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H&A D SI1, 1.26ct Need pricing Help!

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atu

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
10
Hello,

I have been looking for a stone for couple of months.
Pricescope has been extremely helpful. Thank you.

I have finally found the following stone:

1.26
D
SI1
AGS 000 H&A

D: 61.1
T: 57
angles: 35/40.8
msmts: 6.98*7.01*4.27

diamond calc rating 1.6 ex/ex/ex, vg - for spread

What would be a high, avg and low prices for such a diamond? What would be a great price for it?

Thanks. I need to make a decison so please respond!


ATu
 

atu

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
10
Hi,

Sorry to be a pain... but does NO ONE have an opinion on this diamond D/Si1?

Thanks! Really need some input - have to decide ASAP.

Atu
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
There was no stone specific to your measurements and details so here are a few that are somewhat similar for you to compare pricing.


1.22 E SI1 AGS 000 H&A A Cut Above Super Ideal: $8500

1.26 F VVS2 AGS 000 H&A $8500

1.26 F VVS1 AGS 000 H&A $11000


The 1.22 E SI1 is almost the closest to what you are talking about, add a little markup for the colorless D grade and a few more bucks for the .04c difference and I'd maybe estimate that the stone you are looking at should cost around $9000-9500. It also depends on if it is an online retailer or a B&M as they will most times add markup to the stones vs the internet pricing.


The stone that you have sounds pretty darn good if the pricing is acceptable to you! Or if you are not sold on your stone yet, check out the 1.22 E SI1 from ACA at WhiteFlash.Com...should be very beautiful and only one color grade off from D--but still entirely colorless. Good pricing too!
The 2nd stone is from NiceIce.Com and the 3rd from GoodOldGold.Com.



Lastly...I am sure you already know this but be sure your SI1 is entirely eye clean. No point in getting a D absolutely colorless stone if it has a big inclusion that is visible!
If it is not eye clean, then would suggest dropping color to E or similar to stay within budget and finding an SI1 that IS truly eye clean...shouldn't be too hard if you are diligent. Or bump up the clarity one to VS2 and get more peace of mind, esp for an online purchase.



Good luck!
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
I don't like to give estimates on what a vendor's stone "should be going for". They are the ones to decide how much they like the stone, how hard it was to find it, and how much they're willing to let it go for.

On these boards (as opposed to a contracted job) I prefer to comment on a price only after it's stated by the potential buyer. Like the Wild West, there's always a faster gun, and there's always a "cheaper" price. The question is, is the "cheaper" price really the better "value"? Sometimes not...

How much is the asking price?
 

barry

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Mar 21, 2001
Messages
441
Hello, Atu;

Inadvertently left out for your
consideration is a 1.26 E/SI-1 SuperbCert
for $7906

Barry
www.superbcert.com
 

atu

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
10
Thank you very much for your replies!

I am buying that stone - paying around 8,000. I was concerned, since this stone was a little above in color (I was looking for - F/Si1) and i didn't want to overpay for the differences that wouldn't be visible... I also wanted a stone slightly bigger - 1.4 - 1.49, but I guess, pure quality of this stone is more important in the end than the size...(to me that is)

Is it true that on the certificate if the stone is H&A - it would be noted?

My cert doesn't have it noted, but appraisers (I took it yesterday to check it out) even though they didn't have H&A Viewer, both agread that it had the pattern.

The stone is eye clean... there is a small cloud on the tbl though... It is AGS Certified... and I keep hearing that AGS is stricter in grading Si1s over GIA lately.

Do clouds imped brilliance or fire?

Thank you very much again.

Atu
 

Richard Sherwood

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Messages
4,924
----------
I am buying that stone - paying around 8,000.
----------

Excellent price.

----------
Is it true that on the certificate if the stone is
H&A - it would be noted?
----------

I have seen AGS reports stating that such and such stone is laser inscribed with "H&A AGSL #such&such". I don't know if they do that with all H&A stones. Possibly only with the ones that vendors paid extra to have inscribed. Rhino will know.

-----------
The stone is eye clean... there is a small cloud on
the tbl though... It is AGS Certified... and I keep
hearing that AGS is stricter in grading Si1s over GIA
lately.
-----------

I think the debate about GIA being more lenient lately is in regards to SI2 stones. I haven't heard of it extending to the SI1 category. Still though, an AGS SI1 stone is liable to be strictly graded.

-----------
Do clouds imped brilliance or fire?
-----------

Only if they are eye visible over a large portion of the stone. With an AGS SI1 you shouldn't have a problem.

Congratulations.
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,272
----------------
On 2/13/2003 6:17:36 PM barry wrote:

Hello, Atu;

Inadvertently left out for your
consideration is a 1.26 E/SI-1 SuperbCert
for $7906

Barry
www.superbcert.com
----------------

It is one thing when a consumer makes recommendations. It is another entirely different thing when a vendor comes on here and suggests their own stones. Experts come on here to give gemological information, not sell their own stones. This is in violation of the rules of this board. Why not help the client with advice on the stone he is asking about instead of waving a banner and trying to steal a sale from someone else? If you're only intent is to patronize then this is not allowed on these boards. There are stones plenty of us could point this prospective client to including myself, niceice, dbof, whiteflash, etc. however we abide by the rules. Please do the same. Besides, the specs on this stone that he found seem quite nice, why steer him away from a stone with perfectly fine proportions? Do you see something wrong with the proportions he listed that raises a red flag? If so, enlighten us.

I don't mean to sound short but I see posts here everyday where I'd love to point people to stones on my site but refrain for respect of Leonid and the rules he has laid down. Rules which I think make this board the best on the web.

Rhino
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,272
Atu,

Rich has given you a possibility for what your stone may result in with an optical analysis and it indeed may represent the stone you are looking at. It looks like you may indeed have a winner and the numbers do not sound bad.

My advice to you is if you would like to confirm the information that Rich is helping you with to send it to an appraiser who performs optical analylsis like RockDoc (www.consumersgemlab.com) or Dave Atlas (www.gemappraisers.com) You'll want to read their sites and perhaps email them for the amount of data they give independantly. That is if you want that kind of in depth information.

If the guys who appraised the stone do not have an H&A viewer then I would not rely on their word alone. Don't always take advice on face value ... YOU WANT TO SEE THE PROOF if claims are being made of H&A.

Hope everything works out for ya.

Peace,
Rhino
 

Rhino

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Messages
6,272
Hi Rich,

Nope. It would not be noted on an AGS Report. AGS does not currently grade for 3 dimensional or optical symmetry.

There are some suppliers who inscribe their diamonds with the intials "H&A" and the AGS Report # on the girdle and AGS will note that on their reports but that is only a note of the inscription and not the actual H&A pattern. Here is an example of such a stone. http://www.goodoldgold.com/1_23ct_h_si1_h&a.htm

I still have to take the shots of the inscription but note on the AGS Report it states under comments "H&A AGSL 3175605 has been inscribed on the girdle of this diamond".

This is not a verification of the actual H&A's (that needs to be independantly checked), just the fact of the laser inscription on the girdle.

Sorry I left that out. Hope that helps.

Peace,
Rhino
 

Giangi

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
2,530
Hey, that SuperbCert is to die for!!
 

atu

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
10
Thank you again for your answers to my questions.

I have truly learned a lot and was able to make an "inteligent" purchase.

It has been a lot of work and a lot of fun.
We already bought that stone and had it set, so I won't be able to send it for a further analysis.

I saw pricescope tables on the possible price of the d/si1 stone -

d/si1/H&A - $6601(avg) and $6150(lowest) per carat - works out to $8317.26(avg) & $7749(lowest) for 1.26 - what i paid falls between those two levels.

d/si1/1A - $5804(avg) and $4821(lowest) - Prices for 1A are much lower than for H&A - and you wouldn't see the difference!

I think the timing plays a big role in the process as well. it's not easy to find exactly what you want in your price range if you don't have months to do it in.

I am quite happy with our purchase. Thanks to USA Certed Diamonds! Tony and Martin were very helpful.

Special thanks to Mara and Richard for their analysis of the stone and the pricing on this site.

We have set the ring temperarily into a simple tiffany style 14K white gold setting... now the next step is to find a nicer one.

I like pave settings on whiteflash ... some Jewelry sellers have advised us, that if you are buying a very nice, clean diamond you might want to just have it set in the simple setting not to retract from it...
Any opinions on that?

Also can anyone point me to some sites of pave/other settings?

Thanks,

Anna (Atu)
 

Mara

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Oct 30, 2002
Messages
31,003
If you are looking for pave, check out

www.tacori.com
www.joeescobar.com (They sell Michael B rings which has alot of pave...but they are only one retailer of MB rings..you may have someone locally who you can work with)
www.diana.com

There are a few more...try a search for 'pave engagement ring' or something on Google and filter through.

Two comments on pave...the first is that I adore it especially with a gorgeous stunner of a stone...in my opinion it really sets off the color of the stone (e.g. if its pretty white or colorless) and it creates a great 'frame' for the larger stone's beauty. I have seen some great solitaire's but I have always loved pave. The second comment is that if you are considering pave all the way around the ring (eternity style), be careful as we were considering the same thing until notified by our jeweler that the setting for eternity pave (like the Michael B rings) is not necessarily recommended for a daily wear engagement ring--the pave setting is more delicate and not as 'hardy' as a prong set or channel and may be more easily damaged or stone lost, esp out of the bottom of the ring where the hand takes more abuse.

If you like the eternity style of pave..suggest a prong set style such as mine (look at my recent thread 'pictures of my ring'), we loved the pave look but wanted something more secure, so we got small round prong set stones eternity style in platinum. We had it custom made as we had not seen anything out there similar for sale to what we wanted.

Or if you want pave partway around the ring...you should be safe, there are alot of old antique styles as well at faycullen.com and antiqueengagementrings.com that have some pave or similar looks with some old fashioned filigree on them. Very beautiful.

Oh last but not least want to mention that whatever shape you get for the side stones--since your stone is a D you probably want to be sure that the side stones whether pave or prong or channel are colorless as well (D-F range), so that there is not a noticeable difference between the large stone and small. Also it's my opinion that keeping the small stones similar color to the large stone helps set off the whiteness of the large stone. My stone is a G and super white, and the small stones around the ring are all G and the entire ring seems to glow very brightly sometimes. Pretty.


Hope this helps somewhat. Congrats on what sounds like a beautiful diamond at an *amazing* price!!
 

niceice

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
1,792
----------------
Is it true that on the certificate if the stone is H&A - it would be noted?
----------------
First Atu, we would like to say that the diamond you mention appears to be quite nice!

The only time H&A would be noted on the lab report is if the diamond was inscribed with H&A on the girdle edge prior to being sent to the lab for grading or if the company sending the diamond in for grading had "H&A" inscribed on the diamond while it was at the lab... This does not mean that the diamond actually exhibits a crisp pattern of Hearts & Arrows, nor that the laboratory thought the diamond met the criteria for being a Hearts & Arrows diamond... Merely that the inscription was present and the laboratory indicated it as such on the lab report as a characteristic of the diamond.

A few years ago we appraised a diamond that had the word "ideal" inscribed on the girdle edge of the stone, the diamond had a 63% table by our estimation - a fact later verified by Sarin evaluation... But the laboratory grading the diamond had to put the word "ideal" under the comments section worded as "Ideal" has been inscribed on the girdle edge of this diamond" because it was a characteristic of the diamond at the time of grading. We really hope that this concept is making sense to the public... Inscription alone is not an indicator of quality, just words on the edge of a girdle that the laboratory had to comment on.
 

Blessed

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 9, 2003
Messages
14
Hi Anna, Simon G has beautiful pave settings, great workmanship and reasonable pricing! The entire cataloge is on-line at www.simongjewelry.com! Happy shopping!!!
 

aljdewey

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 25, 2002
Messages
9,144
----------------
On 2/14/2003 11:48:13 PM Rhino wrote:


It is one thing when a consumer makes recommendations. It is another entirely different thing when a vendor comes on here and suggests their own stones. Experts come on here to give gemological information, not sell their own stones. This is in violation of the rules of this board. Why not help the client with advice on the stone he is asking about instead of waving a banner and trying to steal a sale from someone else? If you're only intent is to patronize then this is not allowed on these boards. There are stones plenty of us could point this prospective client to including myself, niceice, dbof, whiteflash, etc. however we abide by the rules. Please do the same. Besides, the specs on this stone that he found seem quite nice, why steer him away from a stone with perfectly fine proportions? Do you see something wrong with the proportions he listed that raises a red flag? If so, enlighten us.

I don't mean to sound short but I see posts here everyday where I'd love to point people to stones on my site but refrain for respect of Leonid and the rules he has laid down. Rules which I think make this board the best on the web.

Rhino
----------------

Amen....I second that. Nothing personal against Barry at all....I've heard beautiful things about his diamonds, but that post also struck me as being outside the guidelines of this forum.

If it matters at all to those of you who are vendors or appraisers....Dave Atlas, Rich Sherwood, Robin & Todd, Jonathan, Lesley.....you all conduct yourselves impeccably on this forum, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who appreciates that. I think that the best way to show appreciation for that professionalism is to do business with such organizations. If you take that kind of care to follow the dictates of this board, then I can expect you'll do everything you can to take care of your customers, too. A word of encouragement, for what it's worth.
 
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