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Branded Diamonds

Karl_K

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Aug 4, 2008
Messages
9,121
Also, I think it makes a diff when you are considering insurance replacement.
Like kind for a random ags0 is another ags0.
It can become a paperwork fight which is why you need to save anything that sets your diamond apart from any other and have the policy bound with that information this includes brand.
For example for my wifey4vr's diamond I have a 6 page document that details everything about the diamond, ASET,IS,Arrow,Heart images and the grading report that GOG provided. I added photos of the ring itself to the packet. That allows me to bury them in paperwork.

Like kind for a branded cut is easier, its another of the same brand so there is an insurance consideration.(still keep the other info in case the brand does not exist at the time of the claim)
The number one rule of insurance claims is have detailed paperwork and images.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
I'm curious if you have seen them yet in person? I remember the images and the stats, but not sure I remember your reaction upon first seeing them after the recut. From all you've written above, I think in your heart you would like these diamonds branded.
Yes, I would like to do it. I have not seen them in person yet. They were sent for grading and once I make the final decision on branding, the appropriate AGS report and inscriptions will be done. Then they will be set in the mountings I purchased and then finally shipped back to me! I am sure I will love them... they clearly have to be "worthy" to be eligible. Clearly they will kick butt against my GIA 3X that has its shortcomings....
 

OdetteOdile

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
558
Yes, I would like to do it. I have not seen them in person yet. They were sent for grading and once I make the final decision on branding, the appropriate AGS report and inscriptions will be done. Then they will be set in the mountings I purchased and then finally shipped back to me! I am sure I will love them... they clearly have to be "worthy" to be eligible. Clearly they will kick butt against my GIA 3X that has its shortcomings....
Exciting! You have a lot to look forward to! Although I am hoping you have peace of mind in regards to your GIA 3X.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
The upgrade rights of that house make sense. Such an arrangement would also represent continuity for me - the old diamonds will be as much part of a future upgrade, as assets [I come from gold country, the idea of inheriting rough material to shape as desired is dyed in the wool; that value is approximately maintained, goes without saying; your diamonds will be working just this very old school way].

Then, lab reports do not age well; what you have is good enough for insurance etc. and at some point in the future, who knows what might be required.


thinking out loud


TMI - To me, a significant single stone is more wearable than large studs; I can do .3 studs - at which size they loose the 'diamond dot' quality for me & start wanting to matter in their own right, with a crazy thing hanging off a finger; did this too for many years.
I, too, have thought about many scenarios that the future could bring, the unknowns. However, we do know that technology has revolutionized diamond cutting and this is the future... it is here now as a niche market, but everything is so global now including knowledge and consumers are getting more educated and more sophisticated, so we are never going to go backwards in cut quality, and more and more people, as they become aware, are going to desire stones of this quality. Clearly these will "hold their value", for whatever that may mean, long after my flawed GIA 3X... of which we know the value of 3X :(
 
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headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
Exciting! You have a lot to look forward to! Although I am hoping you have peace of mind in regards to your GIA 3X.
Thank you for that. My husband tried to put it in perspective on the 3X yesterday... saying that it is a nice diamond, that people compliment me on it, and that there's probably a range of 3X... like from 80% to 100%, and even if mine is amongst the 80%ers, it is still a nice diamond. Not an AGS0, nor a BGD, but not horrible. (Keep in mind he doesn't know anything about any of this stuff yet clearly he has gathered that there is a broad range of the 3X designation.) The other part regarding my 3X is that, at the end of the day, it is still an E, and that does, I believe, mean something. So is it the best cut available in the context of today's available technology - no... but I don't think it is the worst, so there is still some relative cut quality there as well as it's very high color in a 2 carat. I know I shouldn't complain, whine, nor feel bad for myself lol... but when one comes on here it is hard not to. (Yet I can't keep away from here!!!) I'm sure that before the cutting technology of today existed, my 3X would be considered a much better stone. And with that in mind, it makes me think of my mother's diamond, and grandmother's, etc... what do we now make of those in today's world? Do we say they all suck? I know these are not world problems but it's an interesting conversation to have here on this forum! It's like, how do we "reconcile" the stones cut prior to the huge advances in cutting???
 

SimoneDi

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
3,672
@headlight, I did that once with BGD and to me it was worth it because I was able to later trade the stone in for an upgrade. You essentially buy into the upgrade option. So I would recommend that you think about the possibility of you will ever utilizing the upgrade option.
 

AV_

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 5, 2018
Messages
3,397
these will "hold their value", for whatever that may mean, long after my flawed GIA 3X... of which we know the value of 3X
Oh, I have not thought at all about GIA's cut grading, mostly origin. Also, I am happy with the promisse of value via the brand, because the current secondary market is not as decorous as it could be; of course, this is only as good as it gets.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
@headlight, I did that once with BGD and to me it was worth it because I was able to later trade the stone in for an upgrade. You essentially buy into the upgrade option. So I would recommend that you think about the possibility of you will ever utilizing the upgrade option.
Thanks for sharing your positive experience on this. I think doing it is a good opportunity to leave my options open, especially with a super ideal brand - something of which I would've never had access to before.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
Oh, I have not thought at all about GIA's cut grading, mostly origin. Also, I am happy with the promisse of value via the brand, because the current secondary market is not as decorous as it could be; of course, this is only as good as it gets.
I think the new origin option with GIA is really intriguing. Aside from super ideal cutting, I think that is also the future of diamonds... people really want to know where their stone comes from. And in spite of the Kimberley Act and all the regulations to clean up the blood diamond situation, there is still much skepticism amongst consumers that this is truly the case. As for secondary markets, we all know how that goes :(
 
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AV_

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 5, 2018
Messages
3,397
I am thinking of synthetics - they are possible, so an origin report is a must & it was the GIA who worked through the ID process. Yes, geographical origin for diamonds is overdue... even if every concern behind the Kimberley Act went away, this is additional strength to the natural origin claim IMHO.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
Like kind for a random ags0 is another ags0.
It can become a paperwork fight which is why you need to save anything that sets your diamond apart from any other and have the policy bound with that information this includes brand.
For example for my wifey4vr's diamond I have a 6 page document that details everything about the diamond, ASET,IS,Arrow,Heart images and the grading report that GOG provided. I added photos of the ring itself to the packet. That allows me to bury them in paperwork.

Like kind for a branded cut is easier, its another of the same brand so there is an insurance consideration.(still keep the other info in case the brand does not exist at the time of the claim)
The number one rule of insurance claims is have detailed paperwork and images.
I agree with you on all points (although all this info from all of you has definitely helped sell my case to the husband lol!). I will definitely provide all that backup for insurance and going to go with JM. My 3X is on policy that jeweler provided for 1st year through GemShield. Ugh. Lots of luck finding like for like replacement in a 3X that is even at the level of mine :( yet in a 2 ct, E color and a "decent" SI2 (no knots, cavities, etch channels, clouds, dark inclusions, etc. - yes, somehow I found the 1 decent SI2)... yes, this is going to be harder than needle in haystack so I guess I probably should move it over to JM while they will still accept the receipt vs having to get appraisal (receipt is 1 year old) and just getting payout policy and then if anything happens to the stone I can just take the cash and add $ and buy myself something nicer. Will add that to my diamond to-do list lol... but first need to finalize my recut stones future! Thanks for your personal and professional input.
 

kenny

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Messages
27,763
Depends on the brand.
There are reputable brands and IMO not-reputable brands.

If it's a reputable brand with good tight specs for things like cut for optimum light performance, then yes.
If the brand doesn't, like low-end brands from Kay, Zales, WalMart, etc., then no.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
There are reputable brands and brands I'd call garbage.


If the brand has good specs for things like light performance, then yes.
If the brand doesn't, like low-end brands from Kay, Zales, WalMart, etc., then no.
It's more like "branded" than "brand", however yes, this is a PS acknowledged top super ideal.
 

SimoneDi

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 19, 2014
Messages
3,672
Thanks for sharing your positive experience on this. I think doing it is a good opportunity to leave my options open, especially with a super ideal brand - something of which I would've never had access to before.
Sorry for all the typos, walking and typing is not my strength. I don’t think that many have gone that route, but I would definitely discuss with BGD what the trade in values would be, then make a decision as to how you might want to proceed. It seems that your stones are high quality so maybe you can even trade them in for an e-ring upgrade and use the one you have as a pendant or something else.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
Sorry for all the typos, walking and typing is not my strength. I don’t think that many have gone that route, but I would definitely discuss with BGD what the trade in values would be, then make a decision as to how you might want to proceed. It seems that your stones are high quality so maybe you can even trade them in for an e-ring upgrade and use the one you have as a pendant or something else.
I've practically walked off curbs walking and texting lol!
We have discussed the trade in values so all that has been established, and I feel that the recutting significantly increased their value. It is worth it to me, for the price of the branding, to have the upgrade option. While I don't know if I ever would utilize it, I just know that if I didn't do it, I would regret not having the option. I don't want to someday have the opportunity to throw some $ at upgrading and then kick myself as to why I didn't do the branding and have trade up value. And, to be perfectly honest, and this may be super shallow and egotistical on my part but, aside from having a trade in option, it is important to me to have the documented "pedigree" with the special branded AGS report. I would never be able to afford these stones outright but, given I have had this most lovely "windfall", and my husband was supportive of my relatively nominal investment in recutting, I "darn well" want the paperwork and trade in value that goes with it ;-)
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,542
I had a family stone recut that was much smaller and less valuable than yours. It was only 1 ct and recut to .80. Because it was a family stone, I chose not to even pay for the AGS report since I'd never sell it or trade it in. I also wasn't going to insure it since a sentimetal piece can't really be replaced. In your case, certainly the AGS Ideal cut lab report is essential for the insurance. However, since they are family stones and you don't plan to trade them in, I am not sure whether paying extra for branding is worth it. It's extremely hard for us to give good advice when we don't know the value of the diamonds and the amount extra beyond the AGS reports that they are charging. I suppose I might pay $100 extra per stone, but if it's a lot more than that, I'd personally not do it.

Did you say that JM offers a cash policy rather than replacement for loss now?
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
I had a family stone recut that was much smaller and less valuable than yours. It was only 1 ct and recut to .80. Because it was a family stone, I chose not to even pay for the AGS report since I'd never sell it or trade it in. I also wasn't going to insure it since a sentimetal piece can't really be replaced. In your case, certainly the AGS Ideal cut lab report is essential for the insurance. However, since they are family stones and you don't plan to trade them in, I am not sure whether paying extra for branding is worth it. It's extremely hard for us to give good advice when we don't know the value of the diamonds and the amount extra beyond the AGS reports that they are charging. I suppose I might pay $100 extra per stone, but if it's a lot more than that, I'd personally not do it.
I appreciate your input. I don't think it would be appropriate for me to mention dollar amounts, and I apologize that it's like I'm speaking to everyone "in code". And I sincerely appreciate everyone chiming in even without knowing all the actual figures. One other reason that motivated me to do the branding versus just having AGS reports is with regard to insurance, in that I would want replacement of "like for like". I don't know if there are different levels of AGS0s??? But at least if there are then it will be clearly stipulated as to what the stones are. Yes, I agree, the odds of something happening to them are slim. And, yes, I agree the odds that I would upgrade are slim. You are absolutely right. I just didn't want any regrets because in the context of upgrading I would be throwing away a lot of value by not doing this. Also, if I ever wanted to sell them, I think they would be worth more than stones with unbranded AGS reports. I could be totally wrong. But it seems that when someone here presents an AGS stone for consideration, participants weigh in on the images, etc... but when someone is considering a BGD or CBI or ACA or VC, everyone just says "pick one", there is no scrutinizing, no questioning, no inspection, nothing. If my stones were recut from, for example, a cutter my local jeweler uses (as was the case with the stone I traded in a year ago to get my avatar stone) and it was sent to AGS then I would just have an AGS report which would still obviously be wonderful. But there is no way I would otherwise ever have stones anywhere near this caliber of what I am now getting and since it is via a branded situation, I want the paperwork to reflect that. I also think that if I didn't do it, every time someone here gets a BGD, it will be gnawing away at me. Yes, this venture will push my kitchen cabinet refurbishing out a little further (the cabinets everyone says there's nothing wrong with, so you can see a pattern here lol!), and the diamond studs I'm dreaming of getting pushed back behind the cabinets! I appreciate your candor.
 

headlight

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Messages
2,121
@diamondseeker2006 With regard to your question about JM, I had a policy with them less than a year and a half ago on my former stone that was a cash policy. It was zero exclusions with cash payout. I only had it for a short time because I got it when I did the recut on that stone through my local jeweler. That diamond had been insured as a scheduled item on my homeowners policy and that policy did not cover breakage from recutting. So I had to get it covered by JM (who does cover for that) before I could have the jeweler send it off to his cutter. Fortunately, I had a recent appraisal on it otherwise I would've had to do all that legwork/expense before they would insure before I could have it recut. After the recut on that stone, I still was not happy (crappy stone!) which is when I did the trade with that jeweler for the stone in my avatar and then I just cancelled the policy since I no longer owned the stone. So I guess when I get these recuts back I will find out what my options are with JM as to cash out vs replacement. I have been told that replacement is less expensive which, now that I'm going to be branded lol, I'm fine with a replacement policy.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
55,542
@headlight I certainly understand your reasoning for getting the branding. And thank you for explaining about the JM cash out policy! That is something I had not heard of before. My daughter has their regular replacement policy, and I agree, if you had a branded stone, that should be fine assuming JM will work with BG for the replacement.
 
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