EGL Israel Nightmare!!!

[Christian_Mark]

Hi everyone! My name is Christian. I'm new here to the forums and I wanted to introduce myself and share my horrible experience I had with EGL Israel! I started looking for a stone about 2 months ago for I plan on proposing to my girlfriend sometime in 2014. I didn't know anything about diamonds and certs and all I basically knew was that you can save money buying online instead of buying at a bricks and mortar store. So online I went. My girlfriend told me she likes radiant cut stones so I was in search of the perfect radiant. I noticed there was different types of certifications. I saw GIA, EGL, AGS and some other certs. I noticed that the EGL certs were MUCH cheaper than the GIA/AGS certs so naturally I wanted to save as much money as I can and I bought an EGL diamond. Before making my purchase, I tried to study as much as I can about the 4 Cs so I can get the best bang for my buck. I finally decided to pull the trigger on a stone! I found a 1.78 H/VS2 for a decent price so I purchased it. When I received the stone I noticed that the stone had a bit of a tint, it didn't have that good of a luster, and what bugged me the most was that the right side of the stone tapered in toward the bottom. I took the stone to get appraised. The appraiser pulled out her color grading tool and matched the color of the stone. EGL graded it an H. The appraiser went all the way down the grading scale to a M!! That's 5 color grades off and I was shocked! She also put the diamond under magnification and saw a huge cloud that took up most of the center of the stone which is why it didn't sparkle so much. EGL graded it a VS2 but the appraiser said it wasn't anything better than a SI2. So I kept the stone for a bout 2 days, thought about if I can deal with it and of course I returned it.

The next diamond I got was 10x worse then my first stone. I didn't really learn about EGL Israel and loose grading till after this next stone I had bought. I figured the person who graded the first stone needed to get their eyes checked so I gave EGL one more try. I found a 2.03ct H/SI2. When I contacted the online jeweler, the man on the phone said the stone had a good color, nice luster/sparkle, and the inclusion was on the bottom so SI2 grade should not be an issue. I received the stone. First thing I notice right away is there is something on the table of the stone. It was a cavity! A BIG one as you can see in the picture I attached. It is easily an I1/I2 stone. I returned the stone that same day. The stone was colorless to my eyes and yes it did have a very nice luster. But there was no way I was going to give the love of my life a diamond with a huge cavity on the face of it. ROAR!

I took about a month off making any diamond purchases. I learned about GIA, EGL, and other grading laboratories. I found pricescope recently and this is actually where I learned the most. I recently purchased a GIA graded stone through a different online vendor who was very helpful in helping me get a nice stone. I purchased a GIA graded 2.04ct K/VS2 with medium blue flouro which really helps! The stone has a good cut, it's 100% eye clean, and appears white %90 of the time. I sometimes notice a slight warm color on the side of the stone in some lighting but most of the time it looks completely white. I was happy with my purchase and I even showed pictures of the stone to my girlfriend and she loves it (although she has no clue that the stone had already been purchased). So now I am in the process of getting the stone set. I've learned that Pricescope is an amazing place to learn about diamonds and jewelery and I am glad to now be part of this community.

 

[heididdl]

Glad you learned that GIA is the most reliable and you get what you pay for . That is why PS ers say it is cheaper to buy GIA stones because you are getting what you pay for. With EGL you are guaranteed to pay too much for what you think your getting and is actually 5-10 grades lower.

Just happy you found out and had an option to return

 

[craighnt]

I just had a bad experience with EGL as well. Which one did the cert come from? The Los Angeles location is supposed to be more accurate then the New York office. I think the color grading is supposed to me more accurate to GIA standard in the LA office but NY not so much. I will post my story soon.

Oh, and EGL Israel is supposed to be the worst of the 3. As far as over grading. Someone on another site took a diamond and sent it to all three labs. All of them gave different results. Los Angeles was the closest to the GIA. New York was slightly over rated grading and Israel was just crazy, like 2 or 3 steps above what the grading should be.

 

[Christian_Mark]

Glad you learned that GIA is the most reliable and you get what you pay for . That is why PS ers say it is cheaper to buy GIA stones because you are getting what you pay for. With EGL you are guaranteed to pay too much for what you think your getting and is actually 5-10 grades lower.

Just happy you found out and had an option to return

You speak the truth! Who knows what you are really paying for when you purchase a EGL graded stone...It's best not to take any chances and go with GIA. And yes I made sure I was able to return the stones or I wouldn't have purchased anything at all lol.

I just had a bad experience with EGL as well. Which one did the cert come from? The Los Angeles location is supposed to be more accurate then the New York office. I think the color grading is supposed to me more accurate to GIA standard in the LA office but NY not so much. I will post my story soon.

Oh, and EGL Israel is supposed to be the worst of the 3. As far as over grading. Someone on another site took a diamond and sent it to all three labs. All of them gave different results. Los Angeles was the closest to the GIA. New York was slightly over rated grading and Israel was just crazy, like 2 or 3 steps above what the grading should be.

From what I understand, there is several EGL grading labs. There is Israel, Hong Kong, USA, and some others. I've read that EGL USA has a better reputation for the way they grade their stones. EGL Israel grades the worst. I gave them 2 tries and both times was a disaster. Stick with GIA. You know exactly what you are paying for. It's a lesson learned for me.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Thank you for sharing your experience! We always recommend against buying anything but GIA or AGS graded diamonds for the reasons you stated. Glad you found a stone you are pleased with!

 

[arkieb1]

EGL International means stones can be graded in places like Israel, Hong Kong, India and various others. They do NOT have as strict grading systems compared to other places/labs. This means that frequently stone can be up to 5 to 6 grades out on colour and up to 3 or more on clarity. The norm is around 3 to 4 on colour and around 2 on clarity.

EGL USA is more reliable, they are typically 1 to 2 grades out on colour and 0 to 1 on clarity although I believe they have been trying to grade more in line with GIA lately. GIA stones cost more because generally they are the most accurate grading system.

I hope people who think they are cutting corners by buying EGL International stones and getting bargains read this. There are no bargains when it comes to badly graded diamonds!!!! I am glad you were able to return the first two diamonds!!!

 

[leoshraeder]

Thanks for sharing.

 

[LaraOnline]

I have an acquaintance who works for a mass market maul store, he was surprised and commented very favourably at how good my stone looked 'for a G'. He couldn't get over the high (lack of) colour.

I couldn't be bothered telling him that the reason he was so surprised was because the in house diamond grading system his employer uses is rubbish!

 

[oldminer]

Pretty much any lab, anywhere in the world could grade just about equally as well as the GIA grades diamonds. The fact that some highly successful labs use their own, non-GIA, grading scale which just happens to look identical to the GIA grading system is NO ACCIDENT. These labs which grade in this way mislead consumers with the knowing participation of diamond dealers and diamond retailers who are willing to pervert a pretty good system that GIA has fostered for several decades. The fact that AGSL can pretty much produce GIA equivalent grading is no miracle, but just testifies to the ability of another lab to do just about the same as GIA does. There are some other labs which also meet GIA levels of grading excellence. PGI, GCAL are just a couple.

When grading is different on certain lab reports it is an intentional situation which inflicts damage on innocent, or uninformed consumers. At the same time, such abuse has cost legitimate labs huge amounts of potential business in that legitimate labs lose business to these labs which grade improperly or use a system which misleads end users. Millions of dollars in lost revenue that might have supported more honest labs have gone instead to those labs which are doing the trade and the consumers a major disservice. Of course, the dealers and retails who offer such lab reports to consumers are part of the problem and not innocent victims. Simply put, not all lab reports are the same, no matter what a seller might say to you. They may profess innocence and not understanding lab reports, but they know these reports are bogus. Believe me, they do know.

What can be done? The only course of action which will have a positive effect is educating the consumer thereby driving down the demand for documents that generally have little to no credibility. When the game of misleading reports does not pay dealers and retailers will abandon the approach. Still, today, it is a large profit center for many sellers. More education is required.

When you see a diamond from a lab that commonly provides bogus reports, it is not that a lab has made a "mistake". They know full well how to grade diamonds. They are probably very competent diamond graders. There have an intent to do what they are doing. They have clients ready to use their paperwork to their advantage against honest merchants. They are taking work for honest labs. Consumers are losing the bargain they expected. There are very few "mistakes" on grading. Bad grading reports are a major business far more successful than one can imagine.

Caveat Emptor.

 

[Christian_Mark]

Thank you for sharing your experience! We always recommend against buying anything but GIA or AGS graded diamonds for the reasons you stated. Glad you found a stone you are pleased with!

Thankfully I was able to return the stone for something I am happy with. And Yes, I will never buy any diamond for now on unless it is graded GIA or AGS!

EGL International means stones can be graded in places like Israel, Hong Kong, India and various others. They do NOT have as strict grading systems compared to other places/labs. This means that frequently stone can be up to 5 to 6 grades out on colour and up to 3 or more on clarity. The norm is around 3 to 4 on colour and around 2 on clarity.

EGL USA is more reliable, they are typically 1 to 2 grades out on colour and 0 to 1 on clarity although I believe they have been trying to grade more in line with GIA lately. GIA stones cost more because generally they are the most accurate grading system.

I hope people who think they are cutting corners by buying EGL International stones and getting bargains read this. There are no bargains when it comes to badly graded diamonds!!!! I am glad you were able to return the first two diamonds!!!

I read hear on Pricescope that EGL USA is more reliable than EGL International, but still not as reliable as GIA or AGS. I believe with GIA graded stones you get what you pay for as with EGL you kind of take a gamble with what your buying and you may even be paying more than what you should for a stone.

Thanks for sharing.

Your very welcome!

I have an acquaintance who works for a mass market maul store, he was surprised and commented very favourably at how good my stone looked 'for a G'. He couldn't get over the high (lack of) colour.

I couldn't be bothered telling him that the reason he was so surprised was because the in house diamond grading system his employer uses is rubbish!

Yes I notice that the bricks and mortar stores at my mall don't even carry diamonds graded by well known labs... Not even EGL! Who knows what color and clarity those diamonds really are...

 

[Christian_Mark]

Pretty much any lab, anywhere in the world could grade just about equally as well as the GIA grades diamonds. The fact that some highly successful labs use their own, non-GIA, grading scale which just happens to look identical to the GIA grading system is NO ACCIDENT. These labs which grade in this way mislead consumers with the knowing participation of diamond dealers and diamond retailers who are willing to pervert a pretty good system that GIA has fostered for several decades. The fact that AGSL can pretty much produce GIA equivalent grading is no miracle, but just testifies to the ability of another lab to do just about the same as GIA does. There are some other labs which also meet GIA levels of grading excellence. PGI, GCAL are just a couple.

When grading is different on certain lab reports it is an intentional situation which inflicts damage on innocent, or uninformed consumers. At the same time, such abuse has cost legitimate labs huge amounts of potential business in that legitimate labs lose business to these labs which grade improperly or use a system which misleads end users. Millions of dollars in lost revenue that might have supported more honest labs have gone instead to those labs which are doing the trade and the consumers a major disservice. Of course, the dealers and retails who offer such lab reports to consumers are part of the problem and not innocent victims. Simply put, not all lab reports are the same, no matter what a seller might say to you. They may profess innocence and not understanding lab reports, but they know these reports are bogus. Believe me, they do know.

What can be done? The only course of action which will have a positive effect is educating the consumer thereby driving down the demand for documents that generally have little to no credibility. When the game of misleading reports does not pay dealers and retailers will abandon the approach. Still, today, it is a large profit center for many sellers. More education is required.

When you see a diamond from a lab that commonly provides bogus reports, it is not that a lab has made a "mistake". They know full well how to grade diamonds. They are probably very competent diamond graders. There have an intent to do what they are doing. They have clients ready to use their paperwork to their advantage against honest merchants. They are taking work for honest labs. Consumers are losing the bargain they expected. There are very few "mistakes" on grading. Bad grading reports are a major business far more successful than one can imagine.

Caveat Emptor.

I totally agree with you Oldminer. It does seem like EGL graded these stones the way they do on purpose. If the same exact stones were sent to GIA or EGL, the chances for them being sold seem slim in my opinion. When I bought my 2 EGL stones I really had no clue what I was getting myself into. In my experience it also seems like the type of diamonds that get sent to EGL Israel have issues with them thus get sent there to get a higher grading. I can also understand how dealers and retailers may rely on selling EGL graded stones. For dealers and retailers EGL stones can be good for selling stones for it makes the consumers think they are getting a good diamond for their money. But for the consumes it can impact them in a really negative way. The consumers think they are getting a good deal on a diamond when in reality the are paying more for a lower quality stone that didn't get graded correctly. I agree that the only real good way to avoid this situation is by educating the consumers.

 

[LaraOnline]

Thank you for your great post, Oldminer!