Cherokee1979
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2011
- Messages
- 246
Howdy, fellow PS’ers! The name’s Cherokee… first-time caller, long-time listener. 
Let me initially say that everyone’s advice and knowledge on this forum has been invaluable, and GREATLY appreciate any sage wisdom from you on PS! 
I would have NOWHERE NEAR the amount of knowledge or confidence I now have regarding diamonds (albeit comparatively small) without the kind help of all of you. 
Well, if you are ready for a rambling hot mess of my neurotic ramblings, PS, here goes! 
For the sake of clarity, I will number the various questions that I have, and some are, admittedly, more like "stream of consciousness ramblings", in which I detail my planned course of action and seek from you your advice!
1. I have been conducting a good amount of research into diamond buying during the past month or so, via PS, trips to local B&M’s, etc., and I believe that I have decided upon the best route for me to purchase the diamond of *MY* dreams (I joke with my girlfriend that I will likely fall more in love with her ER than she will!
Seriously though - and as a bit of background, she is a sweetheart and very, VERY laid-back and not at all a “blingy” person. I just want her to get the best for our money, so that we can dedicate the rest to something more utilitarian, like a house downpayment). In any event, I plan to go the following route, and I was wondering what the PS’ers out there think of the wisdom of this course? First, I will describe the specs of the desired stone to (hopefully ) get some of your feedback regarding the same, and then I will set forth my planned route to purchase the stone (which is, admittedly, quite unorthodox 
), to seek your opinions on that matter.
2. As for the stone, I am looking for a RB between .94 -1.15 carats (and will go with the former if I find there to be a significant difference in price, which I suspect will be the case), G-H color, VS2. Any imput on those specs? Thanks! As for the cut, I mention this below:
3. I, like many here I imagine, would like to obtain a stone with a very, very good cut. After conducting a good amount of research on PS, I am leaning toward an AGS0 ideal-cut stone. My diamond source (discussed in RIDICULOUS detail in #5 below ) can obtain stones either via AGS or GIA, and I am tending to lean toward AGS due to their seemingly better reputation for stricter cut an clarity grading. My question is- do you think that going with an AGS0 stone is preferable, if one is quite concerned with cut quality, as opposed to a GIA “triple excellent” stone? On this note, I found the following data contained in the very helpful article written by Dave Atlas and Garry Holloway, pertaining to AGSL vs. GIA diamond cut grading to be particularly noteworthy https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamond-grading/discussions::: “It is most common for diamonds submitted to AGSL to be of or close to AGS 0. Diamonds graded with AGS ‘ideal’ proportions, polish and symmetry … can have a premium of about 8% - 10% over the same grade GIA-GTL diamonds….” And “Diamonds with AGSL reports command the same or slightly higher prices as GIA-GTL graded diamonds. The market perceives a high level of trust in AGSL color and clarity grading; however their reputation has more to do with AGS being the “ideal cut” brand.” Is the slight extra premium paid for some AGS stones worth it?
4. As mentioned, my girlfriend is by NO MEANS blingy or a “cut nut”; rather, only the old man (yours truly
). To be quite honest, she could give two you-know-whats less about whether her stone is an ideal vs. excellent vs. very good vs. ran through a wood chipper/crushed ice . Accordingly, and with her preferences in mind, although I am pretty dead-set on getting an AGS0 stone, I wonder whether it is worth paying the premium for a H&A stone (which I’m not even sure if my stone supplier will have in stock)? From reading many of the PS posts on this issue (including one that included a link to the following on cut precision http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-precision), it appears to me that many posters who really care about cut, but not die-hard cut symmetry cut-nuts, seem to think that going with an AGS0 will be just as good, if not more economical, as going with paying the premium for a H&A stone. Any thoughts on this? 
5. Now, finally getting to my unorthodox plan to obtain the stone (and let me AGAIN say in advance that ANY of your feedback regarding this scheme would be GREATLY appreciated ). Anyways, my cousin lives in NY and is a part-time jeweler. He used to work as a diamond setter for Tiffany & Co. (i.e., the evil empire 
), and he had offered to obtain a stone for me from his wholesaler AT COST 
. I have been reading that the mark-up for loose diamonds by vendors (particularly online vendors and B&M’s) is not very high (is this true??), but in any event, after telling my cousin to get a quote from his wholesaler for a price of a stone with SOMEWHAT similar specs I mentioned above (aside from the cut, which my cousin, oddly, did not specify to me), he gave me the following stone as an exemplar: 1.15 carat RB, VS1 to VS2, G - $5,700. This seemed pretty dang good to me for a certed stone . Oh, and by means of background, my budget for the stone ALONE is between $5,000-$5,800. According to my cousin, this wholesaler of his has numerous, numerous stones going through his hands every day, and, apparently, what is in stock one day might not be in stock the following day. Accordingly, he gave me the above stone only as an example in pricing. In any event, my cousin tells me that he will be able to obtain from the wholesaler, for him to hold for two days, two stones. He had said that he could tell the wholesaler that both must be AGS certed. With this in mind, I plan to tell my cousin to select two stones with the following specs: (1) .9-ish RB, G-H color, VS2, AGS0, (2) 1.15-ish RB, G-H color, VS2, AGS0. My cousin had initially stated that he would like me to meet with him in person to look at the two stones before selecting, but I have planned otherwise for the following reasons…. And I would LOVE to hear what you think about this plan! Anyways, I live in PA, and would prefer not to fly up to see him in NY b/c (1) it will be a pain in the butt to fly up there and I trust him greatly, and (2) MUCH, MUCH more importantly, if I do not like the specs of either of the 2 stones that he selected (after having looked at the certs – which I will have him fax to me – and plugging the cut info into the HCA, doing some online price comparisons, etc.), I could then much more easily tell my cousin “No, Thanks”, as opposed to having felt “pot-committed” to pick one of the two there in person no matter what b/c I flew my skinny Irish butt all the dang way up there. Anyways, I had thought that this fax plan might be helpful because it would give me 2 days to research the stones before deciding, and I could possibly post the 2 reports onto PS to see what you all think?? 
6. If I do get one of the two stones from my cousin, I was going to wire the funds to his bank and then have him ship the stone to me. What way would you ship them (and must it be insured)? I have read on PS that many of the posters prefer insured, registered mail (and, amazingly, even the Hope Diamond was shipped via registered mail by Harry Winston ). However, I spoke to one of the reps with JA yesterday (I will be obtaining a platinum 6-prong Tiffany-style setting from them – at the following link: http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/solitaire/diamond-solitaire-rings.html), and they tell me that they ship via FexEx, insured. I DO trust registered mail, but I hear that they can take FOREVER AND A DAY . I am not in a huge rush, but I’d certainly like to get the ring to my gf sooner than later, as she has been VERY patient, and an absolute sweetheart!
7. JA tells me that they will set my stone in the above setting for an additional fee of $100 (for a total cost of approx. $1,225). Does anyone have experience with JA setting stones for them or the quality of their work? Is anyone familiar with this particular setting? I remember reading the following post [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/let-me-show-you-my-new-ring-by-james-allen.163844/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/let-me-show-you-my-new-ring-by-james-allen.163844/[/URL] – in which PS poster “bluemoon 2” has this setting. My girlfriend really likes the classic Tiffany-style setting, and, after having looked at virtually all of the other knock-offs (i.e., via WF, BGD, etc.), I PERSONALLY think that JA comes closest to the Tiffany design, or, at least, the aspects of the design that we particularly like (and I'd FAR rather cut off my pinky toes with pruning shears than pay Tiffany for one of their exorbitantly-priced ER's
)
8. And, finally, I have selected a WHOLLY independent GIA-gratuate appraiser located here in Pittsburgh (http://www.pittsburghjewelryappraisers.com/) and he seems like a very nice and competent man. An appraisal will cost me only $75. If it were you, would you get the stone appraised first (i.e., before sending it to JA to set) or after (i.e., after getting the finished ring back from JA – which I understand is harder to evaluate the stone after it is set, but that way, I could verify that the stone I get back from JA was the same one I sent them)?
Well, THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH for your taking the time to read my ramblings and hair-brained schemes! I would be shocked if anyone read this whole hot mess , let alone took the time to respond to it! However, to be honest, I would not be surprised after seeing how very helpful and willing to share of your time and experience all of you have been. Thanks again, PS community. I sincerely hope to hear from someone! Best,
Cherokee
Let me initially say that everyone’s advice and knowledge on this forum has been invaluable, and GREATLY appreciate any sage wisdom from you on PS! I would have NOWHERE NEAR the amount of knowledge or confidence I now have regarding diamonds (albeit comparatively small) without the kind help of all of you. Well, if you are ready for a rambling hot mess of my neurotic ramblings, PS, here goes! For the sake of clarity, I will number the various questions that I have, and some are, admittedly, more like "stream of consciousness ramblings", in which I detail my planned course of action and seek from you your advice!
1. I have been conducting a good amount of research into diamond buying during the past month or so, via PS, trips to local B&M’s, etc., and I believe that I have decided upon the best route for me to purchase the diamond of *MY* dreams (I joke with my girlfriend that I will likely fall more in love with her ER than she will!
Seriously though - and as a bit of background, she is a sweetheart and very, VERY laid-back and not at all a “blingy” person. I just want her to get the best for our money, so that we can dedicate the rest to something more utilitarian, like a house downpayment). In any event, I plan to go the following route, and I was wondering what the PS’ers out there think of the wisdom of this course? First, I will describe the specs of the desired stone to (hopefully ) get some of your feedback regarding the same, and then I will set forth my planned route to purchase the stone (which is, admittedly, quite unorthodox ), to seek your opinions on that matter.2. As for the stone, I am looking for a RB between .94 -1.15 carats (and will go with the former if I find there to be a significant difference in price, which I suspect will be the case), G-H color, VS2. Any imput on those specs? Thanks! As for the cut, I mention this below:
3. I, like many here I imagine, would like to obtain a stone with a very, very good cut. After conducting a good amount of research on PS, I am leaning toward an AGS0 ideal-cut stone. My diamond source (discussed in RIDICULOUS detail in #5 below
) can obtain stones either via AGS or GIA, and I am tending to lean toward AGS due to their seemingly better reputation for stricter cut an clarity grading. My question is- do you think that going with an AGS0 stone is preferable, if one is quite concerned with cut quality, as opposed to a GIA “triple excellent” stone? On this note, I found the following data contained in the very helpful article written by Dave Atlas and Garry Holloway, pertaining to AGSL vs. GIA diamond cut grading to be particularly noteworthy https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamond-grading/discussions::: “It is most common for diamonds submitted to AGSL to be of or close to AGS 0. Diamonds graded with AGS ‘ideal’ proportions, polish and symmetry … can have a premium of about 8% - 10% over the same grade GIA-GTL diamonds….” And “Diamonds with AGSL reports command the same or slightly higher prices as GIA-GTL graded diamonds. The market perceives a high level of trust in AGSL color and clarity grading; however their reputation has more to do with AGS being the “ideal cut” brand.” Is the slight extra premium paid for some AGS stones worth it?4. As mentioned, my girlfriend is by NO MEANS blingy or a “cut nut”; rather, only the old man (yours truly
). To be quite honest, she could give two you-know-whats less about whether her stone is an ideal vs. excellent vs. very good vs. ran through a wood chipper/crushed ice . Accordingly, and with her preferences in mind, although I am pretty dead-set on getting an AGS0 stone, I wonder whether it is worth paying the premium for a H&A stone (which I’m not even sure if my stone supplier will have in stock)? From reading many of the PS posts on this issue (including one that included a link to the following on cut precision http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-precision), it appears to me that many posters who really care about cut, but not die-hard cut symmetry cut-nuts, seem to think that going with an AGS0 will be just as good, if not more economical, as going with paying the premium for a H&A stone. Any thoughts on this? 5. Now, finally getting to my unorthodox plan to obtain the stone (and let me AGAIN say in advance that ANY of your feedback regarding this scheme would be GREATLY appreciated
). Anyways, my cousin lives in NY and is a part-time jeweler. He used to work as a diamond setter for Tiffany & Co. (i.e., the evil empire ), and he had offered to obtain a stone for me from his wholesaler AT COST . I have been reading that the mark-up for loose diamonds by vendors (particularly online vendors and B&M’s) is not very high (is this true??), but in any event, after telling my cousin to get a quote from his wholesaler for a price of a stone with SOMEWHAT similar specs I mentioned above (aside from the cut, which my cousin, oddly, did not specify to me), he gave me the following stone as an exemplar: 1.15 carat RB, VS1 to VS2, G - $5,700. This seemed pretty dang good to me for a certed stone . Oh, and by means of background, my budget for the stone ALONE is between $5,000-$5,800. According to my cousin, this wholesaler of his has numerous, numerous stones going through his hands every day, and, apparently, what is in stock one day might not be in stock the following day. Accordingly, he gave me the above stone only as an example in pricing. In any event, my cousin tells me that he will be able to obtain from the wholesaler, for him to hold for two days, two stones. He had said that he could tell the wholesaler that both must be AGS certed. With this in mind, I plan to tell my cousin to select two stones with the following specs: (1) .9-ish RB, G-H color, VS2, AGS0, (2) 1.15-ish RB, G-H color, VS2, AGS0. My cousin had initially stated that he would like me to meet with him in person to look at the two stones before selecting, but I have planned otherwise for the following reasons…. And I would LOVE to hear what you think about this plan! Anyways, I live in PA, and would prefer not to fly up to see him in NY b/c (1) it will be a pain in the butt to fly up there and I trust him greatly, and (2) MUCH, MUCH more importantly, if I do not like the specs of either of the 2 stones that he selected (after having looked at the certs – which I will have him fax to me – and plugging the cut info into the HCA, doing some online price comparisons, etc.), I could then much more easily tell my cousin “No, Thanks”, as opposed to having felt “pot-committed” to pick one of the two there in person no matter what b/c I flew my skinny Irish butt all the dang way up there. Anyways, I had thought that this fax plan might be helpful because it would give me 2 days to research the stones before deciding, and I could possibly post the 2 reports onto PS to see what you all think?? 6. If I do get one of the two stones from my cousin, I was going to wire the funds to his bank and then have him ship the stone to me. What way would you ship them (and must it be insured)? I have read on PS that many of the posters prefer insured, registered mail (and, amazingly, even the Hope Diamond was shipped via registered mail by Harry Winston
). However, I spoke to one of the reps with JA yesterday (I will be obtaining a platinum 6-prong Tiffany-style setting from them – at the following link: http://www.jamesallen.com/engagement-rings/solitaire/diamond-solitaire-rings.html), and they tell me that they ship via FexEx, insured. I DO trust registered mail, but I hear that they can take FOREVER AND A DAY . I am not in a huge rush, but I’d certainly like to get the ring to my gf sooner than later, as she has been VERY patient, and an absolute sweetheart!7. JA tells me that they will set my stone in the above setting for an additional fee of $100 (for a total cost of approx. $1,225). Does anyone have experience with JA setting stones for them or the quality of their work? Is anyone familiar with this particular setting? I remember reading the following post [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/let-me-show-you-my-new-ring-by-james-allen.163844/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/let-me-show-you-my-new-ring-by-james-allen.163844/[/URL] – in which PS poster “bluemoon 2” has this setting. My girlfriend really likes the classic Tiffany-style setting, and, after having looked at virtually all of the other knock-offs (i.e., via WF, BGD, etc.), I PERSONALLY think that JA comes closest to the Tiffany design, or, at least, the aspects of the design that we particularly like (and I'd FAR rather cut off my pinky toes with pruning shears than pay Tiffany for one of their exorbitantly-priced ER's
)8. And, finally, I have selected a WHOLLY independent GIA-gratuate appraiser located here in Pittsburgh (http://www.pittsburghjewelryappraisers.com/) and he seems like a very nice and competent man. An appraisal will cost me only $75. If it were you, would you get the stone appraised first (i.e., before sending it to JA to set) or after (i.e., after getting the finished ring back from JA – which I understand is harder to evaluate the stone after it is set, but that way, I could verify that the stone I get back from JA was the same one I sent them)?
Well, THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH for your taking the time to read my ramblings and hair-brained schemes!
I would be shocked if anyone read this whole hot mess , let alone took the time to respond to it! However, to be honest, I would not be surprised after seeing how very helpful and willing to share of your time and experience all of you have been. Thanks again, PS community. I sincerely hope to hear from someone! Best,Cherokee
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