Eighstar vs. H&A
- Thread starter lenhejo
- Start date
- Status
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2003
- Messages
- 15,808
Yiks!
Eightstar diamonds are "Harts and Arrows" ... What was the Q?
I am affraid there is already more than two brands to talk about here, since there are many makers of H&A besides Eightstar. It definitely remains up to you to judge wether the Eight Star brand of H&As is worth it. While many would content there is a difference, it is hard to judge - since there is virtually no way to test a sample of Eight Star diamonds against other contenders. They say that each diamond is brought to it's best look under eight Star's cutting regardless of cost (same for your cost!) but then... every H&A maker would likely say the same and since not the average quality of the product line but just one diamond is what counts, this is by no means an easy question.
Eight Star is a top diamond brand, but a diamond is a diamond...
Is comparing shops and comparing diamonds the same to you ?
Eightstar diamonds are "Harts and Arrows" ... What was the Q?
I am affraid there is already more than two brands to talk about here, since there are many makers of H&A besides Eightstar. It definitely remains up to you to judge wether the Eight Star brand of H&As is worth it. While many would content there is a difference, it is hard to judge - since there is virtually no way to test a sample of Eight Star diamonds against other contenders. They say that each diamond is brought to it's best look under eight Star's cutting regardless of cost (same for your cost!) but then... every H&A maker would likely say the same and since not the average quality of the product line but just one diamond is what counts, this is by no means an easy question.
Is comparing shops and comparing diamonds the same to you ?
strmrdr
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2003
- Messages
- 23,295
8* run 30-40% more than most h&a diamonds.
Iv looked at one and it was impressive but to me not worth the added money.
I seriously dought that they perform any better than the best from goodoldgold.com whiteflash.com or niceice.com and cost a lot more.
Compared to what some vendors call h&a and the cut level of some branded h&a diamonds they do have an advantage.
On thing studying here will tell you is that while most h&a diamonds will be amoung the better performing diamonds there is definatly different levels in the h&a catagory as far as performance goes.
8* is in the high end of the range but so are a lot of others.
Iv looked at one and it was impressive but to me not worth the added money.
I seriously dought that they perform any better than the best from goodoldgold.com whiteflash.com or niceice.com and cost a lot more.
Compared to what some vendors call h&a and the cut level of some branded h&a diamonds they do have an advantage.
On thing studying here will tell you is that while most h&a diamonds will be amoung the better performing diamonds there is definatly different levels in the h&a catagory as far as performance goes.
8* is in the high end of the range but so are a lot of others.
John-Aaron
I was looking at branded (HoF etc) diamonds at one time becuase I felt that going with a brand meant that they had great quality control and I would not have to worry about the numbers and I'd get a significantly better stone. Long story short, I got an IdealScope and all of a sudden I could see with my own eyes the differences between diamonds and begin to better understand bad, good, and ideal cuts. $29 saved me a whole load of grief. In the end I purchased from a PS vendor who is a hybrid B&M and Internet store, GoodOldGold and went with a new cut, Jubilee, a square brilliant with H&A. Let's put it this way, I catch people staring at the ring (including my wife), in all light conditions it performs amazingly. Perhaps EightStars really are better but at a certain point the difference becomes insignificant. You can take the "brand tax" and put it towards a bigger, whiter non-branded H&A.
Andrew
I was looking at branded (HoF etc) diamonds at one time becuase I felt that going with a brand meant that they had great quality control and I would not have to worry about the numbers and I'd get a significantly better stone. Long story short, I got an IdealScope and all of a sudden I could see with my own eyes the differences between diamonds and begin to better understand bad, good, and ideal cuts. $29 saved me a whole load of grief. In the end I purchased from a PS vendor who is a hybrid B&M and Internet store, GoodOldGold and went with a new cut, Jubilee, a square brilliant with H&A. Let's put it this way, I catch people staring at the ring (including my wife), in all light conditions it performs amazingly. Perhaps EightStars really are better but at a certain point the difference becomes insignificant. You can take the "brand tax" and put it towards a bigger, whiter non-branded H&A.
Andrew
Hi Andrew,
Thanks so much for your reply. I feel much more at ease. So, do you recommend goodoldgold? I am currently dealing with a retailer in NY. I just never really felt comfortable buying over the internet. Is the saving significant. I was quoted between 35k-40k for a 3 carat, F, VS2, Hearts of Fire.
John-Aaron.
Thanks so much for your reply. I feel much more at ease. So, do you recommend goodoldgold? I am currently dealing with a retailer in NY. I just never really felt comfortable buying over the internet. Is the saving significant. I was quoted between 35k-40k for a 3 carat, F, VS2, Hearts of Fire.
John-Aaron.
strmrdr
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2003
- Messages
- 23,295
John-Aaron
Absolutely I recommend GOG but I have never purchased from the other PS rspected vendors so please no one accuse me of favouritism!
GOG is a hybrid, they are a brick and mortar and happen to publish "rockumentaries" (TM!) of their diamonds on the Internet. I looked at many diamonds (my full experience is here: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-diamond-buying-experiences-a-must-read-for-budding-fiances-and-beginners-long.14907/) before finding GOG and getting to know Jonathan. If you are in NY you have to go see them. I saved so much money I am now researching a nice right-hand ring setting for my wife.
Do you have a firm quote on the HoF? Do you have meaningful stats? Did you order that IdealScope yet! I will keep nagging you until you do, it is what finally taught me to see diamonds more critically. Up to that point I thought everything was pretty.
Limey
Absolutely I recommend GOG but I have never purchased from the other PS rspected vendors so please no one accuse me of favouritism!
GOG is a hybrid, they are a brick and mortar and happen to publish "rockumentaries" (TM!) of their diamonds on the Internet. I looked at many diamonds (my full experience is here: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-diamond-buying-experiences-a-must-read-for-budding-fiances-and-beginners-long.14907/) before finding GOG and getting to know Jonathan. If you are in NY you have to go see them. I saved so much money I am now researching a nice right-hand ring setting for my wife.
Do you have a firm quote on the HoF? Do you have meaningful stats? Did you order that IdealScope yet! I will keep nagging you until you do, it is what finally taught me to see diamonds more critically. Up to that point I thought everything was pretty.
Limey
Hi Limey,
Thanks for your repsone.
I recently visited GOG's website and was very impressed and am now considering buying my diamond from them. No, I don't have a firm quote from the retailer in NY. Also, is HoF a type of Hearts and Arrows, or are they synonyms? I actually reside in california, but my fiancee-to-be lives in New York. I will definitely pay GOG a visit next time I am out in New York. And to answer your question, I haven't ordered anything from the retailer as of yet because up until today I had no idea what those items you mentioned were. I will call them tomorrow and keep you posted. I definitely see potential savings with GOG. Thanks so much Limey. I will keep you posted as to my progress. Oh yeah, who is Jonathan?
Regards,
Thanks for your repsone.
I recently visited GOG's website and was very impressed and am now considering buying my diamond from them. No, I don't have a firm quote from the retailer in NY. Also, is HoF a type of Hearts and Arrows, or are they synonyms? I actually reside in california, but my fiancee-to-be lives in New York. I will definitely pay GOG a visit next time I am out in New York. And to answer your question, I haven't ordered anything from the retailer as of yet because up until today I had no idea what those items you mentioned were. I will call them tomorrow and keep you posted. I definitely see potential savings with GOG. Thanks so much Limey. I will keep you posted as to my progress. Oh yeah, who is Jonathan?
Regards,
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 33,852
John-Aaron,
Although the quote that you got on the 3 ct HOF sounds reasonable, just keep in mind there's no guarantee that HOF will out perform other top cut hearts/arrows. Believe me, if you erase that HOF symbol from the girdle, there is no difference between any other 0 cut hearts/arrow stone. I have seen a few duds HOF. With the kind of money you are thinking of spending, you should look into all other options.You should check out GOG and speak with Jonathan. He just got in couple 3 cts in your range. G VS1 and H VVS2. As for 8*, you should go see for yourself. They are just different kind of stones. I have seen 4 of them. They are higher premium. Just like the HOF you are considering. So you just have to decide for yourself and see if it is worth the extra premium.
- Joined
- May 3, 2001
- Messages
- 7,516
There seems to be some misunderstanding about the difference between an EightStar diamond and H&A diamonds. EightStars are different than H&A.
Both are incredibly beautiful diamonds and I sell both, so please understand that this is not intended to be a "My diamond is better than your diamond" post.
EightStars were developed by a Japanese cutter and require that all 57 facets be perfectly in balance with one another to create the EightStar pattern that is seen in the Firescope. They require a great deal of time to create in comparison to other stones and the result in a larger and more cohesive pattern of flash and sparkle than other cuts. EightStars are cut for internal light performance perfection and are the most consistent looking stones I have ever seen. Big or small, colorless to fancy colors, the EightStars all look like EightStars.
The Hearts and Arrows cuts were developed about four years later and require that 17 of the facets be perfectly aligned to create the pattern. It is an interesting fact to me that both stones can be incredibly beautiful and can be outside the parameters considered to be ideal. Both stones. And, unlike the claims of many dealers, the fact that a stone is an AGS ideal cut will not automatically mean that it displays a Hearts and arrows pattern.
The differences in performance by many H&A stones is in the fact that what happens with the other facets can vary so much. It is possible to have a H&A cut stone that has a perfect pattern and still looks good, but not spectacular, rare, but possible. Some H&A suppliers are actively involved in the purchase and manufacturing of the stones, like Paul Slegers with his Venus by Infinity brand. Others just buy the finished product and have their name put on them. It is not much of a guess as to which group will have a more consistent looking product.
In a Firescope, you will see some leakage of light around the edges of the H&A cut diamonds, but not in the EightStar. When looking at the stones with the unaided eye the differences are subtle. The patterns of flash in an EightStar are larger and more cohesive than in other diamonds. The patterns of flash in a Hearts and Arrows cut is smaller and more random. Which pattern you like best is personal preference.
The EightStars take more time to make, lose more of the initial rough and are only cut by one company. They cost more than any other diamond to cut, so they sell for more. For some of my clients, the extra money is worth it, for some it is not.
Here is my dilemma. I love the EightStar diamonds. I think they are fantastic and beautiful. I also love the top quality Hearts and Arrows cut diamonds. I think they are fantastic and beautiful.
Surrounded by beauty, oh well, I can live with it...
Wink
Both are incredibly beautiful diamonds and I sell both, so please understand that this is not intended to be a "My diamond is better than your diamond" post.
EightStars were developed by a Japanese cutter and require that all 57 facets be perfectly in balance with one another to create the EightStar pattern that is seen in the Firescope. They require a great deal of time to create in comparison to other stones and the result in a larger and more cohesive pattern of flash and sparkle than other cuts. EightStars are cut for internal light performance perfection and are the most consistent looking stones I have ever seen. Big or small, colorless to fancy colors, the EightStars all look like EightStars.
The Hearts and Arrows cuts were developed about four years later and require that 17 of the facets be perfectly aligned to create the pattern. It is an interesting fact to me that both stones can be incredibly beautiful and can be outside the parameters considered to be ideal. Both stones. And, unlike the claims of many dealers, the fact that a stone is an AGS ideal cut will not automatically mean that it displays a Hearts and arrows pattern.
The differences in performance by many H&A stones is in the fact that what happens with the other facets can vary so much. It is possible to have a H&A cut stone that has a perfect pattern and still looks good, but not spectacular, rare, but possible. Some H&A suppliers are actively involved in the purchase and manufacturing of the stones, like Paul Slegers with his Venus by Infinity brand. Others just buy the finished product and have their name put on them. It is not much of a guess as to which group will have a more consistent looking product.
In a Firescope, you will see some leakage of light around the edges of the H&A cut diamonds, but not in the EightStar. When looking at the stones with the unaided eye the differences are subtle. The patterns of flash in an EightStar are larger and more cohesive than in other diamonds. The patterns of flash in a Hearts and Arrows cut is smaller and more random. Which pattern you like best is personal preference.
The EightStars take more time to make, lose more of the initial rough and are only cut by one company. They cost more than any other diamond to cut, so they sell for more. For some of my clients, the extra money is worth it, for some it is not.
Here is my dilemma. I love the EightStar diamonds. I think they are fantastic and beautiful. I also love the top quality Hearts and Arrows cut diamonds. I think they are fantastic and beautiful.
Surrounded by beauty, oh well, I can live with it...
Wink
ep6585
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- May 10, 2004
- Messages
- 609
By Jubilee premium I presume you mean "brand tax." I don't really think there is any. The price for a Jubilee in pretty much in line with very good, unbranded, H&A rounds.
The Jubilee is going to become more widely available as the creators, Horowitz & Atlass, get more cut. As I understand it they have 40 or so cutters but not sure if all of them are trained or are working on creating Jubilee's. I got lucky and purchased one of the first batch, and then I had a chance to speak to Cary Horowitz.
Only GoodOldGold.com (Jonathan aka Rhino) is sanctioned to sell the Jubilee over the Internet, other jewelers will be able to sell locally. Not sure if there is a CA store.
Limey
The Jubilee is going to become more widely available as the creators, Horowitz & Atlass, get more cut. As I understand it they have 40 or so cutters but not sure if all of them are trained or are working on creating Jubilee's. I got lucky and purchased one of the first batch, and then I had a chance to speak to Cary Horowitz.
Only GoodOldGold.com (Jonathan aka Rhino) is sanctioned to sell the Jubilee over the Internet, other jewelers will be able to sell locally. Not sure if there is a CA store.
Limey
ep6585
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- May 10, 2004
- Messages
- 609
- Status
The Ultimate Guide to Men’s Wedding Bands: Metals, Fit & Finish
The Ultimate Guide to Men’s Wedding Bands: Metals, Fit & Finish - 06/27
Chipped Diamonds: Causes, Risks, and What You Should Do About It
Chipped Diamonds: Causes, Risks, and What You Should Do About It - 06/27
300x240.png)