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Concave Cuts

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MissAva

MissAva

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 6, 2005
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Who all does concave cutting on gemstones?
Is there a way to judge whether or not they have been done properly?
I ask because recently I have been seeing them on ebay for next to nothing.
 
a lot of people these days.

other than looking at them no clue.

Gary @ www.diamondexpert.com has a source and iv seen some in person.
They are kewl.
He says they arent in the same class as R.H. but they are nice and not very expensive.
 
Manyh years ago the Vietnamese sent a group to talk to Richard to ask him to teach them how to concave facet. They were not willing to pay a fair price, nor were the Chinese cutters who contacted him a couple of years later.

They all said they would figure it out themselves rather than pay him a fair price.

The stones you are mostly seeing now are done in China, and I think that they would have benefited greatly by paying Richard to teach them to do it correctly.

Wink
 
I ask becuase my younger sister, who is about to turn 5 loves the "firework" stones. But I dont feel okay with spending that kind of money on something like that for a little girl her age. She is also big it mixing colors, aerobatic planes and Rainbow bright...so I thought one of these two might be fun. Since she may or may not like such things as she gets older.

7.5ct Cushion Concave Mystic Topaz
gem-64545a%5B1%5D.jpg



13.17 Pear Concave Mystic Topaz




gem-64558a%5B1%5D.jpg
 
Date: 1/8/2006 12:37:32 AM
Author: Matatora

But I dont feel okay with spending that kind of money on something like that for a little girl her age.
Click to expand...

$1 sounds pretty darn cheap - even for a toy.


I would be happy to hear any informed opinion about what to look for in concave cut gems. I have seen only few nice ones in wearable sizes (that is 5 cts or less as opposed to 30-ish carats).

Following the earlier accounts of concave cut qualities and not allot of experience... I came to expect that the cut disperses light relatively evenly inside the stone and add up to a glowing effect traditional facets do not have. In turn, there is less contrast - but this is not bad thing for the very light to medium colors concave cut is done in. IMO, this glow effect gets lost when the facets are relatively large (=> concave cut is not often done on small stones - in fact, the sidestones cut by Richard for a couple of Pricescopers are the smallest concave cuts I know of), or the angles miss the point. Not that every no-name concave cut gem suffers or everyone would agree.

I would not be surprised to find some very successful concave cut stones from another custom gem cutter. For $1? Dunno... In fact, I hope not: because this meant that a talented and experienced cuter is definitely not getting paid right.
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Sometimes these no-name stones look nice even if the look is not what you''d expect from concave faceting. If one isn''t looking for that in particular, why not.

There is allot of concave faceting though all the way from international awards to commercial and beautiful innovation is bound to come from all over the place.
 
You realize that mystic topaz is just a coating applied to a colorless white topaz. This coating can be scratched off.

To do a good job cutting a stone, especially one over 3 or 4 cts. takes several hours. So if you are asking about the quality of a cut stone that is selling for just $2, you need to wonder how much time was really spent cutting it, even at labor rates of $.20/ per hour. A piece of white topaz rough sells for about $.30 per ct., then figure about 25% yield. So to cut a 8 ct stone you would need to start with about 32 ct. rough x .30 per ct. = $9.60 for the rough. Now these cutting houses in China will buy huge qty''s of rough, and get a better price. I still couldn''t see how any one could make any money on the stone for $2.

As a toy gem for a 5 year old go for it. Just hope she doesnt think it''s candy and eat it.
 

Date: 1/9/2006 10:41:18 AM
Author: PrecisionGem
You realize that mystic topaz is just a coating applied to a colorless white topaz. This coating can be scratched off.

To do a good job cutting a stone, especially one over 3 or 4 cts. takes several hours. So if you are asking about the quality of a cut stone that is selling for just $2, you need to wonder how much time was really spent cutting it, even at labor rates of $.20/ per hour. A piece of white topaz rough sells for about $.30 per ct., then figure about 25% yield. So to cut a 8 ct stone you would need to start with about 32 ct. rough x .30 per ct. = $9.60 for the rough. Now these cutting houses in China will buy huge qty''s of rough, and get a better price. I still couldn''t see how any one could make any money on the stone for $2.

As a toy gem for a 5 year old go for it. Just hope she doesnt think it''s candy and eat it.
Click to expand...
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4 and 5 year old children are not that foolish and Saxon is well above average, I am sure you did not intend to be impolite but to imply that child who reads chapter books and does division is going to revert to being and infant and eat something is rude.

Ana- you make an excellent point those would be too large for her.


I know the setting will likely cost between 125-200 dollars. I just want her to have something fun that perhaps she can later take off as a necklace and have it become a charm for her bracelet.


If I find another stone that catches my eye I will post it.
Thanks!
 
Date: 1/9/2006 11:43:21 AM
Author: Matatora




I just want her to have something fun that perhaps she can later take off as a necklace and have it become a charm for her bracelet.



Click to expand...
That isn't disposable 'toy' anymore... And it sounds like you would rather get something that looks appealing to you - and that may be different than a child's preference
38.gif
After all, it isn't completely self evident what is more or less than average about these fancy cuts.

Speaking of which:

How does this look to you? (not sure this is concave anywhere - just some fancy cut spinel and tourmaline out of a rather long list on the site where these come from- those guys were posting here at some point).

EA005784A.jpg
EA004437C.jpg


These are 6-7mm and under $100. Larger are listed too. The pictures must be tremendously flattering - at least size-wise. Can't believe such detail shows on a small stone nearly as well.

The stones could be set by the seller, as far as I understand.


Re. kids and gems... It is embarrassing to admit for how long I've been into rocks & things. The induction came rather early _ I must have been 10 or 11 when someone had the brilliant idea to let me handle some outrageous stuff. Otherwise, it didn't happen to often to get to see and handle truly precious jewelry alongside professionals - I'd wish. Anyway, the first time I had any idea of the value and importance of the candy-like red and green pebbles set battered gold frames. It is a nice memory, but must sadly admit that today I would not be able to just see the object for what it is in such blissful ignorance of the six digit price tag
9.gif
FRED FELDMESSER has an essay along these lines online (see the 'Two Small Pebbles' bit). You may find it fun
1.gif
 
Date: 1/9/2006 2:36:47 PM
Author: valeria101

Date: 1/9/2006 11:43:21 AM
Author: Matatora






I just want her to have something fun that perhaps she can later take off as a necklace and have it become a charm for her bracelet.




Click to expand...
That isn''t disposable ''toy'' anymore... And it sounds like you would rather get something that looks appealing to you - and that may be different than a child''s preference
38.gif
After all, it isn''t completely self evident what is more or less than average about these fancy cuts.

Speaking of which:

How does this look to you? (not sure this is concave anywhere - just some fancy cut spinel and tourmaline out of a rather long list on the site where these come from- those guys were posting here at some point).

EA005784A.jpg
EA004437C.jpg


These are 6-7mm and under $100. Larger are listed too. The pictures must be tremendously flattering - at least size-wise. Can''t believe such detail shows on a small stone nearly as well.

The stones could be set by the seller, as far as I understand.


Re. kids and gems... It is embarrassing to admit for how long I''ve been into rocks & things. The induction came rather early _ I must have been 10 or 11 when someone had the brilliant idea to let me handle some outrageous stuff. Otherwise, it didn''t happen to often to get to see and handle truly precious jewelry alongside professionals - I''d wish. Anyway, the first time I had any idea of the value and importance of the candy-like red and green pebbles set battered gold frames. It is a nice memory, but must sadly admit that today I would not be able to just see the object for what it is in such blissful ignorance of the six digit price tag
9.gif
FRED FELDMESSER has an essay along these lines online (see the ''Two Small Pebbles'' bit). You may find it fun
1.gif
Click to expand...
She wears a JA charm bracelet most days, and sometimes a necklace. I emailed her a few (my mother will show them to her) but I don’t know. She thought mystic topaz was pretty neat because it would match everything, which is vital to her just now. I will forward along the ones you have posted too. Her favorite color is blue, like her eyes
2.gif
, and that is how this got started I was on Richard Homers web page and showed her a blue one this summer...
 
Oh storm, it is lovely!!!
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I cannot wait to see what Saxon thinks! Thanks!
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Iv seen one like it in person and the photos dont come close to doing it justice.

A local jeweler buys ones like it and mounts them in $75 14k settings and sells them for $279
 
If you want this to be something she can keep for a long time but also wear everyday I would stay away from rings. I had a small ruby ring my parents gave me when I started 1st grade and between needing to take it off for art classes and PE it was either lost or stolen even though I tried so hard to take care of it. I certainly wish I had that ring today.

Theres just too many times you need to remove rings while in elementary school, the chance of it being lost is pretty high.
 
Wow! I want these for me...bad KK.
Saxon will be five on the 25th and has dark blue/grey eyes (though they are turning more grey all the time) and white blond hair. She is a cutie! I would post pictures of her but our mother would shot me.

I sent the pair of rounds to my mother, but she thinks they are proably too big for a little girl to wear. I was the one who took her to get her ears peirced this summer, her current studs are 2mm I think anything much over 4 would overwhelm her.
My mother is getting into this little hunt. Though we both think it is unlikely that I will be able to find just the right thing in time for her birthday. She has decreed (no better word for it) that she would like either a blue stone or a garnet which is her birthstone.

Now I am thinking that earrings would be perfect!
 
email Gary and see what he can find.
concave in that size wont likely be available but he can get others.
A couple small blue zircons would rock for earrings.

as would a couple sapphires and they arent expensive in that size.
 
18.gif
A little OT but wow! I love this necklace!!!
sblj117x.jpg
 
With Saxon's coloring you must go Blue! I highly recommend those two sweet concave Topaz's Stormy showed you from Gary for 40 bucks. They are big enough for her to grow into womanhood with and will compliment her eyes!!!

Great unique name I must say. In high school we were the Saxons!
 
Date: 1/12/2006 9:41:52 AM
Author: Matatora
18.gif
A little OT but wow! I love this necklace!!!

sblj117x.jpg
Click to expand...


isnt that just the kewlest.
I was looking at it and added it to my someday list for my wifey2b.
 
Date: 1/12/2006 10:05:52 PM
Author: Kimberly
With Saxon''s coloring you must go Blue! I highly recommend those two sweet concave Topaz''s Stormy showed you from Gary for 40 bucks. They are big enough for her to grow into womanhood with and will compliment her eyes!!!

Great unique name I must say. In high school we were the Saxons!
Click to expand...
Thanks, she likes it.

In high school we were the Minute Men....you can imagine the jears we heard at wrestling events.
emembarrassed.gif
 
Well I have not been able to find the perfect stones for Saxon’s earrings yet, but I am still looking. I asked her what she wanted for her birthday, 5 next Wednesday, and she said she would like a carpet sweeper because our mother wont vacuum her room more then once a day…and the dogs shed more then that. So I will have my eye out for Christmas.
 
Date: 1/18/2006 2:33:18 PM
Author: Matatora


Well I have not been able to find the perfect stones for Saxon’s earrings yet, but I am still looking. I asked her what she wanted for her birthday, 5 next Wednesday, and she said she would like a carpet sweeper because our mother wont vacuum her room more then once a day…and the dogs shed more then that. So I will have my eye out for Christmas.
Click to expand...

That is the cutest thing. I used to babysit for a little boy (probably around the same age as your sister) who was obsessed with cleaning. Too funny.
 
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