Does 14k or higher gold content tarnish? Question re Victorian piece

[Pinkmartini87]

Hi all,

I saw this very peculiar locket described as Victorian, tested per seller as 14k or 15k gold, but to my humble eyes there seems to be a lot of tarnish (too much tarnish for a gold karat content supposedly described?). Piece is unmarked.

I know many Victorian lockets are usually gilded/plated, is this possible for this piece that the gilding/plating has worn off to reveal the base metal beneath?

And would it be possible to replate?

I really love it but would not want to pay for 14k gold price if in fact it’s not (or if it’s not a true Victorian era piece). Currently being sold for 3000 USD.

 

[glitterata]

Yes, any gold with substantial nongold metal in the alloy, including 14K, can tarnish, given enough time and exposure to chemicals in the air where it was stored. The lower the gold content, the more quickly and thoroughly it will tarnish, but without knowing how it was stored, there's no way to judge the gold content from the tarnish. If that's 14K, the colors in the photo are very distorted--the background is very blue and the parts without tarnish are not very yellow. That's a beautiful piece, at a high price. If it were me, I would want details about how it was tested for gold content and a reliable, no-questions-asked return policy so you can get it checked out when you receive it.

My guess, for what it's worth, is that that locket is either tarnished gold of some alloy (possibly 14K, possibly lower) or vermeil--that is, gilded silver. It doesn't look gold filled to me. It does look plausibly Victorian.

 

[MollyMalone]

Hi, @Pinkmartini87
Is the vendor saying this is 14-15K white gold or yellow gold?

 

[Pinkmartini87]

Yes, any gold with substantial nongold metal in the alloy, including 14K, can tarnish, given enough time and exposure to chemicals in the air where it was stored. The lower the gold content, the more quickly and thoroughly it will tarnish, but without knowing how it was stored, there's no way to judge the gold content from the tarnish. If that's 14K, the colors in the photo are very distorted--the background is very blue and the parts without tarnish are not very yellow. That's a beautiful piece, at a high price. If it were me, I would want details about how it was tested for gold content and a reliable, no-questions-asked return policy so you can get it checked out when you receive it.

My guess, for what it's worth, is that that locket is either tarnished gold of some alloy (possibly 14K, possibly lower) or vermeil--that is, gilded silver. It doesn't look gold filled to me. It does look plausibly Victorian.

Many thanks for the detailed reply! I will query and report back!

 

[Pinkmartini87]

Hi, @Pinkmartini87
Is the vendor saying this is 14-15K white gold or yellow gold?

Greetings! Does not say, just 14-15k tested.

 

[glitterata]

Hi, @Pinkmartini87
Is the vendor saying this is 14-15K white gold or yellow gold?

If it's Victorian, it has to be yellow or rose gold--white gold wasn't invented until the early 20th century.
Edited: Actually, I think white gold was invented a little earlier, but it really wasn't used until after World War I. Before that, if you wanted white metal, you used silver or occasionally platinum.

 

[MollyMalone]

If it's Victorian, it has to be yellow or rose gold--white gold wasn't invented until the early 20th century.
Edited: Actually, I think white gold was invented a little earlier, but it really wasn't used until after World War I. Before that, if you wanted white metal, you used silver or occasionally platinum.

Yep, that's why I asked: if the vendor were saying it's white gold, then you'd know s/he is blowing smoke to describe the locket as Victorian.

I too am wondering what the locket is made of. At least on my monitor, the exterior surface appearance looks most like silver that, apart from the crevices, has been polished. And heavily tarnished silver can have golden/brassy tones (not just dark grey), so maybe that would explain the appearance of the interior surfaces.

I'm tagging @Bron357 , @YadaYadaYada and @stracci2000 to see what they might say

 

[Pinkmartini87]

@MollyMalone Many thanks for your advice and for the tags! I really love the look of the piece but agree that there are some unanswered questions!

 

[Pinkmartini87]

@MollyMalone & @glitterata

Updates from seller who has been very fast to respond which I appreciate:

1. It is clearly yellow gold and not plated. As per description, it was acid tested as there are no marks, which is typical of English jewelry of this period.

2. I know that 'photos can be misleading. I do not believe there is any tarnish. There is dirt, in particular in the crevices that are difficult to reach. I think that with some warm water, an old toothbrush and dish-washing-up/liquid soap, you could get rid of most of it. As you know, many people/collectors would not wish to do that.

 

[stracci2000]

I would ask for more photos in different lighting. The color looks really washed out.
And yes, I have seen tarnished gold, but generally it is low karat gold.

And about that price.....
For $3000, (which is really exorbitant for this piece) I would:
1. Ask for more photos in other light sources. If it is yellow gold, then by golly, send better pics that show it is yellow gold!

2. Question the age. Late Victorian? Early Victorian? English? French? Russian? How can we know for sure with no marks?
And what is the stone...
Garnet? Ruby?
If you are going to spend this much, I feel the vendor needs to be more thorough about the description and photos.

 

[Pinkmartini87]

I would ask for more photos in different lighting. The color looks really washed out.
And yes, I gave seen tarnished gold, but generally it is low karat gold.

And about that price.....
For $3000, (which is really exorbitant for this piece) I would:
1. Ask for more photos in other light sources. If it is yellow gold, then by golly, send better pics that show it is yellow gold!

2. Question the age. Late Victorian? Early Victorian? English? French? Russian? How can we know for sure with no marks?
And what is the stone...
Garnet? Ruby?
If you are going to spend this much, I feel the vendor needs to be more thorough about the description and photos.

@stracci2000 Thanks for taking the time to stop by! Stone is garnet.

I’ve expressed my honest reservations to seller that:
1) if the “dirt” (per seller it’s dirt and not tarnish) does not come off I would want to return
2) if the locket does not test as 14k or higher I would want to return

Because I really do generally purchase with the intent of NOT returning (too much hassle!).

Here’s the eBay link in case it’s helpful for you to get a “feel” for her if you can look also some of her other items/listings, if you have time. She’s been very kind and responsive thus far for what it’s worth! I’d love to know what you think given your vast experience with antique jewelry AND online shopping!

Victorian Pendant Locket 14-15ct Gold, Carved Garnet, Double Hearts Cherub (6901 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Victorian Pendant Locket 14-15ct Gold, Carved Garnet, Double Hearts Cherub (6901 at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[Pinkmartini87]

Well, glad I asked re the cleaning! Her response,

“If you attempt to clean it, I will not be able to accept it back. I am selling it as it is and most of my customers would not want an antique item that someone tried to clean.
It is an antique and we expect antiques to have signs of age and wear. I suggest you think about it before making a decision.”

I hate to waste her time and I think maybe for me $3000 is too much to gamble for me, and it would really bother me if I were not able to clean off the “dirt” and be obligated to keep it anyway.

 

[ringo865]

Seems like too big of a risk.

 

[MollyMalone]

The listing states that she does not accept returns; a "no returns" policy is, in and of itself, a deal breaker for me when the purchase price is more money than I care to declare a loss -- even though I know one can seek reimbursement via eBay's Money Back Guarantee policy when the item received "doesn't match the listing:"

eBay Money Back Guarantee policy

eBay Money Back Guarantee covers most transactions on eBay. It means buyers can get their money back if an item didn't arrive, is faulty or damaged, or doesn't match the listing.

www.ebay.com

I'm also put off by her haughty claim that she is a purist about not cleaning antique jewelry because "most of my customers would not want an antique item that someone tried to clean." Compare and contrast the photos of this locket with those of other pieces she describes as being Victorian and 14K-15K gold -- and which obviously have been cleaned up to a far greater extent than the locket you've inquired about, e.g.:

Antique Victorian Pendant Locket 15K Gold Diamonds Turquoise w Appraisal (5918) | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Antique Victorian Pendant Locket 15K Gold Diamonds Turquoise w Appraisal (5918) at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

Antique Victorian Earrings 15ct Gold Engraving Tassels Filigree Granulation(6889 | eBay

Beneath a gold half-globe is a v-shaped, flat surmount, like a Dutch gable with it's curves and scrolls, the entire upper surface very finely engraved with tightly scrolling ferns, which give a textured effect.

www.ebay.com

 

[Snowdrop13]

It looks like silver gilt to me, with all the gold worn away! The price is way too high, as others have said.

 

[kgizo]

The inside of the locket looks a different color than the outside here. Wonder where she acid tested and about the photography. So many questions about this one.

 

[Pinkmartini87]

@MollyMalone Exactly! Maybe I misunderstood her, but seems odd to me anyway that I’m expected to keep an antique piece with dirt (her words not mine that it’s dirt, not tarnish) on it and if I clean some but not all the dirt off she would not take it back in that “disturbed” state, and if I can’t clean the dirt off at all she would not take it back either. I don’t think most antique jewelry lovers are going around nowadays wearing pieces with dirt on it! I get preserving the patina, but dirt??

@Snowdrop13 Yes, I’m going to pass, don’t need unnecessary stress/hassle over the holidays!

@kgizo Agreed. I really want to give her the benefit of doubt that she is trustworthy and her descriptions accurate, because I really love the look of the piece, but without a return policy I’m just not willing to take a chance on an internet sale that I can’t inspect in person prior to purchase.

 

[glitterata]

I think you're wise to pass. The price is astronomical, and the "dirt" really does look like tarnish.

 

[glitterata]

I mean, $1K for a worn 20th century 14K green chalcedony ring? Come on.

Antique Ring 14k Gold Sugarloaf Green Chalcedony Pinky Ring Emerald Green (6610) | eBay

Great shape and proportion. It is held in a mount of moulded gold with flowers and foliage in small detail. The stone rises up within this interesting gold mount making for a doubly interesting feature.

www.ebay.com

 

[DAF]

I've been following Brenda for a couple of years. She really finds some unique, exquisite pieces.

I purchased an18k Victorian watch chain that had been converted into a necklace from an IG seller. Her pics had a beautiful, rich buttery yellow color gold. In person, it looked brassy. I did ask her about patina and asked if she knew of anything that would take the patina off. She was mortified, and pointed out that mixed color metals were in now. She suggested a jewelry polishing cloth. I needed quick and little effort. I tried Tarn-X and it brightened it up considerably. I'm happy with it now. It's still not as bright as I would have liked it, as I'm a matchy-matchy person.

 

[Pinkmartini87]

I've been following Brenda for a couple of years. She really finds some unique, exquisite pieces.

I purchased an18k Victorian watch chain that had been converted into a necklace from an IG seller. Her pics had a beautiful, rich buttery yellow color gold. In person, it looked brassy. I did ask her about patina and asked if she knew of anything that would take the patina off. She was mortified, and pointed out that mixed color metals were in now. She suggested a jewelry polishing cloth. I needed quick and little effort. I tried Tarn-X and it brightened it up considerably. I'm happy with it now. It's still not as bright as I would have liked it, as I'm a matchy-matchy person.

Many thanks for sharing your experience! Sounds like her description is largely accurate but color may be a bit off in the photos possibly sometimes? That’s one of my concerns on this piece—it’s supposed to be yellow gold 14k or higher per description but doesn’t look very yellow to me, and the discoloration to me looks like tarnish, not dirt per her description, but I’m just guessing based on photos.

Ideally I would want the gold more yellow, and no tarnish/dirt. The lack of return policy concerns me.

 

[Pinkmartini87]

Many thanks for sharing your experience! Sounds like her description is largely accurate but color may be a bit off in the photos possibly sometimes? That’s one of my concerns on this piece—it’s supposed to be yellow gold 14k or higher per description but doesn’t look very yellow to me, and the discoloration to me looks like tarnish, not dirt per her description, but I’m just guessing based on photos.

Ideally I would want the gold more yellow, and no tarnish/dirt. The lack of return policy concerns me.

Oops, my mistake, I see you were referring to your experience with another IG seller, not Brenda. Please ignore prior msg!

 

[YadaYadaYada]

Sorry, I am just seeing this! Notifications aren’t always reliable for me!

@stracci2000 brought up some great points and questions and as @MollyMalone said, lack of a return policy definitely doesn’t ease ones mind with such a large purchase.

I know you said you decided to pass and IMO that’s smart because there are just too many questions. I also think the color is very odd and looks too washed out, also no return policy. I would have come to the same conclusion.

 

[Pinkmartini87]

Sorry, I am just seeing this! Notifications aren’t always reliable for me!

@stracci2000 brought up some great points and questions and as @MollyMalone said, lack of a return policy definitely doesn’t ease ones mind with such a large purchase.

I know you said you decided to pass and IMO that’s smart because there are just too many questions. I also think the color is very odd and looks too washed out, also no return policy. I would have come to the same conclusion.

Thanks for taking the time! I feel reassured that you agree!