Color question G SI1 vs H VS1

[meffaman]

I''m driving myself crazy because I find I can''t compromise clarity, and don''t want to pay for both color and clarity because it drives the price way up. So I''m thinking of moving from G SI1 to H VS1, and want to know what people think of the color difference? The H color with the better clarity is about $1100 more than the G, but the optics look so much better. I''m also stuck on the idea that feathers are a crack in a stone, so I''ve been shying away from stones with feathers. Am I neurotic or what?

So, am I crazy to pay a higher price for clarity and precision, while at the same time dropping from G to H? I also need to verify the internal pictures of the H stone are the actual pictures and not representative. I think I read that if it says "confirmed" then it''s the actual, but if it doesn''t then it''s representative.

Here are the two I''ve got it down to:

G SI1

H VS1

Everyone here is great and I''m truly impressed with the amount of time everyone spends helping out. My head is about to burst from trying to process everything, and I actually thought about putting pieces of paper in a hat and going with whatever I pulled out!

 

[pqcollectibles]

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On 1/27/2004 9:45:32 PM meffaman wrote:

I'm also stuck on the idea that feathers are a crack in a stone, so I've been shying away from stones with feathers. Am I neurotic or what?

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I have a personal aversion to "clouds", but hey, that's just me! I know that I know that I know clouds can be no problem at all, but still.....

GOG's pics are of the actual diamonds. No worries there. Rhino is truly one of the good guys!

Both are excellently cut diamonds. Both will out perform most any diamond you will to run into walking around on the street. G vs H, flip a coin. The average person cannot discern between adjacent colors. Both the G and the H will be WHITE WHITE WHITE.

If Rhino says the SI1 is eye clean, it's eye clean. Clarity costs more than color. That's part of the pricing of the H. A H, VS1, H&A is $320/carat on average, higher in price than a G, SI1, H&A.

Is the higher clarity and extra performance indicated by the GOG's test results worth the extra $$$??? Some people would say, "YES!!" Some people would say, "Extra money for the house, the honeymoon, the bachelor party." Only you can make that call.

 

[Daniela]

I am going to be the dissenting voice, I know, even before others reply. Just watch--people love to vote for the eye-clean SI-1!

If clarity bugs you now, it will probably always bug you. Eye-clean means that the casual observer will not notice the inclusions. Put the light source behind the stone in the right conditions and look closely, and you may be able to see the inclusions in your SI-1. I am speaking from the perspective of an eye-clean SI-1 owner. Or from the side in any condition, depending. Your VS-1 stone, however, will be all clean, all day long. Jonathan told me when we were buying that if people are really anal about clarity, he advises them to buy VS-1 or better. While I decided to get an SI-1, I would totally upgrade to a VS in a heartbeat.

I own a H&A "H" colour diamond. It's beautiful. In fact, the H VS-1 stone you are eyeing on GOG is one of the stones that I would consider for an upgrade for my own stone! Good eye.

 

[valeria101]

Did you see any inclusions in that SI1? It looks clean as a whistle to me

Also, just taking my chances here, why not keep color and clarity and save a bit on those arrows, and testing services? If a non H&A G-VS would show nice promise of light return via Briliance Scope, how much worse would that be?

 

[sumi]

I agree with Daniela. You said you can't compromise clarity, right? Well, if it bugs you now, it will always bug you. It seems like you like the H VS1 stone better, that the optics look better. It sounds like you've already made your decision.

I tend to be the type that will just obesess about things. I know that if something bugs me, whether it be diamond clarity or even the color of a shirt, it will always bug me. If I don't go with my gut instict and instead compromise something then it will bug me forever!

As for the technicalities of VS1 vs. SI1, well....there are other people more qualified to answer that than me. I'm just looking at this from a gut instinct point of view.

 

[Daniela]

Sumi,

Well spoken.


Daniela

 

[meffaman]

I keep thinking that either way I can't go wrong. I say that because this is a replacement for the stone I bought my wife 12yrs ago, when I was a lot worse off financially. I'm also getting a new wedding band, looks like Precision Set is the direction I'm heading.

I bought her a .67 round when I proposed, the jeweler said it was F color and I1 or I2 (not sure on that one)and I paid around $1100-$1200 at the time.

She's not really in the loop on this, but I've been able get a little information here and there without being to conspicious.

 

[valeria101]

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On 1/27/2004 11:04:49 PM meffaman wrote:

I keep thinking that either way I can't go wrong.----------------

Chances are there will be oly the slightest diference in color and clarity (if any) between those two stones face-up, all things equal about the cut. I would bet my hat (plus the FedEx shipping fee from Bucharest

) that the SI2 is eye clean face up. Those inclusions are not going to be red blobs as the ink on the GIA chart, but rather some trasparent, illusive "features" for one to enjoy with some effort and magnification

Oh, and sorry for the barbaric language, is 6 am here...

 

[meffaman]

I just sent an email to Jonathan asking if he can take a picture of the SI1 on a white business card next to a better VS1 stone. Does that sound like something he would do for me?

The magnified closeups kinda scare me, I'm interested in what it will look like in the real world.

 

[Kamuelamom]

Meffaman, congratulations on a fine gift for your wife. I'm sure she will be blown away with either stone. That said, I'm not sure about spending the $1100 more for something you will not see with your naked eye (clarity), especially if the inclusions are not dark. BUT, if it will drive you crazy, by all means it might be worth it.

I can be very picky about certain things so I surely understand.

I'd say it would depend whether spending the $1100 more was important or not. If not, then the HVS1 looks like a real winner in terms of both cut and color/clarity. With the excellent cut you will not see a difference on the H vs. G. Nothing against the G/SI1 either--it's my personal favorite for great bang for your buck. Good luck with your decision. Please keep us posted.

 

[Kamuelamom]

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On 1/27/2004 11:36:36 PM meffaman wrote:

I just sent an email to Jonathan asking if he can take a picture of the SI1 on a white business card next to a better VS1 stone. Does that sound like something he would do for me?

The magnified closeups kinda scare me, I'm interested in what it will look like in the real world. ----------------

I'd think he'd do it. And yes, the close up shots, though somewhat helpful, can never give you a true feel for what your eyes can judge. The G/SI1, though not perfect H&A could wind up being a real dazzler. Each stone is so unique that way. Have you considered having it shipped to you for inspection so you can actually see it? Or maybe sending it off to an independent appraiser?

 

[valeria101]

I guess the most important picture would be face up...

I would try a small experiment in the meantime: copi that inclusions chart (or the magnified diamond picture from the webpage) and shrink it down the the actual dimentsions of the stone. Those inclusions are under 1mm - as big as the doth on a printed page, only they'd be transparent to boot and placed against some very sparkly background. Magnified pictures are great, but diamonds are small objects after all. A non-magnified picture would usualy not capture even eye visible inclusions (maybe a 3X would serve better), but I am sure Jonathan would help somehow.

 

[jbenning]

Without tons of diamond experience, take this advice as non-diamond related...the problem is, no matter what, you'll know what you have, and once you decide to spend a ton of money as you have, part of me says you should spend the little extra that is necessary to make you feel proud of what you bought, even if it is for trivial reasons. With this scale of purchase, you shouldn't ever doubt your purchase. No stress.

 

[Hest88]

I doubt you'll see any difference in the H. Personally, I think you should go with what pleases you the most. If the extra $1K is something you can easily afford and the better clarity makes you feel a lot better than go for that.

I would choose the higher color and lower clarity, but that's really a personal preference.

 

[iceprincess]

Meffaman,
You're not being neurotic. You are doing everything you can to avoid having buyer's remorse. This is certainly no small purchase and it's a very loving gesture to your wife. You should be picky!

I can't add more to what everyone else has already said, but from the two you've selected you certainly can't go wrong. It's true, you will pay a higher premium for clarity, more so than color, but as I've seen and as I've read other's testify here, in stones this well cut the color diff. bt/w G and F and neglible. Both stones are beautiful, but personally I'd pay the premium and choose the H VS1.

 

[meffaman]

Thanks everyone.

I did want to mention that when I was talking about the pictures being the real pictures, I was talking about the hearts and arrows pictures, not the zooms of the stone. I thought I read that GOG will put up a stock picture of excellent hearts and arrows pictures for stones that don't have issues because they have a great source that cuts their premium H&A's very close to each other. I would imagine this would save time having to photograph each one individually when you know there isn't a problem with the internal precision.

 

[Hest88]

I never got the impression that Jonathan put up "stock" pictures. Part of the premium of those "featured" diamonds lies in the copious information and proof of quality that, in part, lies in the H&A photos.

Maybe Jonathan can confirm?

 

[Lisa B.]

Meffaman...

I just have to respond here...first, no one can tell you what will make YOU and your future Fiancée happy; I can only share with you my experience. My husband bought me an upgrade ER for Christmas. To me it looked beautiful; it was an F VS1 1.03 CT RB. He asked me to do some research, knowing I had become hooked on this site, and what I found was that the cut was less than desirable, which made the 1.03 look more like a .90 or something like that, anyhoo, we decided to make a change on it. I have always thought that color and clarity was the end all be all, but after lurking here for a while, I decided to test myself. When we went to look at new diamonds, I asked not to be told the color or clarity. What I found is that I personally have an "eye for color" and could pick out what was the higher color grade; however, I could not distinguish between the clarity grades...to be honest with you, with or without a loupe. So, the moral of my story? I went with a stone that scores a .7 on the HCA, is 100x the cut I had in the first stone...can see my arrows like no-one's business (and it is not a branded H&A), that is E in color and SI1 in clarity...for just a little more $, I got a diamond, that for the most part, looks like a .25 bigger than the original X-mas stone and is a color grade higher.

Good Luck!

 

[BWise]

What a sweat thing you are doing for your wife!

Has anyone noticed that 80% of shoppers here are BF looking for e-rings? Where are the husbands?

(I have to shop for my upgrades myself - though I enjoy it - wouldn't it be nice if my husband did it instead of spending his time in front of the TV?)




I will go with G SI1. I am an addict to clarity too but I know that I see the difference mostly through my brain, not via my eyes. If you cannot tolerate the idea of buying an SI1 then go with the other one. No layman (that is who sees the diamond everyday) can tell the difference between those stones when they are mounted face up. Everyone who look at the stones will be caught instantly by the brilliance and fire. Only you know the difference! If I were you, I will be pleased of myself to have spend $1,000 less on something equally beautiful! As for the color, I won't repeat what is said - no difference to your eyes!




I don't like the H VS1 since its cut is not that ideal. Look at the wide range of table, crown angle and pavillion angles, and the wavy griddle profile! All means the minor facets are not perfectly cut. Fro the price I would expect something better but that's me who is a 'cut geek'. The G SI 1 has better stats. True the heart pattern is not perfect, but it cost 20% less, yet still a triple-ideal!




Good Luck!

 

[aljdewey]

Meffa.....do note in your decision though.....the higher money on the H stone is due not just to the better clarity, but also due to the fact that it is a true H&A.




In my opinion, the G stone is not....and Jonathan fairly notes that one heart is smaller than the others. The price is fairly reflective of this, too.




While I'd likely pick the G stone (because I don't give a whit about clarity as long as it's eyeclean), that's not how YOU feel about it. You will be looking at this stone on her hand for the next umpteen years. I think that if you go with the G and you have reservations, what you'll always think is "MMM....wish the clarity was better." That's not what you want to be thinking everytime you look at the stone.




I think you should follow your clarity instincts and go with the H. Believe me, there will be no noticeable difference in color. My H is WHITE, and I'm sure this one will be too.

 

[Giangi]

I would get the G color too. It's not a perfect H&A, but it shows a decent pattern and that's a sign of nice internal symmetry and precision cutting. It looks quite clean for an SI 1. The price is very nice too... Honestly I couldn't justify the price difference between this G/SI 1 and the H/VS 1. Anyway, no matter which one you choose, you won't do wrong!

 

[pqcollectibles]

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On 1/28/2004 2:47:41 PM aljdewey wrote:


Meffa.....do note in your decision though.....the higher money on the H stone is due not just to the better clarity, but also due to the fact that it is a true H&A.


In my opinion, the G stone is not....and Jonathan fairly notes that one heart is smaller than the others. The price is fairly reflective of this, too.


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Thanks, AL! I realized when I reread my post I wasn't entirely clear on that point.

 

[phoenixgirl]

Have you considered this 1.07 G SI1? It doesn't have an "eye clean" disclaimer, but the magnified shot doesn't look busy, so I would be surprised if it isn't. A quick email should get you an answer. This stone is less $ than the H VS1, and is also a true H&A. It scores triple very highs on the brilliance scope and a 9.8 on the ISee2.

Maybe you want to look for a VS2 if clarity bothers you. I would personally rather have a higher color grade than a higher clarity grade if the other stone were already eye clean.