Diamond cut question American vs Indian

[Rose974]

So I bought .80 round diamond from one of the top vendors. I had a great transaction from them and they were easy to work with and return to.
The numbers looked great and came up high on the HCA calculator but in person it had no sparkle whatsoever. My mothers side of the family are from India and their diamonds sparkle like anything. I also have a 1/2 carat double halo from India and it has a blinding sparkle.

Is there something different about the way they cut diamonds in India? Or did I just stumble onto a bad diamond?

 

[ecf8503]

Who certified the stone? GIA? AGS? other lab? Can you post the report number?

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Most of the stones for sale in USA were polished in India

 

[D_]

I'm sorry to hear that.
Your diamond is a 60:60, which technically can still be sparkly.
The cut matters more then where it's cut.
May be due to its relatively low crown?
Did you manage to get IS/ASET images prior to purchasing the diamonds?
Are you still within the return period?
You may prefer diamonds closer to Tolkowsky's specs.

 

[JDDN]

Hm, I'm thinking it may be the very low crown angle. 32 degrees and 12.5% is pretty shallow. Round brilliants that have such a shallow crown angle will often appear brighter but they will do so at the expense of dispersion. Also the table is large so that will affect dispersion as well. If you are looking for more flashes of colored light, then a crown angle of 34.5 or 35 with a smaller table 54-56% may suit you better.

If the stone is certified by AGS or GIA, then I don't think where it was cut is what the issue is. I think more than likely you are not liking the personality of the stone you have compared to other diamonds you've seen. Every diamond has a personality so to speak. So regardless of what the HCA score is, you may or may not gravitate towards a particular diamond. In other words, a stone with a 35 degree CA, 40.6 PA and 55% table will perform and behave very differently than a stone with a 60% table, 32 degree CA and 41 degree PA. They will both score nicely on the HCA, but they will look very different!!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

As Garry said, the diamond very well could have been polished in India! I don't think very many diamonds are polished in the US. The problem is the cut of this particular diamond.

I looked and saw that you did post those diamond specs at the time you bought it, and I am very sad that no one (including myself) saw it and replied. Had I seen it, I would have encouraged you to return it for a better cut stone. That stone has a very low crown angle and a larger table, so you sort of have a flat top looking stone.

As someone has already mentioned, there is more than just the HCA needed to buy a really well performing and beautiful stone, and I always limit my searches to 34-35 for the crown angle, 40.6-41.0 for the pavilion angle, 54-58 for the table, and 60-62.3 for depth. The other piece needed is an idealscope or ASET image to see light return or leakage.

 

[Rose974]

Thank you for the responses, I appreciate it. Yes the stone was certified by GIA at excellent cut, h color, vs2 or 1 i don't fully remember. Great vendor though, I just know too much what I'm looking for but can't express it in words.

@jddn + diamond seeker -- your answers makes a lot of sense, thank you!

I'm glad to know there isn't that much a difference between the cuts here. I'm giving it another go and purchasing a ring this christmas with another vendor more carefully. When I get the ring and hopefully I like it I can post it here

I did go to Tiffany's and they showed me a 2 carat round and a 1 carat cushion, i wasn't impressed with either.

I was in Vegas several months ago and stumbled by Harry Winstons (I literally walked into the glass) and loved all their diamonds, Except the round, so maybe round doesn't give me the type of sparkle I want. But it was the first jeweler I had seen whose diamonds I liked. I dont know what that means. Anyway I hope this new ring turns out well and I'll be able to finally show it off.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

The biggest variable can be lighting.
I am appalled at the bad display lighting of so many big name brand companies.
I visited Bulgari and Cartier stores here in Melbourne and the larger diamond rings appeared to be dark grey and I2.

 

[WinkHPD]

I do not have any of the name brand stores here in Boise, Idaho Garry, but a local store I have been assisting has been doing some mystery shopping to see what the competition is doing.

The abuse of the clients that they witnessed were shocking. Stones being sold without diamond grading reports that were clearly I 1's being declared SI2's and tons of EGL report papers that were even more egregiously misgraded.

Frankly, you are totally correct. When the vendors set out to deceive, it matters not a whit where the diamond was cut.

I often laugh when I go to Polygon and hear so many of the retailers complaining of the "wild west internet and how consumers were going to get cheated. I sure that many do, but just like in the retail bricks and mortar stores, anyone who buys without knowing about the product is fair game. The well educated are hard to cheat, either in retail environments or on the web.

Wink

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

I do not have any of the name brand stores here in Boise, Idaho Garry, but a local store I have been assisting has been doing some mystery shopping to see what the competition is doing.

The abuse of the clients that they witnessed were shocking. Stones being sold without diamond grading reports that were clearly I 1's being declared SI2's and tons of EGL report papers that were even more egregiously misgraded.

Frankly, you are totally correct. When the vendors set out to deceive, it matters not a whit where the diamond was cut.

I often laugh when I go to Polygon and hear so many of the retailers complaining of the "wild west internet and how consumers were going to get cheated. I sure that many do, but just like in the retail bricks and mortar stores, anyone who buys without knowing about the product is fair game. The well educated are hard to cheat, either in retail environments or on the web.

Wink

to true Wink

 

[Dancing Fire]

Hm, I'm thinking it may be the very low crown angle. 32 degrees and 12.5% is pretty shallow. Round brilliants that have such a shallow crown angle will often appear brighter but they will do so at the expense of dispersion. Also the table is large so that will affect dispersion as well. If you are looking for more flashes of colored light, then a crown angle of 34.5 or 35 with a smaller table 54-56% may suit you better.

I wouldn't touch a low crown stone with a 10' pole.