Need Advice - Diamond Dealer won't honor return policy

[DJHoliday]

I have been trolling for a couple of weeks, but hoping for help here. I recently purchased a diamond in the diamond district from a dealer that offered a specific guarantee in writing - 30 day money if the stone appraises for less than the purchase price at an independent appraiser (not a jewelry store). I was a novice when buying but I saw the guarantee so I figured how much could I screw it up? I was sold an EGL USA split grade stone H-I color VS2. I didn't have the best feeling ever since I bought it. I took it to Just Appraisers and David Wolf graded it a K color vs the H-I... same clarity, VS2. With a siginficantly less Insurance Replacement Value than I paid for it. I went back to the store within the 30 day window and he called David's appraisal "bullsh*t" and told me that he has seen this before and that I just want out of the deal and I must have paid off my appraiser for a sham. I told him to call David's office and review his Curriculum Vitae and he declined. I told him of course I want out of the deal... my diamond appraised for less than I paid and you have a written guarantee on my receipt. The owner told me as far as he is concerned I am not getting my money back and the deal is done. I told him I will file a complaint but he doesn't seem to care. He just walked away from the desk when I was there. I called the consumer protection line at 311 and they referred me to the JVC. Any advice with this? Thanks.

 

[the_mother_thing]

If you used your credit card, call your CC company. They should be able to help.

That really stinks. Hope you get your money back.

 

[telephone89]

I'm not sure what the JVC is, but where I live we have a consumer complaint board as well as the better business bureau. I would be filing a complaint with both of those. I hope you get this resolved asap!

 

[DJHoliday]

I paid cash for the majority and put a 500$ deposit on my card. So the guy has the bulk of my money. The JVC is the Jewelers Vigilance Committee. They are a self-governing body of jewelers that handle mediation between customers and jewelers, I think. I called 311 to complain - there was a sign at the store to call the NYC Consumer Protection Bureau if there were any complaints. They referred me to the JVC and I left a phone message today but haven't heard back.

 

[julesxxxooo]

Is it possible for you to obtain a second appraisal? It would be harder for him to dispute if you had yet another appraisal showing it is not what he advertised. Good luck.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

It is too late to help you, but for the lurkers here considering buying a diamond, NEVER buy unless there is an unconditional return policy. That is the only way you are safe. I do not buy from PS vendors using a credit card because their return policies totally trustworthy, but aside from those, I would always recommend using a credit card.

DJHoliday...I think you are already doing what you can. Someone might also recommend having a lawyer friend write a letter for you, if possible. I think you should win in this situation, but the question is how long it will take and what it will take to get the refund. A second appraisal is a good idea.

 

[DJHoliday]

I doubt that a second appraisal would help in any way. He will just say that I "paid off" another appraiser because he has "seen this all before in his 50 years" His idea of an accurate appraisal is the EGL subsidiary appraisal that came attached to my EGL USA cert which is 2.5 times what my ring actually appraised.

 

[Gypsy]

Sue him. That's all you can do.

 

[Gypsy]

You can also go to his store. Reciept and appraisal in hand. Then call the cops and have them come out.

See if they will help you.

 

[Gypsy]

Also call the BBB.

 

[Karl_K]

You can also go to his store. Reciept and appraisal in hand. Then call the cops and have them come out.

See if they will help you.

They wont be able to do anything.
Contact the NY attorney generals office and contact an attorney for advise.
Be sure and document everything and keep a log of all conversations.
time date and what was said.
There is a good chance they will tell you to go through the jvc first.

 

[WinkHPD]

Also call the BBB.

I have always found the BBB to be basically worthless in actually doing anything but collecting money from the stores for dues.

Call your local news paper and tv stations an ask if they will run a consumer alert story. Many of them actually have something like "6 On Your Side" and LOVE to harass stupid business owners who are trying to renege on a written guarantee. Write your local review sites and paper this guy with bad reviews. Then show him all that you have done and promise to keep it up until he gives you back your money.

Oh, and ask him why he is still selling EGL reports when Martin Rapaport has banned them from his list for exactly the kind of crap that you have experienced. This guy is a crook and you will have to hurt his business any way you can in order to get him to budge. If all else fails, picket his store for a few days with a few of your friends. Eventually he will pay you to go away and you will have some fun doing it.

Just my thoughts, of course.

Wink

 

[Gypsy]

Also call the BBB.

I have always found the BBB to be basically worthless in actually doing anything but collecting money from the stores for dues.

Call your local news paper and tv stations an ask if they will run a consumer alert story. Many of them actually have something like "6 On Your Side" and LOVE to harass stupid business owners who are trying to renege on a written guarantee. Write your local review sites and paper this guy with bad reviews. Then show him all that you have done and promise to keep it up until he gives you back your money.

Oh, and ask him why he is still selling EGL reports when Martin Rapaport has banned them from his list for exactly the kind of crap that you have experienced. This guy is a crook and you will have to hurt his business any way you can in order to get him to budge. If all else fails, picket his store for a few days with a few of your friends. Eventually he will pay you to go away and you will have some fun doing it.

Just my thoughts, of course.

Wink

These are great suggestion. Call the news programs!

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

Also call the BBB.

I have always found the BBB to be basically worthless in actually doing anything but collecting money from the stores for dues.

Call your local news paper and tv stations an ask if they will run a consumer alert story. Many of them actually have something like "6 On Your Side" and LOVE to harass stupid business owners who are trying to renege on a written guarantee. Write your local review sites and paper this guy with bad reviews. Then show him all that you have done and promise to keep it up until he gives you back your money.

Oh, and ask him why he is still selling EGL reports when Martin Rapaport has banned them from his list for exactly the kind of crap that you have experienced. This guy is a crook and you will have to hurt his business any way you can in order to get him to budge. If all else fails, picket his store for a few days with a few of your friends. Eventually he will pay you to go away and you will have some fun doing it.

Just my thoughts, of course.

Wink

This!

 

[DJHoliday]

Also call the BBB.

I have always found the BBB to be basically worthless in actually doing anything but collecting money from the stores for dues.

Call your local news paper and tv stations an ask if they will run a consumer alert story. Many of them actually have something like "6 On Your Side" and LOVE to harass stupid business owners who are trying to renege on a written guarantee. Write your local review sites and paper this guy with bad reviews. Then show him all that you have done and promise to keep it up until he gives you back your money.

Oh, and ask him why he is still selling EGL reports when Martin Rapaport has banned them from his list for exactly the kind of crap that you have experienced. This guy is a crook and you will have to hurt his business any way you can in order to get him to budge. If all else fails, picket his store for a few days with a few of your friends. Eventually he will pay you to go away and you will have some fun doing it.

Just my thoughts, of course.

Wink

Interesting idea but I'm not really sure that I want to go down to the NYC Diamond District and picket a guy's store for a few days in 9 degree weather. I will break before he does in those conditions. That is a shady part of town where I don't want to spend any more time than I have to spend. I'm ok with writing one review per site but I'm not going to slander the guy under fake names. Even though he deserves it. I am pretty sure that it is going to come to suing him in small claims court and there is little doubt in my opinion that the appraisal report that I received from David can be anything but valid in this instance.

Speaking of Rappaport, the owner showed me a Rap list and claimed that I was paying wholesale. I was stupid when I bought the diamond. I am anything but stupid now.

 

[arkieb1]

Also call the BBB.

I have always found the BBB to be basically worthless in actually doing anything but collecting money from the stores for dues.

Call your local news paper and tv stations an ask if they will run a consumer alert story. Many of them actually have something like "6 On Your Side" and LOVE to harass stupid business owners who are trying to renege on a written guarantee. Write your local review sites and paper this guy with bad reviews. Then show him all that you have done and promise to keep it up until he gives you back your money.

Oh, and ask him why he is still selling EGL reports when Martin Rapaport has banned them from his list for exactly the kind of crap that you have experienced. This guy is a crook and you will have to hurt his business any way you can in order to get him to budge. If all else fails, picket his store for a few days with a few of your friends. Eventually he will pay you to go away and you will have some fun doing it.

Just my thoughts, of course.

Wink

Interesting idea but I'm not really sure that I want to go down to the NYC Diamond District and picket a guy's store for a few days in 9 degree weather. I will break before he does in those conditions. That is a shady part of town where I don't want to spend any more time than I have to spend. I'm ok with writing one review per site but I'm not going to slander the guy under fake names. Even though he deserves it. I am pretty sure that it is going to come to suing him in small claims court and there is little doubt in my opinion that the appraisal report that I received from David can be anything but valid in this instance.

Speaking of Rappaport, the owner showed me a Rap list and claimed that I was paying wholesale. I was stupid when I bought the diamond. I am anything but stupid now.

Without meaning to be rude if you knew it was a shady area why on earth would you buy a EGL diamond in the first place, you would have to have suspected that anything EGL would not be accurately describe. If the store has a 30 day money back policy and you were sold something "not as described" by the vendor legally you are entitled to your money back.

 

[DJHoliday]

I didn't know any better when I had bought the diamond. I didn't even know what EGL was when I went to buy it. That was a mistake on my part, but I was a first time diamond buyer pressured into a sale. I'm not the only one. If I knew what it was, I certainly wouldn't have purchased it. I know better now. I'm not an expert who took a bad swing. I'm a novice who was taken. I was taken for a sucker at the time the diamond was sold but it has a 30 day guarantee on the appraisal value. That is my issue.

 

[Gypsy]

You missed the bulk of Wink's advice.

Local radio stations. If you find the right program, they can work miracles. Especially if you know how to sell your story. Mention EGL. Mention the Rapport. Mention law suits that have been brought against other jewelers over EGL's inaccuracy.

Mention Martin and link to his site.

 

[elle_chris]

I'm in the city and would like to know which store this was..

You can go the FB pages of fox, abc, nbc and cbs and post what happened. If they're interested in shaming the guy, they'll contact you.

 

[WillyDiamond]

Hey OP
Just wanted to say that I am sorry for your experience. Most people don't know of this forum to educate themselves and they get taken to the cleaners, it just stinks. Well I hope it was not a boatload of money.
I kind of like the idea of standing in front of his store and telling people who are about to walk in your experience and not to buy from him. After a few customer losses, I think he will whistle a different tune. And take a friend with you, don't do it alone. Yes, it is cold in NYC now, bundle up and drink coffee to stay warm. Best of luck.
edit: Do it during lunch hour, that is when he will be busiest.

 

[DJHoliday]

Actually I would rather not say the store until he has a chance to respond to my certified letter.

 

[DJHoliday]

You missed the bulk of Wink's advice.

Local radio stations. If you find the right program, they can work miracles. Especially if you know how to sell your story. Mention EGL. Mention the Rapport. Mention law suits that have been brought against other jewelers over EGL's inaccuracy.

Mention Martin and link to his site.

Thank you for the advice. I really appreciate the help. I am still in a bit of a state of shock. I actually thought that I was going to get my money back today by taking in a copy of the appraisal. I will have a clearer head tmrw. Thanks again.

 

[DJHoliday]

Hey OP
Just wanted to say that I am sorry for your experience. Most people don't know of this forum to educate themselves and they get taken to the cleaners, it just stinks. Well I hope it was not a boatload of money.
I kind of like the idea of standing in front of his store and telling people who are about to walk in your experience and not to buy from him. After a few customer losses, I think he will whistle a different tune. And take a friend with you, don't do it alone. Yes, it is cold in NYC now, bundle up and drink coffee to stay warm. Best of luck.
edit: Do it during lunch hour, that is when he will be busiest.

Thanks. It isn't really even 100% percent about the money. It is about honoring the agreement. I just want a diamond comparable to the amount that I paid.

 

[JulieN]

If he hasn't returned your money soon, I would picket his store in a few weeks. Valentine's Day is coming up. Reputation is everything. Listen to Wink's advice.

 

[JulieN]

Thanks. It isn't really even 100% percent about the money. It is about honoring the agreement. I just want a diamond comparable to the amount that I paid.

Ok, I know you already have David Wolf's appraisal, but ...what did you pay? Did you search the PS database for what you could get for how much you paid?

 

[Rockdiamond]

DJ- a lot of what's been said here can be of use to you- but not that you need to actually do it.
Antagonizing the seller is not going to make your job easier.
If you have to take him to court, then you have to do whatever it takes-
Try and find a way to encourage him to make you go away before you have to do all the work.
IMO trying to start a crusade is useless to you personally.
But if you remind the ...ahem, nice gentleman who sold you this misgraded diamond that you have a lot of places to complain, and that such complaints will hurt his business, that might help you.

Basically try a little sugar coated threats- I really hope you can get your money back
I hate the way people are treated in so many of the stores and booths on 47th street.

 

[16ocean]

Ugh! Sorry you have to go through this . . .
"I'm ok with writing one review per site but I'm not going to slander the guy under fake names. Even though he deserves it. I am pretty sure that it is going to come to suing him in small claims court and there is little doubt in my opinion that the appraisal report that I received from David can be anything but valid in this instance." - - - don't forget yelp. With you writing about your experience it will help others.

I do hope the diamond dealer honors his policy.

 

[Gypsy]

Okay two things to follow on RD's advice.

NEVER make a threat that you don't intend to follow up on.
So if you threaten with the news-- make sure you mention that you are SURE they would love a story about a crooked jeweler just before Valentine's Day. AND make sure that if that threat gets you no where, then you call and follow through.

Also mention the state attorney general's office. And if you do, follow up.

If you aren't going to picket, don't threaten it.

If you INTEND to follow through and are serious and confident THAT will make an impact more than hysterical litany's of meaningless threats .

 

[CharmyPoo]

Perhaps choose an appraiser under mutual agreement - give him a list and he can choose one?

The problem here is your stone was graded under GIA standards and it came with an EGL-USA cert. It is pretty normal that EGL-USA is 1 or 2 grades higher than GIA. So I actually don't think you were cheated at all assuming you paid EGL-USA prices.

 

[DJHoliday]

Perhaps choose an appraiser under mutual agreement - give him a list and he can choose one?

The problem here is your stone was graded under GIA standards and it came with an EGL-USA cert. It is pretty normal that EGL-USA is 1 or 2 grades higher than GIA. So I actually don't think you were cheated at all assuming you paid EGL-USA prices.

My stone was appraised under a certain set of standards and was priced against stones in the marketplace with similar characteristics that were also graded under a comparable set of standards. It came up substantially overpriced even under this scenario. Regardless of whether EGL says it is an H-I, if it is a GIA K, it is worth GIA K.