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Big Question???

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wack65

Rough_Rock
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Jan 6, 2010
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Ok I''m having a bit of an issue feeling like I made the right decision. I put a deposit on a stone that I bought in the Bowery/Canal diamond district in NYC. I bought a D SI2 1.51 with very good cut grading, polish very good, and symmetry was good. I paid $9000 for the diamond and I got a beautiful platinum baguette (.5 tcw) = all in $10250. I am fairly certain that I got a good price, that really isn''t the issue.

I chose this diamond versus an E SI2 that was also 1.51 in weight, and received excellent cut grade, excellent polish, and excellent symmetry. The inclusions on the E SI2 were about 50% on the table and 50% on the sides. There was also a black carbon deposit.

The inclusions on the D SI2 (the one I chose) just had a small feather on the side which the jeweler said could be covered by one of the prongs in the setting. The table was basically free of inclusions. There was also a green and black inclusion on the bottom picture way off on the side, on the key one said extra facet and the other was an indentured "something" (I forget). Are these green and black inclusions something I should have steered away from? The jeweler said that the green and black inclusions could have very well been why GIA graded the clarity SI2.

Here are my main questions:

1) Did I make the wrong decision because I did not get the best cut that my budget of 10K could hold. Meaning was the E SI2 with all excellent grades the better choice because cut grade is more important than clarity. The jeweler put the D and E side buy side and let my mother and I look at them under the light. She liked the sparkle of the D better and so did the jeweler. The jeweler continually emphasized the better color in the D and the fact that the inclusion could be covered. I did notice that it sparkled nicely, but for some reason my instinct was the E because it is the better cut and E is also colorless. Besides the time when a D is next to an E (which would be never), and you can see the slight difference between two colorless stones, won''t the better cut do more for me in the long run towards the brilliance the stone captures?

I went into my search really wanting an F SI1 figuring SI 1 was the lowest clarity (still gemstone quality) and F the lowest of the colorless diamonds but could not find one under 10K.

I could get a G SI 1 for the money I was looking to spend, would a G SI 1 be better than a D or E SI 2?

The jeweler (who I really like and trust) kept saying that I was getting too stuck on certificate gradings and didn''t look enough for myself to see which one I felt was more brilliant.

Is the good grade on symmetry ok?

Was picking color over cut the wrong decision?

What about the green and black blemish''s on the D stone?

I trust the jeweler, he spent a lot of time with us, showed us many diamonds (and I''ve looked at tons of diamonds over the past week). It is also pertinent to note that he showed us the E SI 2 stone and declared that it was the best bc of the ex ex ex grades, next he looked at the D stone and apologized and corrected himself stating that D was the stone he liked best bc of its sparkle, color, and the ability to hide the one major inclusion.

Should I trust his assessment that the D was the way to go? Both of them were 9K.

Any and all advice is greatly appreciated. Thank you all so much.
 
What kind of certificate accompanies the diamond?
 
GIA Certificate - I would not buy anything that was not GIA certified.
 
I am seeing some red flags in the sales pitch the jeweler was using. Not saying they cannot be trusted, but, well, telling you to ignore the paper, telling you "this ons is the best... no wait! This is the best ever! I was wrong" just sounds like phony balony sales lines to me. The jeweler had seen the diamonds before ever bringing them out for you to see so pretending surprise is silly. Anyways, you mentioned many times you trust the jeweler, are you trying to convince yourself?

That is neither here nor there, just my spidey senses. On to your questions.

You cannot judge cut grade based only on the GIA grade. Generally speaking, YUP the excellent would be a better cut than the VG. But you need to assess cut on a case by case basis. You need to look on the cert and post for us the crown angle, pavilion angle, depth and table %, and then we can tell you if you have chosen a diamond that is ideally cut by the numbers.

Numbers do not not tell the whole story, and you have seen the diamond and say it performs well. Perhaps is does. But I do not think that most people know diamonds well enough to discriminate between two diamonds that are close in cut when they are at the jewelers because the difference between VG and ideal is most noticable *accross situations* not in only one or two lighting environments.

Regarding the clarity, when you say a green inclusion, do you mean a green marking on the cert or that the inclusion is visibly green? I am hoping the former.
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If so, it means it is an inclusion that breaks the surface of the diamond, in your case an indented natural. Nothing inherently wrong with those. Can you see the inclusions with your naked eyes? If I am buying an SI2 (and I own one) I want a diamond that is eye clean without having to cover something with a prong.

Anyways, "When if doubt, don''t" is my motto. You have doubts, I think you should consider listening to them.
 
Date: 1/6/2010 10:50:45 PM
Author:wack65
I trust the jeweler, he spent a lot of time with us, showed us many diamonds (and I've looked at tons of diamonds over the past week). It is also pertinent to note that he showed us the E SI 2 stone and declared that it was the best bc of the ex ex ex grades, next he looked at the D stone and apologized and corrected himself stating that D was the stone he liked best bc of its sparkle, color, and the ability to hide the one major inclusion.
It sounds like he wanted you to just buy one —– and he didn't care which one.

But you've already bought your stone, had it set and you picked it out with your own eyes. Now is not the time to question yourself unless you are willing to return it. So enjoy your ring and give it to the intended recipient!
 
The jeweler showed us many diamonds in the order that I asked to see them. I definitely don''t feel as though he steered us into any one particular diamond. Once I realized that G was the color I would have to drop to in order to get SI 1 clarity within my budget of 10K, I realized that I did not want to drop down to a G. My focus then began to be on the cleanest D, E, F SI 2 stone. He showed me 6 or 7 different diamonds ranging from $7300 up to $9300. He looked at all of them as did we under different kinds of light and under the loupe. After we were done looking at a particular diamond, he told us what he thought was good and/or bad about that diamond.

The green mark was on the GIA cert, not on the stone itself. The fact that this is not a big deal is great because this was one of my major concerns.

The D SI 2 that I chose has: Very good cut, very good polish, good symmetry, inclusion is off to the side, clean table

depth-61%
table-56
crown angle-32
crown height-14%
pavillion angle 40.6
pavillion depth 43%

The E SI 2 in question was ex, ex, ex and I know it had the same table and depth, not sure what the other measurements are. Inclusions on the table and the side.

Both diamonds the same price $9000, both diamonds had no human eye visible inclusions. The D did sparkle more than the E when showed signs by side.
 
Your D is on the shallow side - definitely not a disaster, stop worrying!


At this point I would be more concerned about having given my money to that jeweller, it sounds like he wanted to make a sale - any sale - and didn't feel the need to be forthright to get it. Slimy, really
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Yes, in GIA graded stones a D will be indistinguishable from an E in ever real-life scenario. Even between a D and an H, though, cut is more important. That said, some GIA EXs can be steep/deep so the best way to evaluate cut is really by numbers and images. Why not buy your own IdealScope and take a look
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You say the D sparkled more in person, and you're happy with the price you paid, so unless you're planning on doing a return and starting all over again I would really just stop stressing and enjoy it
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. Buyers' guilt is not something you want to foster unless there's something you want to and can change..
 
It scores well on the Hollaway cut adviser and actually falls into the BIC range. This means it will excell at white light return and it will not be very firey. A more ideally cut diamond would balance the two variables.

I like white light return myself, it is what you see most of the time.

I think if you have seen it and like it at this point stop worrying. You may want to consider taking it to an indepedent appraiser just to set your mind at ease. You will need an appraisal anyways for insurance, and they can tell you for sure that there is nothing wrong with the diamond.
 
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