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Help! Having Doubts about GemScan appraisal

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phoenix1119

Rough_Rock
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Feb 16, 2009
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10
Hi everyone,

I recently got engaged. My fiance and I had an independent jeweler in Toronto custom make my engagement ring. We also bought our diamond from the same jeweler. Before we purchase the diamond, I asked the vendor if the diamond is GIA certified and he said, "Even better, it''s AGS". He showed us the pre-cert and it listed the specs of the diamond (0.71ct, VS2, F colour, excellent cut). We decided to purchase the diamond and have him make the setting for us.

On Tuesday, which is a month later, we went to pick up the engagement ring. I was really happy with it. It turned out really well and it even came with a certificate of appraisal, which I didn''t even look at at the time because I was too excited. Yesterday, I decided to look at the appraisal certificate and noticed that the logo has GS on it. I went to the web site listed on the certificate and found out that GS stands for GemScan! The appraisal contained an insert which had the pre-cert for the diamond and it also had the GS logo. At the time that we decided to buy the diamond and when he showed us the same pre-cert, I only quickly glanced at it and saw the GS in the logo, which in my subconscious, I assumed was AGS.

I quickly panicked after finding out that the centre diamond had a GemScan precert because I''ve read a lot of forums here that did not have a lot of good things to say about GemScan. As a knee-jerk reaction, I quickly picked up the phone and called Harold Weinstein and got an appointment for today. The lady that I spoke with was very nice. I expressed to her my concern and told her that I wanted to get the specs of my centre diamond re-appraised because I want to make sure that it is in fact F colour with VS2 clarity and excellent cut. She told me to bring in the appraisal certificate from GemScan so they can accurately put down the weight and the gauge of the diamond on paper for insurance purposes. She said that this was the only way they could accurately document the diamond because it''s already been set. But I''m not sure if I should give her the GemScan certificate because I really do want an independent review of the diamond.

I also told her that I read somewhere that GemScan is not as strict as other labs. I told her the story of one person I read about that thought he had a D colour diamond when it was at best a good F when another lab looked at it. She explained to me that since my centre diamond has already been set, that they will do their best to try to determine the true colour, cut and clarity of the diamond. Once a diamond has been set, they cannot guarantee an accurate appraisal of the centre diamond.

I''m really confused and worried. I don''t know if I should bother having Harold Weinstein look at my engagement ring if they can''t give me a 100% accurate appraisal or if I should go as far as have someone unmount the diamond for them to look at. Also, should I bring the GemScan certificate of appraisal to show Harold Weinstein?

Thanks in advance for all your help!
 

Dancing Fire

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
32,396
Date: 4/16/2009 12:11:24 PM
Author:phoenix1119
Hi everyone,

I recently got engaged. My fiance and I had an independent jeweler in Toronto custom make my engagement ring. We also bought our diamond from the same jeweler. Before we purchase the diamond, I asked the vendor if the diamond is GIA certified and he said, ''Even better, it''s AGS''. He showed us the pre-cert and it listed the specs of the diamond (0.71ct, VS2, F colour, excellent cut). We decided to purchase the diamond and have him make the setting for us.

Thanks in advance for all your help!
so,no AGS report after all?
 

denverappraiser

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
8,810
Congratulations on your engagement.

Take a deep breath. Talking with an independent expert about it who can actually see the stone is a good place to start. Gemscan doesn’t enjoy the same reputation as some other labs but this doesn’t make them wrong either. Let us know what Harold says. Yes, take all of your paperwork with you to your meeting. Tell him you have it before you start and discuss your concerns about when and if you should show them to him. If you find you have a discrepancy, discuss with him how to proceed.

I don't suppose the promise of an AGS pedigree appears anywhere in writing does it?

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 

jet2ks

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
2,022
Is there any chance that he said "Even better it''s a GS" instead of "it''s AGS"? Small semantic difference--easliy misinterpreted.
 

phoenix1119

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 16, 2009
Messages
10
Dancing Fire: No, there''s no AGS cert. I''m kicking myself now for not paying attention in the first place. I was just so excited about the whole process that I overlooked important things.

Denverappraiser: *trying to take a deep breath* No, I don''t have it in writing
I just really took his word for it. He did show me the pre-cert but I overlooked the GS logo. For some reason, I didn''t think twice about it and it just registered in my brain as AGS. My financee and I are no diamond experts. We''ve done a lot of research and have learned quite a bit from PS. We did look at the diamond with 10X magnification, and we didn''t see any inclusions on it.

I was contemplating on whether or not I should call the vendor and tell him about my concern and ask him about the AGS cert, but my fiancee told me to wait until we get the result from HW. The vendor is really nice and I really think we built a good relationship with him. I really don''t want to tarnish that good relationship by questioning his credibility, etc...but I can''t help but worry.
 

phoenix1119

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 16, 2009
Messages
10
jet2ks: Yes, I guess it''s possible. I didn''t even think about that. To be honest, I wasn''t familiar with GemScan - I''ve never heard of them. I only knew about GIA, AGS and EGL. So maybe I heard what I wanted to hear. If that''s the case, it does make me feel a bit better because it''s possible that the vendor wasn''t lying to us - I think part of my panic is due to being hurt that someone we got along with really well and trusted would lie to us. Thanks, jet2ks - I really do feel a lot better about the situation.
 

oldminer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 3, 2000
Messages
6,438
If you are going to "worry" then pay an independent expert for an unbiased opinion. Don't show your paperwork until AFTER you have the opinion. If there is a conflict of opinions, then you might need to have the seller remove the diamond so that you can have it graded unset for further accuracy.

You are headed for what may be a tedious situation, but if you are the worrying kind, then take care of it and put it behind you. If you have a D color, a cautious independent appraiser might likely not be able to be certain about saying "D" on a set diamond. If I think a set diamond "might" be "D" is usually offer the opinion of "D to F" and hesitate to ever grade a mounted diamond as "D" without some qualification in my report. Your "F" color may be a bit easier to judge depending on how it is set and the color of the metal. A true F will appear E to G while set and that is about as good as it is going to be. If that won't stop the worry effect, then you'll need to go the longer route with stone removal and eventual resetting. Remember, color grading by any expert is an opinion just like the color on the GS document is now. This is not a perfect science.

However, should the unset diamond grade H or below, then you have a problem which will need an adjustment.

Do not encourage an independent appraiser to remove the diamond without permission from the original seller. You might become accused of "switching" the better diamond for a poorer color one. Be up front about it with the seller. Stay cool and calm and work your way one step at a time. Best of luck!
 

phoenix1119

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 16, 2009
Messages
10
Thanks David. I actually ended going to HW today. The gentleman I dealt with was very nice and he said the exact same thing that you did - that it''s not exact science and that it''s a matter of opinion. He said that even two people who work in the same lab, may have different opinions on the exact colour and clarity.

After all the panic attack, HW confirmed that the appraisal from GS is pretty accurate. I didn''t give him the GS certificate until after he was finished appraising my e-ring. Actually, he didn''t even ask for it. There were very minor differences in the appraisals. HW graded my centre diamond as F-G colour with VS2 clarity and .71ct in weight - which was the same as GS. But instead of having an excellent cut, he appraised it as very good cut. Don''t know if this makes much of a difference.

He added that in his opinion, GS is a reputable company. He said that he has had people bring in their diamond with a GS certificate for a second opinion and the results has always come back almost the same. And when things were different, they were only slightly different and weren''t that significant.

I really feel a lot better now. Thank you all again for all your help and input. Much appreciated
 
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