Find your diamond
Find your jewelry
shape
carat
color
clarity

Good Old Good charges just to view a diamond?

J

jeffcwang

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 22, 2014
Messages
15
Hello,

I had read some good reviews on Good Old Gold and they have some excellent videos on YouTube. I contacted Good Old Good based on this. I am looking for a Radiant Cut Engagement Ring and asked for ASET images. Good Old Gold wants to charge me a non-refundable $300 just to give me ASET imagery to this. If I didn't like the diamond and wanted to view different ones, I would have to pay an additional $300. In fact, every shipment requires another fee. That struck me as really strange because it is impossible for me to make a buying decisions on a fancy cut without seeing ASET. I'm thinking it could take several tries to get the right ring and don't want to spend thousands just to see the ASET. Is this a standard policy? I am working with James Allen as well and they don't do this so it seems very fishy.

Any advice would be greatly welcome.

Thanks
 
GOG sometimes needs to pay to ship it in. On top of that, all the techy stuff takes up manpower hours. If a client buys, that's good and all. I believe they used to do it for free in the past. However, some took advantage by letting them do all the work and ended up buying from someone cheaper as the cheaper guy didn't provide these additional reports. So now they are asking for a fee to cover their cost and to sieve out serious buyers. I might be wrong but there was a thread about that on here once and that was my takeaway from that thread.

GOG has in house stones with reports as well. Those are similar to the JA ones where their gemologists can look at for you. The $300 fee applies to stones not in GOG's inventory. I don't think JA call in stones not in their inventory. Then again JA's listed inventory is larger than GOG's in house inventory. Different business models. Go with the one you're comfortable with.
 
The deposit is your commitment to work with them, not necessarily the stone - I don't know personally but I would think any amount you pay to bring in stones should count towards your final balance. Yes it locks you in with them but on the other hand they are also committed to find you the perfect stone for you.
 
I understand why GOG has a deposit policy. GOG seems to have a great deal of advanced imaging and a rock solid reputation, but if you think that James Allen can give you everything you want/need in a retailer then perhaps you should stick with them in the short term and avoid the deposit.
 
After spending about 10 years on PS, majority as a lurker, my impression is that GOG started to charge for viewing etc., because they had been too nice and too willing to help potential customers in choosing their perfect diamonds.

Some would ask for videos, this and that image, and not just for one stone; for them to turn around and said, sorry, we had changed our minds etc...

As others have already commented, there are other vendors who do not charge up front for "viewing", however, if I were seriously about buying from GOG, I would not hesitate to pay for viewing fee upfront and to work with them, as I know I would be getting excellent products and services from them.

It is not atypical, as some jewellers/benches would request for a design input fee upfront, to be paid towards the final cost of finished article.

Making videos, taking photos, bringing diamonds in, designing (for benches) etc., all cost money, time and efforts, hence I do not believe GOG and others who operate such a policy are being unreasonable.

DK :))
 
I would try to work with a vendor who owns their inventory, and can supply things like images and video without a great deal of effort or added cost, all of which should be par for the course. When you pay a fee, you're essentially subsidizing their risk and the costs associated with securing inventory they need in order to make a potential sale, a sizable sale at that. I consider any cost absorbed by the vendor to bring in a stone or supply relevant information on the stone a cost inherent to doing business and not a consumers responsibility, should they decide not to proceed. These vendors make good margins, particularly when they don't hold their own inventory. They should build these costs into their margin, if they don't already.

There are many other options out there. You're in the drivers seat. Good luck!
 
RandG|1404931396|3709883 said:
I would try to work with a vendor who owns their inventory, and can supply things like images and video without a great deal of effort or added cost, all of which should be par for the course. When you pay a fee, you're essentially subsidizing their risk and the costs associated with securing inventory they need in order to make a potential sale, a sizable sale at that. I consider any cost absorbed by the vendor to bring in a stone or supply relevant information on the stone a cost inherent to doing business and not a consumers responsibility, should they decide not to proceed. These vendors make good margins, particularly when they don't hold their own inventory. They should build these costs into their margin, if they don't already.

There are many other options out there. You're in the drivers seat. Good luck!
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say they were subsidizing so much as mitigating risk as the fee goes towards the final balance of the purchase. What you're saying is just increase the prices for everything to account for the cost. The problem is that 1) it's not a straightforward exercise to quantify the cost, and 2) you're now at a price disadvantage for everyone who does not raise prices.

For the record, GoG is actually one of these vendors your talking about that owns their inventory and already has a great deal of information available for them. The discussion at hand is for bringing in outside stones, which is a hassle and incurs a cost for ANY vendor.
 
GOG is the most highly regarded vendor on PS for choosing fancies for you. They go far beyond the norm in offering extensive reports, videos, and customer service. As a consumer I understand your concern, however if you are serious about wanting a top performing stone they'll find you one. I have been on PS for a while and have seen many a gorgeous fancy diamond purchased from them.

JA is a great vendor as well, they don't charge for their online videos or ASET's of stones, but you still have to educate yourself to find ones that are going to perform.
 
Roqsteady|1404931916|3709890 said:
RandG|1404931396|3709883 said:
I would try to work with a vendor who owns their inventory, and can supply things like images and video without a great deal of effort or added cost, all of which should be par for the course. When you pay a fee, you're essentially subsidizing their risk and the costs associated with securing inventory they need in order to make a potential sale, a sizable sale at that. I consider any cost absorbed by the vendor to bring in a stone or supply relevant information on the stone a cost inherent to doing business and not a consumers responsibility, should they decide not to proceed. These vendors make good margins, particularly when they don't hold their own inventory. They should build these costs into their margin, if they don't already.

There are many other options out there. You're in the drivers seat. Good luck!
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say they were subsidizing so much as mitigating risk as the fee goes towards the final balance of the purchase. What you're saying is just increase the prices for everything to account for the cost. The problem is that 1) it's not a straightforward exercise to quantify the cost, and 2) you're now at a price disadvantage for everyone who does not raise prices.

For the record, GoG is actually one of these vendors your talking about that owns their inventory and already has a great deal of information available for them. The discussion at hand is for bringing in outside stones, which is a hassle and incurs a cost for ANY vendor.
Click to expand...

They do not own all the stones listed on their site. Consumers shouldn't be compelled to lock-in to a stone merely because they asked for more information on a stone listed on the vendors site, but which is actually owned by a third party. I would stick to vendors who don't charge for information which should be readily available when evaluating a purchase of this magnitude.
 
Good Old Gold supplies more information and images (video) than any other vendor as far as I am concerned. They do specialize in excellent cut fancy cut stones and are excellent at sourcing them. I totally agree with the deposit, because people in the past would have them call in stones and then they'd buy the stone from a drop shipper. Since the deposit goes towards the purchase price of the stone, I think it is really just a commitment to buy from them if you want them do do all the imaging work and assess light return for you.

As far as James Allen is concerned, they are owned by a diamond supplier and not all of their stones are even in the US. You really won't ever get light performance video on a stone nor a comparison video between various stones. When buying sight unseen, I want what GOG provides, personally.
 
As a vendor I find this conversation very interesting.

While it is a common feeling that there are "good margins" on diamonds, in fact the margins on virtual inventory are razor thin, less than 10%. Thus the cost to bring in a diamond, examine it, and then ship it back if it is not sold are able to quickly erode the little profit that is available on the diamond.

Most of the internet vendors have huge lists of diamonds available. Much of that inventory is virtual and can be found from many different locations. Sadly, it is not uncommon for many consumers to call inquiring about several stones and wanting all of the information that can only be garnered from personal inspection and then when that information is received to go back out on the net and find which vendor is $5 cheaper than the other vendors. That cheaper vendor gets the sale without having incurred any of the expense or providing any of the information other than the cert number and measurements. That cheaper vendor will never even see the diamond, but rather have it shipped directly to the end user from the wholesaler. They will collect their 5 to 7% and go on to the next sale, leaving the vendor who was willing to provide the information holding the bag and out the shipping and insurance costs as well as the value of their time and the equipment used to provide the information.

Fair? As a vendor, I think not. As a consumer, well gosh, of course it is. (Actually, I think most consumers realize that it is not, but that does not stop many from doing it. A few have even offered me the "opportunity" to match the lower price, but only after the work has been done.)

Frankly, I admire Jonathon for taking the initiative of saying, "Hey, I will do the work, this is what it costs. If you buy the diamond I will apply it towards your purchase."

It is fair, it is only a few dollars above his actual costs if you include the value of his or an employee's time, and it lets you decide if having that information is worth the few dollars that it costs or if you would rather buy the pig in a poke. If I was a consumer who was able to do all my own testing and decision making, I would go for the cheapest vendor on the net. If I was a consumer who was going to do this once or twice in my life, I would certainly spend a few more dollars to be sure I actually got what I was paying for.

Life is full of choices. Some of them will be good, some will be okay and some will be, OUCH, I REALLY WANT A DO OVER!

As an early mentor used to tell me, "Wink, if you think education is expensive, just try ignorance."

Wink
 
Wink|1404994769|3710372 said:
As a vendor I find this conversation very interesting.

While it is a common feeling that there are "good margins" on diamonds, in fact the margins on virtual inventory are razor thin, less than 10%. Thus the cost to bring in a diamond, examine it, and then ship it back if it is not sold are able to quickly erode the little profit that is available on the diamond.

Most of the internet vendors have huge lists of diamonds available. Much of that inventory is virtual and can be found from many different locations. Sadly, it is not uncommon for many consumers to call inquiring about several stones and wanting all of the information that can only be garnered from personal inspection and then when that information is received to go back out on the net and find which vendor is $5 cheaper than the other vendors. That cheaper vendor gets the sale without having incurred any of the expense or providing any of the information other than the cert number and measurements. That cheaper vendor will never even see the diamond, but rather have it shipped directly to the end user from the wholesaler. They will collect their 5 to 7% and go on to the next sale, leaving the vendor who was willing to provide the information holding the bag and out the shipping and insurance costs as well as the value of their time and the equipment used to provide the information.

Fair? As a vendor, I think not. As a consumer, well gosh, of course it is. (Actually, I think most consumers realize that it is not, but that does not stop many from doing it. A few have even offered me the "opportunity" to match the lower price, but only after the work has been done.)

Frankly, I admire Jonathon for taking the initiative of saying, "Hey, I will do the work, this is what it costs. If you buy the diamond I will apply it towards your purchase."

It is fair, it is only a few dollars above his actual costs if you include the value of his or an employee's time, and it lets you decide if having that information is worth the few dollars that it costs or if you would rather buy the pig in a poke. If I was a consumer who was able to do all my own testing and decision making, I would go for the cheapest vendor on the net. If I was a consumer who was going to do this once or twice in my life, I would certainly spend a few more dollars to be sure I actually got what I was paying for.

Life is full of choices. Some of them will be good, some will be okay and some will be, OUCH, I REALLY WANT A DO OVER!

As an early mentor used to tell me, "Wink, if you think education is expensive, just try ignorance."

Wink
Click to expand...

I don't doubt its a tough market for dealers. But this idea that diamond traders, and this one in particular has "razor thin" margins is just lost on me. I recently had a vendor quote several stones, all of which were listed on Rap, and the margin they added was anything but "razor thin". Conversely, I had a different but comparable stone quoted by another vendor and the margin was reasonable, although still not "razor thin", but fair. If a consumer is shopping around its because they're being prudent and doing their diligence. Asking for a commitment fee before actually selling the consumer on why you're the vendor of choice is not the answer. Car dealerships don't charge for a test drive, and they certainly have costs inherent to having ancillary vehicles available for consumers. Just like diamond vendors, I'm sure they build those costs of into their model. I can't think of a viable business that doesn't.

The transparency that has come to this industry over the last 15 years, although still not enough, has made it possible for consumers to shop around, and attempt to get the best deal, not to mention make better choices because there is a plethora of available information. It's a competitive market and this buyer has other options, free of upfront costs. I know I'd exercise my option to walk away and find another dealer.
 
jeffcwang said:
Hello,

I had read some good reviews on Good Old Gold and they have some excellent videos on YouTube. I contacted Good Old Good based on this. I am looking for a Radiant Cut Engagement Ring and asked for ASET images. Good Old Gold wants to charge me a non-refundable $300 just to give me ASET imagery to this. If I didn't like the diamond and wanted to view different ones, I would have to pay an additional $300. In fact, every shipment requires another fee. That struck me as really strange because it is impossible for me to make a buying decisions on a fancy cut without seeing ASET. I'm thinking it could take several tries to get the right ring and don't want to spend thousands just to see the ASET. Is this a standard policy? I am working with James Allen as well and they don't do this so it seems very fishy.

Any advice would be greatly welcome.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Hunting for an outline shape such as a Radiant, choosing from virtual inventory and then judging it by ASET is in my opinion the wrong way to go.

Most radiant cuts are not designed with a primary emphasis on returning high angle light back to the viewer from edge to edge like a round brilliant. Other factors such as outline shape, spread, scintillation pattern, yield, and color are given more equal consideration in this cutting style.

You will be choosing the best out of a finite number of mediocre performing stones in this regard. If that will be your selection method it is fraught with error. Its easy to select the best from the worst in terms of brightness with ASET but when all of them are somewhere in the middle that is where an overall assessment is more valuable. I would prefer video comparisons and live viewings for this outline shape.

I don't see anything wrong with their policy, it is disclosed up front and protects their time and shipping expenses and the deposit is credited against your future purchase. But if committing to one vendor at this stage bothers you than perhaps you should restrict your search to other vendors who don't require any commitment.
 
I agree with GOG's policy and Wink's statement. In this case, the customer is making a special request for essentially testing and inspection of a stone that the vendor has to call in. If you don't like that, then you find a dealer who specializes in radiants and keeps great ones in stock or has a relationship with a cutter who makes them. Diamonds by Lauren used to have radiants, although most of theirs are yellow.

Nobody expects a house inspector in inspect a house for free. Auto shops charge to do a vehicle inspection. NDT inspectors don't work for free. Pay the experts for their services, or go home,
 
I find it difficult to comprehend why one would quibble about paying a few hundred dollars for professional products and services upfront towards the final cost of a supposingly once in a lifetime purchase costing thousands more!

DK :confused:
 
Roqsteady|1404931916|3709890 said:
RandG|1404931396|3709883 said:
I would try to work with a vendor who owns their inventory, and can supply things like images and video without a great deal of effort or added cost, all of which should be par for the course. When you pay a fee, you're essentially subsidizing their risk and the costs associated with securing inventory they need in order to make a potential sale, a sizable sale at that. I consider any cost absorbed by the vendor to bring in a stone or supply relevant information on the stone a cost inherent to doing business and not a consumers responsibility, should they decide not to proceed. These vendors make good margins, particularly when they don't hold their own inventory. They should build these costs into their margin, if they don't already.

There are many other options out there. You're in the drivers seat. Good luck!
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say they were subsidizing so much as mitigating risk as the fee goes towards the final balance of the purchase. What you're saying is just increase the prices for everything to account for the cost. The problem is that 1) it's not a straightforward exercise to quantify the cost, and 2) you're now at a price disadvantage for everyone who does not raise prices.

For the record, GoG is actually one of these vendors your talking about that owns their inventory and already has a great deal of information available for them. The discussion at hand is for bringing in outside stones, which is a hassle and incurs a cost for ANY vendor.
Click to expand...

Actually, not every vendor incurs a cost to bring in diamonds. Some of us are located right where the cutters are, so no shipping is required- and the cutters make it no hassle at all for those of us who actually purchase inventory.

I don't blame any vendor for charging to bring stones in. But every seller has different considerations.
 
MelisendeDiamonds|1405002912|3710458 said:
jeffcwang said:
Hello,

I had read some good reviews on Good Old Gold and they have some excellent videos on YouTube. I contacted Good Old Good based on this. I am looking for a Radiant Cut Engagement Ring and asked for ASET images. Good Old Gold wants to charge me a non-refundable $300 just to give me ASET imagery to this. If I didn't like the diamond and wanted to view different ones, I would have to pay an additional $300. In fact, every shipment requires another fee. That struck me as really strange because it is impossible for me to make a buying decisions on a fancy cut without seeing ASET. I'm thinking it could take several tries to get the right ring and don't want to spend thousands just to see the ASET. Is this a standard policy? I am working with James Allen as well and they don't do this so it seems very fishy.

Any advice would be greatly welcome.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Hunting for an outline shape such as a Radiant, choosing from virtual inventory and then judging it by ASET is in my opinion the wrong way to go.

Most radiant cuts are not designed with a primary emphasis on returning high angle light back to the viewer from edge to edge like a round brilliant. Other factors such as outline shape, spread, scintillation pattern, yield, and color are given more equal consideration in this cutting style.

You will be choosing the best out of a finite number of mediocre performing stones in this regard. If that will be your selection method it is fraught with error. Its easy to select the best from the worst in terms of brightness with ASET but when all of them are somewhere in the middle that is where an overall assessment is more valuable. I would prefer video comparisons and live viewings for this outline shape.

I don't see anything wrong with their policy, it is disclosed up front and protects their time and shipping expenses and the deposit is credited against your future purchase. But if committing to one vendor at this stage bothers you than perhaps you should restrict your search to other vendors who don't require any commitment.
Click to expand...

Thank you Melisende- for expressing this so well. The use of ASET for radiant Cut diamonds, and other shapes is far more complex than round diamonds when it comes to correlating the ASET with what looks good in real life.
 
RandG|1404998031|3710408 said:
Wink|1404994769|3710372 said:
As a vendor I find this conversation very interesting.

While it is a common feeling that there are "good margins" on diamonds, in fact the margins on virtual inventory are razor thin, less than 10%. Thus the cost to bring in a diamond, examine it, and then ship it back if it is not sold are able to quickly erode the little profit that is available on the diamond.

Most of the internet vendors have huge lists of diamonds available. Much of that inventory is virtual and can be found from many different locations. Sadly, it is not uncommon for many consumers to call inquiring about several stones and wanting all of the information that can only be garnered from personal inspection and then when that information is received to go back out on the net and find which vendor is $5 cheaper than the other vendors. That cheaper vendor gets the sale without having incurred any of the expense or providing any of the information other than the cert number and measurements. That cheaper vendor will never even see the diamond, but rather have it shipped directly to the end user from the wholesaler. They will collect their 5 to 7% and go on to the next sale, leaving the vendor who was willing to provide the information holding the bag and out the shipping and insurance costs as well as the value of their time and the equipment used to provide the information.

Fair? As a vendor, I think not. As a consumer, well gosh, of course it is. (Actually, I think most consumers realize that it is not, but that does not stop many from doing it. A few have even offered me the "opportunity" to match the lower price, but only after the work has been done.)

Frankly, I admire Jonathon for taking the initiative of saying, "Hey, I will do the work, this is what it costs. If you buy the diamond I will apply it towards your purchase."

It is fair, it is only a few dollars above his actual costs if you include the value of his or an employee's time, and it lets you decide if having that information is worth the few dollars that it costs or if you would rather buy the pig in a poke. If I was a consumer who was able to do all my own testing and decision making, I would go for the cheapest vendor on the net. If I was a consumer who was going to do this once or twice in my life, I would certainly spend a few more dollars to be sure I actually got what I was paying for.

Life is full of choices. Some of them will be good, some will be okay and some will be, OUCH, I REALLY WANT A DO OVER!

As an early mentor used to tell me, "Wink, if you think education is expensive, just try ignorance."

Wink
Click to expand...

I don't doubt its a tough market for dealers. But this idea that diamond traders, and this one in particular has "razor thin" margins is just lost on me. I recently had a vendor quote several stones, all of which were listed on Rap, and the margin they added was anything but "razor thin". Conversely, I had a different but comparable stone quoted by another vendor and the margin was reasonable, although still not "razor thin", but fair. If a consumer is shopping around its because they're being prudent and doing their diligence. Asking for a commitment fee before actually selling the consumer on why you're the vendor of choice is not the answer. Car dealerships don't charge for a test drive, and they certainly have costs inherent to having ancillary vehicles available for consumers. Just like diamond vendors, I'm sure they build those costs of into their model. I can't think of a viable business that doesn't.

The transparency that has come to this industry over the last 15 years, although still not enough, has made it possible for consumers to shop around, and attempt to get the best deal, not to mention make better choices because there is a plethora of available information. It's a competitive market and this buyer has other options, free of upfront costs. I know I'd exercise my option to walk away and find another dealer.
Click to expand...

I'd agree to a certain extent, but the only dealer I know of that does this free of charge is James Allen, and even they had to change their policy from unlimited idealscopes/ASETs to just 3 per customer, probably because they were dealing with the same issue. Car dealerships are a good example that prove your point of a business model that exists. However I'm not convinced that everyone needs to adopt it or that it's like you said "the answer." Is it consumer friendly? yes - but like you said you are essentially paying a higher final cost of the car to pay for those "free" services that they've incorporated into their model. I don't see how having the upfront "cost," which is arguably not a cost if you decide to go with the vendor since it counts towards the balance, is any less transparent or viable.

This is especially true over the internet, where you don't even have the semblance of commitment that would be their walking to your store/car lot. It takes less than a minute to shoot an email to ask for IS/ASET images on 10+ several different stones. Are vendors supposed to respond to every one of these emails, paying shipping and insurance + man hours to scan/verify eye cleanliness/take photo and video, etc. without verifying they're a serious buyer? I can't think of a viable business that would.

I guess it's just a fundamental difference in what we think should be a customer-first vs. reasonable business model. You say you would go to another dealer, but what online (or even retail) dealer do you know provides all the information GoG does on stones not in their inventory at no cost besides James Allen (which is still not as much info as GoG provides, but is decent)?
 
I'd agree that the vendors should charge a fee for bringing in a cyber stone for photos, ASET, etc...b/c if they do it for free then they would have to hire a dozen people just to take photos to satisfy every tire kickers on the internet.
 
Roqsteady|1405016672|3710668 said:
snip.....

I'd agree to a certain extent, but the only dealer I know of that does this free of charge is James Allen, and even they had to change their policy from unlimited idealscopes/ASETs to just 3 per customer, probably because they were dealing with the same issue. Car dealerships are a good example that prove your point of a business model that exists. However I'm not convinced that everyone needs to adopt it or that it's like you said "the answer." Is it consumer friendly? yes - but like you said you are essentially paying a higher final cost of the car to pay for those "free" services that they've incorporated into their model. I don't see how having the upfront "cost," which is arguably not a cost if you decide to go with the vendor since it counts towards the balance, is any less transparent or viable.

This is especially true over the internet, where you don't even have the semblance of commitment that would be their walking to your store/car lot. It takes less than a minute to shoot an email to ask for IS/ASET images on 10+ several different stones. Are vendors supposed to respond to every one of these emails, paying shipping and insurance + man hours to scan/verify eye cleanliness/take photo and video, etc. without verifying they're a serious buyer? I can't think of a viable business that would.

I guess it's just a fundamental difference in what we think should be a customer-first vs. reasonable business model. You say you would go to another dealer, but what online (or even retail) dealer do you know provides all the information GoG does on stones not in their inventory at no cost besides James Allen (which is still not as much info as GoG provides, but is decent)?
Click to expand...

Roq- actually there are many other dealers that will bring in stones, and give very thorough info without charge.
We do- and I know for a fact there are others besides JA that will bring in stones for clients without charging.
 
Rockdiamond|1405026686|3710815 said:
Roq- actually there are many other dealers that will bring in stones without charge- we do- and I know for a fact there are others besides JA.
Click to expand...

So any customer can request to bring a stone in and request scope/reflector images with no monetary commitment? That's great to know! What other vendors provide this service? It would be good to have a list of them so we know when advising other members of additional options without committing to a vendor for their search.
 
Roq- I agree that a broad range of choices is beneficial for consumers.
In terms of scopes and reflector images- not every dealer uses them.
For fancy shapes in particular, actual photos and videos are far more informative to consumers IMO.
 
...If a consumer is shopping around its because they're being prudent and doing their diligence. Asking for a commitment fee before actually selling the consumer on why you're the vendor of choice is not the answer. Car dealerships don't charge for a test drive, and they certainly have costs inherent to having ancillary vehicles available for consumers. Just like diamond vendors, I'm sure they build those costs of into their model. I can't think of a viable business that doesn't.
Click to expand...

I had two more thoughts regarding that analogy:

First, the consumer should shop around. But they should do their evaluations of a vendor and that vendor's policies up front. If you know you don't want to pay anything but rock-bottom price, then just save everyone some irritation and useless work by committing to the vendor who fits your price range, then work with that vendor. Expecting some vendor like GOG to do the test work for free, then you go buy from the rock-bottom vendor who COULD NOT MEET YOUR TESTING AND INSPECTION REQUIREMENTS is just plain ludicrous and dishonest. So, GOG charges what the work is worth, and then if you buy, it's credited toward the sale, and if you don't, then you've paid for the work that you requested and you received. There is nothing unfair about that.

Second, the car dealer business model doesn't fit. No car dealer will bend over backward to "call in" and then fully test and inspect a car for you, at dealer's expense, just so you can test drive it. You test drive what's already there in stock, right? And that is going to be a vehicle that the dealer has in-house, because he or she knows the local market and what will be easy to sell. It's not going to be a rare and desirable "fancy" (in most cases,) unless the manufacturer is closing out some slow-movers and offering dealers lower wholesale prices to get rid of them. Yes, they can locate and bring in a car for you. But it's with the expectation that you have moved beyond the test-drive stage and are committing to the purchase. And yes, you can rest assured that the dealer is covering his/her costs on the vehicle and is making a profit on the sale. ;) Otherwise, they'd go bankrupt and shuttered very fast.
 
This is the business of selling diamonds, not Diamond Consultancy, Inc. I'm paying for a product, and all cost of sales inherent to a dealer selling that product should be built into the price, at the time of sale. As with all product sales, some customers will inquire and not buy while many will. That's the risk/reward every business takes. For as many consumers who do ask for these additional tools to evaluate a stone, there are plenty of others who don't ask for anything more than a GIA report (like myself). It all balances out in the end, I'm sure. I applaud James Allen. I gather they offer these services to market and differentiate their business over that of another, and the value is evident in their profitability or they wouldn't be doing it. Seems pretty smart to me. Makes me want to buy from them!

Given the generous margins dealers apply to stones sourced on Rap and brought in on memo (which I consider pretty risk free), I believe all costs for time invested in justifying one stone over another are covered. It's not helpful to confuse the work of a professional services consultant and someone selling a physical product. Of course you pay a home inspector. Their time and professional expertise is the product. A diamond dealer is only "consulting" so to lead to a sale of a high value item. Plus, the dealer not only has the chance to sell a stone today at a pretty nice margin, but also a mounting, wedding bands, wedding gifts between bride and groom, push presents and every other item a consumer will source through that trusted vendor. The good will invested by the dealer at the front-end will pay dividends long into the future.


Good debate though and certainly worth continued exploration!
 
Good comments. Just some input.

DF you couldn't be more correct.

David you are assuming I am acquiring diamonds only from NY. Truth of the matter is we would be paying to have diamonds shipped in from out of state for this particular call and we are also not beyond shipping in diamonds from other parts of the world if needs be. The best cutters we know for this particular call are not in NY.

Unlike vendors who either limit their suppliers to a certain small group of facilities or even ones located in just one city we will scour sources globally or internationally when we know the best cutters for a particular call are outside of our local NY region.

With regards to the analogy of cars I wish it were that easy. Unlike cars that are the same regardless of what dealership you go to, there can be a plethora of gemological reasons that separate one diamond from another even when the paperwork is seemingly identical. While this is true with rounds it is especially true when it comes to fancy shapes.

Kind regards,
Rhino
 
TC1987|1405028228|3710835 said:
Second, the car dealer business model doesn't fit. No car dealer will bend over backward to "call in" and then fully test and inspect a car for you, at dealer's expense, just so you can test drive it. You test drive what's already there in stock, right? And that is going to be a vehicle that the dealer has in-house, because he or she knows the local market and what will be easy to sell. It's not going to be a rare and desirable "fancy" (in most cases,) unless the manufacturer is closing out some slow-movers and offering dealers lower wholesale prices to get rid of them. Yes, they can locate and bring in a car for you. But it's with the expectation that you have moved beyond the test-drive stage and are committing to the purchase. And yes, you can rest assured that the dealer is covering his/her costs on the vehicle and is making a profit on the sale. ;) Otherwise, they'd go bankrupt and shuttered very fast.
Click to expand...

A good example would be Car Max. they do charge a fee for shipping in a car for you to look see and test drive.

I will only inquire about in-house stones b/c I don't wanna waste my time nor the vendor's time on a cyber stone. I would feel bad if I asked the vendor to call in 3 stones and then pass on all 3 after they have taken the time to shoot videos, I-scopes, etc..
 
Also, you don't keep paying a separate fee, its a one time flat fee that gets applied towards the purchase. I am SO glad I went with GOG because their experience and knowledge was well worth the small deposit I paid towards having several stones shipped to them to view, analyze, video and comment on. I wouldn't hesitate to use them or recommend them- I had a fantastic experience and such a personal experience that will bring happy memories (and a gorgeous emerald cut stone) for life. :love:
 
HI Jon,
I actually made no assumptions whatsoever about your business- a member said that bringing in stones involved cost and hassle for any vendor. That is not true.
Each seller has their own considerations.
We do find most of what we need right here- but like you sometimes we will call stones from other markets.
The NY market is incredibly well packed with goods- so it's generally not necessary.

It is any vendors right to charge to bring in stones- no debate about that.
But not all do.
 
Rockdiamond|1405034528|3710903 said:
HI Jon,
I actually made no assumptions whatsoever about your business- a member said that bringing in stones involved cost and hassle for any vendor. That is not true.
Each seller has their own considerations.
We do find most of what we need right here- but like you sometimes we will call stones from other markets.
The NY market is incredibly well packed with goods- so it's generally not necessary.

It is any vendors right to charge to bring in stones- no debate about that.
But not all do.
Click to expand...


... you forgot to mention that you do not provide the many value-adding tools/services that GOG provides.
In fact for years you've argued against tools for cut evaluation. :knockout:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
GET 3 FREE HCA RESULTS JOIN THE FORUM. ASK FOR HELP
Jewelry Blog
PriceScope-Concierge-Ad
Find prime cuts.
Top