Help! Not sure how much/where to sell my diamond.

[makhro82]

I would like to upgrade in the upcoming months and would like to get as much for my stone as possible to help with that. I got the stone from ERD back in 2011 and it was an upgrade from my .90 H so I can't upgrade again, only sell. Here are the specs and one semi-decent picture. The stone is eye-clean and faces up very white per Mark T. when originally purchased. The grade making inclusion is covered by a prong. You do get some color from the side. What do you think would be a good asking price for such a stone? I've considered GOG and JBeg but the consignments fees may be a little too steep for my sad pockets. Ideally I'd like to go to a 1.6ish J.

From the GIA cert:

ROUND BRILLIANT

Measurements 6.70 - 6.73 x 4.17 mm
Carat Weight 1.16 carat
Color Grade J
Clarity Grade SI1
Cut Grade Very Good

PROPORTIONS

Depth 62.1 %
Table 57 %
Crown Angle 34.5°
Crown Height 14.5%
Pavilion Angle 41.0°
Pavilion Depth 43.0%
Star Length 55%
Lower Half 80%
Girdle Medium to Slightly Thick, Faceted, 4.5%
Culet None
Polish Very Good
Symmetry Excellent
Fluorescence None
Clarity Characteristics Crystal, Feather
COMMENTS
Clouds are not shown.

 

[momma2boys]

Hi - I'm not qualified or experienced enough to give you any pricing opinions, but I would suggest posting more pics from various angles. It might be hard for those who are able to give you an "idea" of a potential price if there are more views of the ring. Maybe not, but just a suggestion! Good luck!

Edit: Ooops, I re-read your post and it appears that you're just selling the diamond, right? More pics might not be necessary then. Sorry!

 

[makhro82]

Here's an additional picture if that helps. I looked into selling last year but didn't go through with it after much backlash from friends. Looks like pricing may have gone up so good thing they talked me out of it

PS. IDK how to rotate my pictures.

 

[arkieb1]

Try listing it on Loupetroop and Diamond Bistro first and mention it on the preloved section here. I don't really understand why won't ERD do another upgrade, especially if you are buying a bigger stone from them, have you asked? The JBEG girls or GOG might take it as a trade if you find something else on their site that could also be an option, if you don't want to consign it with them.

 

[makhro82]

Try listing it on Loupetroop and Diamond Bistro first and mention it on the preloved section here. I don't really understand why won't ERD do another upgrade, especially if you are buying a bigger stone from them, have you asked? The JBEG girls or GOG might take it as a trade if you find something else on their site that could also be an option, if you don't want to consign it with them.

I checked with Mark and only 1 upgrade per customer is allowed. With JBeg I can only consign. Grace estimated consigning for $5600-$5900 and the fee would be 15%.

I haven't checked with GOG. I will check with them tomorrow.

 

[arkieb1]

O.K try a listing on Loupetroop and Diamond Bistro and mentioning it on the preloved section here. You could keep lowering the price until you find someone that might be interested.

 

[kenny]

Here's something to keep in mind when pondering the pain of paying a consignment fee.
A good pro vendor can charge and get a higher price for the stone than you probably could as a private individual.
Buyers feel safer shelling out thousands of dollars to an established business, than to a private individual.

Also their listing will reach more eyeballs than your private ad.
They probably have better photography skills than you or I, and may also provide videos and cut tool analysis to lubricate the sale.
IOW, the diamond is the same but it comes across as more attractive and credible when a pro presents it to the world.

If you sell it yourself ... sure, you get to keep all the money but you may have to sell it at a price lower than what you would net after paying a commission to a pro.

Next, when selling a diamond speed and money are opposites.
If you want to sell it fast, price it low.
If you want to price it high plan on a long wait for a sale.

By consigning it you don't bear the risk of being robbed during the transaction as you would if you sell it privately.
Also I don't like the buyer getting my home address when I ship it in a private sale.

Good luck.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Try listing it on Loupetroop and Diamond Bistro first and mention it on the preloved section here. I don't really understand why won't ERD do another upgrade, especially if you are buying a bigger stone from them, have you asked? The JBEG girls or GOG might take it as a trade if you find something else on their site that could also be an option, if you don't want to consign it with them.

I checked with Mark and only 1 upgrade per customer is allowed. With JBeg I can only consign. Grace estimated consigning for $5600-$5900 and the fee would be 15%.

I haven't checked with GOG. I will check with them tomorrow.

The JBEG deal is a good one. I would check with GOG and see if their fee is any less if you do the upgrade with them once the ring is sold and you put all the money toward the upgrade. I know they do that when you consign a stone you bought from them. I do not think you'll get more selling it yourself. 15% is a decent consignment fee and most people are going to trust a vendor more than sending a stranger thousands of dollars. I do think most people here are looking for GIA XXX, so it might be a little harder to sell, although if GOG can show a good idealscope image, that might help sell it.

 

[ChristineRose]

Have you picked your upgrade out? Some jewelers are willing to buy a stone from you and apply the proceeds to a new stone. Sort of an unofficial upgrade. You might get a better net price this way as the buyer/seller ends up with a stone they can sell for more profit.

 

[Christina...]

Are you sure that the GIA cut grade is accurate? I'm curious as to what prevented the EX cut grade, the proportions appear to be in range. Do you know if there are girdle enhancements?

 

[makhro82]

Kenny: Those are great points that I have yet to consider. Consigning is sounding better and better.

ChristineRose: I haven't picked anything out yet as this is the first step in being able to finance the project.

Christina...: On the cert it is listed as Very Good. How would I know if there had been any girdle enhancements? Would it be listed on the certificate.

DiamondSeeker: I didn't know that everyone is after the TripleX only. That's good to know. I've only had two VG cuts and it will be interesting to see what the difference is between a VG and X. I think I'm going to take a look at some brick and mortars for comparisons. I need to find some in the Bay Area.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I should rephrase that to say that we usually recommend GIA Excellent cut here, and even that is a broad category with some stones better than others. I agree with Christina that I am not sure why your stone got a VG cut grade because the numbers can indicate Ex. It may be that your stone is fine, and the thing that most people are going to want to see to prove it is the idealscope image, which would make me lean towards GOG for the consignment.

 

[makhro82]

I should rephrase that to say that we usually recommend GIA Excellent cut here, and even that is a broad category with some stones better than others. I agree with Christina that I am not sure why your stone got a VG cut grade because the numbers can indicate Ex. It may be that your stone is fine, and the thing that most people are going to want to see to prove it is the idealscope image, which would make me lean towards GOG for the consignment.

Thanks for the reply. What are some things that would prevent it from making the "cut" for excellent (pun intended)? I feel bad that I have been a member of this site for years but still lack in the diamond education aspect. I come mostly to drool I emailed GOG but I didn't realize they were out of the office on Mondays.

 

[CharmyPoo]

Have you asked if ERD is willing to consign this stone for you? They may be at a lower fee given they won't upgrade your stone.

Honestly, will try listing it yourself first and seeing what happens. I recognize all the benefits of consignment through a pro but feedback I am hearing is that people consigning don't often achieve the benefits for the cost.

 

[makhro82]

Have you asked if ERD is willing to consign this stone for you? They may be at a lower fee given they won't upgrade your stone.

Honestly, will try listing it yourself first and seeing what happens. I recognize all the benefits of consignment through a pro but feedback I am hearing is that people consigning don't often achieve the benefits for the cost.

Trying to do it myself through DB or LoupeTroop for a set amount of time probably isn't a bad idea. I never considered asking ERD to consign it. I will check with Mark and see what he says. I still have my email out there to GOG. I'm looking to get the ball rolling. I've been up all night looking at K stones so I can get even more bang for my buck

 

[SB621]

I have cosigned a few things with Jbeg. They both took almost a year to sell for a price of less then what I wanted but at the same time I didn't want to wait any longer. I wish I had just kept them up on LT and DB. Though I love the ladies of Jbeg- I'm just not a fan of cosigning and will probably never do it again.

 

[makhro82]

I have cosigned a few things with Jbeg. They both took almost a year to sell for a price of less then what I wanted but at the same time I didn't want to wait any longer. I wish I had just kept them up on LT and DB. Though I love the ladies of Jbeg- I'm just not a fan of cosigning and will probably never do it again.

I'm going to get the diamond unset today so I can start listing and seeing where that takes me. Now how I have to figure out how to price this baby.

 

[VRBeauty]

Have you checked this out?

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-tutorial-how-to-sell-your-diamonds.186249/

 

[makhro82]

Are you sure that the GIA cut grade is accurate? I'm curious as to what prevented the EX cut grade, the proportions appear to be in range. Do you know if there are girdle enhancements?

Looks like there is something to this. I shipped the diamond off to GOG because I realized if I wanted top dollar I would have to consign even though it would cost me some dollars! Jonathan received it in the office today says that the cut grade may be off and once his Sarin machine is back in the office he'll scan it and see if it should be an excellent grade instead.

He said this, " Secondly ... Even if it does check out and still only qualifies for the VG cut grade it does have the best optics attainable within the VG (and I would also add) the Ex cut grade."

Thanks for the info!

 

[yssie]

Are you sure that the GIA cut grade is accurate? I'm curious as to what prevented the EX cut grade, the proportions appear to be in range. Do you know if there are girdle enhancements?

I assume 4.5% girdle thickness?
Bump it down to 4 in Facetware and it gets the EX expected from everything else. But this doc (apparently revised 2009) states that EX range is 2.5-4.5%... Unless it is non-inclusive?
http://www.diamondcut.gia.edu/pdfs/estimating-a-cut-grade-hires.pdf

 

[gemmyblond]

Hi makhro82 -- You mentioned that you might want to stop by a B&M in the Bay area to see some GIA 3EX stones in person. FYI, I was just at Joe Escobar Diamonds in Campbell (near San Jose) last weekend, and they had several in various sizes/colors so you might check them out if you're nearby. I worked with Erik there and he's terrific. I know there are many other Bay area jewelers who stock GIA 3EX stones, but just thought I'd mention Escobar as I think other PS'ers have had good experiences there too, and I know he had a number of GIA XXX stones (as well as at least one AGS 0, too). Good luck!

 

[Christina...]

Are you sure that the GIA cut grade is accurate? I'm curious as to what prevented the EX cut grade, the proportions appear to be in range. Do you know if there are girdle enhancements?

I assume 4.5% girdle thickness?
Bump it down to 4 in Facetware and it gets the EX expected from everything else. But this doc (apparently revised 2009) states that EX range is 2.5-4.5%... Unless it is non-inclusive?
http://www.diamondcut.gia.edu/pdfs/estimating-a-cut-grade-hires.pdf

Ah! According to the link you provided it does appear as though it was knocked for girdle thickness. I'm still sort of confused though because I thought that GIA based it's girdle measurements on the thinnest and thickest points, so even if this particular stones girdle measured 4.5% at any point, regardless of amount, and the remainder was under 4% it would still have been knocked to a VG? Isn't it true that in some cases the girdle thickness is adjusted to make an inclusion less obvious...not always to increase weight in order to achieve the increased weight premium? If that is true, wouldn't this make it increasingly difficult to tell if an otherwise great stone has been downgraded for reasons that would otherwise be considered beneficial to the stones overall appearance or performance?

BTW I have updates for you. I'll try to get an email off in the next day or two.

 

[yssie]

I hope Makhro comes back with GOG's evaluation - I'll be really interested to see what the verdict is... That link confuses me because it reads like 4.5% is within EX range, unless there's some fine print somewhere that I'm missing - or it's in the GIA Lab Manual they suggest referencing?

I have no updates for you - which is sorta an update by itself. But I owe you one and I want yours!

 

[Christina...]

I hope Makhro comes back with GOG's evaluation - I'll be really interested to see what the verdict is... That link confuses me because it reads like 4.5% is within EX range, unless there's some fine print somewhere that I'm missing - or it's in the GIA Lab Manual they suggest referencing?

I have no updates for you - which is sorta an update by itself. But I owe you one and I want yours!

If your interested, I just checked out the referenced link. http://www.diamondcut.gia.edu/10_learn_more.html#research There is a PDF called culet and girdle assessment, but I can't figure out how to link it here. I need to go back and read it more carefully but a quick skim didn't offer a clear answer...or at least I didn't find it. I'm hoping for an update of Jonathon's findings too. I've sometimes been puzzled by some of the stones that GIA includes in it's EX cut category and by others that have been excluded.

Hhmm, now I'm curious as to why you don't have any updates! I'll get an email off to you asap.

 

[makhro82]

Hi Yssie and Christina:

His Sarin machine hasn't been returned yet so no update. As soon as I hear something I'll update. It's weird that this "VG" has the best optics even for an excellent cut but is rated VG. Is that common? I'll attach the images that I've received thus far.

 

[Christina...]

Most people here believe that GIAs EX cut category is too broad, and I agree. It includes proportions that AGS excludes, but GIA also excludes some proportions that AGS might include in it's ideal category, although AGS's grading isn't really proportion based but rather performance based. GIA also knocks stones that they consider to have extensive girdle enhancements (painting/digging) that AGS would otherwise still consider AGS0 candidates. That's why I had initially asked if your particular stone may have had either or these. But based on the images provided it has not. So it could be that Yssie was correct in thinking that it was the girdle thickness, but I haven't been able to find anything conclusive that would rule out a 4.5% girdle as an EX candidate.

I'm especially interested in what Jonathon has to say because I also own a GIA VG that would be an AGS1 (knocked for VG polish) candidate and haven't been able to determine why exactly the grade was applied the way it was by GIA. I've often considered submitting the stone to AGS to see how it came back, but as of yet, haven't done so. I'm guessing that my stones grade was based on the averaging and rounding of it's proportions but I really don't know that for sure so it's a guess at best. My stone also performs better than many other ideal cuts that I've done side by side comparisons with. So, I'm stumped! However, when buying online I still believe that the 'safer' alternative is to consider only GIA EX or AGS0 stones, but with lots of information and professional guidance, I believe that there are some stones out there that GIA excludes that are definitely superior performers....sort of like those eye clean I1's....they are few and far between but they CAN be found if you look long and hard enough and have some assistance along the way.

 

[makhro82]

Mark T. of ERD picked this one for me and the prior one he picked was a sparkler too. It always amazes me how knowledgeable everyone here is. I can't even attempt to buy a stone without the help of everyone here and Mark. My budget for my new stone just shrunk quite a bit so I don't think I'll be able to buy anything at retail with him, I'll have to stick to resell. Hopefully some of you lovely people can help guide me through that process too.

 

[Christina...]

There are some people here that have mad skillz finding gorgeous stones and fabulous deals on the secondary market. I have no doubt that we will find you a gorgeous stone very close to what you are hoping for. I think I recently read that if you consign with GOG and then apply the funds of the sale toward a new stone through them that they will reduce their commission....so that might be an option. If you discuss with Jon what it is that you want and what your budget is, he could probably start keeping an eye out for you and notify you when a great option comes up.

Have you considered old cuts? They have increased in popularity tenfold over the past few years and it's getting more difficult to find a fabulous deal, but many people have and they are out there, so that might be something to consider if you find them as charming and beautiful as many of us here do. I have no doubt that if you keep your needs/wants a bit flexible that we will be able to find you an absolutely perfect stone. It's going to be fun watching your journey unfold!

 

[makhro82]

That's true Christina about GOG and their commission but my max budget would be around $5200. Life happened and I had to reduce my budget I want to go as big as possible with this upgrade but keep the sparkle and clarity. I have been looking at old cuts. I'm very interested in one listed in the Preloved section. I'm hoping that one will work out. I put up a WTB post over there too so if anyone sees anything or has anything please feel free to post

 

[yssie]

Are you sure that the GIA cut grade is accurate? I'm curious as to what prevented the EX cut grade, the proportions appear to be in range. Do you know if there are girdle enhancements?

I assume 4.5% girdle thickness?
Bump it down to 4 in Facetware and it gets the EX expected from everything else. But this doc (apparently revised 2009) states that EX range is 2.5-4.5%... Unless it is non-inclusive?
http://www.diamondcut.gia.edu/pdfs/estimating-a-cut-grade-hires.pdf

Ah! According to the link you provided it does appear as though it was knocked for girdle thickness. I'm still sort of confused though because I thought that GIA based it's girdle measurements on the thinnest and thickest points, so even if this particular stones girdle measured 4.5% at any point, regardless of amount, and the remainder was under 4% it would still have been knocked to a VG? Isn't it true that in some cases the girdle thickness is adjusted to make an inclusion less obvious...not always to increase weight in order to achieve the increased weight premium? If that is true, wouldn't this make it increasingly difficult to tell if an otherwise great stone has been downgraded for reasons that would otherwise be considered beneficial to the stones overall appearance or performance?

BTW I have updates for you. I'll try to get an email off in the next day or two.

I know that w/ GIA "girdle thickness" percentage is measured at the eight kite/main junctions and reported as a percent of diameter, whereas the "thin/med/slthk/etc." descriptions are descriptions of the thinnest and thickest valleys only, and that according to GIA's documentation the valleys are usually ~1.7% thinner than the reported "girdle thickness" percentage barring brillianteering... vs AGSL's "thin/med/etc." that describe the thinnest and thickest points anywhere around the girdle, not just at the valleys.
But I can't find anything that states definitively whether a 4.5% girdle thickness is a disqualifier for the EX grade. Facetware seems to indicate as much but the charts do not, and Facetware has disclaimers stating that results may not match GIA's official verdict, and yeah - the Culet and Girdle Assessment is not helpful!! I'm tempted to just call in on Monday. Or maybe we'll get lucky and one of our tradepeople will see this.
Curiouser and curiouser

ETA: Report makhro posted in an old thread: