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decision decision please help!!!

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flexicitus

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 21, 2006
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Dear all,
I am picking a round diamond for a size 6 engagement ring on a great tiffany setting in platinum and need advice on the following selection:

0.40 D/IF H&A ideal, 4.74x4.75x2.90, gridle: m-s.t; faceted, fluo: none, T57% D61%: 35 40.8: HCA 1.1 ex/ex/ex/vg, e-praise score (eps) 0.975, GIA ex/ex/ex. $2600 USD.

0.41 E/IF H&A ideal, 4.77x4.81x2.93, gridle: t-m; faceted, fluo:none, T57% D61.2% 34.9 40.7: HCA 1.1 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.980, AGSL id/id/id. $2255.

0.38 E/IF H&A ideal, 4.66x4.69x2.87, gridle: t-m; faceted, fluo: none, T56% D61.4% 34.5 41.0: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/ex, eps 0.987, GIA ex/ex/ex. $2098.

0.36 E/IF ideal (inscripted H&A), 4.59x4.60x2.80, gridle: t-m, fluo: none, T55% D60.9% 34 40.8: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.981, GIA ex/ex/ex. $1155.

0.36 F/IF ideal, 4.61x4.65x2.79, gridle: t-s.t, flou: none, T57% D60.3 34.1 40.6: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/ex, eps 0.994, AGSL (Sept, 05) id/id/id. $ 1070. Would this have H&A patterns?

0.39 F/IF ideal, 4.72x4.75x2.89, gridle: t-m, fluo: none, T56% 61% 35 40.8: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.992, GIA ex/ex/ex. $1386

I am willing to pay as much as the price for the first one but am not sure if it's the best in terms of value and quality in comparison with others listed here.

Please help!!

Flex

PS: just out of curiousity of what you think, Tiffany offers me the following (on the T. setting) and the prices are almost the same as the first one (D/IF/0.40 with a great T.setting):

0.32 E/VVS2
0.31 E/VVS1
0.30 F/VVS1
0.33 D/VS1

no tax. That's all the information provided ever.


MANY THANKS for your help on this happy and yet anxious decision of mine!!
 
You can't give your email on here, it's against forum policies. Ok with that said, why the IF?? You're paying for something you will never see. I'd rather see you go with a larger stone with an ideal cut and lower clarity. VS1- VS2 will be eye clean and many here have gotten SI1's that are eye clean. If your girl wants colorless fine, but the IF is overkill IMHO.
2.gif
 
Hey,

You can almost DOUBLE your carat weight if you're willing to go down in clarity and color a bit.

I'm not sure I know of anyone on here who has an IF stone in their engagement ring... is this a specific thing you are set on, or is your girlfriend? Seriously, you can go down to SI1 or even SI2 if you are lucky, and the stone will be totally eye clean. Really, a lot of people say IF is for collectors... it's incredibly rare, and you'll pay a huge premium for it.

Also, in terms of color, some people really are color sensitive and can tell the difference between D and F... or F and H... But then again, some really can't! Have you seen stones in person and decided this is your comfort level? Again, it's a place ot seriously save some cash and not notice it in your ring if you drop from D/E to G/H or lower. Again, this could be a personal thing, but at least consider the option : )

So if you drop to VS1 or VS2 (again you could go lower to SI1 or SI2), and a slightly lower color, here are a few stones within the same price range as what you listed...

0.70 carats, G, VS2, $2394 http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=898656
0.70 carats, G, VS1, $2480 http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=896849
0.754 carats, H, SI2 $2140 http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=896849

Anyway, these are just examples... of course SIZE isn't everything, but you seem to be sacrificing it for clarity and color... not really necessary : )

Good luck and let us know how we can help!

Aussie

ETA: spelling and clarity
 
Thanks, Kaleigh! I have spent endless nights for weeks to think on the excellent point you just raised. ''IF'' does something to me that ''VVS1'' doesn''t, as it reminds me of a strong sentiment that I feel for my girlfriend!! Yes if I could afford ''Fl'' diamonds I would!! Trust me!! In fact I have done a search for a great ''VVS'':

0.46 E VVS2 ideal, 4.93x4.96x3.09, gridle: st-T, HCA 0.7 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.983, AGSL id/id/id. $1688. The AGSL report shows only ONE tiny spot on the edge, so much for a VVS2!! But that said, my budget for non-H&A and non-IF is capped at a significant lower amount. That''s the biggest and the best quality I found so far. But I am wary of the search simply my heart is quite set on an IF. It''s time to make a decision so I can turn my attention to other things. And I can''t bare the increasing volume of information that I can''t discuss with her!! It''s time to get settled down!

It''s wonderful to be able to share this process with people here. =))

Flex
 
Date: 9/23/2006 9:23:12 PM
Author:flexicitus

MANY THANKS for your help on this happy and yet anxious decision of mine!!

to get in touch with me for better offer, please email flexicitus at hotmail.
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Sorry Flexicitus, Vendors CANNOT 1) send you emails, or 2) send you offers (better or not). Both are TOTALLY against the forum''s rules... which you agreed to when signing up : ) You''ll get lots of advice from very experienced diamond people (NOT me... I''m pretty new) on here, so stick around!

Aussie
 
whiteflash has a 38 point d vvs1 with medium blue fluor. i was eyeing it for myself. would you consider fluor?

also if you are in new york or the big cities, people will look at you"funny" if she is walking around with such a small stone, especially if you are a professional.

as a woman "stuck" with a quarter carat engagement ring that is f vvs1, i would rather have gone for a bigger stone.

regards.
 
I am pretty new here. Though the vendors cannot send you emails, you can however send them emails with some of the diamonds you have shortlisted. They will be ever so helpful to assist you to get what you want.

As for flawless (FL) diamond, personally I think it is an overkill. Because it would be so difficult to just maintain it to prevent it from dropping to a IF. It would be very impractical if you want your gf to have it for daily wear. Premium for IF rocks are high based on its rarity. But it boils down to personal preferences.

I have recently purchased a diamond to propose to my gf. Got the largest size I can (size DOES matter, especially for girls who does not know much of the 4Cs) dropping clarity to F and and eye clean SI1.

I''m sure experts here and te vendors you talk to will be able to help you find THE ONE! I got my rock after feeling some kind of "connection" with it. I knew it has to be the one... Good luck!
 
Date: 9/23/2006 10:11:23 PM
Author: ladykemma
whiteflash has a 38 point d vvs1 with medium blue fluor. i was eyeing it for myself. would you consider fluor?

also if you are in new york or the big cities, people will look at you''funny'' if she is walking around with such a small stone, especially if you are a professional.

as a woman ''stuck'' with a quarter carat engagement ring that is f vvs1, i would rather have gone for a bigger stone.

regards.
Click to expand...

Lady Kemma,


You had the guts to say what I chickened out of... seriously... not sure many girls would think her boyfriend didn''t love her because he picked a VVS instead of a IF... just my 0.02!

Aussie
 
Date: 9/23/2006 10:16:30 PM
Author: aussiegirl23

Date: 9/23/2006 10:11:23 PM
Author: ladykemma
whiteflash has a 38 point d vvs1 with medium blue fluor. i was eyeing it for myself. would you consider fluor?

also if you are in new york or the big cities, people will look at you''funny'' if she is walking around with such a small stone, especially if you are a professional.

as a woman ''stuck'' with a quarter carat engagement ring that is f vvs1, i would rather have gone for a bigger stone.

regards.
Click to expand...

Lady Kemma,



You had the guts to say what I chickened out of... seriously... not sure many girls would think her boyfriend didn''t love her because he picked a VVS instead of a IF... just my 0.02!

Aussie
Click to expand...
if i had it to do over again i would pick a k l m si1 stone.
 
Flexicitus:

It sounds like the best thing to do would be to consult your girlfriend about her preferences.

The LAST thing you want is for her to be disappointed or resentful about her engagement ring.

You are of course entitled to your opinions about what makes a perfect stone and ring, but her opinions may completely go in the opposite direction.

A lot of girls out there would prefer a bigger rock, with near I-K color or lower, and eyeclean... Why not boost the 1 factor you''ll really be able to see?

Sorry, not trying to be confrontational, just want to make sure you''re taking account of women''s perhaps silly interest in size (even if she''s not into jewelery, or competitive... she''ll appreciate the bigger size!!)

Aussie
 
Thanks for your responses so far! I found some very insightful and some indeed have touched me with the kindness displayed. Thank you. I know what you mean by 'size matters', even though it's certainly not true for her that 'the bigger' the stone 'the better'. I literally 'ought' not to get one that's 'oversized' if that's ever such a thing an 'oversized' diamond in some cities beyond Canada where we come from. That said, I did have careful empirical comparisons between 0.40, 0.38, and 0.50. The visual difference seems to depend a lot on the setting and how the diamond is set, assuming all other conditions in the comparisons are identical (including my heartrate). Yes, 0.60 or above would look significantly larger than a diamond in the 0.40-0.50 range. It's a valid point well taken. hehe. I am all ears.



Flex
 
ohhhh, you''re in canada. third of a carat then! anything larger is considered garish.

still nudging you towards looking at whiteflash fluorescent stone...nudge nudge.
 
Canada, ok yeah, see your point there. Good luck and please post pics of the ring once you get it!!!
1.gif
 
that changes everything : )

your stone choices look fab then... and goodness... owning a IF?? snazzy!!

best of luck... and we want pictures! LOTS and lots of pictures : )

Aussie
 
Thanks. I will appreciate a whole bunch if your responses would be so kind as to try to work with my diamond selection. That sort of help would be wonderful beyond words! Cheers!!

Flex
 
Date: 9/23/2006 9:54:03 PM
Author: aussiegirl23
...I'm not sure I know of anyone on here who has an IF stone in their engagement ring...
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I have an IF stone in my engagement ring, so there is, at minimum, one person who posts here with such a stone.
1.gif
I think it's rather presumptuous of posters here who say certain qualities are "not worth it" or "overkill": it was worth it to my husband and I now have an appreciation for these qualities as well. Worth is relative to many different things: budget, taste, desires, etc., and I hate to see certain qualities deemed "unworthy" over and over again, when how do you really know what's worthy to someone? In all honesty, all the qualities of a diamond are worthy to me; take your budget and make the best balance you can, or choose one area more than the other. But none are "worthless" as I read here all the time.

And I don't think that men who choose a non-IF stone love any less than one who does, just as I don't think IF stones represent the end-all, be-all of relationships. A woman shouldn't be disappointed in any engagement ring given, it's the thought, right? I just hate when higher clarity or color lovers get blasted on here as being silly for what they like in a stone. I don't think my diamond is better than most other well-cut generally good quality color and clarity diamonds--except that my husband picked mine out just for me, so it's special that way
2.gif
. But I sure have been told that someone else's was better than mine because it's super-ideal and not IF, or that there's something wrong with someone's character or priorities who would purchase an IF stone. Funny, the insults can go that way but not the other...

Anyway,
Flex:
I am one of those women who appreciates a smaller stone but of high quality, so there _are_ some of us out there. I would be too self-conscious to wear stones of a certain size or larger. If your girlfriend is such a person, then she will be tickled pink that you chose an IF stone for her! In my opinion, though, down to VS2 is a fabulous clarity, and if you are thinking you would like more carat weight without sacrificing too much clarity, I personally think you can go down than low, and I am sure most people here would agree.

But if you like the size where it's at, then your stone choices are very nice indeed.
 
Oleander,

thanks for speaking up : ) Now I know of at least 1 IF stone here on PriceScope! I''m interested to hear if there are more...

I certainly didn''t mean any offense, I simply was trying to help this guy out -- some folks come on here thinking they HAVE to buy an IF or VVS1 stone of D or E color because they think anything else will look like poo, or because their girlfriend will detest anything less....

So if money is an issue (and it really kind of is for everyone, isn''t it at some level?) a bigger stone can be picked if certain factors (clarity and color) are dropped...

that''s all I meant... just wanted to make sure he was considering this... REALLY not trying to lessen the beauty and rarity of your stone : )

Aussie
 
Date: 9/23/2006 9:23:12 PM
Author:flexicitus
Dear all,
I am picking a round diamond for a size 6 engagement ring on a great tiffany setting in platinum and need advice on the following selection:

0.40 D/IF H&A ideal, 4.74x4.75x2.90, gridle: m-s.t; faceted, fluo: none, T57% D61%: 35 40.8: HCA 1.1 ex/ex/ex/vg, e-praise score (eps) 0.975, GIA ex/ex/ex. $2600 USD.

0.41 E/IF H&A ideal, 4.77x4.81x2.93, gridle: t-m; faceted, fluo:none, T57% D61.2% 34.9 40.7: HCA 1.1 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.980, AGSL id/id/id. $2255.

0.38 E/IF H&A ideal, 4.66x4.69x2.87, gridle: t-m; faceted, fluo: none, T56% D61.4% 34.5 41.0: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/ex, eps 0.987, GIA ex/ex/ex. $2098.

0.36 E/IF ideal (inscripted H&A), 4.59x4.60x2.80, gridle: t-m, fluo: none, T55% D60.9% 34 40.8: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.981, GIA ex/ex/ex. $1155.

0.36 F/IF ideal, 4.61x4.65x2.79, gridle: t-s.t, flou: none, T57% D60.3 34.1 40.6: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/ex, eps 0.994, AGSL (Sept, 05) id/id/id. $ 1070. Would this have H&A patterns?

0.39 F/IF ideal, 4.72x4.75x2.89, gridle: t-m, fluo: none, T56% 61% 35 40.8: HCA 0.6 ex/ex/ex/vg, eps 0.992, GIA ex/ex/ex. $1386

I am willing to pay as much as the price for the first one but am not sure if it''s the best in terms of value and quality in comparison with others listed here.

Please help!!

Flex

PS: just out of curiousity of what you think, Tiffany offers me the following (on the T. setting) and the prices are almost the same as the first one (D/IF/0.40 with a great T.setting):

0.32 E/VVS2
0.31 E/VVS1
0.30 F/VVS1
0.33 D/VS1

no tax. That''s all the information provided ever.


MANY THANKS for your help on this happy and yet anxious decision of mine!!
Click to expand...
Of the stones listed above I like #3 and #4. As far as the Tiffany stones can''t help there, if they can give you crown and pavillion angles that would help.
 
Date: 9/23/2006 11:52:13 PM
Author: aussiegirl23
Oleander,


thanks for speaking up : ) Now I know of at least 1 IF stone here on PriceScope! I''m interested to hear if there are more...


I certainly didn''t mean any offense, I simply was trying to help this guy out -- some folks come on here thinking they HAVE to buy an IF or VVS1 stone of D or E color because they think anything else will look like poo, or because their girlfriend will detest anything less....


So if money is an issue (and it really kind of is for everyone, isn''t it at some level?) a bigger stone can be picked if certain factors (clarity and color) are dropped...


that''s all I meant... just wanted to make sure he was considering this... REALLY not trying to lessen the beauty and rarity of your stone : )


Aussie
Click to expand...

My diatribe was not aimed at you. I think i have been keeping quiet for a while about all the anti-high clarity comments here, and it came out tonight. I know you meant no animosity.
1.gif


I agree that one can have some play in the combination of qualities of a stone, and that people should not be pushed into buying certain combinations of qualities just because it''s the highest or best. my stone is an "H" because colorless was not a concern for my husband (nor me either). Personally, if it sparkles I most likely love it!
1.gif


Hope I didn''t rub you the wrong way, Aussie. Two glasses of wine will get me to run off at the mouth sometimes.
3.gif
 
Nah, Oleander... no ruffled feathers here : )

I remember when my boyfriend and I first started looking at rings, his first reaction was... okay, let''s do IF/D... He simply assumed you had to do "the best" for it to turn out beautifully. He thought it was like grades at school... I mean really, I don''t think anybody strives for a ''C''... there are no benefits of C''s over A''s... unless you say you had more time to spend with your friends... but that''s a whole other argument!

I suppose I was trying to counter a few posters who ocassionally come on and say "I can''t believe you''re considering below a G-colored stone... those people frustrate me...

so no worries... 2 glasses of wine have NOT ended you up in some bitter, angry war with a 23 year old half way across the world : ) I promise!

Aussie
 
I recently bought a 0.9 carat internally flawless diamond.
For the same price I could have gotten a much larger stone.
And this is after being very well informed.

To each his own.


Allow others to have different values than yours.
Live and let live.
 
Kenny - I was not trying to start a clarity war, I swear!

I simply saw it was flexicitus'' first post... and was trying to make sure he knew other options were beautiful too and would allow him to emphasize other aspects of the stone, or simply drop his budget for a similarly-sized stone.

I am not forcing my values or opinions on anyone -- just trying to help him see that there are other options.
Aussie
 
I kind of like #1 and #2. I know many here like the smaller tables, but I kind of like the slightly larger tables. I like the tips of the arrows to be a little less pronounced, especially in smallerish diamonds. Plus, if you are going to stick to a smaller diamond and go for the ultimate in quality, those would be my picks.

BTW, I also have an IF diamond. I know you can''t see it, and I didn''t plan it that way, but it''s still kind of cool to know it''s IF.
 
what is an e praise score?

ooook, i just looked it up. worthless.
 
I have found that my priorities have changed over the years. I have been on diamond boards on and off for about 7 or 8 years. I first wanted for about 4 years maybe a F or G, VVS2 or VS1 now I have started looking at size and realise I had not really considered it before, I am still saving for my diamond but when I buy I may look as far down as H or I and clarity will most likely be VS2. Clarity is still something that bothers me but I would never never never never go for a VVS2 now and back then for years that was how my mind was definitely made up.

So being a guy it may be the end of it for you, but for us women who are addicted to the jewellery (I know some engineers guy types are into the technical stuff here for years) the diamond you want does change over time.

Oh and ofcouse this is going without saying that Cut comes Number 1 on my list. I want a super ideal that has not changed but depending on budget that may drop a bit to an ideal but no further down.
 
Great advice everybody!! Some of what you said did warm my heart so much that I felt tears in my eyes!! snif snif ... I think I am beginning to understand why Tiffany & Co could be appealing as it could be a default solution to many problems such as the balance of size, cut and the value of feeling sentiment (or subjective appreciation) because of a historic connection that a celebrated tradition/designer can offer. To be sure, no one in his sane mind, when looking to make one of life's most important statements, would like to get this wrong. As a guy I do love such things as a very fine designer's fountain pen, even though my humble parker fountain works fine. 'Value' is a wrong word for an engagement ring, unless one plans to sell it one day. Rather, 'the depth of a personal appreciation' would be how I look at the innocent joy of owning anything sentimental and beautiful whether it be expensive reasonably or unreasonably. That said, the value of a diamond on such a landmark piece as an engagement ring would not be as objective as doing calculas but any lasting 'personal appreciation' of it would never be a result of a careful formula of objective data or even that of a designer's name. I think afterall it's the story that counts, isn't it? If the story goes with a Tiffany it goes with a Tiffany. If it goes with a G or D it goes with such. Every one here has a great story to tell, I am 100% sure. And thanks for being here to help me tell mine!!

I wonder what kind of size of a round diamond (on a platinum Tiffany setting) one could get with a budget capped at around 5700 USD or 3000 GBP, for a F-G of a clarity of VVS2-VS2. In the UK my purchase would be tax-free because I am not British. So that's some help, isn't it? Any advice on how to make a good purchase at Tiffany's without having one's diamond calculator or laptop near for such tests as a HCA?

Many thanks for your help and ideas for this important decision!!!!

Flex





28.gif
 
of all your choices i would pick the 0.36 inscripted h&a, e/if. the 55 table will give you lots of fire, the depth is right. have you seen it?

i like #1 also. just cause d/if sounds cool. but it is slightly deep.
 
My feeling is that there is no balance of size or clarity with value of sentimental feeling at Tiffanys, because the size and clarity would be skewed by my having to pay a 30% mark up just for having the Tiffany''s name and their light blue CARDBOARD box.
 
I am in the UK too. I see Tiffanys a bit like this personally, if I was very very rich I may go to Harrods and buy an exclusive piece of furniture for the mansion I would no doubt have and pay say £70,000 for the furniture, so if I went to Tiffany's too I may buy a very rare, very unusual natural Pink diamond of say 30 carats for a few million £££.

If I was rich that is, but I am not, so I would not go to Harrods and buy a packet of McVities Digestive biscuits for £3 (don't know what they sell these for) when I could go into the supermarket and buy them for 68 pence.

Tiffany make their money on the smaller diamonds the normal people buy at great markup but I feel the name is only really of merit along with the rare diamond for millions or tens of thousands.

Just how I feel about it. I also notice from other threads that those with the big dollars ie. Hollywood celebrities don't always head to Tiffany & Co for their engagement diamond.
 
How about Birks in Canada? They do still offer their legendary silver ring boxes for engagement rings. Their starting price for a platinum with their signature sapphire side stone is CAD $3850.

https://birks.com/index.asp?cFlag=products&sgFilter=64&src=sdlk&PageID=2&SKU=870706&SecID=0&CatID=0&LangID=1

I am still considering the many options and opinions here. Thanks again for your invaluable inputs!!


Flex
 
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