Feeling uncertain. Round brilliant in cushion setting.

[priscilla]

Hi! My husband upgraded my ring for our 10 year anniversary. I feel like the setting and/or center stone are off. I'm not feeling comfortable with it so I might be changing it soon. I was hoping to get some opinions and guidance. I was told I should repost in Rocky Talky for advice on stone and setting.
Here are the details of my stone:
Shape Round Brilliant
Measurements 7.48-7.41 x4.60mm
Depth 61.7%
Carat Weight 1.56CT
Cut Grade EGL IDEAL
Clarity Grade VS1
Color Grade I
Fluorescence None
Polish Excellent
Symmetry Excellent



Original Post [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/feeling-uncertain-round-brilliant-in-cushion-setting.210129/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/feeling-uncertain-round-brilliant-in-cushion-setting.210129/[/URL]

 

[chrono]

Can you return the stone?
Can you return the setting?
I'm not sure what you are looking for in terms of advice and support.

 

[priscilla]

Yes I can return both the stone and the setting. I'm looking for advice on how I could get more/better for my money, like what specs should I require for the stone. When I return it I do have to buy something from the same store because I am outside the return period but they have an upgrade policy as long as I spend at least 20% more. This is a great jeweler here in San Antonio, TX. So basically I want some guidance that way when I go back in I'm at least a little educated. I'm thinking I might go with an oval instead.

 

[chrono]

I don't like the 20% more but it's better than nothing. Are you able to swing the 20% more? If so, let's start again.

Are you still looking for a round in a cushion setting? If so,
Labs: AGS or GIA only due to accurate and consistent colour and clarity grading.
Cut: AGS0 or GIA 3Ex only for something well that for maximum sparkle. GIA 3 EX still needs follow up because some are good and some aren't.

If the colour of your current EGL I VS1 is fine to you, you are likely able to drop down to a GIA/AGS J/K and SI1/2 safely.

If you go with other shapes such as an oval or cushion, helping you shop for a well cut stone will be more difficult unless you purchase from a vendor who provides ASET, you have your own ASET and know how to interpret the results, or view umpteen fancies to be able to tell the difference between a great cut, mediocre and poor cut by sight alone. You can get by with purchasing rounds by the numbers but you cannot do the same for other cut shapes.

 

[priscilla]

I wasn't happy about the 20% either but its my fault for waiting until after the return period so I guess I'm glad that I at least have an option. I can swing the 20%, it will probably be next month so I'm trying to learn as much as possible before then. I was thinking of going with an oval but I know that its harder to find a good stone. I'm wondering if I should put all the money into a better stone and go with a plain setting for now because I can always change the setting later. I just really feel like I paid way too much money for a stone I feel isn't that pretty.

 

[priscilla]

I purchased the stone from Americus Diamond in San Antonio, TX. They also have a policy that if you find a stone for a better price they will refund the difference plus 25%. It talks about it on their website too.

 

[chrono]

I purchased the stone from Americus Diamond in San Antonio, TX. They also have a policy that if you find a stone for a better price they will refund the difference plus 25%. It talks about it on their website too.

It is difficult to do this when one is comparing a loosely graded EGL with an accurately graded GIA diamond.

No problem, let's start anew and if you like rounds, they are the easiest to shop for. For me, I'd go for a better stone first, then take my time finding the right setting for it (while saving for it again). Just be careful with return policies even if they seem safe. You don't want this to happen:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/need-advice-diamond-dealer-wont-honor-return-policy.209574/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/need-advice-diamond-dealer-wont-honor-return-policy.209574/[/URL]

 

[chrono]

Gypsy's sound advice:

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only. EGL is a bad option: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/[/URL]

So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut

Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones.
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor

The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other. Stick to stones with a crown height of 34% or higher (33.5 is fine for a 60/60 style stone) and a depth of 62.4 or less.

Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.

Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.

 

[priscilla]

Ok. I just meant if I can prove they overcharged me for the stone(as compared to somewhere else) they will refund some of my money. Then I could use that money towards a better stone. I spent $11,748 on my stone and $2,103 for the setting(not including the wedding band). So with 20% more($2,770.20) I could spend about $16,621 on a stone. I hope its ok to share these numbers, I just feel like I could get more advice if you all have specific details.

 

[priscilla]

Wow! Great advice thank you!! I didn't know any of that.

 

[chrono]

1.56 ct EGL I VS1 $6K
http://search.virtcert.com/cgi/u/1012/v.cgi?stock=15360495&_s=1012&_p=sdf348gd743&_c=&_fs=1&prestock=&_ln=ps

You can run a PS search with the parameters and even GIA graded diamonds are going for less than $11K.
https://www.pricescope.com/diamond-search-results/

 

[sweet_jane]

Ok. I just meant if I can prove they overcharged me for the stone(as compared to somewhere else) they will refund some of my money. Then I could use that money towards a better stone. I spent $11,748 on my stone and $2,103 for the setting(not including the wedding band). So with 20% more($2,770.20) I could spend about $16,621 on a stone. I hope its ok to share these numbers, I just feel like I could get more advice if you all have specific details.

Here's the rub , diamonds span a price range and many factors dictate price. In your situation, you would have to compare EGL USA diamond prices and specs to the diamond you purchased since it is an EGL USA diamond. If you compared pricing and specs from your EGL USA diamond to GIA or AGS, it would be akin to comparing apples to oranges. It would be time consuming to try to "prove" your theory. I agree with the other PS'ers that it would be better to return it and start over if you are able.

Many vendors offer virtual listings of diamonds, meaning the exact same diamond is offered via multiple sites and each vendor prices the exact same diamond differently. If you find the exact diamond (you can verify it is the same diamond by the certificate number and diamond specs) listed at a cheaper price, some vendors may price match plus give and additional discount in order to garner your business.

ETA - Okay, maybe not "time consuming"...Chrono works fast!

 

[priscilla]

Well I guess its time for me to see if they hold true to their policy. Thanks! I'm going to print that up and take it in and see what happens.

 

[sweet_jane]

Well I guess its time for me to see if they hold true to their policy. Thanks! I'm going to print that up and take it in and see what happens.

I just checked out the policy and their wording is "...is lower than any jewelry store's very best sale price, or we'll refund the difference plus 25%."

It may be implied that they are referring to traditional B&M stores only.

 

[priscilla]

I just checked and yes you are correct

 

[sweet_jane]

I just checked and yes you are correct

Sorry for the bad news...

 

[priscilla]

That's ok at least I can upgrade and get a beautiful stone that is really worth the money.
Is the HCA only for rounds or does it apply to all shapes?

 

[RockyRacoon]

Well I guess its time for me to see if they hold true to their policy. Thanks! I'm going to print that up and take it in and see what happens.

I just checked out the policy and their wording is "...is lower than any jewelry store's very best sale price, or we'll refund the difference plus 25%."

It may be implied that they are referring to traditional B&M stores only.

Hmmm...about the return policy.

What about contacting Good Old Gold? They are a jewelry store in the most classic sense (they have a brick and mortar location and mailing address).

They can source EGL stones for you, if you specifically ask.

They may be able to provide you with the required info you need to get the situation rectified.

 

[sweet_jane]

Well I guess its time for me to see if they hold true to their policy. Thanks! I'm going to print that up and take it in and see what happens.

I just checked out the policy and their wording is "...is lower than any jewelry store's very best sale price, or we'll refund the difference plus 25%."

It may be implied that they are referring to traditional B&M stores only.

Hmmm...about the return policy.

What about contacting Good Old Gold? They are a jewelry store in the most classic sense (they have a brick and mortar location and mailing address).

They can source EGL stones for you, if you specifically ask.

They may be able to provide you with the required info you need to get the situation rectified.

Interesting angle...worth a shot.

 

[priscilla]

Sorry another question. Are there any posts or websites that talk about EGL USA not being up to GIA standards? I was talking to my jeweler about EGL and telling them how I have learned that EGL is not a great option. They argued that EGL USA is as good as GIA and that EGL overseas are the ones that are bad. I know that is not correct. I did read the post linked above but did not see that it says EGL USA specifically. Is EGL USA better than the others?

 

[priscilla]

Well I guess its time for me to see if they hold true to their policy. Thanks! I'm going to print that up and take it in and see what happens.

I just checked out the policy and their wording is "...is lower than any jewelry store's very best sale price, or we'll refund the difference plus 25%."

It may be implied that they are referring to traditional B&M stores only.

Hmmm...about the return policy.

What about contacting Good Old Gold? They are a jewelry store in the most classic sense (they have a brick and mortar location and mailing address).

They can source EGL stones for you, if you specifically ask.

They may be able to provide you with the required info you need to get the situation rectified.

I didn't see this earlier. I will give it a try. Thanks!