Help with diamond

[diamond island]

What do you guys think about the color/clarity combination of J and VS1. According to Fred from diamondcuttersintl.com they said this is not a good combination because the color is too low for VS1 or vis versa. Therefore there is no market for this kind of diamond now or in the future. Does anyone have any comments about "warped" diamonds that is commenly quoted on their website? Based on their calculations, every single diamond is warped.

Would your opinion about the J/VS1 combination change if it was an Eightstar diamond? What about your thoughts of J color in an Eightstar? Can you safely say it actually looks whiter than a non-eightstar? Any thoughts about setting this in platinum, too yellow?

What is the fair price for this stone 1.63 ct J VSI Depth 60.2 Table 55 Crown ht 15.0 Crown angle 33.8 Pavillion Depth 42.6 Pavillion angle 40.7 Girdle med to slightly thick. Does the angles match? Face up you cant tell any difference from this J to a E. Would you price this differently if I say it is an ideal cut and if I say it is an branded diamond or an eigthstar? Do anyone have a price range, high/low???

How well will this do on the HCA? Does this mean anything if it does score well?

Would anyone buy this stone if price wasnt an issue, is it a top notch stone?

Thank You!!!

 

[pqcollectibles]

Hi Diamond Island!

Welcome to Price Scope!!

First thing,.......... Forget Fred C. and "warped" diamonds. The only warp you need is Warp Speed to run as fast as you can away from Fred C.

The specs you posted scored very well on the HCA. (Disclaimer that the girdle of the diamond is a bit thicker than the 1.2% that the HCA automatically uses.) Using the specs you posted, I got 0.6, TIC, Ex/Ex/Ex/Ex. That's a fabulous score!! This diamond has real potential to be a great performer.

Pricing,.......... The 8* name carries a hefty premium. I have read that the 8* name could mean as much as 40% over some other branded and unbranded H&A's. I, personally would go for a diamond that was comparable in performance, without the premium of the 8* name. But buying a diamond is laced with emotion. If part of you loves the name, or the idea of the name, and it's within your budget, go for it.

The J, VS color/clarity combo,.......... I have seen David Atlas, appraiser extraordinaire from www.gemappraisers.com say the same thing. That the low color combined with the high clarity is not a desireable market combination. The VS clarity commands a premium that the J color will not justify in the minds of many people.

Mounting metal color,........... Yes, you can mount a well cut, J color diamond in white metal, even platinum. Here's a pic of my 1.25 carat, J color, A Cut Above H&A from White Flash, set in platinum.

Buying a diamond is also a balancing act of compromises. You have to pick and choose which of the C's you are willing to give on, in order to get on other C's. I would not sacrifice CUT, and I wanted at least the size of a well cut 1.15 carat (6.8mm or so in diameter). I was considering a 1.15 carat H/SI1 and a 1.15 carat I/SI1 color diamonds. With the 1.25 carat J, I got a bigger diamond, for less money, and I didn't have to sacrifice CUT.

 

[Dancing Fire]

diamondisland,

give wink(at Winfield's) a call. he's one of the feature vendor on this site. he carries both 8* and venus by infinity brand. they're both beautiful diamonds in different ways. i'm sure wink can give you good advice.

 

[Magnum]

What do you guys think about the color/clarity combination of J and VS1. According to Fred from diamondcuttersintl.com they said this is not a good combination because the color is too low for VS1 or vis versa. Therefore there is no market for this kind of diamond now or in the future.

Fred's logic is flawed. Are you planning on selling this diamond at any point in the near future? Most people do not buy diamonds as an investment, but for personal enjoyment. And even if they were buying it as an investment, there's no proof that his criteria for matching color and clarity guarantees a better return on your investment. Assuming that you are buying it for your own pleasure, people do not fit into neat little molds. Some people value high clarity over color, and some the reverse. That doesn't even take into account their criteria for cut. In some cultures, there's a premium placed on the "flawlessness" of the diamond, so it's not surprising that clarity may be more important than color. And while generally, colorless (DEF) is more highly valued, some people actually prefer a hint of color in their diamonds and like the way it looks better next to their skin. In my opinion, color/clarity is a personal preference kind of thing, and as long as your educated on the differences between the different grades, neither Fred, nor anyone else, can tell you four preference is wrong.

Does anyone have any comments about 'warped' diamonds that is commenly quoted on their website? Based on their calculations, every single diamond is warped.

Fred's math is warped. He relies on a consumer's lack of knowledge to come up with stuff that seems to make logical sense, but in reality is flawed. The reason the numbers never add up is because the thickness of a girdle goes around a diamond like a wave and the standard is to measure the max/min thickness at the low point (troughs) of the waves, and not the high points (crests), which is something he doesn't tell you. The crown and pavilion are measured from the "crests" of the girdle, but the actual girdle thickness is measured at the "troughs", so the numbers will never add up. The only lab that actually measures the girdle at the "crests", I think, is the HRD, but they are mostly used in europe. Goodoldgold has a great explanation in their tutorial about the fallacy of the "warped" theory, and if you do a search on Fred here at procescope, you'll find a lot more info.

Would your opinion about the J/VS1 combination change if it was an Eightstar diamond? What about your thoughts of J color in an Eightstar? Can you safely say it actually looks whiter than a non-eightstar? Any thoughts about setting this in platinum, too yellow?

Ideal cut diamonds, whether they're eightstar or not, will tend to "face-up" whiter than average cut stones simply because the superior light return masks the body color of the diamond when viewed in the face up position. It probably will not change the appearance of color from the bottom or side, but most of the time the diamond is going to be viewed from the top, anyway, so that's usually the most important unless it's in a very open setting that exposes a lot of the side and bottom of the stone.

Many people have set J color stones in platinum and are happy with it. One other thing to consider is that as you go down the color scale, the range for each grade gets bigger, so while all most F color stones will look very similar, one J color stone might look closer to an I while another might look closer to a K, so it might be worthwhile to ask how "good" a J it is, and whether it's closer to an I or a K.

What is the fair price for this stone 1.63 ct J VSI Depth 60.2 Table 55 Crown ht 15.0 Crown angle 33.8 Pavillion Depth 42.6 Pavillion angle 40.7 Girdle med to slightly thick. Does the angles match? Face up you cant tell any difference from this J to a E. Would you price this differently if I say it is an ideal cut and if I say it is an branded diamond or an eigthstar? Do anyone have a price range, high/low???

For a good price range, do a search on Pricescope's homepage for diamonds of similar carat, color, clarity, and if possible, cut. that should give you a good idea. Eightstars will generally be more expensive than other ideal cut diamonds of similar size/color/clarity. I think it's something like a 40% premium for an eightstar, but I'm not sure about the exact number. Only you can decide if the premium is worth it to you.

How well will this do on the HCA? Does this mean anything if it does score well?

HCA score of 0.6 with all excellent grades for brilliance/fire/scintillation/spread. While the HCA does not take into account several factors, it does suggest that this diamond has the potential to be a very well cut diamond. The HCA is best used as a sorting tool, and in my opinion, the results say that the diamonds is not one that should be ruled out, but instead, should be given further examination to determine if the cut is as good as the HCA suggests is possible.

Would anyone buy this stone if price wasnt an issue, is it a top notch stone?

My personal preference would be to drop a little in clarity to a VS2 or a really "eye-clean" SI1, and in return, go up on the color scale, to hopefully an H or if possible, sacrifice a little size, as well, for a G. But that's just my opinion.

Best of luck in your search.