E-Ring Help — Online vs In-Store

[sledge]

Interesting interpretation of David's post. I actually interpreted his post to mean that when looking at any given stone, then if over 99% of the surface area was eye-clean, then that stone could be graded VS, whilst anything over 95% and under 99% would be graded SI. Make sense?

I understand what you are saying but I did not intepret that way. While size of the inclusion plays into the clarity grading it is not as simplistic as saying X% is free of inclusions therefore it is a Y grade.

Instead the quantity, size, nature and location of each individual inclusion comes into play along with how said inclusions affect the overall appearance of the stone.

Well I agree to leave the % out of this but in my hamble 35 years looking at diamonds I do not remember (maybe it is my memory) seing a GIA or AGS or HRD certified VS2 which is visible- as mentioned before by looking from top from 20cm.
Very rarely I see an SI1 diamond certified by the above labs that is not eye clean, the real problem starts with SI2 certified diamonds-many are not eye clean.

Being a diamond business owner and having 35 years in the trade would make your sample pool much larger than mine. Also it may indicate a shift of diamond quality. I have often heard an SI1 stone of yesteryear tends to be cleaner than an SI1 stone of today. Obviously this isn't true of every case but as a "general observation" the old was better than the new.

Percentages and technicalities aside I would agree there are many SI1 stones that are eye clean.

 

[DeJoHe]

Alright so I’ve narrowed my search down further, with the help of excellent customer service from both WF and BGD.

I know these are both top notch vendors, and each offers exceptional quality product. Is there any consensus on which brand is generally “better”? I understand the answer to that is largely subjective, the impressions of which being based on a stone-by-stone basic. Just curious your feedback on how they typically compare?

For reference, here are the stones I’ve narrowed down to as of today:

Selection of WF stones: https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3965477,3408406,3712977,3508611

BGD 2.040 K-VS1: https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/....040-k-vs1-round-diamond-ags-cbl-104102258027

BGD 1.718 J-VS1: https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/...ls/1.718-j-vs1-round-diamond-ags-104102020069

The BGD stones seem to face up much whiter than their color grade would suggest. This was also conveyed to me by their rep I spoke with (who was very responsive and helpful)—typically I wouldn’t believe this kind of stuff coming from a sales rep, but given their reputation, it stands to reason that she wasn’t just pitching me. The stones don’t look particularly warm to me, but obviously tough to tell online.

I also noticed that the WF stones seem to show a ton more fire in their 360 photos, but I assume that’s due more to the photography techniques than the stones themselves.

Looking forward to some feedback!

 

[crbl999]

Alright so I’ve narrowed my search down further, with the help of excellent customer service from both WF and BGD.

I know these are both top notch vendors, and each offers exceptional quality product. Is there any consensus on which brand is generally “better”? I understand the answer to that is largely subjective, the impressions of which being based on a stone-by-stone basic. Just curious your feedback on how they typically compare?

For reference, here are the stones I’ve narrowed down to as of today:

Selection of WF stones: https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3965477,3408406,3712977,3508611

BGD 2.040 K-VS1: https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/....040-k-vs1-round-diamond-ags-cbl-104102258027

BGD 1.718 J-VS1: https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/...ls/1.718-j-vs1-round-diamond-ags-104102020069

The BGD stones seem to face up much whiter than their color grade would suggest. This was also conveyed to me by their rep I spoke with (who was very responsive and helpful)—typically I wouldn’t believe this kind of stuff coming from a sales rep, but given their reputation, it stands to reason that she wasn’t just pitching me. The stones don’t look particularly warm to me, but obviously tough to tell online.

I also noticed that the WF stones seem to show a ton more fire in their 360 photos, but I assume that’s due more to the photography techniques than the stones themselves.

Looking forward to some feedback!

You can't go wrong with either vendor. These are my favorites. If color sensitivity is not a factor I would go with the 1.824 I SI1 due to its size. Otherwise the 1.746 H SI1 is a great choice to maximize color.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Keep in mind, places like WF, HPD and BGD are super ideal vendors and they also have local store fronts. What really separates them is they focus on cut quality and precision of a high magnitude. It serves them well to do the additional things like provide performance and symmetry images, videos, pictures, etc to help prove what superior products they have. For the nerds, WF will even run advanced Sarin reports and share with you. The fact the stones are in-stock in their vault and fully vetted also speaks volumes.

IMO, the difference is when you have a unique and high quality product, you have to market it differently than a guy selling a virtual inventory stone that 10 other retailers can get. With virtual inventory you have nothing unique, other than your ability to sell cheaper than your competition. To maximize profit margins, you can't always offer the same level of service of those with more high quality & unique products because those services cost money, time & effort.

Aside from gorgeous diamonds, one of the things I love about WF, HPD and BGD is they have a sincere desire to build a long-term relationship with a client. Notice I said client, and not customer? Customers are just people that spend money. When companies take time to treat you like a valued client, that is special -- period. I have lots of choices of where to spend my money so I like to spend it with people that I like, and that have great products and fair prices. Fair prices doesn't always mean the lowest price, but rather a good price that is cognizant of all criteria and circumstances I deem important.

I'm not sure who is helping you at WF, but I am going to call out @Texas Leaguer who is their VP and might be able to help expedite the process.




Where are you getting your facts for 99% eye clean on VS2's and 95% on SI1's? I hate percentages in general as a statistics professor once started his class with the expression, "99% of all statistics is made up".

While I'm not implying you made them up, I will explain what the professor meant. Most the time, to make a statement about percentages we had to have a sample group. That sample group may or may not be fully representative of the actual group. Most the time the sample group is much smaller and does not always give accurate results.

I haven't actually done any precise data collection & reporting or scientific methods to confirm but in my limited layman sampling I'm not sure I would agree that 95% of all SI1's are eye clean which is why I found this statement interesting.

This is a good one Sledge: "99% of all statistics is made up"

The real problem with making any pronouncements about the percentage of Si1 (or VS2 for that matter) that are 'eye clean' is not so much variable definitions of what eye clean means. It is the fact that it is highly size dependent. A VS2 in a 2ct is far more likely to have an inclusion visible to the naked eye than a VS2 in a .50ct. The allowable size of inclusions is somewhat relative to the size of the diamond.
Saying it another way, if you could magically pluck the crystal out of the 2ct VS2 and place it in the .50ct, you would have a .50ct Si1 - maybe even an Si2!