He sounds...Married

[decodelighted]

Uhmmm.... I think rock bottom just happened..... My sister just called me at 6 AM, and calmly told me that he had just called her, and left a screaming message that not only had he slept with his ex-girlfriend last weekend, but that in the 8 months they were together, nearly every second week that he said *he was on call* he actually was with her. She did not sound hysterical as is her usually MO. She just said, "I need to call cell phone company to get his phone number blocked because I want to phone messages, and especially no text." And then she said it feels really bad to be cheated on. I always suspected, but confirmation in such a brutal way is a bit unnecessary.

It's not over yet. Weeks or months from now he'll get a hold of her somehow & say that he can't believe how wrong he was and they are true soul mates and he'll change and she's such a kind, wonderful person who could totally forgive him etc etc etc

SO GET HER THE BOOK STILL. It'll help debrief from this situation and prepare her to resist the eventual attempts to reconcile. Ooof. Sorry you're in the middle of this, Ally. Just remember -- It's your choice whether to *remain* in the middle. Your sister needs to do some growing by herself. You can't do it for her.

 

[nkarma]

In addition to what everyone else has said, I think it is very important to get counseling yourself. Does anyone know if they have al-anon for people with addictive personalities but not necessarily drugs & alcohol?

I have been to an Al-Anon meeting for a class assignment and I am positive what everyone shares in there about letting go and you cannot control their behavior and the toll that takes on you will greatly resonate with you. Maybe you can stop in and just listen to one.

 

[ame]

Uhmmm.... I think rock bottom just happened..... My sister just called me at 6 AM, and calmly told me that he had just called her, and left a screaming message that not only had he slept with his ex-girlfriend last weekend, but that in the 8 months they were together, nearly every second week that he said *he was on call* he actually was with her. She did not sound hysterical as is her usually MO. She just said, "I need to call cell phone company to get his phone number blocked because I want to phone messages, and especially no text." And then she said it feels really bad to be cheated on. I always suspected, but confirmation in such a brutal way is a bit unnecessary.

It's not over yet. Weeks or months from now he'll get a hold of her somehow & say that he can't believe how wrong he was and they are true soul mates and he'll change and she's such a kind, wonderful person who could totally forgive him etc etc etc

This, exactly. And if it were my sister, I'd be forced to smother her with a pillow if she gave him a second thought. Or even answered.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

First of all, stop calling this girl an "ex" ... there is nothing ex about her and him ... nothing at all.

Everyone has been here before, the bad guy and the bad relationship ... pretty much par for the course in life. It's sad ... and as her sister, I understand how you would be hurt for her. But, you can't fix her. And you can't make her see things your way. The more you indulge it, the harder it will become for everyone involved.

This latest message from "he sounds ... married" may be her "coming to Jesus" moment. Now she knows. She has the information, black and white and in bold about who he is and where his priorities are. He told her. It's no longer you speculating or her own self doubt, those little security blankets of "maybe" have been ripped away ... what remains is what is true. She now knows who she's been dealing with ... sucky though it may be.

For some people, I would imagine, this is the beginning. That moment where they can see "how bad he really wants me" ... if he chases her, don't be shocked if she goes back. These sort of relationships tend to be vicious, never ending cycles. Though, I hope that's not the case for your sister.

 

[Ara Ann]

In addition to what everyone else has said, I think it is very important to get counseling yourself. Does anyone know if they have al-anon for people with addictive personalities but not necessarily drugs & alcohol?

I have been to an Al-Anon meeting for a class assignment and I am positive what everyone shares in there about letting go and you cannot control their behavior and the toll that takes on you will greatly resonate with you. Maybe you can stop in and just listen to one.

Yes. There is a 'Celebrate Recovery' program at our church and they have a co-dependency group, which deals with this issue, of trying to control other's actions, etc., and coming to terms with not being able to control everything and everyone (or force others to take our advice, etc.)... makes life and relationships much simpler and healthier when we learn our own limits and boundaries.

 

[allycat0303]

Deco: I'm only cautiously optimistic for now. He called her like 7 times today when I was with her. She didn't answer. She says she is repulsed but I know that repulsed can turn to *missing* within a few weeks once the anger dies down. I suggested the book to her, and she said she would order it. I think it's a beginning at least.

Italia: I know she's not an ex. No one flies across the country for 1.5 days and calls it an ex. Actually this guy keeps in touch and juggles ALL his ex's. There are two girls he sees in Vancouver, a lawyer and nurse, even if the relationships have been over for 3-4 years. It astounds me that woman are so silly.

Ame: I know exactly what you mean. Its enraging to have someone act like this.

My sister fully expects him to keep texting/calling for about 1 year even with no response, because that's what he always does. She explained that at this very moment he was probably online, on the phone, trying to get a relationship going because he can't stand to be alone. Honestly, it is NOT normal behaviour. And I felt today a small glimmer of hope because she said, "Well, I knew all this and I still chose to engage in it, so I'm to blame for this." Mostly she felt bad, because she said, she must really lack self esteem to let a guy treat her like poop, especially since the last time he went to Vancouver she took him back. And the previous relationship (1 year ago), the other guy she dated was juggling woman. She said that she didn't tell me, but a lot of times, they would have a date and he would just stand her up (not even call) just never show up, and she would never address it. In addition, the other guy would date other girls, and she said, "I was aware, he was aware that I was aware, and I didn't have the courage to say anything.

I don't know what has changed in her, that she has become like this. It's like she has no sense of self worth/ self respect. Whatever it is, she needs to work on that. Forget men. The only thing she would do is find the only loser in the room, and date him. She needs to take an unspecified hiatus from dating.

 

[Pandora II]

Deco: I'm only cautiously optimistic for now. He called her like 7 times today when I was with her. She didn't answer. She says she is repulsed but I know that repulsed can turn to *missing* within a few weeks once the anger dies down. I suggested the book to her, and she said she would order it. I think it's a beginning at least.

Italia: I know she's not an ex. No one flies across the country for 1.5 days and calls it an ex. Actually this guy keeps in touch and juggles ALL his ex's. There are two girls he sees in Vancouver, a lawyer and nurse, even if the relationships have been over for 3-4 years. It astounds me that woman are so silly.

Ame: I know exactly what you mean. Its enraging to have someone act like this.

My sister fully expects him to keep texting/calling for about 1 year even with no response, because that's what he always does. She explained that at this very moment he was probably online, on the phone, trying to get a relationship going because he can't stand to be alone. Honestly, it is NOT normal behaviour. And I felt today a small glimmer of hope because she said, "Well, I knew all this and I still chose to engage in it, so I'm to blame for this." Mostly she felt bad, because she said, she must really lack self esteem to let a guy treat her like poop, especially since the last time he went to Vancouver she took him back. And the previous relationship (1 year ago), the other guy she dated was juggling woman. She said that she didn't tell me, but a lot of times, they would have a date and he would just stand her up (not even call) just never show up, and she would never address it. In addition, the other guy would date other girls, and she said, "I was aware, he was aware that I was aware, and I didn't have the courage to say anything.

I don't know what has changed in her, that she has become like this. It's like she has no sense of self worth/ self respect. Whatever it is, she needs to work on that. Forget men. The only thing she would do is find the only loser in the room, and date him. She needs to take an unspecified hiatus from dating.

Yes she would. And this guy she has been seeing - he's trying it on with 100 women and some, like your sister and like me before I stopped being co-dependent and got some self-esteem, will click with him. As the book explains, it's like dancing - you find someone where you both just know the steps and it feels comfortable even when it's horribly toxic.

 

[movie zombie]

[quote="allycat0303|1323127318|3074854...... She needs to take an unspecified hiatus from dating.[/quote]


truth.


the good news is that she's recognizing her part. that is a first step.

i think you already know its not your job to "fix" her. i think it just hurts to see your sister making lousy choices and allowing herself to let these men abuse her....yes, it is abuse: emotional abuse. it sounds like the dance is no longer that comfortable for her. the one way you can be of help to her is to be honest with her.

good luck!

 

[VRBeauty]

In addition to what everyone else has said, I think it is very important to get counseling yourself. Does anyone know if they have al-anon for people with addictive personalities but not necessarily drugs & alcohol?

Emotions Anonymous - http://www.emotionsanonymous.org/..

Also, Adult Children of Alcoholics (ACA - which does not in this case mean "a cut above" ) is for people who grew up not just in alcoholic households, but with dysfunctions of many sorts:http://www.adultchildren.org/. If alcohol or drug addition was a factor in her past relationships, she may also feel comfortable going to an Al-anon meeting.

Any of these groups would most likely welcome her, give her tools to help her deal with the likes of the boyfriend and ex-husband, and -- most importantly -- help her start to see herself in a new, better light.

 

[edlinmccosker]

I'm sorry to hear about this.

 

[AGBF]

In addition to what everyone else has said, I think it is very important to get counseling yourself. Does anyone know if they have al-anon for people with addictive personalities but not necessarily drugs & alcohol?

I have been to an Al-Anon meeting for a class assignment and I am positive what everyone shares in there about letting go and you cannot control their behavior and the toll that takes on you will greatly resonate with you. Maybe you can stop in and just listen to one.

Thank you for your contribution, nkarma.

In my opinion, Al-anon itself is available to people who are having problems with others close to them, whose lives are having a negative impact on theirs. In at least some Al-anon groups the people who drink or use drugs or are causing problems for the Al-anon member are referred to as the Al-anon member's, "qualifier". (It is an incorrect use of the word, "qualifier", of course, but I think it makes its point!) I believe that the idea of using the term (in the groups where it is used) was to to show an even playing field in the group for spouses, boyfriends and girlfriends, parents, sisters and brothers, friends, lovers, children, of alcoholics, addicts, abusers, emotionally disturbed people, and others disturbing the serenity of people seeking help from Al-anon. Everyone seeking help from Al-anon was welcome as long as s/he had a, "qualifier". Naturally the primary purpose of Al-anon remains to help the families of people suffering from alcoholism.

This is, of course, only my interpretation. I do not speak for Al-anon. I do think Ally would fit right in at an Al-anon meeting, however, having many of the same issues as the other members there. I think she might really like it a lot!

Deb/AGBF

 

[movie zombie]

re emotions anonymous: i used them about 3-5 times. i found that in the initial process of detoxification and when i would start to spin out of control [think moving towards a panix attack] that it helped to have some place to go and be. that these were people admitting to having "emotional" [not alcohol, drugs, etc] issues was a real plus. for me it was a crisis management tool. once i worked through some things for myself, i found that the ongoing weekly meetings weren't working for me. i was moving faster and quicker through things than some who had been attending for years but i'm still glad they were there when i needed it.

i highly suggest your sister find a group if she can. they are not as well known or numerous as the drug/alcohol groups and al-anon [really designed to help those that are impacted by those with drug/alcohol issues]. btw, this was the SF bay area.

 

[allycat0303]

I really liked the emotions anonymous, but there are no meetings in Quebec (in English). At this moment, I think she's doing well though, No signs of breaking. She bought the book, and has been reading it.

Last night at 11:30 pm, the ex snuck into her apartment building and was knocking on the door! She called me whispering, saying she was trying to be quiet so he would go away. It was all a little freaky. Thankfully, he went away (she didn't open the door). The incessant phone calls have not stopped, but text message blocking is working.

She moves to the new condo she bought on December 19th (with very tight security) so he won't be able to come in anymore. It's a real blessing in disguise that she started that process many months ago.

 

[ForteKitty]

Can't he just wait for her outside the building? I'm sure she has told him about the place before? She needs to get a restraining order against him.

 

[ame]

I really liked the emotions anonymous, but there are no meetings in Quebec (in English). At this moment, I think she's doing well though, No signs of breaking. She bought the book, and has been reading it.

Last night at 11:30 pm, the ex snuck into her apartment building and was knocking on the door! She called me whispering, saying she was trying to be quiet so he would go away. It was all a little freaky. Thankfully, he went away (she didn't open the door). The incessant phone calls have not stopped, but text message blocking is working.

She moves to the new condo she bought on December 19th (with very tight security) so he won't be able to come in anymore. It's a real blessing in disguise that she started that process many months ago.

She probably should call the police and try to get a restraining order. That way every call he makes, every time he shows up, it's a violation of the order of protection and he can be arrested for violating it. Thankfully she does move. I wonder if there's anyone that can move in with her--a male cousin or something? Does he have a key to her current place? If so call the landlord.

 

[Dreamer_D]

What can you do for her?

Stop enabling her. Imagine if she was a drug addict. You are indirectly supporting her self-destructive behavior by participating and perhaps even fueling the behavior. The situation sucks. BUT SHE CHOSE IT. She is free to leave this man. You cannot control her or help her beyond refusing to participate in anything relating to the relationship drama. That is what I would suggest if alcohol or drugs is the issue. It is what I suggest when self-destructive relationship problems are the issue too.

 

[movie zombie]

ally, please tell her to call the police if he shows up again. please. if he's crazy enough to do this, he's a threat. he could stalk her. he is NOT to be trusted.

i hope she has plenty of people around her at all times.....especially during the move.

she really needs a restraining order.

glad she'd reading the book! and i'm glad she did not cave when he showed up at her place.

she's making good progress. however, for every step forward there can be two back.....be prepared. however, please convey to her that she is strong and will be even stronger.

again, call the police and get a restraining order!

 

[joflier]

Oh my word. What a creep! And a loser. Thank goodness she's seen the light and is getting away from it! What was so good about this guy that she was sticking with it??