Having a hard time learning :)

[nojs]

Is it just me, or is buying CS online incredibly difficult?

Prior to PS, I bought stones with nice color but large windows (on the positive side they don't have any extinction). Even after studying, I bought some more learner stones (eBay), but they too had windows (although smaller)) and one was too dark. I then decided that I need something with a better cut, so I purchased two stones from Jeff Davies' eBay action. The cut is great, but other than that, neither looks anything like I imagined or was able to tell from the photos and videos. The one I thought would be worse is actually very pretty and the other one I was really excited about is very disappointing.

This pink/purple sapphire:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321645816072?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2648&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
is mostly pink to my eyes, with some peachy (!) undertones and there is a lot less contrast than in photo what I really like. It holds its color in every lighting and the cut is nice. So I'm very happy with this one.

This blue spinel:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321652773000?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
is, to my eyes, mostly grey or at best, dark purple. It is so grey, that in most lighting it just looks "dead" to me. I have been told spinels can be shifty and many have grey modifier, but I didn't expect this stone to be so complete dark grey in most lighting. I'm seeing very little blue. I have to see if I can return it.

Sorry I don't have a camera that could take proper pictures of these small stones.

I know that the more experienced members have told me not to buy so many learner stones, but how else is one supposed to learn I don't know if one usually has better luck with more expensive stones, but now I'm even more reluctant buying anything expensive. Here in Finland the customs can be a real hassle so returns aren't that simple.

I went on to study the chemical properties of each gem, and was thinking that maybe something with a high RI would be nice. So I bought a Sphene (I am well aware of the limitations witch its softness). That hasn't arrived yet, so it remains to be seen.

Does one improve over time or should I stick with buying from gem shows?

It would be comforting to know there are others who are/have been suffering from difficulties with online buying

 

[Siameseroo]

Hi Nojs I'm sorry the spinel was disappointing - the photo and video look so promising! Based on what I've seen on PS, JD's stones can be hit or miss. My personal experience has been very positive - I have a lovely collection of his blue sapphires which are very bright and saturated - much more saturated than his pics/videos and a super sparkly rose de france. I have also won a number of his auctions - most of which don't wow me but I got them for peanuts so I don't really care. I don't bid on auctions anymore - if I'm interested in anything I contact Jeff via fb for more info which is working really well for me.

More generally, some of my most positive experiences have been purchasing preloved stones from other PSers via Loupetroop. Firstly, you typically get more photos including hand shots in various lighting conditions and they usually provide detailed descriptions and are helpful in answering questions.

I have learned a lot from my learner stones, particularly how to 'read' specific vendor pics and descriptions and also my own tolerances and preferences when it comes to colour, cut, clarity etc. For instance, I never thought I'd like orange or yellow stones until I purchased inexpensive chryso and spess stones a few months ago. I also now know that inclusions don't bother me if the colour is great but I can't stand bad cuts especially windows.

I think its great that you have the option to attend gem shows! Its a great way to get to know your preferences and tolerances without necessary spending money!

Goodluck!!

 

[LoversKites]

Sometimes Jeff Davies photography is misleading, there have been a few instances of PSers disappointed from his less expensive stones. I at least hope the stones with higher pricetags have accurate photos. It's best to judge his stones from his videos.

Do return it if you can. Don't let one spinel you saw make you think the periwinkle-type coloured spinels are dark or dead.

Buying online can be difficult. What I do is try apply whatever good or bad thing I saw in a stone in real life to stones online. For example, now you've seen for yourself the grey mask that is warned about here so often, particularly in spinels -- so you'll know to be particularly wary about that in the future with all stones -- and it'll let you appreciate vivid spinels more like the one below.

Visiting gem shows is a great way to see gems for yourself IRL and learn your preferences. I wish I had the opportunity.

 

[eastjavaman]

You can always go to this Thread to learn about vendor pictures and actual

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/vendor-pictures-and-owner-pictures-of-ps-stones.109420/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/vendor-pictures-and-owner-pictures-of-ps-stones.109420/[/URL]

 

[dk168]

I had to return a spinel back to Jeff D as it looked brown to me and not as pink as in the photo and the video. I was very disappointed as I had high hopes that it would look nice, after purchasing a small oval spinel from him that looked true to the pic and video.

I have since learnt that the colours of spinel can shift quite dramatically, better late than never.

The grey spinels I purchased from him are darker in real life than in the photos and videos for certain, and I have learnt what to expect whenever I purchase a grey spinel from him.

However, the other stones I have purchased from JD all met my expectations if not exceeded them.

I have not purchased a higher value stone from him yet, however, I shall take the risk and do so some time in the future when my financial situation is more stable.

DK

 

[chrono]

It is difficult to buy CS, period! In person, your options are limited because vendors carry only a few stones at best. Online gives more options but it isn't easy to learn how to "read" the pictures/videos to minimize your risk. Couple that with international shipping and import taxes, and it becomes more of a mine field to make sure one purchases the right stone.

As always, the PS Vendors list is just that - some take more accurate pictures, some are outright horrible at it. The only reasons they made the list are other things that include hassle free returns and refunds. However, this is still problematic for shoppers outside the USA due to taxes and international shipping hassles. This remains true for both cheap and expensive stones. I'd rather make a mistake on a $50 CS than a $5000 CS, although those $50 mistakes can accumulate easily into a large sum.

For now, I'd say visit a lot of shows and hang around PS. Start threads about stones, post pictures and ask questions. Maybe there's a stone you like and wonder whether it is a good starter stone but don't feel sure whether it has cut, clarity, treatment, colour or whatever issues. Go ahead and post about it to get feedback. You will get all sorts of responses from the good to the bad to the ugly. Advice here is cheap and plentiful and often times help many make better decisions.

 

[T L]

Is it just me, or is buying CS online incredibly difficult?

Prior to PS, I bought stones with nice color but large windows (on the positive side they don't have any extinction). Even after studying, I bought some more learner stones (eBay), but they too had windows (although smaller)) and one was too dark. I then decided that I need something with a better cut, so I purchased two stones from Jeff Davies' eBay action. The cut is great, but other than that, neither looks anything like I imagined or was able to tell from the photos and videos. The one I thought would be worse is actually very pretty and the other one I was really excited about is very disappointing.

This pink/purple sapphire:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321645816072?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2648&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
is mostly pink to my eyes, with some peachy (!) undertones and there is a lot less contrast than in photo what I really like. It holds its color in every lighting and the cut is nice. So I'm very happy with this one.

This blue spinel:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321652773000?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
is, to my eyes, mostly grey or at best, dark purple. It is so grey, that in most lighting it just looks "dead" to me. I have been told spinels can be shifty and many have grey modifier, but I didn't expect this stone to be so complete dark grey in most lighting. I'm seeing very little blue. I have to see if I can return it.

Sorry I don't have a camera that could take proper pictures of these small stones.

I know that the more experienced members have told me not to buy so many learner stones, but how else is one supposed to learn I don't know if one usually has better luck with more expensive stones, but now I'm even more reluctant buying anything expensive. Here in Finland the customs can be a real hassle so returns aren't that simple.

I went on to study the chemical properties of each gem, and was thinking that maybe something with a high RI would be nice. So I bought a Sphene (I am well aware of the limitations witch its softness). That hasn't arrived yet, so it remains to be seen.

Does one improve over time or should I stick with buying from gem shows?

It would be comforting to know there are others who are/have been suffering from difficulties with online buying

I didn't read what everyone else said, so I apologize if I'm repeating this, but it's not always your fault. Buying CS online is incrediby difficult because often times vendors will photoshop or photograph the gem in the best possible lighting and/or with a darker background, to enhance any color. Spotting photo enhancement, or purposeful cover up of accurate color, is what is difficult, because if we all could do that, I'm sure there would be a lot less returns.

For the longest time, I thought all blue family spinels (violets, purples, lavenders, lilacs, blues) were dead and/or dark and/or grey. On this forum, early on, I couldn't understand why people loved them so much. Guess what? No, not all spinels are like that. There are actually some nicely saturated blue family spinels, and yes, they're what a lot of people rave about on this forum. I realized it when I took a chance on a cheap spinel I lucked out buying on ebay. It was included, no glamour photography, but when I got it, my love affair with spinels began. Therefore, I highly suggest you ignore glamour photography and ask the vendor the following questions.

How saturated is the stone?
How does it look in various light sources?
Does it lose a lot of saturation in various light sources?
How dark is it?

I just saved myself a recent purchase online because the vendor admitted to a stone being medium dark in tone, when the photo showed it to look medium light to light in tone. It took a while to get it out of him, and he is a reputable vendor too.

While windows and other cutting issues are easier to spot in a photo, even a glamour photo, the one thing that vendors try most to cover up is color. Be really careful when it comes to that, and buy from vendors that have a good reputation with no major photo enhancement.

Jeff is a mixed bag. Some people love his gems in person, and some people don't, so you do have to be somewhat careful with his photography. Consequently, you really need to ask the important questions, because while I do see grey in that one spinel photo, I would never guess it was "dead" as you said, by that one photo. What you probably can honestly surmise from that photo is that it's well cut, but if the color just isn't there for you, then what's the point?

Good luck and happy shopping!

 

[Acinom]

Buying colored stones is much more complicated compared to buying diamonds because of the factor color and because the price depends on so many factors. Colored stones are also difficult to photograph.

Personally I have learned I love bright saturated colors that are a tad on the darker side as these are the best match with my skintone. I have bought stones online and in some cases they look better in real life. I have also bought stones online and had it send directly to a US jeweller (since I live in Europe). I asked the jewellers to take pictures of the stones and in some cases these stones looked dead and I had them sent back. In some cases I took the risk and it turned out that jewellers can make excellent and accurate pictures of diamond jewelry and less then average photo's from colored stone jewelry.

I bought my blue sapphire local and I saw other sapphires as well. It proved to me how difficult it is to aquire colored stones and that it is preferred to see stones with your own eyes. Still, I have been lucky with colored stones till sofar as in some cases the stones looked better than I could ever dream of.

I have 3 stones from Jeff:
- one is comparable to the photo (my blue zircon)
- one is much much better than the photo (my little pink sapphire)
- one is true to the picture yet somehow underwhelms me as it is not the best match with my skintone
I had 2 stones from Jeff sent back.

I will not order from Wildfish as they use some sort of disco light that makes every stone look good.

I have one stone from Gemfix and it looks as beautiful in real life compared to the pic.

 

[nojs]

Thank you all for words of encouragement!

What really bugs me is that I wasn't able to tell either (!) correctly, one for the better and the other for worse. It would have been different if I had been disappointed with both (luckily not). The other eBay stones have been much closer to photos and videos.

 

[dk168]

My first high value CS since venturing into the CS section of PS was a rubellite tourmaline cut by Jeff White.

When I was spec'ing my stone, I informed him of the colour I was looking for by pointing out the various gemstones as seen in his sold gemstones galleries, and we decided on a rubellite. I was after a blue-red stone, a deep pink, with no orange.

When the stone was cut, he sent me a pic and I was not thrilled by the colour, as it looked redder and less pink than I had anticipated.

However, he assured me that it was to do with his photography, and it is pinker and lighter in real life.

To my relief, he was right about the pic not doing justice to the stone, as it is a lot more vibrant and pink in real life.

This is his pic:


These are my pics and I love the stone:



DK

 

[PrecisionGem]

I think one of the isses the past few years has been the death of the incandescent light bulb, and these new CFL bulbs. Many, if not most stones look horrid with these lights. A few exceptions i have seen are green/yellow chryserbryl and peridot.
The past few years while in Tucson i would return to my room each night and look at the rough i bought, and really couldnteven tell what the heck the stones were! A red garnet with incandescent lightwoulf look like a muddy brown color with the hotels CFL bulbs. In our house we use LED bulbs which are better, but aso have the old incandescentbulbs. Even the wall colors looked very strange with CFL bulbs, and we needed to remove them all.

 

[T L]

My first high value CS since venturing into the CS section of PS was a rubellite tourmaline cut by Jeff White.

When I was spec'ing my stone, I informed him of the colour I was looking for by pointing out the various gemstones as seen in his sold gemstones galleries, and we decided on a rubellite. I was after a blue-red stone, a deep pink, with no orange.

When the stone was cut, he sent me a pic and I was not thrilled by the colour, as it looked redder and less pink than I had anticipated.

However, he assured me that it was to do with his photography, and it is pinker and lighter in real life.

To my relief, he was right about the pic not doing justice to the stone, as it is a lot more vibrant and pink in real life.

This is his pic:


These are my pics and I love the stone:



DK

I've had the opposite problem with Jeff's stone. It looked vibrant and wonderful in his picture, and was really a "black hole" IRL. After I returned it to him, it has since many many rounds on Loupetroup, and has changed hands several times, so I guess I'm not the only one not enamored with it. I think he's a mixed bag too, but he's a nice guy and one shouldn't be worried about being very forthcoming with lots of questions.

 

[chrono]

The problem is that CFLs are everywhere today and are here to stay, so as consumers who wear these CS under CFLs most of the time, we have to try our best to find stones that do reasonably well under this type of light source. There's no point in buying stones that look great under incandescent if there are no more incandescent bulbs around anymore.

 

[nojs]

Surely gems can look different depending on the light, but in this case the problems with the spinel are not to do with light bulbs The first time I noticed its overly grey and dark appearance was outside the post office on an overcast day. The looks like that near the window and under different types of lighting. The sapphire looks nice in same conditions.

For something titled "blue spinel" I'm seeing very little blue (or any color other than grey for that matter). We are not talking about large sums of money, but there is no way I would have bought it if I had know how grey it is. The last thing I want is to make the same mistake on an more expensive item.

Funny thing happened today. I showed the pink sapphire to a friend (none of them are into gems), and her first reaction was "it's so big". The sapphire is 4x4 mm My countrymen in general have very modest tastes in jewelry

 

[chrono]

Spinels are difficult to buy online. They are especially shifty but there are a handful that hold their colour extremely well (equal to a sapphire) and those are more expensive. A majority of blue spinels will become overly dark and gray unless viewed under strong shaded/diffused sunlight.

 

[nojs]

I'm very grateful for your replies. It is so nice to get replies from those more experienced in the CS world This thread has really helped me feel less bad about my purchases I have even gotten to a point were I'm happy to have seen the spinel in person It cured me from my "cut obsession" once and for all. I now appreciate my not-precision-cut-but-otherwise-nice stones a lot more

I had another look at my gem box and feel so much better with two 7x5 mm oval beryls (which had minor cut issues), I might even set them. Might have to start another thread to get ideas

 

[dk168]

Yes please for setting ideas, as there are a few of us just love to spend other people's money!

DK

 

[pregcurious]

It is difficult to buy CS, period! In person, your options are limited because vendors carry only a few stones at best. Online gives more options but it isn't easy to learn how to "read" the pictures/videos to minimize your risk. Couple that with international shipping and import taxes, and it becomes more of a mine field to make sure one purchases the right stone.

This is so true. The best thing I've found is to look at as many colored stones in person, even if it is not the species you want. If you live in DC, Tiny Jewel box has a small but decent selection of colored stones (tanzanite, rubies, sapphires, etc). Intergem starts tomorrow in Chantilly, VA`.

The second thing I learned is to ask a lot of questions, which people mentioned above. I used to have a list of questions, but now I am not as scripted. The questions were things like please provide a picture with your hand to give a color/size reference, provide a verbal description of the color, how much does the color shift, does it black out or turn brownish/greyish under certain light conditions, can you describe the inclusions, are there areas of shadowing or extinction...and for certain species I have specific questions.

Finally, when you receive a stone take that return period time to look at it at home, outside, at work, etc. If it doesn't wow you, return it. I've never had a stone "grow" one me. Instead, flaws that I notice initially become more apparent to me with time. In general, a stone should wow me when I open it at home, and look good outside and at work. After a while, you'll get more comfortable with your tastes. I definitely have certain colors I like and don't like.

Also look around at gemstones and prices to get an idea of what a fair price is. It's good to be familiar with what is considered top color/characteristics according to the trade so you understand what affects the prices of stones. Then, buy what you like, but don't overpay.

 

[minousbijoux]

Time and experience. You will get there for sure! I thought knowledge about stones and color would be sufficient when I first joined, but I quickly learned that the first things is learning how to read photos and query vendors, which is a completely different skill set. Then, once in hand, and you've either fallen in love or not, you rely on yet another skill set of design/setting. Again, a completely different skill set, which many here have mastered. I have struggled with design for a long time and am just recently feeling like I "get it" a bit more. So give yourself time to look at designs, stones and vendor photos. And read what others have to say about vendor photos vs. photos in hand.

 

[lilmosun]

I am hopeless at looking at stones on-line and design setting. But I am artistically impaired - whether it be putting together accessories, home decor, etc... While I do know when I like something once I see it but on a screen, it usually takes someone pointing out flaw for me to see unless glaring (especially in a picture). Even in person, I often need to see things side-by-side to tell what I really want.

The best purchase I have made usually involved others as picking things out for me and on LT/DB where patient sellers tolerate my questions (they probably are thinking "didn't she look at the picture???" ). In fact, some of the purchases that most exceeded expectations were on LT/DB where cell phone pics simply don't do the stones justice.

 

[nojs]

The sphene I mentioned in a previous post to this topic arrived, and it is very pretty I'll try to get you some pictures later, although not sure how I will succeed without a macro lens. I was just about to give up buying online, but the sphene has restored my faith just a little. It is just so cool and sparkly The color is green like peridot but the flashes are "multicolor". It is also nice to see double reflection in person.

I think I'll have to keep up ordering learner stones for a little bit longer. I just got a 1.14 carat GLB certified blue zircon from eBay for only EUR 1.40 + few euros shipping . It is nice and sparkly, but I'm surprised that the nice blue color is not doing that much for me. For some weird reason I seem to prefer lighter tones. The pink/peach/purple sapphire from JD has really "grown on me", which is something I would not have guessed. It is not a strong color, but is definitely not "diluted" either. I guess it is light tone and high saturation, then? I think it is something I can wear everyday, so it has a high place on my "stones to set" list

TL: which vendor(s), in your opinion, has a reputation having "true" pictures (and/or videos) most often?

 

[chrono]

You can get by without a macro lens on your cell phone if you can magnify the screen and get very close before taking the snapshot. Most cameras these days come automatically with the macro function built in (tulip icon/button). It is very easy to like sphenes; the high sparkle and low price are in its favour.

 

[Lisa Loves Shiny]

It has been my experience that many grey spinels with hints of pink, purple or blue are being advertised without the description "grey." Over time you learn who's photos are better regarding color and or cut. If you are interested in inexpensive spinels or sapphires that are usually true or better to the color photographed I recommend Tan's stones (on the recommended vendor list). Usually you will see the stones are not cut to the precision standards that many here on Pricescope recommend, but then again you are not paying top dollar and many of the gems are beautiful in their own right. Or try to snag a pre-loved stone from a member of PS, as usually the seller will be very honest on how the stone looks in different lighting conditions.

 

[T L]

The sphene I mentioned in a previous post to this topic arrived, and it is very pretty I'll try to get you some pictures later, although not sure how I will succeed without a macro lens. I was just about to give up buying online, but the sphene has restored my faith just a little. It is just so cool and sparkly The color is green like peridot but the flashes are "multicolor". It is also nice to see double reflection in person.

I think I'll have to keep up ordering learner stones for a little bit longer. I just got a 1.14 carat GLB certified blue zircon from eBay for only EUR 1.40 + few euros shipping . It is nice and sparkly, but I'm surprised that the nice blue color is not doing that much for me. For some weird reason I seem to prefer lighter tones. The pink/peach/purple sapphire from JD has really "grown on me", which is something I would not have guessed. It is not a strong color, but is definitely not "diluted" either. I guess it is light tone and high saturation, then? I think it is something I can wear everyday, so it has a high place on my "stones to set" list

TL: which vendor(s), in your opinion, has a reputation having "true" pictures (and/or videos) most often?

I'm not really sure because I've not ordered from all of them. I will say that, after reading so much in this forum, I think the least complaints I hear of are from Brad of "Thegemtrader.com." I can't vouch for him though because I never ordered from him, but one of my very very picky friends does (and if she's reading this, "you know who are" ), and she hasn't had an issue that I know of with color variances from his photos and IRL.

HTH

Looking forward to seeing your sphene.

 

[nojs]

Some photos of the sphene with my husbands cell phone (mine doesn't do a good job)

 

[pregcurious]

Looks like a fire ball. What do you plan on doing with it?

 

[nojs]

Sphene set

 

[Acinom]

It looks amazing. What a gorgeous 'toxic' (in a good way) colour
You have chosen a great setting for your stone. Congrats!!

 

[EvangelineG]

I love sphene! Great colour and I love the simplicity of the setting, works beautifully together!

 

[nojs]

Thank you Acinom and EvangelineG!

I have been staying away from this forum in order to save money ( ), but just had to come back to post pictures of this ring I found a great stone setter and he did the ring exactly as I specified. It will be an occasional wear RHR. Although many of you probably think there is not a lot of "finger coverage", this stone size is the absolute maximum for me personally