Asscher help

[arjunajane]

I very much appreciate all the info and assistnace on this site that has helped me immensely, however despite my efforts, one thing still escapes me - An AGA (or any other) cut grading chart for Asscher cuts!
If anyone can help direct me to this info, or a post that would help in my quest for my perfect asscher?
Cheers!

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

The only such chart that can really help you has 3 crown and 3 pavilion angles on it, and you will find it near impossible to get the data.
ASET and photo''s are as good as it can get at the current time if you are buying unseen

 

[Ellen]

I would suggest doing a search on here for Asschers. If you read through enough threads (esp. those looking at stones/those who've bought one), you'll begin to get a feel for what numbers have more potential. However, with fancies, numbers aren't everything, and they really do have to be seen. But if you get a good idea of what to look for, it will help you weed out the bad ones from the possibilities.

Then as Gary said, get pics. I would also suggest only dealing with vendors who can give you pics.

 

[arjunajane]

Thankyou both for you''re answers..it''s starting to make more sense now. I''ve been looking at stones mainly through whiteflash, and as i am buying from australia, it is challenging to get the most accurate info, without being able to speak someone direct.
So, just a question then, ifi''m serious about a stone, but whiteflash are only showing stock photos, should they be able to provide detailed images, interscope etc, if requested?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 1/19/2008 8:52:03 AM
Author: arjunajane
Thankyou both for you''re answers..it''s starting to make more sense now. I''ve been looking at stones mainly through whiteflash, and as i am buying from australia, it is challenging to get the most accurate info, without being able to speak someone direct.
So, just a question then, ifi''m serious about a stone, but whiteflash are only showing stock photos, should they be able to provide detailed images, interscope etc, if requested?

Yes. If they don''t have the stone on hand, they will have to call it in. They''ll run tests then and take pics. I "think" if you end up buying it, you don''t have to pay for bringing it in, but if you don''t buy it, you do. Check with them on that.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 1/19/2008 8:52:03 AM
Author: arjunajane
Thankyou both for you''re answers..it''s starting to make more sense now. I''ve been looking at stones mainly through whiteflash, and as i am buying from australia, it is challenging to get the most accurate info, without being able to speak someone direct.

So, just a question then, ifi''m serious about a stone, but whiteflash are only showing stock photos, should they be able to provide detailed images, interscope etc, if requested?

The Whiteflash stones you''re seeing are ones that are not in house, so Whiteflash would have to call in the diamonds you were interested in. Once they do that, they will do a sarin, take photos and do an Idealscope, etc. That''s what I had WF do for my radiant and it worked out well. I believe GoodOldGold.com does have some asschers in house, and those have real pictures, so that might be a good place to check for asschers, too.

 

[arjunajane]

ok guys, thankyou for the advice. If they''re gonna charge for bringing in the stones, I think i''ll have to narrow my choices a bit then!!
I have checked good old gold, but he''s a bit too pricey for me. still, good advice and a good place to educate.
thankx!

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/19/2008 9:47:45 AM
Author: arjunajane
ok guys, thankyou for the advice. If they''re gonna charge for bringing in the stones, I think i''ll have to narrow my choices a bit then!!
I have checked good old gold, but he''s a bit too pricey for me. still, good advice and a good place to educate.
thankx!

gog can get the same virtual stones in that any other dealer can at the same price.
They have different policies on charging for call ins, check with both...
Compare apples too apples there is a large premium on well cut asschers.
The lowest cost asschers will not be the best performers.

 

[strmrdr]

here is an example:
potentual too be well cut:
1.00 G VS2 68.2% 61% GIA thk no ex ex no 5.54x5.54x3.78 $5688 $5688

total woofer:

1.00 G VS2 77.2% 67% GIA m-stk no gd gd ft 5.41x5.36x4.14 $3294 $3294

Thats a $2394 differene in price

If we add in soft graded EGL stones it gets even more so...
1.00 G VS2 67.8% 65% EGL m no vg vg 5.69-5.52x3.74 $3153 $3153

thats a $2535 difference in price

all for a 1ct G vs2 asscher.

 

[arjunajane]

Hi storm, thankyou for your input-i was hoping you''d chime in as I''ve been told your the resident asscher expert!
To be honest I''m probably only looking for about half carat to 0.55 at most to fit more in my budget-I am buying from australia, so after tax, duties etc it will get more expensive. I didn''t know Good Old order in any as request, so I''ll follow up there. so far i have been lookin mainly on Whiteflash, but am quite overwhelmed with the choice.
Maybe you can help me choose between some of my favourites? I am working in a budget of preferably under $1300 ($1500 AUD), so pls keep that in mind when critiquing my choices! I will also leave off the prices, as I would like you guys to tell me what you think that they''re worth.


0.53 ct G SI1 Asscher
. Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.53
. Depth %: 66.3
. Table %: 64
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.65-4.54X3.01
. Polish: Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet:
. Fluorescence: None
0.51 ct F VS2 Asscher
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.51
. Depth %: 68.9
. Table %: 58
. Girdle: M
. Measurements: 4.45-4.44X3.06
. Polish: Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Medium Blue
Does anyone have an opinion on whether the fluorescence of this stone will have a negative impact? Most consumers seem to say, steer wide clear. However I''m getting mixed messages as the literature on this site suggests it can be a good thing...Storm? anyone?


0.57 ct D VS2 Asscher
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.57
. Depth %: 65.1
. Table %: 57
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.85-4.67X3.04
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Faint

Again, I''m concerned about the fluro here-I know thats whats keeping the price down a bit, but will it affect my overrall diamonds appearance much?

Any opinions would be greatly appreciated, also any links to Asschers you think are good, under the $1600 US range.
thanks for evreyones help,

 

[strmrdr]

Im off for the evening will do some hunting later.
The last one is one Id consider getting called in depending on what else is out there.
Talk to the vendors they have access too some stones not on the PS list too.

the Fluorescence is fine but id stick to vg/vg pol/sym or better and avoid si1''s.

 

[arjunajane]

Ok storm, thanks, i look forward to your input.
I have been negotiaeing for an Asscher ring on ebay that I want to buy it''s from MDC diamonds, who from everything I''ve read so far they seem pretty reputable. And the ring seems to represent pretty good value to me.
However seeing as the photo is a stock photo, when I requested a picture of the actual ring, this is the reply I got:

"All the info we have on this diamond is displayed on this page. We take from each ring style we have one picture and keep making the same model again and again."

I''m not sure if he''s really answered my request????
What do you guys think?
It can''t be that much of an hassle for him to take a photo and email it to me, right????

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/19/2008 9:29:41 PM
Author: arjunajane

Ok storm, thanks, i look forward to your input.
I have been negotiaeing for an Asscher ring on ebay that I want to buy it''s from MDC diamonds, who from everything I''ve read so far they seem pretty reputable. And the ring seems to represent pretty good value to me.
However seeing as the photo is a stock photo, when I requested a picture of the actual ring, this is the reply I got:

''All the info we have on this diamond is displayed on this page. We take from each ring style we have one picture and keep making the same model again and again.''

I''m not sure if he''s really answered my request????
What do you guys think?
It can''t be that much of an hassle for him to take a photo and email it to me, right????

they dont want your business.. no pics no $$$ bottom line.
The odds are the one you get wont look anything like the one pictured.
No 2 asschers look the same.

 

[strmrdr]

0.57 E VS2 67.7% 57% GIA no vg vg no 4.74x4.73x3.20 $1262
0.57 E VS1 67.1% 55% GIA - ex ex 4.66-4.62x3.10 $1418
0.58 E VS1 68.4% 58% GIA no vg ex no 4.71x4.69x3.21 $1455
0.59 D VS2 68.8% 57% GIA stk-tk no ex vg 4.76x4.74x3.22 $1395

Also see if the vendors can hunt down some G-H/VS stones that are a little larger in your range.
If not the first and last in the list above are the first 2 id consider calling in.

 

[arjunajane]

Thanks storm!
just one thing..am I misssing something, or have you listed what vendors these stones are from?
cheers again for all the input!

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/20/2008 9:40:04 PM
Author: arjunajane
Thanks storm!
just one thing..am I misssing something, or have you listed what vendors these stones are from?
cheers again for all the input!

any vendor can call them in they are virtual stones, personaly Id have Jon at Gog call em in.
http://www.goodoldgold.com

 

[arjunajane]

ok, is there a fee for having them call in the stones? Also, ...whats a virtual stone???
Sorry for my ignorance-does this mean its a stone that every website has access to?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/21/2008 4:48:36 AM
Author: arjunajane
ok, is there a fee for having them call in the stones? Also, ...whats a virtual stone???
Sorry for my ignorance-does this mean its a stone that every website has access to?

Jon will call in 2 for free. Other places you have too pay a call in fee on the ones you don't buy from the 1st one where gog it would be the 3rd that might cost a call in fee. (some places if they don't like the stone then they wont offer it and there is no fee but if they approve it and offer it too you then there is a fee if its not purchased.)

Yes virtual stones are available to pretty much any vendor.
They have similar lists to the PS list except for vendors.
What happens is parts of that list is copied over here and a markup applied those stones are called virtual because they are not part of the vendors in house stock but are in the wholesalers vault.
Some wholesalers may not allow their stones too be listed this way but are available which is why its good too check with a vendor.

more info on virtual stones here: http://journal.pricescope.com/Articles/12/1/Why-are-there-several-dealers-offering-the-exact-same-stone.aspx

 

[arjunajane]

Awesome, that makes things alot clearer for me, cheers again.. Yeah, from what I''ve seen GOG seem the way to go...I''ve had a short contact with Rhino and he is very helpful and knowledgable. I absolutely Adore their square H&A''s and Jubilees-talk about take your breath away! however, I fear these are abit out of my price limit at the moment. (sigh), And so I continue my search for a great asscher..its difficult, as I''m in Perth Australia, and there are only rubbish retailers here really. I''ve read some good things on here about Jogia diamonds in Perth though-although the trouble is his asschers are also sourced from O/S, and there is a fee to bring it in and have an idealscope done etc..So there''s really not much of an advantage, I guess, than just buying completely online fromGOG or WF.
Sorry, I''m thinking out loud!
A funny story about the "prestige" jewellery store here in Perth, West Australia, called Rosendorffs. Was in there today to look at loose stones, and enquired about the idealscope. Of course, the 50-something year old SA looked at me quizically before admitting she didn''t know what it was.

later in the day, she told me the gemologist knows how to use it, but (quote) "It only applies to round cut stones, not the asschers or any thing else"....OKAAY. And this is their gemologist that has been with them for 20years!
Even with my meagre knowledge, I knew this was wrong - but seeing as I wouldn''t ever consider to buy from them anyway, i didn''t bother to try to educate them. (although I did mention Pricescope as some educational learning).

Anyway, thats my funny diamond story for today..I''m off to hunt my perfect stone..Storm, will keep you posted on this thread if I make a good decision.

 

[arjunajane]

I think I''ve found the My Asscher!
Storm , or anyone else, can I have your opinion?

0.47ct H VVS1
Report GIA
Depth 65.7%
Table 58 %
Girdle TH-M
Measure 4.52-4.52x2.97
Polish and Symmetry: excellent
Culet no
fluoro no

I would love your opinions before I go ordering it in!
I am dealing with Jamie from WF and he is very helpful and kind. Still awaiting soke stones from Jon at GOG...

 

[arjunajane]

Sorry, just re my previous post - the only concern I have is the size- its just that most of the settings i like are all for 0.5 or larger-does anyone think I will have problems setting this size stone / will it be more expensive etc if i need to have the setting altered to fit?
cheers!

 

[strmrdr]

pictures?
It is smaller which might be noticable but if the price is right.... and the pics check out....

 

[arjunajane]

hey storm , just wanted to ask what ppl think of the specs and the size first as i think there will be a fee for calling it in - mainly concerned about it not being at least 0.5? not because I mind personally , just as most of the settings i am liking say 0.5 or higher.
I will be sure to post photos and images as soon as I have them.
In the meantime, its really just a dream probably, but here is an example of the kinda setting I''m considering:

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/22/2008 2:02:18 AM
Author: arjunajane
hey storm , just wanted to ask what ppl think of the specs and the size first as i think there will be a fee for calling it in - mainly concerned about it not being at least 0.5? not because I mind personally , just as most of the settings i am liking say 0.5 or higher.
I will be sure to post photos and images as soon as I have them.
In the meantime, its really just a dream probably, but here is an example of the kinda setting I'm considering:

.5 would get lost in that setting.....

my thoughts are go as big as possible on your budget as in this size every little bit helps.

 

[arjunajane]

Right, yeah I presumed as much. However its not like I have my heart set on this setting-its just a good example i could find quickly. It''s probably outta my budget anyway!

It''s so very hard to find a balance between size and the four C''s and more. etc!!!

Any advice on where I could compromise so as to go bigger? Probably on colour and go to SI1? Don''t really want to compromise on symmetry and cut though..your thoughts?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/22/2008 2:44:20 AM
Author: arjunajane
Right, yeah I presumed as much. However its not like I have my heart set on this setting-its just a good example i could find quickly. It''s probably outta my budget anyway!

It''s so very hard to find a balance between size and the four C''s and more. etc!!!

Any advice on where I could compromise so as to go bigger? Probably on colour and go to SI1? Don''t really want to compromise on symmetry and cut though..your thoughts?

avoid the si1s... hunt g/h maybe I if your not color sensitive clarity vs and best cut you can find.
They aren''t easy too find and you may have too compromise.

 

[strmrdr]

I''m curious whats your total budget for the setting and the stone?
Have you considered putting most of the money in the stone and go for a simple setting for now?

 

[arjunajane]

Yeah, that setting was probably abit elaborate for my budget. I guess I''m thinking about $2500 max for total ring - that was my idae, to keep most of the money in the stone of course.
I''ve been reading some of the other threads re fluorescence in Asschers - I have noticed I can go up considerably in size and not compromise cut or colour if the stone has faint to medium fluoro-(i don''t think I''m brave enough to buy strong fluoro unseen over net),
I noticed in another post your opinion is this is a good thing?

Here''s an example of a stone I found, that seems very good i think, except has "medium blue" fluorescence:
pls tell me what you think - is this better value for money? will there be a way to tell from photos only if it will be milky in real life?

0.6 ct D SI1 .
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.60
. Depth %: 66.3
. Table %: 59
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.72-4.69X3.11
. Polish: Excellent
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Medium Blue
$1144


Here''s another example of a good (i think) fluoro stone, faint only
0.57 ct D VS2 Asscher $1,358.00
. Report: GIA
Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.57
. Depth %: 65.1
. Table %: 57
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.85-4.67X3.04
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Faint

As you can see, I''m getting another like 20points, for hardly any more money, just for accepting fluoro..

And just to finish - for balance, one without fluoro at all, which I am seriously considering, and would love your opinion on:

0.57 ct F VS2 Asscher $1266
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.57
. Depth %: 70
. Table %: 62
. Girdle: M-STK
. Measurements: 4.58-4.56X3.19
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet:
. Fluorescence: None

I hope I''m not boring you by now..it''s just every time I start to think I''ve got the hang of this diamond thing, i learn something new!! Your opinions and feedback have been very valuable to me. I would love to know which of these you think represents the best value, and how I should weigh up the fluroro Vs discounted price?

Kind regards

I know you said to steer away from from SI1, and on principle I agree. However so many ppl on this forum think its so hard to even see the difference between SI1 and VS2? thoughts?

So I''ll post this other one as a comparison -

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/22/2008 6:34:57 AM
Author: arjunajane

Yeah, that setting was probably abit elaborate for my budget. I guess I''m thinking about $2500 max for total ring - that was my idae, to keep most of the money in the stone of course.
I''ve been reading some of the other threads re fluorescence in Asschers - I have noticed I can go up considerably in size and not compromise cut or colour if the stone has faint to medium fluoro-(i don''t think I''m brave enough to buy strong fluoro unseen over net),
I noticed in another post your opinion is this is a good thing?

Here''s an example of a stone I found, that seems very good i think, except has ''medium blue'' fluorescence:
pls tell me what you think - is this better value for money? will there be a way to tell from photos only if it will be milky in real life?

0.6 ct D SI1 .
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.60
. Depth %: 66.3
. Table %: 59
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.72-4.69X3.11
. Polish: Excellent
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Medium Blue
$1144


Here''s another example of a good (i think) fluoro stone, faint only
0.57 ct D VS2 Asscher $1,358.00
. Report: GIA
Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.57
. Depth %: 65.1
. Table %: 57
. Girdle: STK-TK
. Measurements: 4.85-4.67X3.04
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet: None
. Fluorescence: Faint

As you can see, I''m getting another like 20points, for hardly any more money, just for accepting fluoro..

And just to finish - for balance, one without fluoro at all, which I am seriously considering, and would love your opinion on:

0.57 ct F VS2 Asscher $1266
Report: GIA
. Shape: Asscher
. Carat: 0.57
. Depth %: 70
. Table %: 62
. Girdle: M-STK
. Measurements: 4.58-4.56X3.19
. Polish: Very Good
. Symmetry: Very Good
. Culet:
. Fluorescence: None

I hope I''m not boring you by now..it''s just every time I start to think I''ve got the hang of this diamond thing, i learn something new!! Your opinions and feedback have been very valuable to me. I would love to know which of these you think represents the best value, and how I should weigh up the fluroro Vs discounted price?

Kind regards

I know you said to steer away from from SI1, and on principle I agree. However so many ppl on this forum think its so hard to even see the difference between SI1 and VS2? thoughts?

So I''ll post this other one as a comparison -

med blue is fine as is strong if its not overblue....
they are talking about si rounds not asschers.