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Do you believe that they are blue diamonds?

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stci

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It'' done. I bought my diamond this evening. I am so nervous that I cannot sleep. I am so happy! The realization of my dream would like that mounting is a blue diamond halo. Not need to be large but I think that it would be pretty. I found this ring which is to be sold. The person says that they are blue diamonds and the price would be reasonable. I could make me make a mounting with these diamonds.

My question: do you believe that they can really be blue diamonds?

Here is the description of the ring: "New ladie''s 14kt yellow gold 1.5c blue diamonds. Clarity SI2-I1 Color fancy blue. Gold weight 7.71 grams. Comes with US Gemological identification card. Estimated replacement value $13,377.00."


 

strmrdr

Super_Ideal_Rock
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treated blues most likely if they are real the cert is a joke.
 

stci

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Ho! I see... and it''s probably not a good idea to put this treated diamonds with my real diamond no? What do you think?
 

JulieN

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It''s fine to mix. They''re not going to hurt each other.
 

stci

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And how much would you agree to pay to recover these treated diamonds? After, I will tell you how much the person ask...
 

Officers girl

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Jan 16, 2007
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If you are going custom for your mounting your jeweler should be able to provide you with treated blues and I would imagine it would be less than the 13000 especially if the blues are only for a halo.
 

UCLABelle

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That is a beautiful ring, but no doubt in MHO that they are treated....If you thought they were untreated, and they bug you, I would ask for a refund. If not, they are still pretty, and keep it! But be aware that most real natural blue diamonds have a different hue than those treated blue diamonds.
 

denverappraiser

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I think you would have little difficulty finding someone who would be willing to replace that ring for less than $13k.


‘Replacement value’, ’Insurance Value’, ‘Appraised Value’, and similar terms when presented by a seller are often a misdirection. If the asking price is significantly different from the appraised value, this is almost always the case. Anyone who wants to can call themselves a gemological lab and anyone who wants to can give you their opinion as to what something ought to be worth. The secret is that you don’t have to care. If you can’t identify the appraiser and you can’t determine what THEY mean by their various terms, you should ignore it.


These cards are not completely useless. Although you haven’t learned anything at all about the jewelry, you’ve learned a great deal about the dealer. They’re giving you information that they know to be false in the hopes that they can convince you to buy something. In other words, they’re lying to you. If they have these things proudly displayed with every item, you know even more. They lie to every potential customer about every item every time. It’s the basis of their sales pitch. Shop accordingly and don’t rely on what they tell you.


Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 

diamondseeker2006

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I personally would far rather have some beautiful natural sapphires around a diamond than treated blue diamonds.
 

Ellen

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Date: 1/19/2007 8:26:48 AM
Author: UCLABelle
Another
Can you imagine this in a halo??
 

RockDoc

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Date: 1/19/2007 12:56:03 AM
Author:stci
It'' done. I bought my diamond this evening. I am so nervous that I cannot sleep. I am so happy! The realization of my dream would like that mounting is a blue diamond halo. Not need to be large but I think that it would be pretty. I found this ring which is to be sold. The person says that they are blue diamonds and the price would be reasonable. I could make me make a mounting with these diamonds.

My question: do you believe that they can really be blue diamonds?

Here is the description of the ring: ''New ladie''s 14kt yellow gold 1.5c blue diamonds. Clarity SI2-I1 Color fancy blue. Gold weight 7.71 grams. Comes with US Gemological identification card. Estimated replacement value $13,377.00.''


Treated or Natural Color ????????

Here''s is where it get a bit "sticky".

Nothing is mentioned in the description that these are treated or untreated blue diamnonds. Now we don''t have a graphic of the USGI report, however the value reported, would lead a "reasonable person" to assume that they are untreated!

From the photo the stones all appear to be small ones, and they have a stated weight of 1.5 carats. Yet the value is reported at $ 13K. This would certainly not be a price for treated blues, would it? So there is a strong INFERENCE that the diamonds are natural. ( count one ), and by not disclosing the treatment you have a situation of Deception by Omission (Count Two).

I think treated blue SI-2-I-1 small diamonds would sell for a lot less than $ 13K.

A prudent purchaser would ask what they are definitively. However, not all purchasers know about treatment and the affect on their values.

Rockdoc
 

DBM

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Date: 1/19/2007 12:56:03 AM
Author:stci
It'' done. I bought my diamond this evening. I am so nervous that I cannot sleep. I am so happy! The realization of my dream would like that mounting is a blue diamond halo. Not need to be large but I think that it would be pretty. I found this ring which is to be sold. The person says that they are blue diamonds and the price would be reasonable. I could make me make a mounting with these diamonds.

My question: do you believe that they can really be blue diamonds?

Here is the description of the ring: ''New ladie''s 14kt yellow gold 1.5c blue diamonds. Clarity SI2-I1 Color fancy blue. Gold weight 7.71 grams. Comes with US Gemological identification card. Estimated replacement value $13,377.00.''
?? I''m not understanding why the thought of purchasing that ring, taking apart the stones and then resetting them instead of having a jeweler quote the cost of a new setting with new treated blue diamonds or natural blue diamonds in a halo. why pay the extra in setting costs and possible damage to the stones in the resetting?
 

Cehrabehra

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Date: 1/19/2007 2:54:36 AM
Author: stci
And how much would you agree to pay to recover these treated diamonds? After, I will tell you how much the person ask...
why not just source them? the treated ones would be less than naturals anyway... and you wouldn''t have to deal with the hassle of having them removed or buying that ring.... if I were you I''d email wink and see what he can get you those stones for without the hassle and you can compare the difference yourself :)
 

Cehrabehra

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Date: 1/19/2007 9:13:18 AM
Author: diamondseeker2006
I personally would far rather have some beautiful natural sapphires around a diamond than treated blue diamonds.
ITA - however I do like the coor the treated blues get - that slightly green tinge to them.... kinda like topaz but of course harder. If that was the color I was going for I''d get them but I kinda prefer the baby blue hue you can get from sapphires anyway :)
 

Fly Girl

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I have a pair of treated blue diamond studs and they are exactly the color of the stones in your ring. I love them, and wear them all the time. I think they are a beautiful shade of blue, they cost a fraction of the price of clear stones, and I don''t worry about wasting big $$$ if I should lose one.


I think treated stones would make a beautiful sparkly halo for a diamond. I''d ask a jeweler to pick them out, though. They will select the nicest ones for you.
 

strmrdr

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There is nothing wrong with treated blues as long as they are properly disclosed by the seller and properly priced.
Its the element of fraud around them by some sellers that gives them a bad name.
I think the ones iv seen look pretty nice but the do have a bit different look to them and need to be seen in person.
I would likely use sapphire instead for a halo.
 

dkodner

Shiny_Rock
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I would feel VERY confident in agreeing with everyone else that these stones are indeed treated. They are not the color (at least in the picture) of natural blue. They do however match the color of treated blues. The value is nowhere near $13K. Treated blues of that size may sell retail for $1000.00 per carat, and that would be FULL retail. so you have a little over $1500.00 in the treated blues. I would run away from anyone who tells you this is worth $13000.00. Nothing wrong with using treated blues for small stones though, just be aware of what you are buying.

In my mind, the listing of this ring as blue diamonds, and omitting the treatment is FRAUD, plain and simple.....
 

RockDoc

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Date: 1/19/2007 12:39:13 PM
Author: denverappraiser
Here''s a list of completed auctions from that very vendor that will give you a better idea of how much they are actually selling things for. Quite a few of them involve blue diamonds and USGL ''certificates''.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
It is very interesting that this seller (Neiman''s) seems to do this on as a systematic practice. In looking at his ebay sales, he''s sold 20,000 pieces, with a 99% positive feedback.

I read one negative feedback where the buyer says it isn''t anywhere near the value as represented..for the item he purchased.

But it appears evident that he represents treated blue diamonds without proper disclosure of what he is really selling.

What is shocking to me, is that so many buyers have said how "beautiful" or "lovely" the stuff is. In looking at a few of the images, it really does not look like the qualities of fine stuff albeit the USGL reports seem to support that the stones are natural by way of the values they''ve assigned to the various items. I wonder how many of the purchasers went to someone knowledgeable to learn the "real" truth about what they bought? Probably none, as there are so many positive feedbacks for this seller.

Valuations such as this seem to come from the Alice in Wonderland School of Valuation and in this case with a severe dose of Dr. Timothy Leary "juice" added.

So Neil, you''re absolutely correct about the integrity of the seller here.

I would think there''s a very good case to make the seller replace all those blue diamonds with natural ones.

There a good story for the press that does consumer fraud exposes in this.

Rockdoc
 

kenny

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Apr 30, 2005
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This sort of appears to be Neimans website - though there is no phone number or street address.
Hmmm.

They do charge 7.75% sales tax if you are in California so they must be somewhere in CA.

Here is a quote from their FAQ:

Q: Are your stones natural?
A: All Neimans gemstones are genuine gemstones, produced by Mother Nature, and mined from the earth.




http://stores.channeladvisor.com/neimansjewelry/

 

asquareguy

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Messages
87
STCI,

Congrats on picking your diamond !

About the blue stones, I would have to agree with the others that they are irradiated.

I was searching for some blue stones for my project and ran across these stone. They are irradiated, and I think they were well under $200. I almost bought them, but found the non-irradiated stones in the next post, and they were considerably more; you can see the difference in the pureness of the blue. No greenish tint that the irradiated stones have.

That being said, they can be lovely, just don''t overpay - considering they are plentiful.

After you decide, if you love it, it does not matter where the stones came from or if they were enhanced.

Enjoy the process and your new ring !

irradiated.jpg
 

asquareguy

Rough_Rock
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Mar 27, 2004
Messages
87
These are the non-irradiated:

blue web.JPG
 

RockDoc

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Date: 1/19/2007 2:25:37 PM
Author: kenny
This sort of appears to be Neimans website - though there is no phone number or street address.
Hmmm.

They do charge 7.75% sales tax if you are in California so they must be somewhere in CA.

Here is a quote from their FAQ:

Q: Are your stones natural?
A: All Neimans gemstones are genuine gemstones, produced by Mother Nature, and mined from the earth.





http://stores.channeladvisor.com/neimansjewelry/

Hi Kenny

The above is misleading. As treated/irradiated diamonds are "genuine gemstones, produced by Mother Nature and mined from the earth".

That is all they are claiming.

Also consider natural blue diamonds are rather scarce. Neiman''s seems to have an abundance of them. That in itself is very odd.

I think SI-2 - I-1 irradiated diamonds would cost several hundred a carat.... not the price that is reported by their "lab" they use.

Even hpht blue diamonds would cost a lot more than the achieved prices on that site. I wonder just how many former customers they sold to realize that they most likely got just treated stones?

Probably an interesting "experiment" is for one of the consumer Pser''s to ask Neiman''s that question on one of the items active for sale, with blue diamonds in it and see if they "fess up" that they are treated.

Of course, if they say they are untreated and they aren''t - they would need to change all the stones for natural ones, or cough up the $$$$ for the difference in value.

Rockdoc
 
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