Easing my nerves or Damn another Tiffany''s question

[thatdude]

According to the many posters in this forum, Tiffany''s and like retailers are grossly overpriced. Although I probably could afford a decent Tiffany''s ring, I would like to get value for my money as well (and not substitute Ramen Noodles for every fourth meal). I must say that I have a lot of trepidation about online retailers and I doubt the amount that I would save would be ease the pain of the ulcer it created -- I have a tendency to obsess over certain things. So I guess I am basically asking what is a good intermediate step? Can you really negotiate with your local jewelry store? What is H&A? Anyone have any good tips on how to go about purchasing an engagement ring. Note the ring that I am looking for is pretty simple -- princess cut solitaire. GF choice -- at least thats what I think I overheard. I would love to become an expert on the subject but I have a few limitations . . . I will graduate from law school and take the bar within the next few months. Thus, my time will be at a premium. Hence the reason Tiffany may be right for me -- working for a big law firm, e.g. a little extra cash, limited time to research, possible on-line purchase insanity. Any advice would be great. Also, I am located in the DC metro area -- recommendations on brick and mortar sites is welcome.
Thanks a great deal.

 

[decodelighted]

Hey there,

I hear ya. Everyone who places a premium on their time can understand the tradeoffs here ...but it''s not just ULCER vs. PRICE ... its POSSIBLE ULCER vs. PRICE + SIZE.

Any amount you spend at Tiffany''s could, with research, the help of Pscopers & a reputable online or non-designer Brick & Mortar jeweler would get you a much larger yet equally or even superior quality stone.

I love Tiff but am glad we didn''t do my e-ring from there because going the "non-designer" route afforded us an at least 30% larger stone, and the setting of my dreams. However, if my fiance had wanted to get me a Tiff/Harry Winston/Cartier ring for sentimental reasons or because he saw something he loved, loved, loved (rather than sheer convenience) I''d have swooned I''m sure.

Are the lines of communication open on this purchase, or is it a secret?

 

[Mara]

well nothing about choosing a great princess cut stone is simple unfortunately.....

but you could go a slightly easier route and find someone who carries the new ideal AGS0 princess stones, those seem to be real eye-poppers but may carry a slightly higher markup of their own.

i think winkjones.com carries them.

also the tiffany princess cut is the lucida, if i am not mistaken i recall, they do NOT have a regular ole princess cut? so if your gf wants a lucida which is a rounded corner squared stone then that could be an option, but yes you would end up with a much smaller stone than if you had shopped elsewhere.

anyway, personally i'd just start with educating yourself on here, and going out and looking at princess cut stones in stores too. DO NOT BUY anything, don't get carried away, just educate yourself, see stones in person, look at various colors and clarity combos and figure out who seems to carry the most sparkly stones, etc. take stones over by the store windows in natural light to see them outside of the fakey unnatural everythingsparkles store lights.

note that if you don't really have tons of time, i'd call up jonathan at GOG (www.goodoldgold.com) because he carries well-cut princess stones and well-cut squared rounded stones as well as the square H&A's etc and has lots of options for someone who wants something with a squarish shape and a great cut stone. if i was limited on time and just wanted an exceptionally cut stone i would probably do that, oh and check with wink on the AGS0 princesses. i'd start there.

the more patient you can be the better!

 

[someday]

Quest Jewlers is close and it is by Tiffany''s at Tysons. I believe. Alot of people have had their rings custom made by Quest and they look great. Also you can purchase the stone there and see it in person. Plus if you live in DC then you have the ring be tax free, because you could have the stone shipped to your home and with Tiffany''s it won''t be tax free-unless you ship from St. Thomas-.

 

[widget]

High thatdude, Welcome!

Shopping online for a high quality diamond ring is great for those with the interest, inclination and time to research and learn, and PS is a great place for that. BUT it's not for everyone...especially if the process might cause ulsers!

So there is something to be said for the "big names" (Tiff, HW, Cartier, Van Cleef, etc): you'll get a beautiful, high quality ulser-free ring and perhaps a sense of pride that it came from such highly regarded establishments. Whether or not the extra $$ involved is worth it is up to the individual.

I think lot's of independent jewelers come down a bit from the posted prices of their merchandise, but I don't know if that counts as 'negotiating'. It sure never hurts to try!

Good luck!
widget

 

[thatdude]

RE: Time. Although my time this summer will be at a premium, I doubt I would purchase before the end of the August. So I will have a little time to research before I start working in the sweatshops. Then again, I may just put off the whole asking thing for a couple of months -- that would buy me a little more time as well.

RE: Princess & Tiffany''s. Yes the Tiffany''s princess is the lucadia.

ASG0 -- I assume that is the ideal cut. Is there a faq with terminology and such?

Also, thanks for the heads up on the tax thing.

You guys are quick. I look forward to hearing from you guys in the future, as I am sure I will ask about 20 more mundane questions.

 

[firebirdgold]

I love Tiffany's but their prices are hard to swallow. I did originally suggest it to my bf as an ..um.. idiotproof method of buying a ring that's pretty. But after having been corrupted by PS, I'm steering him towards whiteflash.com.
What exactly is it about online diamond buying that you are leery of? You have the benefit of an entire forum of diamond obsessed customers all giving reviews of the vendors. While I'm sure somebody must have had a bad customer service experience with them, pretty much everyone who has dealt with the ps vendors have been glowing in their feedback.
I believe Quest's brick & Mortar is near D.C, and their jewelry work is very popular around here. I'm not sure about their diamond selection though, I can't remember off the top of my head. Whiteflash, and GoodoldGold have great diamond selections with a lot of information and helpful people. Plus both of them have good return policies. (Winkjones also has nice diamonds). You could buy a diamond from them and have Quest set it for you. It's not uncommon to buy a diamond from one place and have another place make the ring.
Is there a particular Tiffany setting that you are focusing on? There are some very good copies of their classic tiffany setting and the lucinda setting (the non-bezel one). I'm not so convinced on the gracefulness of the etoile copies, and they don't seem to be as common.
Hope that was helpful!

ETA: Dude! you people type fast!!

 

[thatdude]

WREN: I am looking at the Tiffany''s Lucadia.

ALL: Thanks -- now I kind of see how this is developing. So a good method of finding a diamond may be to locate an online dealer, make a trip to their brick and mortar, then do you have it appraised by your own third party? What is this about create your own ring -- I kind of thought they were all similar -- rings that is. I guess I have a lot to learn. I know there are different settings and stones but do rings really change that much? As far as online retailers, does this forum offer some type of ranking system? Man, this is going to be a lot more work than I thought. Finally, in an ideal world I would purchase something like a 1.1 carat princess cut or Lucadia, platinum ring. My GF is very tiny 4''11" -- is this about the right size? I guess I am willing to spend between 8500 and 11K. Is that too much? She isnt very materialistic, but still in all. HMMM . . . thanks again.

 

[Small]

I just wanted to chime in and say that I bought a diamond from Wink Jones (he carries the AGS0 princess cuts) and he was fantastic to work with! I highly recommend him. He's very honest and you definitely get a comfortable feel with great customer service. I can sympathize with your time constraint and your nervous feelings about buying online...I felt the same way. If you stick around here long enough though you can get a true feel for the kind of vendors you would be more comfortable working with. Remember too...they have return policies so it's not like you couldn't view the diamond and decide you didn't want it and move on.
Do some research and come up with what is really important in your quest to find your girl's diamond. Then maybe talk to some of the vendors either via email or phone depending on your time and also go out and look around some. I would at least suggest talking to some of the vendors here about your search...it can't hurt to compare what they have to offer right?
Good luck.

 

[ecf8503]

Here''s one to get you started:

1.50ct AGS0 Princess H VS1 for $10,257

 

[february2003bride]

Here is a "gently loved" Lucida at SignedPieces: http://www.signedpieces.com/item.cfm?item_id=3825

And attached is a WF X prong princess that's just stunning! I would buy from either Good Old Gold or WhiteFlash for a Lucida look-alike. More bang for hte buck and they are trusted here at PriceScope!

 

[ecf8503]

If you haven''t seen a Square Hearts and Arrows here''s one at Good Old Gold - 1.46ct F VS2 - no price listed (you''d have to call them)

 

[firebirdgold]

Hmmm. Lucinda..
Just to give you an idea for under $10k:
Personally I''m very fond of the channel set x-prong style

Set with something like this:

(I don''t know that much about princess cuts, but it looks pretty to me)

or a plain dvatche x-prong with this beauty from GOG:

Just ideas, and very easily bought.

 

[ecf8503]

Here''s a few AGS0 Princesses at Wink Jones:

PR 1.19ct F VS1 $9,104 AGS 0/0/0/0

PR 1.3ct F VS2 $10,075 AGS 0/0/0/0

 

[firebirdgold]

Have you thought about an asscher cut? They''d look great with the x-prong style
I know this one is smaller, but it''s a very pretty picture.
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/1879/

I also think radiants look similar to the lucinda cut in their outline
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/1846/

 

[thatdude]

Thanks guys that will give me a few places to begin my search. You guys have made me 500% smarter in about 8 hours. Those diamonds all look great, which probably means I am in trouble. Since I am such a novice, princess and ascher (sp?) are different? How so? Is the ascher an emerald cut?

 

[Modified Brilliant]

So a good method of finding a diamond may be to locate an online dealer, make a trip to their brick and mortar, then do you have it appraised by your own third party?

thatdude,

It''s not a bad idea to get an independent appraiser to verify your diamond and check the quality of the workmanship. It''s part of what we do....spot shoddy workmanship, loose stones, and tiny problems that could develop into bigger problems. I always feel that when you''re spending big bucks on an important purchase...an independent appraisal can''t hurt...but than again I''m a bit biased.

Good luck with your search and ask tons of questions!

www.metrojewelryappraisers.com

 

[diamond_quester]

Hi, I''m from the DC Metro area and recently bought a cut-cornered square diamond locally. I haven''t gotten my ring yet but had good experiences so far.

My original plan was to purchase from Good Old Gold because they have an impressive variety of square shapes. They seem really knowledgeable and helpful. If you''re leaning that way, I''ll add another a recommendation for them.

However, I bought from Limon''s in Bethesda, MD, due to the convenience. They had access to the shapes I wanted and were happy to call in stones in my specs, and they emphasized quality of cut. I was able to compare 6 options within days, and also compare with ideal cut (not H&A) rounds and a square radiant. My ring ended up costing a few hundred dollars more than from an online vendor. Not THE cheapest route but, in my opinion, ideal for someone whose time is at a premium and a small price to pay for viewing the diamonds before purchasing. We don''t plan to get the diamond appraised.

My search was probably simpler because I wanted a Lucere (similar to the Lucida) or Flanders cut. Each of those only have one supplier in the US and relatively small inventory, so I figured jewelers everywhere would be calling in the same stones.

 

[princessv]

thatdude: just to add some more to what others have said..I started out liking the Tiffany''s Lucida then was steered towards princess cuts and then I found PS and fell in love with the Jubilee. I know they are in short supply (if any) right now (not sure if they are still any around) but I love ''em Jubilee Cut. I think Jubs look more square than cushiony but thats JMHO

I had my re-set done at Quest and they really know how to do good work but if you visit in their current location...they do not have a show room at all it''s more like a workshop with a small office if that makes sense. (I wish someone had warned me before I went..I was totally unprepared hehe!)

Asschers are fun..they are like ECs in that they are step cuts. Different in that the patterns of the diamond are different just look in the SMTR folder for some asschers and ECs. As much as I love love love asschers, I realize that they are not for me. I am a big sparkle girl and the sparkle of an asscher is a little more understated but still very elegant. Also, are you planning on bringing your girl ring shopping so she can try on different shapes and settings? It can save alot of time and money, not to mention in some cases, heartache.

 

[thatdude]

Diamond Quester -- thanks a lot. I will look them up as well as some of the online places as well. I think we have similar concerns or at least methodology . . . I like the idea of being able to look someone in the eye.

 

[thatdude]

Date: 3/20/2006 8:48:03 PM
Author: Princess V
As much as I love love love asschers, I realize that they are not for me. I am a big sparkle girl and the sparkle of an asscher is a little more understated but still very elegant. Also, are you planning on bringing your girl ring shopping so she can try on different shapes and settings? It can save alot of time and money, not to mention in some cases, heartache.

Well the big sparkle part sounds very much like what I THINK she would say . . . I was going to try to do this on my own, if possible. I would like it to be a surprise.

 

[widget]

Well, my first love will always be the elegant, "bottomless well" look of a beautiful asscher, but there are plenty of more sparkly squarish stones out there if that''s your druthers!

Personally, I don''t care for princess cuts and their pointy corners that require special protection...like V-prongs...but that''s just me.

Hee hee Dude: Are you confused yet?

widget

 

[Lynn B]

This may go without saying... and if so, please forgive! But the foremost thing, I think, to know (as a newbie) is that all diamonds are NOT created equal. CUT is the most important "C" and it will determine the beauty and SPARKLE of the diamond you choose. Therefore, whatever "shape" you choose, it is critical to choose a stone with a stellar cut. That''s where it can get tricky, and most average B&Ms will try to sell you color, or clarity, or size... with very little (if any) mention of cut.

That''s why Mara suggested an AGS-0 princess... with an AGS-0 stone, you can be pretty darn sure that you have a great performer. AGS also grades rounds, but currently those are the only two shapes that they assign cut grades to.

 

[thatdude]

Date: 3/20/2006 9:35:54 PM
Author: widget

Hee hee Dude: Are you confused yet?

widget

Why Yes I am.

 

[thatdude]

Date: 3/20/2006 10:15:06 PM
Author: Lynn B
This may go without saying... and if so, please forgive! But the foremost thing, I think, to know (as a newbie) is that all diamonds are NOT created equal. CUT is the most important ''C'' and it will determine the beauty and SPARKLE of the diamond you choose. Therefore, whatever ''shape'' you choose, it is critical to choose a stone with a stellar cut. That''s where it can get tricky, and most average B&Ms will try to sell you color, or clarity, or size... with very little (if any) mention of cut.


That''s why Mara suggested an AGS-0 princess... with an AGS-0 stone, you can be pretty darn sure that you have a great performer. AGS also grades rounds, but currently those are the only two shapes that they assign cut grades to.

Actually that is something that I did not know.

 

[Lynn B]

Date: 3/20/2006 10:21:15 PM
Author: thatdude

Actually that is something that I did not know.

Well, then, I''m glad I mentioned it!

 

[ljmorgan]

I second Quest Jewelers! They are in Mclean, VA right by Tyson's Corner. They have extremely competetive prices and are very friendly. They will custom create anything that you want, so just bring in a picture. We are having a ring created by them right now. With Quest you have internet pricing, but with the ability to work with them in person so it's not nearly as stressful. I really recommend getting in touch with them. They will make your wildest dreams come true!

 

[thatdude]

CUT: If cut is the most important, is there a uniformed grading scale. Is that the ideal, premium, etc. scale? I need to read some faqs but first I need to read some law, especially if I am going to pay for all this.

 

[Mara]

No there is no uniform idea of what is beautiful for cut, but it is the most important thing, a badly cut stone will not return as much light to your eye as a well-cut stone, regardless of shape.

With princesses or fancies it's even harder than with rounds to determine what people find ideal or beautiful, because they are cut for shape and not always for 'best light return'.

I would say that GOG has probably the best selection of in-house diamonds that are going to be beautiful and they carry princess cuts, square H&A's, regents (another square rounded stone), it would almost be the 'easiest' place to find and virtually see many options. I would want to see many options if I were you, not just what a local jeweler sells or one AGS0 ideal stone, etc.

I would start with reading the tutorials here on PS but really it is alot of information to digest...I hope you don't get too overwhelmed...take your time and ask questions here...but make them as specific as possible so that people can help you out. good luck!

 

[Kaleigh]

Why not call Jonathon at GOG tomorrow and see what he can find for you. I would also give Wink a call too. www.winkjones.com They will take great care of you. Good luck!!