, there were no pics or video lol, so I figured let me get it and if it love it fine and if I don’t, I’ll just send it back.

I loved it.

I would say the James Allen one is my second choice.
 
ILikeShiny said:
@shinee77 - What are your reasons for VVS2 or higher and no/faint fluorescence?
Click to expand...

Was thinking the same thing. Plus, Cut should be your main focus. Paper stats is step 1 of MANY, when evaluating & comparing step cuts.
$16k is a great budget. You can get a beautiful VS-VVS F/G with beautiful spread, without maxing out your budget. Cut should be the main focus; you’ll get more for your money that way.
ASET & Videos will be key visual aid components during your search.
I have to go back to look at what you’ve posted. Just curious: why JA & BN? Are you open to other vendors?
 
I only had a quick look and I do like the look of 1.72 (blue nile) and the 1.9(James Allen)
The height of the crown and the windmill sizing work well for these stones.
 
I love the consistent brightness in the center of BN 2.01.
The only drawback is that you are viewing these diamonds while they are positioned on P3, and that makes evaluation of their true nature more difficult. ASET, and a video of the stone, pinched in tweezers, rotated from every angle, would be more effective ways to know for certain how well the stone performs, and how bright it is.
It’s my understanding that BN does not provide ASET images or additional videos of their diamonds. I may be wrong. It wouldn’t hurt to ask for these additional visuals in order to know for certain.

3A6139DB-8225-49F7-BA4A-1C35D7AA4EB0.png
 
BN 1.51 is out. See why?F2A2C82B-E28B-4C00-A8BE-943A122A553F.png
 
ILikeShiny said:
Of the ones you posted, this is my favorite - https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD10145079?click_id=34054261

I'd encourage you though to expand your search to G/VS2 though =)2
Click to expand...

I liked that one too. In my top 3.

I have a G and sometimes when it hits me, I feel like I can see tint and most of the time it doesn’t bother me (like 95% of the time). It makes me wish I didn’t see it and/or could be more open and appreciative to super slight tint of near colorless.
 
I'm a bit size partial, hence my suggestion. It doesn't have perfect crisp facet lines, but it seems pretty good for overall light return and it's plenty big! It doesn't appear to have a bulging pavilion, which is a sign that a diamond has been cut for weight retention at the cost of light return. It's also quite impossible for me to see the inclusions, a very clean looking stone.

Of the ones you posted I like the 2.01 best. It has nice white light whereas several of the others have the "square of death" with several facets flashing off at once. None of the choices, apart from perhaps the 1.51, are too poorly, but none seem to be awesome. There is a 1.56 royal asscher for sale on Ebay; if you are looking in that size range it would be worth buying without it's setting. It's already a good price.

Personally, I would be tempted by the larger face size perhaps even more than a royal asscher, as long as it is doing it's generic light show business. As for a G, I seem very insensitive to color - I would rate a G as colorless to my eyes.

It may come down to just which stone you simply like looking at the best. And you may have to wait if you can, or play with your criterion. Cut is definitely king with asschers and good cuts are truly hard to come by. Ask for an ASET for any that you consider finalists, and keep the thread alive. Sometimes the diamond you like can be found at a lesser price with another vendor.
 
scarsmum said:
I'm a bit size partial, hence my suggestion. It doesn't have perfect crisp facet lines, but it seems pretty good for overall light return and it's plenty big! It doesn't appear to have a bulging pavilion, which is a sign that a diamond has been cut for weight retention at the cost of light return. It's also quite impossible for me to see the inclusions, a very clean looking stone.

Of the ones you posted I like the 2.01 best. It has nice white light whereas several of the others have the "square of death" with several facets flashing off at once. None of the choices, apart from perhaps the 1.51, are too poorly, but none seem to be awesome. There is a 1.56 royal asscher for sale on Ebay; if you are looking in that size range it would be worth buying without it's setting. It's already a good price.

Personally, I would be tempted by the larger face size perhaps even more than a royal asscher, as long as it is doing it's generic light show business. As for a G, I seem very insensitive to color - I would rate a G as colorless to my eyes.

It may come down to just which stone you simply like looking at the best. And you may have to wait if you can, or play with your criterion. Cut is definitely king with asschers and good cuts are truly hard to come by. Ask for an ASET for any that you consider finalists, and keep the thread alive. Sometimes the diamond you like can be found at a lesser price with another vendor.
Click to expand...

...and, here, I thought I was the only one who could see the glaring darkness of all the centers, other than BN 2.01!! So glad someone else sees them, too!! I’m not particularly concerned with size, as I am the cut!! Of all 7, 2.01 has the best optics in static photo & in action on video.
You NEED an ASET image & video examination of that diamond in full motion, NOT resting on P3.
The Adiamor 2.20 @scarsmum posted I also found in my search for contenders. I like it. It’s crystal clear for a VS2 clarity grade & cut nicely (excellent, in fact). Another choice to consider & compare to BN 2.01.
 
Matthews1127 said:
...and, here, I thought I was the only one who could see the glaring darkness of all the centers, other than BN 2.01!! So glad someone else sees them, too!! I’m not particularly concerned with size, as I am the cut!! Of all 7, 2.01 has the best optics in static photo & in action on video.
You NEED an ASET image & video examination of that diamond in full motion, NOT resting on P3.
The Adiamor 2.20 @scarsmum posted I also found in my search for contenders. I like it. It’s crystal clear for a VS2 clarity grade & cut nicely (excellent, in fact). Another choice to consider & compare to BN 2.01.
Click to expand...
My problem with the 2.01 is I don’t see any stepping in to the lowest facets, except for the very center. The rest seem static to me?
 
scarsmum said:
There is a 1.56 royal asscher for sale on Ebay; if you are looking in that size range it would be worth buying without it's setting. It's already a good price.
Click to expand...

I’d jump on any Royal Asscher possible. A guaranteed incredible diamond!!!
 
ILikeShiny said:
My problem with the 2.01 is I don’t see any stepping in to the lowest facets, except for the very center. The rest seem static to me?
Click to expand...

I also thought it looked flat.

For the others,
The darkness Is obstruction from the camera. It’s hard to judge an asscher even from video. Within the darkness, I try to see if they are changing colors like to gray.

I more or less think seeing them in person is the only way.

BTW, my 1.52 is almost too small. I fixed that by getting a blingy setting. That is the problem with asschers.. they face up so small for their weight but they are gorgeous and so interesting!

Maybe @Karl_K can chime in about darkness in the middles.
 
whitewave said:
I also thought it looked flat.

For the others,
The darkness Is obstruction from the camera. It’s hard to judge an asscher even from video. Within the darkness, I try to see if they are changing colors like to gray.

I more or less think seeing them in person is the only way.

BTW, my 1.52 is almost too small. I fixed that by getting a blingy setting. That is the problem with asschers.. they face up so small for their weight but they are gorgeous and so interesting!

Maybe @Karl_K can chime in about darkness in the middles.
Click to expand...

Some have nice contrast, but 2.01 doesn’t seem “flat” to me....but....that is why I suggested ASET & other video for better visual aid.
All of these stones rest on P3, which makes them difficult to examine.
 
Matthews1127 said:
Some have nice contrast, but 2.01 doesn’t seem “flat” to me....but....that is why I suggested ASET & other video for better visual aid.
All of these stones rest on P3, which makes them difficult to examine.
Click to expand...

Agreed. blue nile doesn’t have Asets, but maybe if people keep asking for them they will eventually cave in and provide them.
 
OP - Have you contacted IDJ? They have done a great job for many (myself included) in finding beautiful asschers at very good prices.

I just took a quick look at their website and saw this one listed. It’s a 2.01ct G/VS2 (appears eye clean) and is by far better than any that I saw on your list, IMO (others please do chime in with your thoughts). Click on “actual image” and there’s a video linked to it. I think the facets are crisp, the windmills are perfect and a bit fat (which I love), there’s an awesome kobize, and it’s a tiny table with a high crown. All of these have me suspecting it’s either a very well cut antique or a newly cut antique-style asscher. Either way, the light return appears fantastic and it really makes me wish I was in the market for an asscher right now!!

https://idjewelry.com/asscher-dwdcc1501.html
 
ILikeShiny said:
OP - Have you contacted IDJ? They have done a great job for many (myself included) in finding beautiful asschers at very good prices.

I just took a quick look at their website and saw this one listed. It’s a 2.01ct G/VS2 (appears eye clean) and is by far better than any that I saw on your list, IMO (others please do chime in with your thoughts). Click on “actual image” and there’s a video linked to it. I think the facets are crisp, the windmills are perfect and a bit fat (which I love), there’s an awesome kobize, and it’s a tiny table with a high crown. All of these have me suspecting it’s either a very well cut antique or a newly cut antique-style asscher. Either way, the light return appears fantastic and it really makes me wish I was in the market for an asscher right now!!

https://idjewelry.com/asscher-dwdcc1501.html
Click to expand...

This is beauty ful!! I’d love to see more of this in different light environments, and an ASET!!! :kiss2:
 
Thanks so much for all the replies! Definitely have a lot that I wasn’t thinking about before.

@ILikeShiny , @Matthews1127 - You’re completely right. I’ve mainly been focusing on paper stats as that was an easy way to narrow down the search. I couldn’t tell how much effect fluorescence would have so went with the “best”. For the clarity, I have noticed when I step down, I can usually see the inclusions in the zoomed in/360 videos. I understand that’s different than being able to see them with your naked eye, but that’s the main reason I went with VVS2.

I’m open to other vendors. Those are the 2 I’ve used so far because there were a lot more choices.

Sounds like I should ask for more visuals (ASETs, videos, etc) which I’ll definitely be doing!

@scarsmum - Can you explain a little more about the “square of death” and how I should be looking out for it?

Also, this might be a silly question. But, I looked at the royal asscher on eBay, the link to adiamor, and IDJ and they have less video/images than BN and JA. How are you determining that it’s a better cut? Is it based on who created the diamond?
 
shinee77 said:
Thanks so much for all the replies! Definitely have a lot that I wasn’t thinking about before.

@ILikeShiny , @Matthews1127 - You’re completely right. I’ve mainly been focusing on paper stats as that was an easy way to narrow down the search. I couldn’t tell how much effect fluorescence would have so went with the “best”. For the clarity, I have noticed when I step down, I can usually see the inclusions in the zoomed in/360 videos. I understand that’s different than being able to see them with your naked eye, but that’s the main reason I went with VVS2.

I’m open to other vendors. Those are the 2 I’ve used so far because there were a lot more choices.

Sounds like I should ask for more visuals (ASETs, videos, etc) which I’ll definitely be doing!

@scarsmum - Can you explain a little more about the “square of death” and how I should be looking out for it?

Also, this might be a silly question. But, I looked at the royal asscher on eBay, the link to adiamor, and IDJ and they have less video/images than BN and JA. How are you determining that it’s a better cut? Is it based on who created the diamond?
Click to expand...

@scarsmum is describing the dark center in the middle of a step cut diamond that is created from a deep, poorly cut, or poorly positioned pavilion facet that makes the center of the diamond “die”. There is no life in the center of “the square of death”. I demonstrated that phenomenon, when I took still screen shots of BN 2.01 and BN 1.51. You can clearly see the difference.
The only way to know how to avoid that phenomenon is to actually see video & ASET images; stats & certs cannot show you this. Even if the dimensions of depth to table % seem drastically different, the stone may be beautiful, and may not have a dead center; pavilion and crown angles must be in synch in just the right position & proportions in order to create a beautiful step cut. This is why certs are only 1 of MANY factors included in this process. Some step cuts look like absolute garbage on paper, but are stunning IRL.
 
ILikeShiny said:
OP - Have you contacted IDJ? They have done a great job for many (myself included) in finding beautiful asschers at very good prices.

I just took a quick look at their website and saw this one listed. It’s a 2.01ct G/VS2 (appears eye clean) and is by far better than any that I saw on your list, IMO (others please do chime in with your thoughts). Click on “actual image” and there’s a video linked to it. I think the facets are crisp, the windmills are perfect and a bit fat (which I love), there’s an awesome kobize, and it’s a tiny table with a high crown. All of these have me suspecting it’s either a very well cut antique or a newly cut antique-style asscher. Either way, the light return appears fantastic and it really makes me wish I was in the market for an asscher right now!!

https://idjewelry.com/asscher-dwdcc1501.html
Click to expand...

Definitely a contender. Great find.
 
Some that appeal to my uneducated eyes! :)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.35-carat-e-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-1018512

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.46-carat-f-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-5361624 (perhaps a bit leaky at tilt angles)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.50-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-5299759
(perhaps a smidge leaky at tilt angles)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.51-carat-d-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-4675667 (perhaps a smidge leaky at tilt angles)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.56-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-3635549

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.59-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-5254075 (quite interesting faceting - lots of fire, good contrast and quite chunky facets, but might be a smidge leaky from some angles?? I think in-person inspection would be needed.)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.70-carat-g-color-vs1-clarity-sku-5405009 (maybe lacking very slightly in contrast head-on)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.70-carat-e-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-5312171

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.72-carat-g-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-613248 (I like the way the crown facets are working but a bit grey / lacking contrast head-on)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.76-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-4267603 (looks good head-on but leaky at angles and the facets under the table seem to be working the virtual facets but not really giving primary reflections - would probably need inspection in person)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.81-carat-f-color-vs1-clarity-sku-5067885 (not bad but I don't think it's amazing)

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/asscher-cut/1.80-carat-e-color-vvs2-clarity-sku-4389022 (like the facet patterning and contrast patterns but too grey / lacking brightness head-on for me)
 
Last edited:
HA 1.35EVVS1.
Most certainly a contender, but much smaller in diameter sq than the others I’d consider (BN 2.01 & Adiamor 2.20):
B07BADC3-6DE9-4606-AC0F-5DF0A00F3FA4.png
Beautiful, consistent brightness & great movement in motion.
ASET necessary. Place on Hold ASAP for comparison.
(More to follow)
 
JA 1.76FVS1:
465511CE-360F-43CC-8973-E09DE91F43C0.png
Another strong contender; bright & consistent across the stone, and beautifully cut. The facet patterns are interesting, and the lines are crisp & deliberate.
ASET is necessary. Place on Hold, immediately for comparison.
(More to follow)
 
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