Do all ideals/super ideals go "dark" in direct sunlight?

[max1111]

I've been obsessively reading threads on the subject. From what I understand this is either a "feature" of tighter tolerances or specific angles and measurements. There seems to be a few theories on what is going on (Not sure I buy that it's our eyes being overloaded ).

Is there a combination of angles that avoids this?

Has anyone left the super-ideal space because of this?

It would be good to get a definitive answer on this perhaps from those who managed to avoid this.

 

[DejaWiz]

Diamonds, in general, tend to go dark in sunlight.
Indirect lighting = brings out the brilliance.
Direct lighting = brings out the fire.

Here's a great article from the business site of Garry H (Cut Nut) that goes into some further detail:

SOME GOOD DIAMONDS LOOK DARK IN SUNLIGHT

Some good white diamonds look dark in direct sunlight. Yellow diamonds look great in sunlight but white diamonds look best in shaded lighting.

www.hollowaydiamonds.com.au

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Hope that article helps. The thing is you want a diamond that sparkles like crazy - it will go dark in direct sunlight.
Bad cut rounds dont.

 

[John Pollard]

Adding to this.

There is an explanation about diamonds and sunlight, accompanied by a graphic on the PriceScope education page covering Diamond Cut.

Diamond Cut: Everything You Need To Know

What's the right diamond grade for your budget? Read our extensive guide to diamond cut and how it can impact your diamond's sparkle.

www.pricescope.com

There is further elaboration about when/why you see different beauty components on the PriceScope education page covering Diamond Performance.

 

[max1111]

Thanks guys

Anecdotally there are people with stones they claim don't do this.. is that a function of poor cuts or spec choices?

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Thanks guys

Anecdotally there are people with stones they claim don't do this.. is that a function of poor cuts or spec choices?

Fancy shapes

 

[John Pollard]

Thanks guys

Anecdotally there are people with stones they claim don't do this.. is that a function of poor cuts or spec choices?

The physics of light behavior are constant. The variables are (1) environment, (2) different shapes and/or natural & craftsmanship differences within same shapes, and (3) the eyesight and physiology of the specific viewer in the viewing moment.

Taking only #1 and #3 into consideration, people can perceive the same diamond differently - especially if one has a more advanced visual palate. That's a thing. More about it on the education page about Diamond Beauty and eyesight.

Diamond Beauty and Eyesight

Whether it’s a diamond you own, or new comparisons, we highly recommend you follow the steps we have outlined in for in-person viewing.

www.pricescope.com

 

[max1111]

The physics of light behavior are constant. The variables are (1) environment, (2) different shapes and/or natural & craftsmanship differences within same shapes, and (3) the eyesight and physiology of the specific viewer in the viewing moment.

Taking only #1 and #3 into consideration, people can perceive the same diamond differently - especially if one has a more advanced visual palate. That's a thing. More about it on the education page about Diamond Beauty and eyesight.

Diamond Beauty and Eyesight

Whether it’s a diamond you own, or new comparisons, we highly recommend you follow the steps we have outlined in for in-person viewing.

www.pricescope.com

Thanks John, those all make sense. I'm most interested in (2) and (3)


(2) Because there seems to be more variation in ideal cut diamonds than is claimed. Cars can have the same horsepower and 0-60 times but very different ways of getting there. Beauty and performance are obviously two different things. For example the CBI looks completely different in all but one setting.

2.3 ct RBC diamond comparison: Crafted by Infinity, WF ACA, and James Allen (GIA 3X)

For background, please refer to the previous thread: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/2-3-carat-rbc-dilemma-wf-aca-with-lower-color-clarity-or-compromise-cut-with-ja.235191/ I decided to start a new thread because the previous thread's title was no longer fully reflective of the...

www.pricescope.com

(3) Could it be that on average preferences are related to age, eyesight, cognitive bias etc? Is it possible that enthusiasts have particular acquired (niche) tastes? I imagine in reality most non PS'ers would compromise some areas to avoid a stone that goes dark when they're in the sun.

For example. Greenm75 (who I assume was 35ish at the time) had a stone that was 9x more popular amongst 20 friends/colleagues than a more "ideal" stone from the same super ideal vendor. I'm assuming this is across a variety of environments.

Likelihood of finding a 'signature' super ideal diamond?

Hello, I am under the impression that signature hearts and arrows, or super ideal, Triple X stones, AGS 000 (or insert your own top of the line stone name) are pretty nice. And I know that the Whiteflash A Cut Above, a Bryan Gavin Signature diamond, are just branded names. If I buy say, a...

www.pricescope.com

Perhaps something about this particular combination made it more pleasing to more people?

 

[oncrutchesrightnow]

Almost all my ideal cuts go a little dark or steely grey. I do have an ideal-but-not-super-ideal GIA 3x three stone that I love that never goes dark.

 

[max1111]

Almost all my ideal cuts go a little dark or steely grey. I do have an ideal-but-not-super-ideal GIA 3x three stone that I love that never goes dark.

What’s the specs on the bright one?

Thanks

 

[Rhino]

Extreme direct light conditions = dark
Direct light conditions with good daylight or an office with bright walls can produce a good mix of fire and brightness at once.
It is a characteristic of about most ideal cuts.
Diamonds it won't happen in are those with extraneous leakage but they will lack fire and generally lack brightness in diffuse/ambient light.

 

[SigMoore]

I have two important questions about these which are shown below.
1. https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/in-the-loupe-with-john-pollard-diamond-traceability-teatimeresults-facts-fiction-and-the-future.273928/
2. https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/help-me-buy-a-tennis-bracelet-tomorrow-in-nyc%E2%80lunchtimeresults%A6%E2%80%A6-and-not-get-taken-for-a-ride.272662/unread
Waiting for the best answer i am too confused.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I have two important questions about these which are shown below.
1. https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/in-the-loupe-with-john-pollard-diamond-traceability-teatimeresults-facts-fiction-and-the-future.273928/
2. https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/help-me-buy-a-tennis-bracelet-tomorrow-in-nyc%E2%80lunchtimeresults%A6%E2%80%A6-and-not-get-taken-for-a-ride.272662/unread
Waiting for the best answer i am too confused.

Summarize your ? Please

 

[tyty333]

Yes, please be a little more specific with your 2 questions.

 

[PearCraze]

I didn't like how rounds go dark in the sun or strong spot lighting, and therefore chose a well cut fancy shape. I don't think it just affects super ideals but also ideal cut rounds and some branded precision cut fancies.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I didn't like how rounds go dark in the sun or strong spot lighting, and therefore chose a well cut fancy shape. I don't think it just affects super ideals but also ideal cut rounds and some branded precision cut fancies.

The better light return portions of fancy shapes will also likely go dark or show the dark blue from the sky.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

As others have said, outdoors in direct sunlight, without any diffusion (clouds) or filtering (leaves on trees), is a lighting environment in which few diamonds will look their best.

If your lifestyle is such that you will be viewing your diamond in this environment a large portion of the time, it is probably best to choose a fancy cut with myriad small virtual facets that depend somewhat on leakage contrast for their distinctive type of performance and eye appeal.

For most people, this lighting environment is a pretty limited part of their overall day to day environment. Especially given the ridiculous heat dome we have been under lately!!

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

As others have said, outdoors in direct sunlight, without any diffusion (clouds) or filtering (leaves on trees), is a lighting environment in which few diamonds will look their best.

If your lifestyle is such that you will be viewing your diamond in this environment a large portion of the time, it is probably best to choose a fancy cut with myriad small virtual facets that depend somewhat on leakage contrast for their distinctive type of performance and eye appeal.

For most people, this lighting environment is a pretty limited part of their overall day to day environment. Especially given the ridiculous heat dome we have been under lately!!

100% agree with TL
But all you need to do is use the shade of your body when in direct sunlight and your brilliant diamonds will look amazing