Help with a < 1.0 ct diamond decision

[JohnnyHands]

Hello all, I've been lurking around here for a bit, reading the guides and discussions on different diamonds. I never would've imagined how much I could learn, and how many people contribute to this site. So thank you to everyone who has helped me out, whether they know it or not.

Now that I am in the final stages of making my decision, I was hoping to get a better opinion from the users here on a stone less than 1.0 ct. I have kept my search standards fairly high (SI1 - VS2 clarity, E - G colour, and GIA XXX), but I want to know if at this size I would be better to open that range up more to perhaps discover and even more amazing stone.

I am going to post links to each of the stones that I am considering (3 around 0.6ct, and 4 around 0.7-0.75ct.), and I would appreciate any comments or criticism in this decision. Perhaps I'm way off the mark in what I've chosen, however I have done my best with the reasearch I have done so far.

Thanks in advance!

~0.60 ct
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2680249.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2890077.htm?source=pricescope
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...carat-e-color-vs1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-73669

0.70 - 0.76 ct.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...-e-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-233537
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...arat-e-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-107850
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...-f-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-189747
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-242181

 

[JohnnyHands]

Budget is a bit of a moving target right now. I would like to keep the diamond between $3500 and $3800, and that will give me some room to work with for a nice setting/mount that I have been working on with a designer. That said, if there is an absolute stunner that is just outside that range, I'll definitely consider it.

 

[TC1987]

H would definitely look white enough to me in that size range. There are some "eyeclean" (enough) SI2 diamonds out there, but they are most likely to be the ones that vendors have in-house, as opposed to must be called in.

James Allen doesn't have all of those stones in-house. I am not sure whether they even designate what they have vs. what's at a cutter.

Also, clarity is graded face-up. If you want eyeclean from the sides or at a tilt, be sure to verify that with the vendor before buying. How vendors define eyeclean and at what distance varies, too. Ask questions.

 

[RockyRacoon]

If you decide to stretch your budget a little, check out these options, as well (all below $5k).

All of these are AWESOME cuts -

.71ct, H:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.711-h-vs1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104064190002

.75ct, F:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.751-f-si1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104066186028

.8ct, F:
http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-default&id=17

.94ct, H:
http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-default&id=20

 

[JohnnyHands]

If you decide to stretch your budget a little, check out these options, as well (all below $5k).

All of these are AWESOME cuts -

.71ct, H:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.711-h-vs1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104064190002

.75ct, F:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/0.751-f-si1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104066186028

.8ct, F:
http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-default&id=17

.94ct, H:
http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=view-id-diamond-default&id=20

Thanks for these diamonds, I just took a look. My only hesitation is the strong fluorescence of the first two. I couldn't agree more that they are all beautifully cut, but while we're talking about it how much should I be concerned about fluorescence? I have been avoiding any up until now.

 

[RockyRacoon]

Thanks for these diamonds, I just took a look. My only hesitation is the strong fluorescence of the first two. I couldn't agree more that they are all beautifully cut, but while we're talking about it how much should I be concerned about fluorescence? I have been avoiding any up until now.

Fluorescence RARELY has a negative effect. It does happen, but it is definitely a minority of stones that possess fluor.

Personally, I prefer a stone that exhibits this property.

The ones from Brian Gavin are selected specifically to not have any negative effects from the fluor. These are all hand-picked, so you don't need to worry about the issue when purchasing one of these stones.

If you go a different route, just ask the vendor to verify there are no hazy/milky characteristics from the fluor.

Bottom line - don't be afraid of fluorescence!

 

[JohnnyHands]

H would definitely look white enough to me in that size range. There are some "eyeclean" (enough) SI2 diamonds out there, but they are most likely to be the ones that vendors have in-house, as opposed to must be called in.

James Allen doesn't have all of those stones in-house. I am not sure whether they even designate what they have vs. what's at a cutter.

Also, clarity is graded face-up. If you want eyeclean from the sides or at a tilt, be sure to verify that with the vendor before buying. How vendors define eyeclean and at what distance varies, too. Ask questions.

Thanks for those couple of points about the in-house stones, and also about asking the vendor about whether stones are eye-clean from all angles.

Just tried my search again looking only for in-house diamonds, and the results were definitely different. Came across this stone, and was quite impressed.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2983073.htm?source=pricescope
Thoughts?

I will have to talk to the vendor and get more information, but the A Cut Above diamonds have been well spoken of from what I've seen so far.

 

[mcosme]

You cannot go wrong with that ACA stone!

I wouldn't be scared of fluorescence - it's extremely rare for them to have negative effects. I have two fluorescent stones and I actually prefer them. The fluorescence hardly affects the stone - but does make it appear whiter under some lighting.

Here's a few suggestions within your budget
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.73-carat-g-color-si2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-72868
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.81-carat-g-color-si2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-72934
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.80-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-205683
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.80-carat-g-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-242820

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2983070.htm
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2986180.htm

 

[Niel]

Sometimes florescence makes a stone have a milky appearance in daylight I would avoid that at all costs but not all strong flour stones have that affect so you have to see the stone personally in daylight equilavant lighting or go for medium florescence or better.

I would try and get an 80 ptr its a great size price per carat jumps at 70 alot and also above 90 while the 80ptr range is a little sweet spot in size vs price ratio. High color and SI1 .

Here's a slip that came with one of my gia certs with my e ring..... hopefully its readable, as I'm too lazy to transcribe. Basically though says only about less than 0.2% show that milkiness, and most people like the way fluor effects stones.

 

[Niel]

It is usually the 2 percent that end up being sold on the internet because they are problem stones , like most stones on the internet.

.2% not 2% .....

And that seems to be an ignorant statement about a method of buying diamonds if your saying buying from reputable online vendors will only get you problem stones......

 

[JulieN]

It is usually the 2 percent that end up being sold on the internet because they are problem stones , like most stones on the internet.

0.2%

 

[Niel]

From personal experience I know that more than .2 percent of diamonds with strong florescence have a milky appearence ive seen thousands of stones like this the gia study tested consumers to see if they can tell the difference but they cant tell the difference between a cz or a diamond either so why would they be able to see it ?

I trust GIA on this one.

OP, reputable online vendor can tell you of the specific stone you like has negative fluor effect. Pick one you like, don't worry about if it will be milky, just make sure to ask just to be on the safe side.

 

[hawk25]

It is usually the 2 percent that end up being sold on the internet because they are problem stones , like most stones on the internet.

.2% not 2% .....

And that seems to be an ignorant statement about a method of buying diamonds if your saying buying from reputable online vendors will only get you problem stones......

+1
A blanket statement that most stones on the internet are problem stones is very misleading, especially since the OP is looking at reputable online vendors.

I like the 0.758 G SI1 from WF the OP posted very much, just remember to ask WF if it's eye clean to your standards, including the viewing distance (ex: 6 inches from all sides). You can ask to get WF's gemologists to take a look at the stone again to check (I did just that with mine). In addition to the PS discount, there's another $50 discount by registering with them (I think you have to register anyways), just ask them.

 

[JohnnyHands]

I wish there were a way to express my gratitude for all the help and insight so far. Thanks so much to everyone who has been constructive. I hope that this thread can continue to formulate useful conversation, especially for stones less than 1.0ct. While I'm no expert, I feel like different qualities become more/less important for smaller stones.

I will be sure to keep you all posted on my decision, and hopefully I will soon be able to show off the final product for all to see. PS has amazed me with their helpfulness... far superior to any other forum I have been a part of. Keep it up, it is appreciated!

 

[hawk25]

I wish there were a way to express my gratitude for all the help and insight so far. Thanks so much to everyone who has been constructive. I hope that this thread can continue to formulate useful conversation, especially for stones less than 1.0ct. While I'm no expert, I feel like different qualities become more/less important for smaller stones.

I will be sure to keep you all posted on my decision, and hopefully I will soon be able to show off the final product for all to see. PS has amazed me with their helpfulness... far superior to any other forum I have been a part of. Keep it up, it is appreciated!

Just wanted to add that if you were planning any of the stones suggested here soon, it's best to ask the vendor to put them on hold. There's no charge for this, although with WF they might ask for a credit card # to do so (no commitment though, I've done it before) I've heard there's a tendency for lurkers to read the threads and buy the recommended stones. Best of luck with the purchase!

 

[Niel]

How about this cutie. Good cut and color and hits the 6mm mark. (Its cheaper if you ask for a PS discount and pay by wire)

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.81-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-247828

 

[JohnnyHands]

How about this cutie. Good cut and color and hits the 6mm mark. (Its cheaper if you ask for a PS discount and pay by wire)

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.81-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-247828

I thought that getting your help would make this decision easier, but all these awesome stones are making it even more difficult! Thank you very much though, I will have to look into this one and pick a few for James Allen to compare for me.

I'm currently talking with Whiteflash, and it is amazing how helpful the live chat can be.

Thanks again!

 

[TC1987]

It is usually the 2 percent that end up being sold on the internet because they are problem stones , like most stones on the internet.

Okay, I might concede that most stones on the Internet (which is mighty large place ) might be problem stones. But most stones that Pricescope vendors offer and PS buyers purchase are shown in this SMTB thread and do not appear to be anything other than the utmost best. [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/the-forum-engagement-ring-folder-eye-candy.5429/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/the-forum-engagement-ring-folder-eye-candy.5429/[/URL] But you might perhaps disagree.

 

[TC1987]

I'd probably buy from GOG or WF or BG before James Allen. I have actually bought 2 diamonds from GOG. They have a great buyback and upgrade policy, if you need to sell it or upgrade it later. I have dealt with Brian Gavin, too, and had a good experience. JA, well, seems more iffy, but might be okay if upgrades are not important.

BC2 Jewels has been quiet lately, but they were doing a fantastic job last Fall and around Christmas of getting buyers good diamonds on tighter budgets. I was considering buying a larger diamond and asking them for quotes, but I am just not seeing any huge profit sharing payments come in here to pay for it, lol.

 

[JohnnyHands]

I'd probably buy from GOG or WF or BG before James Allen. I have actually bought 2 diamonds from GOG. They have a great buyback and upgrade policy, if you need to sell it or upgrade it later. I have dealt with Brian Gavin, too, and had a good experience. JA, well, seems more iffy, but might be okay if upgrades are not important.

BC2 Jewels has been quiet lately, but they were doing a fantastic job last Fall and around Christmas of getting buyers good diamonds on tighter budgets. I was considering buying a larger diamond and asking them for quotes, but I am just not seeing any huge profit sharing payments come in here to pay for it, lol.

I have been leaning strongly towards WF after my experience today, however the quality of BG's site has also made me want to explore them further. I feel like the search could go on forever, so perhaps it is best to choose one vendor and compare their stones, so that I can take advantage of their trained gemologists to review the stones in person for me.

What are typical taxes and fees faced when shipping over the border? I'm located in Toronto, Ontario so these would be coming from TX if I go with WF.

 

[hawk25]

I actually just bought a ring from WF and shipped it to Canada (shipped it to a friend in Calgary to save 8% tax). It left in the evening, and arrived in Calgary early morning the next day, which was impressive. I got a call from Fedex for my CC information to pay the taxes, which was the (amount converted to CAD from USD) x (provincial tax) + ($10 brokerage fee).

Surprisingly, I didn't have to fill out the FedEx power of attorney forms others mentioned I had to fill out, I just had to email them stating the tracking number and that I authorize them to clear the package. Perhaps they've changed things recently to help speed up the customs process? A day after it cleared customs, it was ready to be picked up, so 2 days in total.

All in all, it was pretty simple, you have nothing to worry about.

 

[JohnnyHands]

I actually just bought a ring from WF and shipped it to Canada (shipped it to a friend in Calgary to save 8% tax). It left in the evening, and arrived in Calgary early morning the next day, which was impressive. I got a call from Fedex for my CC information to pay the taxes, which was the (amount converted to CAD from USD) x (provincial tax) + ($10 brokerage fee).

Surprisingly, I didn't have to fill out the FedEx power of attorney forms others mentioned I had to fill out, I just had to email them stating the tracking number and that I authorize them to clear the package. Perhaps they've changed things recently to help speed up the customs process? A day after it cleared customs, it was ready to be picked up, so 2 days in total.

All in all, it was pretty simple, you have nothing to worry about.

The quote that I just received from WF does not show any taxes on the purchase. Am I missing something here, or are the only taxes that I have to pay the provincial sales taxes of wherever it is being shipped to? WF doesn't have any taxes?

Really great to hear that the shipping is quick though!

 

[hawk25]

The quote that I just received from WF does not show any taxes on the purchase. Am I missing something here, or are the only taxes that I have to pay the provincial sales taxes of wherever it is being shipped to? WF doesn't have any taxes?

Really great to hear that the shipping is quick though!

WF themselves don't charge any taxes, its an 'out of state' sale so they leave it up to the states (or in this case, provinces) to charge the taxes. If you have any friends/relatives living in Alberta, I highly suggest shipping it to them and redirecting it to you. I saved around $400, so I could have flown there, picked it up myself, visit the Rockies, and flown back, essentially getting a free trip.

 

[JohnnyHands]

So I have put a hold on the ACA stone from WF that I came across, and as I was looking at the AGS report I noticed that it indicates feather inclusions within the stone. The diamond is listed as "eye clean" however should I be worried about these inclusions?

I have read elsewhere on here that the feather inclusions won't really make the diamond weaker, and that there is nothing to be concerned about. If anyone has a second to look at the report and let me know their thoughts I'd really appreciate it. Thanks.

http://www.agslab.com/pdf_sync_reports/104066317019-PGRH.PDF

 

[JohnnyHands]

Follow-up question to my previous... WF has discussed insuring the diamond before having it set. I am having the setting done by a family friend, so what is the general rule of thumb with this process regarding insuring the stone? Thanks

 

[hawk25]

The feathers shouldn't be a problem, unless they are right at the surface or on the girdle. Ask the WF gemologist whether it poses any structural integrity risk, they'll give an honest opinion. You should be clear with WF on your definition of eye clean so you're on the same page.

As for the insurance, I highly suggest it, unless your family friend puts it in writing that they will fully reimburse you if they damage the stone (IMO there's extra problems of dealing with a family friend). A lot of companies won't insure a loose stone, but companies like Jewelers Mutual (Perfect Circle) will insure it while it's being set. JM has a partnership with WF so it's a simpler process, but I'd ask them specifically about the insurance for it being set.

 

[ecf8503]

Sometimes florescence makes a stone have a milky appearance in daylight I would avoid that at all costs but not all strong flour stones have that affect so you have to see the stone personally in daylight equilavant lighting or go for medium florescence or better..

Ummm.... what? Fluor has a negative effect in 0.2% of stones that exhibit the effect. That is a very broad (and somewhat confrontational and offensive) blanket statement to make.

(I know the thread has progressed from this point, but it bothers me)

 

[JohnnyHands]

The feathers shouldn't be a problem, unless they are right at the surface or on the girdle. Ask the WF gemologist whether it poses any structural integrity risk, they'll give an honest opinion. You should be clear with WF on your definition of eye clean so you're on the same page.

As for the insurance, I highly suggest it, unless your family friend puts it in writing that they will fully reimburse you if they damage the stone (IMO there's extra problems of dealing with a family friend). A lot of companies won't insure a loose stone, but companies like Jewelers Mutual (Perfect Circle) will insure it while it's being set. JM has a partnership with WF so it's a simpler process, but I'd ask them specifically about the insurance for it being set.

I don't know if this thread is the proper place to discuss the bolded statement above, but I would definitely like to hear your take on this matter. I will admist that it HAS created some issues, however nothing that hasn't been worked through and rectified in a civil manner. I'd like to know what to avoid though moving forward. My biggest concern is that if the setting isn't exactly what I was hoping for then I will be stuck trying to negotiate something with someone who I have personal ties to rather than a stranger.