EGL Israel Certificate Illegal in North America?

[IceyIce]

I tried contacting EGL USA to verify my EGL certified diamond. EGL USA stated that the certificate was in origin from EGL Israel and added that "EGL Israel certs are illegal certificates in North America." Is there any truth to this? I know my diamond will be validated upon appraisal but are the comments made by EGL USA accurate?

Thanks in advance for any comments.

 

[IceyIce]

Or has anyone bought an EGL Europe diamond that was totally satified with it and it checked out in the appraisal?

Help!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Greatcall]

I have heard of no such thing. Did you call EGL in LA?

 

[IceyIce]

GreatCall,

Thanks for the response. Finally got one!

Yes, that is who told me that my certificate is from EGL Israel and that the certificate is illegal in North America.

I can't find anything else on the web about this.

Let me know if you have any other suggestions.

Thanks again.

B

 

[AGBF]

On 6/16/2003 11:43:55 AM Greatcall wrote:

"I have heard of no such thing. Did you call EGL in LA?

"

I am glad someone answered this! I was wishing I could help, but had absolutely no idea what status an Israeli EGL certificate had here. Does *any* certificate have "legal" validity here? I know that a stone is not supposed to be off by more than two grades. If it is what happens? The seller is subject to lawsuit? The issuer of the certificate is?

 

[Greatcall]

Who at EGL La did you talk to?

 

[IceyIce]

AGBF, thanks for the reply.

GreatCall, I've been corresponding through email with a women named Shaindy at [email protected]. I do not know her last name.

Thanks again,

B

 

[Giangi]

Shaindy uses to answer all consumers questions...
I had already heard about EGL Antwerp and Israel being illegal in the US... I thought it simpy was an idea, but I didn't know this is already happening...

 

[mike04456]

The rep at EGL-LA is jumping the gun a bit. They have asked the US customs department to bar non-US EGL certs at the border, but to my knowledge there has not been a decision yet. I think it has something to do with Lanham Act unfair competition rules, though I am not sure about that.

A certificate is nothing but an expert opinion, not a guarantee or warranty--UNLESS it is provided by the same party that is selling the stone. In that case, it IS a warranty and if the stone is off, the seller is liable for misrepresentation.

As Furthermore explained (correctly enough for a non-lawyer

), the buyer's recourse is against the seller, not the lab, which is a third party having no connection with the sale. The seller has no recourse against the lab unless the lab is dumb to grade stones without getting a release of liability first--as all the major ones do.

 

[IceyIce]

I appreciate all of your comments. Read the reply email below from Shaindy at EGLUSA:

"Dear Bryan,

Sorry for the trouble..

The reason why the EGL Israel brand is illegal in North America is because they do not follow the United States grading standards.

Yes It is illegal and it will be confiscated sooner or later from the jewelers.

You want to make sure your stone is certified with EGL USA

Please contact me with any questions.

Thank you,

Shaindy Jacob,
EGL USA"

Are the claims she is making here only self serving? Sounds like the usual ours is better than theirs so make sure you give us some money line. Any more thoughts?

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I know a little about this.
I believe EGL-USA own the rights to the trademark EGL in USA and Canada.
At one time this organisation was all just EGL as a franchised business.
Now the US division (2 canadian and 2 US labs) has decided they no longer will tolerate the lax grading standards from Antwerp and Israel especially that result in their diamonds being tarred with the same brush.

It will be interesting to watch the situation unfold.

 

[pricescope]

[/u]

 

[niceice]

It seems like this may be a simple matter of trademark infringement as alleged by the U.S. Division of the EGL but you might contact the Jewelers Vigilance Committee http://www.jvclegal.org in New York at (212) 997-2002 and ask them about the legality of selling diamonds graded by an overseas laboratory here in the United States. If anybody is going to know whether the practice is legal, it will by the JVC. We would have made the call for you and posted their response on this thread ourselves, but unfortunately we didn't run across the thread until closing time here on the West Coast and the JVC has been closed for three hours now...

 

[Richard Sherwood]

-----------
Are the claims she is making here only self serving? Sounds like the
usual ours is better than theirs so make sure you give us some money
line. Any more thoughts?
-----------

I will say that I've never seen an EGL Israel cert that I've agreed on the grading.

 

[mike04456]

Thanks, Garry and Leonid. This makes more sense. I was not aware that there were separate EGL entities. If indeed EGL-USA owns the US trademark, under the Lanham Act, the Customs Dept can seize any infringing goods at the border, which is apparently what is going on. So people who are importing EGL-certed diamonds will get the diamonds but lose the certs. There are similar private rights of action when you have the goods already in the country, though I doubt (as the rep implies) that they're going to start raiding jewelry stores to seize EGL certs because of the ill will it would generate.

I do wonder what the foreign EGL labs will do in response. I have a feeling this is going to keep the lawyers employed for several years.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

The intersting thing is that EGL and EGL-USA stones are all listed under "EGL" on Rapnet and Polygon.
It should be possible for EGL-USA to identify and have removed, all non EGL USA stones?
This would have a big impact.

 

[mike04456]

----------------
On 6/17/2003 4:52:16 PM Cut Nut wrote:
The intersting thing is that EGL and EGL-USA stones are all listed under "EGL" on Rapnet and Polygon. It should be possible for EGL-USA to identify and have removed, all non EGL USA stones?
This would have a big impact. ----------------

I would not be surprised if they have already served Rapaport with a cease and desist order to that effect. If they haven't, I'm sure they're contemplating it.

 

[skandl]

Can someone help me to understand the difference between EGL USA grading and overseas grading? My cert # begins with LA followed by numeric. EGL''s website does not acknowledge this cert #. Please help I feel as if I was taken!

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

that is an EGL USa cert.

They have a reputation for being stricter than EGL Israel and Antwerp.

You can read about a survey we conducted on the front page - link in red on black box in lower left corner.

EGL USA is very close to the same strictness as GIA.

 

[mdx]

Date: 6/17/2003 4:52:16 PM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)
The intersting thing is that EGL and EGL-USA stones are all listed under ''EGL'' on Rapnet and Polygon.
It should be possible for EGL-USA to identify and have removed, all non EGL USA stones?
This would have a big impact.

Hi Gary
Just ran a check on Polygon.
You can search on these parameters
EGL Pre Cert
EGL Belgium
EGL Israel
EGL USA
EGLLA
EGLNY
EGLSA
They also display them individually in the search results
I have sent you a Screen copy by e-mail
Johan