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Help me with an engagement ring choice

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Jonathan360

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
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Hey everybody. So I just joined and finally realized I was in over my head in purchasing a diamond engagement ring. I went to a reputable internet dealer and bought a diamond. It was EGL certified 1.01 ct J color, very good cut VS1. Well I got it for a great price but found out tlater when they got it in it didn't pass their requirements and didn't look like a J color diamond to them and their independent gemologists. Again this is a very reputable company and I paid a very good price for it. But now I need a different one to buy.

So now I have some choices as to what I want to get. I have an option to get a bigger 1.20ct very good cut J color diamond with VS2 clarity. Good for polish and very good for symmetry.

But my concern is with the flourescence. This one is GIA certified and they say it has a very strong blue florescence to it. I've done all the reading online and have read that people say with lower color diamonds such as the J color, the very strong blue is okay and actually preferred and may even add extra value to the diamond. I'm simply worried. As I said, I've read all I could, and wanted some final thoughts from members of this site. Part of why I like this diamond is the size I have to admit. 1.20 seems fairly big atleast to me and my budget. $4300 for the diamond alone.

If not that first, I'm looking at another diamond which is a GIA certified 1.00ct very good cut I color VS2 diamond. I don't know about the florescence or polish/symmetry however. The price is $350 less than the previous strong blue diamond.

Finally, I have one other option. It is a 1.10ct very good cut I color VS1. Obviously being I colored and a VS1, this diamond is $560 more than the first. It has no florescence and is good and good for polish and symmetry.

I want to get the best bang for the buck but not get a piece of trash either. I want to spend but also am on a budget. The strong blue is the one I prefer in terms of size and value, but wanted to know what everyone felt. I don't have a choice of seeing the three together in person, so that is not an option at this point. Return policy on the rings are great however, but I'd prefer to get it and live with it. Thanks for the help everybody and wish me luck, I'm already stressed out knowing I can't have my engagement ring on time for the "big night." Now I have to change all my plans and still need the ring.....Also if anybody has some recommendations as to where I can get a decent priced diamond/ring, that would be beneficial to me too. Thank you once more. God Bless.

Jonathan
 
I guess my budget is around $4500-$5000. Well I know about SI1 giving me more options, but how big of a difference will it be with the inclusions compared to a VS1 or VS2? From what I know of my girlfriend, she's not necessarily into big diamonds as she is into nicer diamonds as in better clarity and better color. But obviously I figured if I could get a bigger diamond that was fairly good with clarity and color it would be extra special.

Unless I can be talked into an SI1, which I want to hear more about, I think it's down to these three diamonds for the engagement ring. But again I'm always listening and want to learn as much as I can.
 
Well, you''re already at the low end of the nearly colorless range, and the low end of cut. You should consider focusing on ideal cuts.
 
Well how big of a difference are we talking about between very good cut and ideal cut? I didn't know that very good cut was at the low end. THe dealership I have has fair, good, very good, and ideal cuts. I know depending on the dealer there is an even higher cut than ideal. But even then, wouldn't that mean very good is in the middle and not the end? Or am I wrong?

THey do have ideal cuts with SI1 and VS2 obviously. I guess it would help if I had advice on what each of the 4 C's should be. As in for the best diamond in my range what should each C be. Like an Ideal Cut, SI1, I Color. Or in some order of importance that I should go by. Like CUt first or clarity first or color first, and which C I can sacrifice a little on. As I said I read quite a bit, but opinions varied. I don't need carat though, it'd help if I could type in the 3 remaining C's and see what they have available in my price range for that particular type of diamond.

The site says that cut is considered by many gemologists to be the most important. It seems like based on you telling me ideal, that may be the first thing to base my diamond on. Again if that is correct I will start with ideal and go from there.
 
I also tried a diamond calculator site to assess the value of the different diamonds. How accurate are those if at all?
 
Each diamond has to be assessed individually, labels such as Ideal cut, Premium etc don't always mean much the way some vendors use them. Always make cut your top priority, it is the most important. Colour I feel is the next and then clarity.

Strong blue fluorescence rarely has an adverse affect, and some feel it can help a lower colour face up whiter. Fluorescence has many fans here and some who prefer not to have it, it is an individual choice. Which diamond calculator did you use?

Have you looked at the diamond Julie posted? That is exactly the type of thing to look for, it will make your search much easier.
 
Date: 4/28/2007 5:24:17 AM
Author: Jonathan360
Well how big of a difference are we talking about between very good cut and ideal cut? I didn't know that very good cut was at the low end. THe dealership I have has fair, good, very good, and ideal cuts. I know depending on the dealer there is an even higher cut than ideal. But even then, wouldn't that mean very good is in the middle and not the end? Or am I wrong?

THey do have ideal cuts with SI1 and VS2 obviously. I guess it would help if I had advice on what each of the 4 C's should be. As in for the best diamond in my range what should each C be. Like an Ideal Cut, SI1, I Color. Or in some order of importance that I should go by. Like CUt first or clarity first or color first, and which C I can sacrifice a little on. As I said I read quite a bit, but opinions varied. I don't need carat though, it'd help if I could type in the 3 remaining C's and see what they have available in my price range for that particular type of diamond.

The site says that cut is considered by many gemologists to be the most important. It seems like based on you telling me ideal, that may be the first thing to base my diamond on. Again if that is correct I will start with ideal and go from there.
Click to expand...
Well, you would have to post the proportions. Some VG cuts could be very nice, and some would suck. What I mean is that you are at the low end of acceptable. "Good" cuts and lower should probably not be considered.

I've already posted an ideal, I SI1. Around here, cut first, color second, clarity third (as long as it's eyeclean and presents no durability problems.)

I think I know what calculator you're talking about. The one I'm thinking of is complete crap.
 
I don't yet know all the rules of posting, I know some sites don't allow this. But the calc I went to I googled it and it was the first site.

http://www.washingtondiamond.com/calc.php was the one I used. I don't know how well that site or calculator is but that's what I've been using. Also I did look at the diamond you posted. My thing is that I prefer to deal with my company because of the problem from the first diamond, they're willing to help me out with the second. Based on that diamond I guess I will try and see if they have something similar.

In terms of similar to what you showed me, I found a 1.06 ct ideal I color SI1 with dimensions for table at 58% and depth at 62.1% (4.04 mm) priced at about $4000. width of 6.49mm and length of 6.52mm. The florescence has it as a strong blue.

And as for dimensions as you mentioned of the original with a VG cut. It's table is at 58% and depth is 62.4% (4.25mm). Width of 6.79mm and length of 6.83mm.

And again the actual diamond is a round VG Cut 1.21 ct J Color VS2 clarity priced at $4300.
 
links are fine, just no personal sites, and no self-promotion.

ah, well, it's better than some complete crap ones that I have seen. Haven't seen the results, so at the worst from what I can see, it's potentially misleading. AGS only has light performance standards for round and princess.

I'm curious, did they ship you the stone even though they disagreed with the EGL grading?
 
Date: 4/28/2007 6:06:48 AM
Author: Jonathan360
In terms of similar to what you showed me, I found a 1.06 ct ideal I color SI1 with dimensions for table at 58% and depth at 62.1 priced at about $4000. width of 6.49mm and length of 6.52mm. The florescence has it as a strong blue.
Click to expand...
Crown and pavilion angles? Spread is a little weak for a 1.06 ct. https://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp
 
No they didn't ship out the stone. They got it in today and their independent gemologists looked at it and said the color was darker than their n colored master. Which is crazy. Because based on what I know, I cna't believe any lab could confuse a J color for an N based on what I've seen. I could be incorrect on that assumption but it would seem that it would be noticeable a fairly yellow diamond.

Honestly, after reading more about EGL, I was worried about the diamond. I heard throughout the sites I read that EGL wasn't the best for grading and there tended to be problems.....I guess that foreshadowed the events to come for me. Now I"m trying to stick to GIA certified only.

I wish Icould give you the crown and pavilion angles. They have a scan of the GIA cert....but I simply cannot read those numbers. It's too tiny and when I go to enlarge it, they just become blurry. If I had to guess though I'm pretty positive the crown is 33 and the pavilion is 41.3. I'm probably 90% positive thats what the numbers are. COuld be 41.5 or 41.2 but I think it's 41.3
 
EGL Israel is considered the most lax of the EGLs.

if you can read the GIA report number, you can use this: www.gia.edu/reportcheck
 
Ahh!! THat's what I needed, yes I cna read the GIA report number.
Depth: 62.1 %
Table: 58 %
Crown Angle: 33°
Crown Height: 13.5 %
Pavilion Angle: 41.2°
Pavilion Depth: 44 %
Star length: 55 %
Lower Half: 80 %

So the pricescope says:
Factor Grade
Light Return Very Good
Fire Excellent
Scintillation Very Good
Spread
or diameter for weight Very Good
Total Visual Performance 2.2 - Very Good - Worth buying if the price is right

Now the question becomes is the price right? As I said it's about an even $4000.

By the way Julie, I don't think I mentioned this, but thank you for your help. I appreciate this tremendously. As I said, when I decided to get a diamond ring, I knew I'd have to research but never knew that it was this involved. As a guy, we simply don't deal this much with diamonds ;)
 
yes, absolutely you can post that.

Angles are fine, though the thick girdle is eating into the spread. Still, price is good, so if it's confirmed eye-clean and an attractive stone, better if you can get pictures, best if you can get an Ideal Scope picture, then it could be a possibility.

35.gif
 
That is my concern too but from what I know they are truly very reputable and many people have mentioned to me that they're good. After this incident I actually do trust them more, because they didn't just buy into the EGL report, and made sure to look into it themselves. Also they have a 30 day full money back refund if I don't like it. No reasons asked. But I'm still looking see if they have any other options. I checked the diamond you showed me and wow, it came out as excellent 1.1 on the cut advisor, but it's almost $1000 more. I guess not to sound cheap, I'd rather use that towards the wedding or whatnot. But again I read elsehwhere where people mention this may be for 10, 20, or 50 years. Why not buy the best?

I found a second diamond but the gia report check site is down and just happen to sell that diamond before I had a chance to look at it. Was available literally 5 minutes ago. I guess I may just buy that diamond with the 2.2 rating.
 
$4683 with the wire discount. (:

Price for the 1.06 seems reasonable (I''m assuming they are both eye-clean,) considering the vg finish marks, and a 1.14 vs 1.06.
 
I just ordered the 1.06. However I will keep looking and hopefully the report check will be back up in the morning I guess it actually is the morning already......If I find something I like a little better, I will cancel my order or return it and try and find something better. But at the price, I can't believe I can find anything better. After the ring setting it costs below $4200 for me total so a diamond and an 18K gold setting. The only thing now I worry about is if she'll like the strong blue florescence. But from what I've seen, I like it a lot. But my opinion probably matters so little that it's pointless for me to even bring it up. As long as she'll like it. I just think the blue in the UV light makes it extra sparkly I guess is the word. Being an I color, the strong blue should make it even a tad brighter I'm hoping.
 
I realized I need to cancel that order. Unless someone here can explain to me what they think. I just double checked the GIA cert. It says for cut that is is very good. Not the ideal that was stated. Some of the other certs I saw say "excellent."

Okay I just looked at the GIA. They don't have ideal. Starts with excellent, then very good, then so on.
 
The thick girdle drops the grade to very good.
 
Ahh okay. Well I decided to keep the one I posted from last night. I just hope when I see it in person it''ll be very nice.
 
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