Help Amateur evaluating Stones and Labs

[MR2019]

While educating my self and researching what to look for in a stone I have came across a lot of great information, so much that I am now confused and clueless. I need help picking a stone and understanding certs still. I have came to the understanding from the blog that only GIA and AGS is reputable. Is EGL or others every acceptable if you are aware you might not be getting what the paper says?

I have looked at a number for stones from SI2 to even a few VVS1 and they all have varied on weather they are eye clean or if my amateur eyes could see anything through a loupe or microscope. The stones online i have had trouble with because my understanding is the magnification is 30x so everything small sticks out.

I was recently almost set on a GIA 2.04 SI1 G depth 62.1% Table:59%, Pav Angle:41.4 Polish: x Sym: x Flour: Faint but over $20k for this was too much for me. This stone was eye clean from top down but did have a black inclusion in the middle that was visible when you looked from the side. It is probably visible from top down in some light.


Recently I looked at an EGL- US Los Angeles stone that was said to be a VS1 2.00 H depth 61.7% Table:60%, Pav Angle:41.2 Cut:ideal Polish: x Sym:VG Flour: Faint.
Under a microscope I could only see the slightest inclusion 1 or 2 specs that were seemed opaque. The cost of this stone was around $15k which is more manageable.



I know from everything I have read the cert is likely soft. I was thinking that even if it was an VS2 or even SI1 the stone to me is cleaner than the GIA SI1's I have seen. In comparing the color to a couple gia stones in the store lights and sunlight the color didn't appear to be far off. The florescence is another factor that could be off. The diamond didn't appear dull and had a good amount of sparkle but i am guessing the cut might not be as Ideal as it is said to be. (I assume it was EGL and not GIA for a reason?)

Overall even though this is EGL and appears ok to me (a person who doesn't know diamonds) and realize this likely not as good as it seems should i still run?

Are their stones on James Allen or Blue Nile that are AGI that would be a better?

 

[Snowdrop13]

Definitely better to stick with GIA or AGS if you‘re in the US, you at least know what you‘re getting and can compare like with like. If you give us your budget we can try to help you. Is 2 carats a must?

 

[KKJohnson]

this one is a no for me, you would basically be throwing your money away

Holloway Cut Advisor | HCA Tool

The HCA Tool uses data from a round brilliant diamond to produce a score that can help you make an estimate regarding the cut quality. Use it here.

www.pricescope.com

 

[KKJohnson]

This one scores a 0.08, its a nice medium price range of 17k

2.03-Carat Round Cut Diamond | Blue Nile

www.bluenile.com

This one is lovely

Diamond | 2.113 ct I VS2 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4000702

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.113 carat I color VS2 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4000702

www.whiteflash.com

This one is under the 2ct mark BUT you are get that 8mm spread w/o the price of that a 2ct will be, I would inquire and ask them to advise if it is eye clean (even though it does state and they are honest, its still best to have it reviewed again) 17.3k

Diamond | 1.941 ct H SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4039667

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.941 carat H color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4039667

www.whiteflash.com

 

[tyty333]

Your pavilion angle is too high @MR2019. Most pavilion angles for well-cut round brilliants fall within the range 40.6 to 41.0.

40.6 pairs better with a high crown (35 degrees). The 41 range pairs with a lower crown (34). 40.8 can go either way.
An idealscope or aset image can verify whether the angles complement each other.

 

[MR2019]

2ct is not an absolute requirement. I was initially looking at Halo settings but as I looked at large stones I felt that would detract from the larger diamond so i just looked at the Pave style band settings. I believe most are ~.25ct, i was thinking to keep the total above 2ct? Not sure if this really matters. Budget wise I am looking at 15-18k and of course preferably to the low end. It seems an SI1 in G or H would be a nice enough stone no one is going to pick up on quality when looking at it. I am looking to get a stone most friends, co workers and people you run into will find nice.

 

[John P]

When considering carat-weight be on the lookout for the diamond's spread in mm. A well-cut 2-carat diamond will spread somewhere around 8.15 mm. Beware those cut with steep angles intended to keep extra weight in the diamond. The pricing may be friendlier, but it's because you'd be buying a diamond that looks smaller when compared to well-cut examples of the same weight.

 

[sledge]

2ct is not an absolute requirement. I was initially looking at Halo settings but as I looked at large stones I felt that would detract from the larger diamond so i just looked at the Pave style band settings. I believe most are ~.25ct, i was thinking to keep the total above 2ct? Not sure if this really matters. Budget wise I am looking at 15-18k and of course preferably to the low end.

Am I interpreting correctly -- a 1.75 stone + 0.25 pave band hits your total 2 carat goal, and makes you happy?

IMO, you have a few issues going on here that may make your life easier if you tackle individually:

1. Certification
Remember, the whole point of a lab report is to provide warm fuzzies about what you are purchasing. Additionally, the color, clarity and weight shown on the report will help drive the price for the stone in question. So if the report says D VS2 but is actually a G SI1 then it's possible you are overpaying for the stone because of a "soft" report. Obviously you don't want that to occur. Sticking with GIA or AGS prevents that.

2. Proportions / Cut
Most people here, including myself, believe that cut is THE most important quality of a diamond. This will drive the fire, or magic, of the stone. In addition to having a stone that will sparkle like crazy, there are other upsides. When the proportions are within ideal ranges and symmetry is good then light enters, bounces around and leaves the stone properly. This does two primary things, it makes the stone brighter as light is reflecting at maximum efficiency. Additionally you get edge-to-edge brightness, which makes the stone look larger.

On the flip side, poorly cut stones will look darker and consequently smaller than well cut stones. Here is a video that I think drives the point home clearly. Two stones of nearly identical size, yet when not in high powered lighting (jeweler shops are notoriously known for over-bright lighting) you can see the poorly cut stone looks considerably smaller.

3. Budget
Diamonds are what we call a zero sum game. What that means is that when your budget is fixed, then you have to adjust down/up the 4 C's so that the dollars balance out. Sometimes we start out with a set of expectations that is unrealistic. When that occurs, we either have to adjust our expectations for the available budget. This may mean lower color, smaller size, less clarity or a less well cut stone.

As I mentioned before, we prioritize cut here, so that is sacred ground we don't want to skimp on. More importantly, of the 4 C's this is also the C that cost the least to get better quality. Therefore, it is helpful to know yourself and what is important to you and your girl. So how would you prioritize the 4 C's? What is most and least important to you? Knowing info like that helps us adjust recommendations to a solution that makes you most happy.

 

[sledge]

It seems an SI1 in G or H would be a nice enough stone no one is going to pick up on quality when looking at it. I am looking to get a stone most friends, co workers and people you run into will find nice.

Here are a few stones that may fit this nicely.

WhiteFlash (WF) has 3 in-house brands. Their top brand is called A Cut Above (ACA). They have 2 other lines called an Expert Select (ES) and Premium Select (PS). Both the ES & PS lines are near ACA misses, and the difference between them is the ES has AGS certification, whereas the PS has GIA certification. Basically if the ACA is their "10" then the ES/PS lines are their "9".

The great thing is all 3 brands carry the same great lifetime trade-in policy (simply spend $1 more and get full credit of your original stone on the new one). Also, they offer complete imaging and while near misses, they still offer excellent hearts & arrow (H&A) symmetry.

WF PS 1.801 H SI1 @ $14,218 wire

Diamond | 1.801 ct H SI1 Expert Selection Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4164590

This fabulous 1.801 carat Round Ideal cut diamond has a clarity grade of SI1 and color grade of H.It is an excellent choice for engagement rings. | 4164590

www.whiteflash.com

57.1 table, 61.9 depth, 34.5 crown, 40.9 pavilion & 76 LGF

This stone packs a great bang for the buck. Ideal cut with AGS certification and true H&A symmetry. It appears the stone missed the ACA grade because of the some very minor manipulation of the girdle (see circled spots below - normally those areas show up as red).




WF PS 1.756 G SI1 @ $14,848 wire

Diamond | 1.756 ct G SI1 Expert Selection Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 2169560

This fabulous 1.756 carat Round Ideal cut diamond has a clarity grade of SI1 and color grade of G.It is an excellent choice for engagement rings. | 2169560

www.whiteflash.com

55.5 table, 61.4 depth, 34.6 crown, 40.5 pavilion & 76 LGF

If color is a little more important than size, then maybe this stone fits the bill. It's slightly smaller in carat weight but because of the proportions of the stone, the actual spread is nearly identical.
It appears it missed the ACA mark because of the shallow 40.5 pavilion angle, and WF requires a 40.6-40.9 pavilion to qualify as an ACA. While going to shallow can be an issue, the other supporting images provide assurance there are no problems with the stone.

A CUT ABOVE® Diamonds Specifications and Qualifications

Uncover the diamond specifications and qualifications that make up the Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® diamonds. The most carefully crafted diamonds in the world.

www.whiteflash.com

My biggest issue with this stone is that while WF indicates it's eye clean on their webpage, the video looks less clear than the H stone I previously listed. If I were buying I'd want WF to pull the stone & verify it has no cloudy/hazy issues. They are very trustworthy, so I doubt it's a problem but I'd still want to double check.


WF ACA 1.752 G SI1 @ $16,078 wire

Diamond | 1.752 ct G SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4123879

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.752 carat G color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4123879

www.whiteflash.com

55.5 table, 61.9 depth, 34.8 crown, 40.8 pavilion & 76 LGF

I thought I would throw up an actual ACA. This is very similar to the above PS stone, except the crown/pavilion is a little more desirable. Also, the clarity is much better in the video. Of course, it's a little more expensive as well.

Final Thoughts:
All 3 of these stones are solid choices if you are looking to keep your budget closer to the $15k mark. And with the 0.25 carat pave setting, all these would get you to 2 carat total weight.

If you are comfortable pushing your budget a little more, I do like the 1.941 H stone that @KKJohnson recommended. I previously recommended that stone to a different user in another thread. It's tough to find ideal cut stones that are just short of the 2 carat mark. This is a great bang for the buck, because once stones cross the 2 carat magic weight mark they get dinged with a price premium.

Let us know if any of these work.