Buying round 2.05+/- Fire over brilliance

[Ss52]

Hello Pricescope!

My brother asked me to help choose an anniversary diamond for his wife, a “surprise” she’s been hinting at. I’m looking for one I’d be proud to see her wear, favoring fire, then brilliance. So smaller tables, higher crowns, prefer F-G color, and some beefy star facets if possible. After searching for days, then painful culling for days, please advise me on the good, the bad, and the ugly if you see something that would put one of these in the cull or *buy now!* category. I’d be so grateful. Thank you all.

1. https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD11655829 2.1 E Vs2 (looks Vs1?), 27,380 matched, HCA 1.3

2. https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD11537395 2.24 G Vs1, 28,171, HCA 1.5

3. https://www.fourmine.com/diamonds/index/diamonddetail/id/97963011 2.01 F Vs1, 27,370 match, HCA 1.3. (Is indented natural on girdle a problem?). No video yet, requested.

4. https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-de...DiamondDetails&action=newTab&catalogView=true 2.09 H Vs2, 19,273 med blue fl, HCA 1.3

5. Lost track of site, grrr. Can anybody find GIA 1186901531 ? 2.0 F Vs1, HCA 0.9. Table 55, star facet 55, angles 33.5/40.8, depth 61.7, HCA 0.9.

6. Waiting on a photo, but these numbers are lovely. Thoughts?
https://enchanteddiamonds.com/diamo...1-Carat-E-Color-VS2-Clarity-Diamond-324570521 2.01 E Vs2, 25,430, HCA 0.8.


Has anybody dealt with Four Mine or Enchanted before? They are Rare Carat recommended, but there’s not a lot of information about them on here. Should I be wary on that account? It’s *scary* spending my brother’s money.

Best wishes to you all.

 

[Gussie]

In a heartbeat, this one!

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4059369.htm

 

[lovedogs]

In a heartbeat, this one!

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4059369.htm

Love that one

 

[shicara]

In a heartbeat, this one!

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4059369.htm

OMG - yes!!

 

[mrs-b]

Hi @Ss52 -

You listed some lovely diamonds! I think your best 2 are numbers 1 and 4 - particularly number 1. What a beautiful stone! It has better spread than the others, and I agree with you - I like a 15.5 crown %, tho you have to be aware, GIA rounds their stats. But, either way, this crown has a nice lift to it.

I agree that the WhiteFlash diamond is lovely - no question! - but I love an E colored stone and I always prefer, if possible, to stay in the VS range. If WF can confirm it's eye clean, tho, then I think it has to be in consideration. They also have better customer service, a better trade up policy, and their sales people are way more educated about their product. I like a 55% table if I can get it, and this one is 55.5. And it is, of course, a tad bigger, with its spread being larger as well. Always a plus.

So those would be my 2 picks - #1 on your list and the WF stone, with #4 coming up a close 3rd.

Good luck!

 

[Ss52]

In a heartbeat, this one!

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4059369.htm

Yeah baby!! Now we’re talkin’ FIRE!! That’s now my number 7.

I’d like to see the dia in a movie under more normal lighting conditions to better see the inclusions under the table as they move along. Hopefully they’ll get back to me today. Anniversary is in February.

Number 6 above is also an HCA 0.8, better color and clarity. Unfortunately there’s no photo yet, but I’ll post it later.
No.6...........................Ceg7
Table 55, stars 55.................55.5...52
CA 35 deg, PA 40.6 deg.......34.2....40.7
Total depth 61.1%................61.0%
Crown 16%, pav 42.5%........15.1....43
HCA 0.8.................................HCA 0.8

Would you expect No. 6 to perform spectacularly as Ceg’s above? Also, it looks like Enchanted doesn’t own No.6; it’s also on Yadav’s site. Would Whiteflash get this in for me and image it?

Any comments on No’s. 1-5 above? Thanks everyone.

 

[mrs-b]

Yeah baby!! Now we’re talkin’ FIRE!! That’s now my number 7.

I’d like to see the dia in a movie under more normal lighting conditions to better see the inclusions under the table as they move along. Hopefully they’ll get back to me today. Anniversary is in February.

Number 6 above is also an HCA 0.8, better color and clarity. Unfortunately there’s no photo yet, but I’ll post it later.
No.6...........................Ceg7
Table 55, stars 55.................55.5...52
CA 35 deg, PA 40.6 deg.......34.2....40.7
Total depth 61.1%................61.0%
Crown 16%, pav 42.5%........15.1....43
HCA 0.8.................................HCA 0.8

Would you expect No. 6 to perform spectacularly as Ceg’s above? Also, it looks like Enchanted doesn’t own No.6; it’s also on Yadav’s site. Would Whiteflash get this in for me and image it?

Any comments on No’s. 1-5 above? Thanks everyone.

Yes. I went through the ones above and picked what I thought were the 2 best. See my above post.

 

[tyty333]

No 6 will be questionable as to whether it will perform up to an ACA. I would not expect it unless you can get an H&A image that shows it is an H&A. WF ACAs are H&As which are diamonds "that have been cut to a very high degree of three dimensional symmetry, also referred to as “optical symmetry” or “optical precision” " which affects the light return. You will also need an idealscope image to show whether the stone has any light leakage. WF ACAs are considered Super Ideal Branded stones because they are highly vetted. Not saying you cant buy a beautiful stone elsewhere but you are in the same price range as
a Super Branded Stone so it makes a lot of sense to get that peace of mind. WF also has one of the best trade up policies in case he/she wants to go larger
in the future.

 

[Ss52]

Yes. I went through the ones above and picked what I thought were the 2 best. See my above post.

Mrs-b, I did read your post....digesting it now. Thanks so much for your opinion.

 

[sledge]

Eliminate stone 2. Despite a good HCA score, the stone is too deep at 62.7. Also concerned 41 pavilion may hit 41.2 when GIA rounding and averaging is taken into account. At 41.2 stuff tends to go wonky.

Link to stone 5:
https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-details/LD10059006

If you are trying to put fire over brilliance, the shallow 33.5 crown doesn't do you any favors. Plus, I just think Astor Ideals are over priced. Most the time they are trying to get H&A prices for stones that aren't truly H&A. As a comparison, here is a true H&A stone that is similar. A little cheaper, but if bumped to VS1 clarity (from VS2) it would be about on par.

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3970294.htm

The only vendor on your list that truly owns and stores the stones in their own vault is WF. Additionally each of their stones is vetted by a team that looks at multitude of things above and beyond proportions to make sure the stone is a true performer in all regards. Lastly you get a complete set of symmetry and light performance images that PROVE the stones are rock stars.

The other vendors are what we call virtual inventory dealers, meaning they have either common or exclusive agreements with suppliers across the globe. They list the stone on their site for sale, but the physical stone is normally located elsewhere by this 3rd party. Some information can be obtained on the stone, but it's generally very difficult to get things like an idealscope, ASET or H&A images because the suppliers either won't or can't do it. For instance, I don't think any images are available on BN. With FourMines, I think it depends on the supplier. With ED, I've seen them do quite a few images on select stones, so probably depends on their supplier as well.

What does this mean to you? Just that you have to rely more on non-specific data to make your decision. Maybe buy your own scopes and test the stone once it arrives. Possibly reject and start over the process. My own 2 cents is I think with no images or vetting this is risky for you since you are pushing the edges with 35.5 crowns and 41 pavilions.

Point blank, there are some beautiful GIA 3x stones in virtual inventory that with enough time & effort can be found. It kind of depends on the buyer if all that hassle is worth it or not. With the anniversary coming up in February, literally a few days away, I'd be leaning more towards someone like WF or similar that could get you a guaranteed performer and then show off their superior customer service skills to get the stone set and delivered in time for the anniversary. After all, that is the big picture goal.

 

[Ss52]

Sledge, you gave some excellent advice about the time frame and the whiteflash customer service. There will be no upgrade on this diamond, but the whiteflash reputation is strong. That means a lot.


The diamond you linked has a large table. It’s hard to find a 55% table, so I’ve been searching as many vendors as possible. Honestly, I’m getting overwhelmed, but have a better idea now about complementary angles and depths. I hope to find the best choice soon and will keep trying.

Thank you so much.
Susan

 

[sledge]

Sledge, you gave some excellent advice about the time frame and the whiteflash customer service. There will be no upgrade on this diamond, but the whiteflash reputation is strong. That means a lot.


The diamond you linked has a large table. It’s hard to find a 55% table, so I’ve been searching as many vendors as possible. Honestly, I’m getting overwhelmed, but have a better idea now about complementary angles and depths. I hope to find the best choice soon and will keep trying.

Thank you so much.
Susan

You're very welcome. Glad it helped some.

I wouldn't go too nuts looking for a 55% table. I too prefer smaller tables, but if you find the right stone that has all other characteristics, price, etc then I wouldn't nix for having a 56 or 57 table. Now if you've short listed to several diamonds then I get looking at things like that.

That said, here are two additional stones plus the one that @ceg recommended.

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3784278,4059369,4049800

You might like the 2.05 G VS2. It has a 35.5/40.6 combo you were originally looking at and it's GIA certified. That stone is part of their Expert Select (ES) brand. Basically this is a near miss A Cut Above (ACA) stone that carries a GIA certification, but all the perks of the ACA stone. Same trade in and buy back policy. Same great customer service. All the performance images, etc. Just a cheaper price for minimal differences.

Didn't know if exactly 2+ carats was required, or if a near 2 carat would be acceptable. I tossed one of those in as well.

Anyhow let me us know if you have any questions.

 

[sledge]

A couple more from a different vendor that has a great reputation for customer service and high quality super ideal stones.

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10096

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10535

 

[Ss52]

Sledge, this is great help. When I feel overload, members here are a real lifeline. Your new suggestions will occupy me until tomorrow. The 2 ct is the lower limit. Just means my bro will have to pay a bit/lot more. (S’okay, he’s been prepared for sticker shock today.)

I did look tho for smaller. This would be awesome in a killer setting. Leon Megé? It may equal Ceg’s.
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4049800.htm

 

[sledge]

I did look tho for smaller. This would be awesome in a killer setting. Leon Megé? It may equal Ceg’s.
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4049800.htm

GMTA -- that is one of the WF stones I linked in the comparison link in post #12 above.

And I think most things would look great in a LM or VC setting.

 

[Ss52]

Sledge, the two additional diamonds plus Ceg’s that you recommended? They were already in my cart. I must be on the right track now, thanks to you and others. Feeling a little more confident.
Going off to HP now.

 

[SimoneDi]

If the stone won’t be upgraded and if the BN 2.1 E VS1 price matched is within budget, I would think twice before selecting a 1.94 G VS2 or a 2ct F SI1 with a table crystal inclusion instead for almost the same cost. This comes from the perspective of a “super ideal” owner btw. The minute differences in cut will likely be indiscernible by the naked eye, but the size and color will be.

I would also consider Steven Kirsch for a handforged solitaire. His work is the closest for LM imo and he is a easy guy to work with.

 

[Ss52]

Heh heh, we gotta stop cross-posting like this.

 

[Ss52]

If the stone won’t be upgraded and if the BN 2.1 E VS1 price matched is within budget, I would think twice before selecting a 1.94 G VS2 instead for almost the same cost. This comes from the perspective of a “super ideal” owner btw. The minute differences in cut will likely be indiscernible by the naked eye, but the size and color will be.

I would also consider Steven Kirsch for a handforged solitaire. His work is the closest for LM imo and he is a easy guy to work with.

I keep on going back to that E Vs1, drawn to it like it would be my own. GIA must have rounded up the table to 56%; it looks smaller NEXT TO THOSE BODACIOUS 55% **STAR FACETS** !!! Dang, I’m gonna be jealous if that’s The One.

 

[SimoneDi]

I keep on going back to that E Vs1, drawn to it like it would be my own. GIA must have rounded up the table to 56%; it looks smaller NEXT TO THOSE BODACIOUS 55% **STAR FACETS** !!! Dang, I’m gonna be jealous if that’s The One.

55 and 56 are both mid-range tables. A diamond doesn’t have to have a 55% table to display great fire. The stone has a nice 15.5% crown. It is a gorgeous stone and I am frankly not sure why he hasn’t put it on hold yet.

WF is a great company and they do offer excellent cs and trade in policy. However, if the diamond will be the one and only, I see absolutely no reason to go with a similarly priced alternatives that have inferior size, color and clarity. If your bother/his wife would upgrade every year or two, my recommendation might be different. Nonetheless, the 2.1 E VS1 is a stunning, stunning diamond. It gets my vote.

 

[Ss52]

A couple more from a different vendor that has a great reputation for customer service and high quality super ideal stones.

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10096

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10535

Holy moley, Layla and I just texted back n forth. D flawless customer service.

 

[Dancing Fire]

A couple more from a different vendor that has a great reputation for customer service and high quality super ideal stones.

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10535

This one looks good to me!

 

[Ss52]

55 and 56 are both mid-range tables. A diamond doesn’t have to have a 55% table to display great fire. The stone has a nice 15.5% crown. It is a gorgeous stone and I am frankly not sure why he hasn’t put it on hold yet.

WF is a great company and they do offer excellent cs and trade in policy. However, if the diamond will be the one and only, I see absolutely no reason to go with a similarly priced alternatives that have inferior size, color and clarity. If your bother/his wife would upgrade every year or two, my recommendation might be different. Nonetheless, the 2.1 E VS1 is a stunning, stunning diamond. It gets my vote.

This one will be in the three or four recommendations going to my brother, and possibly add in a $$$$- decoy D VVs1 to lessen the sticker shock of the E.

Thanks for your opinion.

 

[sledge]

I'm glad Layla was able to help you. Honestly, the CS story you shared is pretty typical for HPD customers. They are good people that go above and beyond for those they serve.

What day in Feb does he need to present this ring? Also what kind of a setting? Is he seriously thinking a custom through LM, VC, SK, DK or going with an in house or designer option where he buys the stone? If anything custom, conversations need to be had about schedule and cost right now.

In regards to the 2.10 BN stone, are we calling it a VS1 because it's so clean? The cert says VS2 and the price should reflect the grading on the cert.

Also, is that a confirmed price match? And how? I looked for that stone elsewhere and couldn't find. Additionally it was my understanding BN had exclusive agreements with their suppliers so those same suppliers cant offer the same identical stone to other virtual inventory dealers. Normally to get a price match you need to find the same stone elsewhere for a cheaper price. Maybe there is a discount, etc instead but just making sure that is a real price is all and not an assumption.

I really like the fact you get an E color and above the magic weight threshold of 2 carats for around $3k more. While that is still a 10%+ increase I would expect it to be more so you are getting a good bang for the buck.

My biggest concern is what I mentioned earlier about the images, etc. The stone proportions and video looks good and I anticipate it will do good so if you go this route buy a scope and confirm when it arrives.

 

[SimoneDi]

This one will be in the three or four recommendations going to my brother, and possibly add in a $$$$- decoy D VVs1 to lessen the sticker shock of the E.

Thanks for your opinion.

OP another suggestion will be to reach out to IDJ to see what price they can offer for the 2.1 E BN stone or another similar GIA stone. Tell them PS sent you.

Steven Kirsch finished a halo ring setting for a friend in 2 weeks, so I am pretty confident that if your bother conveys his timeframe, he will be able to accommodate it.

 

[Ss52]

A couple more from a different vendor that has a great reputation for customer service and high quality super ideal stones.

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10096

https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10535

 

[Ss52]

The first is on hold. That second is a s-s-s-$tunner!! Afraid it’s out of price range tho.

 

[Ss52]

OP another suggestion will be to reach out to IDJ to see what price they can offer for the 2.1 E BN stone or another similar GIA stone. Tell them PS sent you.

Steven Kirsch finished a halo ring setting for a friend in 2 weeks, so I am pretty confident that if your bother conveys his timeframe, he will be able to accommodate it.

SimoneSi, who is IDJ? Not familiar. BN will price match. Right now, it’ll be put in an inexpensive four-prong platinum. Her choice will be a setting.

I’m pleased to report diamond #1, the 2.1 E at Blue Nile, is on hold. Happy, happy dance, but holding my breath. . . . .

 

[lovedogs]

SimoneSi, who is IDJ? Not familiar. BN will price match. Right now, it’ll be put in an inexpensive four-prong platinum. Her choice will be a setting.

I’m pleased to report diamond #1, the 2.1 E at Blue Nile, is on hold. Happy, happy dance, but holding my breath. . . . .

Just FYI , IDJ is ID jewelry in NY.

 

[Ss52]

Thanks. I looked around, but very few images.