Diamond Advice

[impatiently_waiting]

I have been following PriceScope for several weeks now, since my future fiance and I began looking at diamonds and settings. It is a very exciting time and this site has been so helpful!

I realize that this post will most likely be completely irrelevant, because my FF wants to wait at least another year before we get engaged. We have currently been together for 14 months, and he insists that he doesn''t want to feel like he is being pushed into anything. I agree, but the waiting is killing me!

We have chosen a setting: the Tacori 2502RD in either a 7mm or a 7.5mm.

I have been diligently looking for diamonds, both that I will be happy with and that he feels that we can afford. He comes from a very financially conservative family, and being an account, thought that we would only spend $1,000-$2,000 on our e-ring. I know that we *could* do this, but I''m not sure I would be happy with this purchase. I would like to spend $6,000-$7,000 on the ring and am more than willing to contribute to the cost, so that I can get something I truly love.

To the point. I have found two diamonds, and would like your opinion.
I found them both on http://bluegemdiamondsjewelry.com/round_loose_diamonds. I searched for information on this vendor and could not find anything.

He presented me with two diamonds, both of which I really like.

Round 1.53 J SI2 VG VG VG $4,931 GIA N 62.7% 57% 7.32-7.35x4.60
"This is 100% eye clean and the best value I have"

Round 1.51 H VS1 EX EX EX $5,925 EGL N 62.0% 56% 7.30-7.30x4.56

He sent me the Certification for the top diamond, and it does look very white. It seems like a great price, especially for a GIA diamond. He is sending me the certification for the 2nd diamond tomorrow.

Currently, I am leaning toward the 2nd diamond because the specifications are much better, but I''m not sure if the diamond is a EGL USA or Israel diamond. His website says he only deals with EGL USA, though.

Are these prices too good to be true?

Any advice on encouraging SO?

 

[yssie]

Date: 4/19/2010 9:49:58 PM
Author:impatiently_waiting
I have been following PriceScope for several weeks now, since my future fiance and I began looking at diamonds and settings. It is a very exciting time and this site has been so helpful!

I realize that this post will most likely be completely irrelevant, because my FF wants to wait at least another year before we get engaged. We have currently been together for 14 months, and he insists that he doesn't want to feel like he is being pushed into anything. I agree, but the waiting is killing me!

We have chosen a setting: the Tacori 2502RD in either a 7mm or a 7.5mm.

I have been diligently looking for diamonds, both that I will be happy with and that he feels that we can afford. He comes from a very financially conservative family, and being an account, thought that we would only spend $1,000-$2,000 on our e-ring. I know that we *could* do this, but I'm not sure I would be happy with this purchase. I would like to spend $6,000-$7,000 on the ring and am more than willing to contribute to the cost, so that I can get something I truly love.

To the point. I have found two diamonds, and would like your opinion.
I found them both on http://bluegemdiamondsjewelry.com/round_loose_diamonds. I searched for information on this vendor and could not find anything.

He presented me with two diamonds, both of which I really like.

Round 1.53 J SI2 VG VG VG $4,931 GIA N 62.7% 57% 7.32-7.35x4.60
'This is 100% eye clean and the best value I have'

Round 1.51 H VS1 EX EX EX $5,925 EGL N 62.0% 56% 7.30-7.30x4.56

He sent me the Certification for the top diamond, and it does look very white. It seems like a great price, especially for a GIA diamond. He is sending me the certification for the 2nd diamond tomorrow.

Currently, I am leaning toward the 2nd diamond because the specifications are much better, but I'm not sure if the diamond is a EGL USA or Israel diamond. His website says he only deals with EGL USA, though.

Are these prices too good to be true?

Any advice on encouraging SO?

Can you post crown and pavilion angles for both diamonds? how does he define "eyeclean" - from the top, from top and sides, from 6"/10"/arm's length..?
Or just the cert. numbers

 

[yssie]

ETA: An EGL H will most likely be graded by GIA as J or I, and the VS1 as VS2/SI, so you''re not really getting a better "deal" when you choose EGL.

 

[impatiently_waiting]

"In two thirds of cases EGL USA color grading was one grade softer but clarity grading in a third of cases was stricter than GIA."
--From PriceScope''s Grading Laboratory Survey

I know EGL isn''t as good as GIA, but after reading this on PS I thought maybe it wasn''t so bad?

I only have the GIA report from the first diamond.

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=9f2cb3fd0b&view=att&th=12818ce268af4905&attid=0.1&disp=inline&realattid=f_g8810wug0&zw

Can you see that link? I have no idea which proportions to include... Sorry, I am very new at this.

 

[yssie]

EGL - it's not a bad thing, as long as you're okay with an I/J VS2/SI stone. The problem is when people go in thinking they got a fantastic deal on say an G VS2 only to have it appraise as an I SI2 after the return policy has expired, etc.

I will say that I've never, in person or here on PS, heard of an EGL diamond that appraised higher than GIA/AGS would've given it that wasn't anything but a total shock to all parties involved. BUT I'm just a consumer, perhaps one of the experts who regularly see hundreds of stones will chime in with an opinion.


The certificate - I can't see it, I think you may have linked to a personal gmail account? IN any case, if you can open it, there will be a number on the top or side that starts with GIAxxxxxx. If you can copy just that number we can look up the cert. online.

 

[impatiently_waiting]

GIA 2106746987

Thanks for the advice on the EGL. I wonder if I would be able to have the diamond sent to be appraised by an independent third party before purchasing?

 

[stone-cold11]

http://www2.gia.edu/reportcheck/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.showReportVerification&reportno=2106746987&weight=1.53

Not good going by the numbers. I would avoid it.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I am confused about why you are searching so dilligently for diamonds now when you bf won''t propose for another year or more? It will be a whole different diamond ball game at that time and I worry you are just making yourself more crazy by jumping the gun.

At any rate, I don''t like EGL because their color grading so so variable you cannot get a true sense of the value of what you are buying, so it is hard to assess whether the price is fair or not. I don''t like that type of uncertainty, so I would stick to GIA/AGS.

 

[impatiently_waiting]

StoneCold11

What numbers are you looking at? I don''t know what I''m supposed to look at to determine whether or not a diamond is "good"

What do the numbers tell you and what should I be looking for?

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 4/20/2010 7:22:49 AM
Author: impatiently_waiting
StoneCold11

What numbers are you looking at? I don't know what I'm supposed to look at to determine whether or not a diamond is 'good'

What do the numbers tell you and what should I be looking for?

Hi Impatiently

There are several issues at play here, the stone is physically too deep and is facing up a bit small for the weight, also the crown and pavilion angles are what we call ' steep deep'. This means that it is quite likely the diamond will show light leakage which is undesirable, also a J colour with such a steep pavilion angle means that colour entrapment is a real possibility and can make a J colour show more warmth than it would in a better cut diamond.


Below is a guide some of us use in order to find a well cut diamond, but do use as a guide only as diamonds with proportions that fall outside of these ranges can sometimes be absolutely fine.

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57% - if you like the larger tabled look you can go up to 60% thereabouts, suggest a maximum of 61%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above


note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate!

As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.

From expert John Pollard.

With that said, here's a "Cliff's Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.

GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35).